Nic Naitanui urges public to ‘grow together’ after mother paints son’s skin for Book Week parade

[Saintt]

You what... ?

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Yes I've read the post. She says she was a little worried about what the pc crowd would think but chose to not be dictated by them. Hardly antagonistic.

 

[Forward Press]

So a white person dressing up a black man is only cool if it is taking the piss in someway?

If it's to venerate and honour a black person that is not cool.

Like your buddy DemonTim you seem to be experts in building a strawman.

The question was answered in the post you quoted, and the second last post by me, now you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

[DemonTim]

Like your buddy DemonTim you seem to be experts in building a strawman.

The question was answered in the post you quoted, and the second last post by me, now you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

No it wasn't. You just defined satire and made a claim that satire isn't offensive, despite your "buddy" claiming people were offended

As I said quit the condescending s**t, discuss the points. The mods in this thread have been a joke

 

[coerced]

Like your buddy DemonTim you seem to be experts in building a strawman.

The question was answered in the post you quoted, and the second last post by me, now you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

It's not a strawman. This kid wanted to dress up as Naitanui because he idolises him. Everyone told his mother it wasn't cool.

But dressing up as a black man is fine so long as there is humour in it.

 

[Forward Press]

No it wasn't. You just defined satire and made a claim that satire isn't offensive, despite your "buddy" claiming people were offended

As I said quit the condescending s**t, discuss the points. The mods in this thread have been a joke

Did you read the definition of satire that I posted?

You're not bothering to address the posts, you and your buddy are just railing on about separate things in an attempt to redefine the argument. We all stated context matters but both of you are oversimplifying the argument with senseless hypotheticals to try and pick holes or highlight hypocrisy that doesn't actually exist.

Mother wanted to stir the hornet's nest, was aware of implications of blackface, got the reaction she wanted. And it definitely wasn't satirical.

 

[Forward Press]

It's not a strawman. This kid wanted to dress up as Naitanui because he idolises him. Everyone told his mother it wasn't cool.

But dressing up as a black man is fine so long as there is humour in it.

You're terrific at building strawmen.

The whole idea is that RDJ's character is highly controversial and willing to do anything for his craft. Including plastic surgery for blackface. The entertainment reporter in the movie spelt it out pretty explicitly in case viewers didn't get the implication. The actual African-American in the movie also gave him s**t for it, if viewers still didn't get it.

On top of that, it's a movie - many movies are designed to offend but if you think Tropic Thunder of all f***ing things is endorsing blackface you are twisted in your reasoning.

I think you're just arguing for the sake of it, the Tropic Thunder comparison was doomed from the beginning.

 

[DemonTim]

Did you read the definition of satire that I posted?

You're not bothering to address the posts, you and your buddy are just railing on about separate things in an attempt to redefine the argument. We all stated context matters but both of you are oversimplifying the argument with senseless hypotheticals to try and pick holes or highlight hypocrisy that doesn't actually exist.

Mother wanted to stir the hornet's nest, was aware of implications of blackface, got the reaction she wanted. And it definitely wasn't satirical.

Actually I'm directly discussing the point raised that we can't determine what is and isn't offensive to other people. It's been identified that people found tropic thunder offensive, but you're saying it's not. You're doing exactly what you're complaining of others. So if people say this isn't offensive because X reason, then that makes it not offensive, yes?

Context matters. I agree. The context of this wasn't racist, it was a bit of a "I won't be dictated at".

You can keep throwing out "strawman" but it doesn't apply when comments made in this exact thread are being responded to

 

[DemonTim]

Also wouldn't the hey hey skit be exactly the definition of satire?

 

[Werewolf]

Here's a guideline if you want to paint your skin. You have to stay above the little triangle

The other basic colours can be offensive as well if the luminosity number is too low

 

[Plugger35]

There is a vast difference between blackface in the usual sense and what Tropic Thunder was depicting. People generally were smart enough to see this.

Most people are smart enough to see the difference between blackface and the kid dressing up as Naitanui, I don't see how it was somehow more offensive than Robert Downey Jnr dressing up as a black guy in Tropic Thunder.

No one taking your point of view has been able to adequately explain why there is a difference, probably because you can't explain it as it's nonsense.

 

[Forward Press]

Actually I'm directly discussing the point raised that we can't determine what is and isn't offensive to other people. It's been identified that people found tropic thunder offensive, but you're saying it's not. You're doing exactly what you're complaining of others. So if people say this isn't offensive because X reason, then that makes it not offensive, yes?

Context matters. I agree. The context of this wasn't racist, it was a bit of a "I won't be dictated at".

You can keep throwing out "strawman" but it doesn't apply when comments made in this exact thread are being responded to

It was racist in intent. Why do you think she was going on about when she was "I won't be dictated at"? It was clearly a poke at people who thought it would be racist. She knew about the racial connotations, went ahead with it anyway.

The whole 'should offensive thing A but not offensive thing B be allowed'? is another thing altogether that again depends on context. RDJ's character's action is offensive - that was the whole point of the movie. The highly involved actor with no boundaries to achieve the ultimate in method acting, gets called out by the African-American character pretty quickly.

Most people are smart enough to see the difference between blackface and the kid dressing up as Naitanui, I don't see how it was somehow more offensive than Robert Downey Jnr dressing up as a black guy in Tropic Thunder.

No one taking your point of view has been able to adequately explain why there is a difference, probably because you can't explain it as it's nonsense.

Has been explained, happy to quote my posts again if you wish.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Blackface is generally percieved as racist, therefore it is racist. Not a difficult concept.

But what is "generally"? That's the crux of the discussion. Is it like a referendum where something needs 50% disapproval to be regarded as offensive? Where do you draw the line?

 

[DemonTim]

It was racist in intent. Why do you think she was going on about when she was "I won't be dictated at"? It was clearly a poke at people who thought it would be racist. She knew about the racial connotations, went ahead with it anyway.

The whole 'should offensive thing A but not offensive thing B be allowed'? is another thing altogether that again depends on context. RDJ's character's action is offensive - that was the whole point of the movie. The highly involved actor with no boundaries to achieve the ultimate in method acting, gets called out by the African-American character pretty quickly.



Has been explained, happy to quote my posts again if you wish.

Well I disagree it was racist in intent. It was provocative in intent. You enjoy definitions. What she did cant be described as racist in intent.

Again, most of the premise in this thread is "you can't tell people what is and isn't offensive to them". You seem to fail to understand this, and just want to talk about why it's different, so not offensive. You're doing exactly what a lot are complaining about

 

[kingswood71]

Most people are smart enough to see the difference between blackface and the kid dressing up as Naitanui, I don't see how it was somehow more offensive than Robert Downey Jnr dressing up as a black guy in Tropic Thunder.
No one taking your point of view has been able to adequately explain why there is a difference, probably because you can't explain it as it's nonsense.

I dont disagree with this at all and I dont feel a racist element was involved at all. Is the kid dressed up in with an intent to offend NN, no of course not.
What I have said, is that mother was well aware that some people could see it as offensive and still went ahead with the idea. That implies that she was making a provocative choice. This is the issue I have with it. People should think before they make a 100% commitment to performing a provocative act.

The mother already knew that it had the potential to cause an issue, yet still chose to do it. This implies that she had prior knowledge of what blackface signifies. Hell, she even had people telling her not to do it.
She chose to do something provocative knowing full well the potential ramifications.
First she says that she was “a little worried about painting him” because there were “so many politically correct extremists these days”, then says she was "not aware blackfacing was considered offensive".
These 2 comments totally negate themselves! Back-peddling.
It would be like thinking it would be a great idea to wear a Saddam Hussein costume to a Kurdish soccer game despite that you were advised that it may not be the best of ideas.
Deliberately provocative.
Like your profile pic is attempting to be.

If you think the mother didn't have an agenda in dressing the kid up with black face paint - well, you might want to re-read her social media pages and response to the controversy. It was all about sticking it up to the PC extremists and the innocent kid got caught up in it.
The mother is the one we have an issue with, not the kid. People keep conflating the two as if our criticism of blackface is somehow us laying into a poor blameless child.

 

[Kummerspeck]

I know I'm a bit late to the game, but I searched through the thread and couldn't find anything.

You guys know minstrel shows were in Australia, and that blackface was used in the same way here as in the US?

 

[Power Raid]

women should be banned from wearing make-up or at the very least, we need a make-up police that ensures the make up isn't too different to their natural colour

#whitemakeuponlyplease

 

[Plugger35]

It was racist in intent. Why do you think she was going on about when she was "I won't be dictated at"? It was clearly a poke at people who thought it would be racist. She knew about the racial connotations, went ahead with it anyway.

The whole 'should offensive thing A but not offensive thing B be allowed'? is another thing altogether that again depends on context. RDJ's character's action is offensive - that was the whole point of the movie. The highly involved actor with no boundaries to achieve the ultimate in method acting, gets called out by the African-American character pretty quickly.



Has been explained, happy to quote my posts again if you wish.

I've seen all the explanations but none of them make any sense to me or will make me change my mind but like with all these PC type issues there are people on both sides of the argument that won't change their minds regardless of what people on the other side say so it ends up just going around in circles.

I know I'm a bit late to the game, but I searched through the thread and couldn't find anything.

You guys know minstrel shows were in Australia, and that blackface was used in the same way here as in the US?

If the kid dressed up as a minstrel then I'd say it was racist and wrong but a kid dressing up as Naitanui because that's his favourite footy player is a whole different kettle of fish, there's nothing racist or wrong about that and people getting offended by that must have a very low bar when it comes to being offended.

 

[DrEvil_]

No it wasn't. You just defined satire and made a claim that satire isn't offensive, despite your "buddy" claiming people were offended

As I said quit the condescending s**t, discuss the points. The mods in this thread have been a joke

Mod calling is pretty pathetic though. Why so mad? Let everyone have their say.

 

[ShanDog]

Gee it will be nice if one day nobody gave a * what people's skin colour was. Coz pigmentation or lack thereof really matters hey?

 

[Kummerspeck]

If the kid dressed up as a minstrel then I'd say it was racist and wrong but a kid dressing up as Naitanui because that's his favourite footy player is a whole different kettle of fish, there's nothing racist or wrong about that and people getting offended by that must have a very low bar when it comes to being offended.

Blackface is inextricably linked to minstrels, mocking black people and enforcing a lesser standing in society. The kid didn't dress himself, his mum who quite obviously knew the issues with it decided to do it and made it about sticking it to the PC monster.

 

[DrEvil_]

Gee it will be nice if one day nobody gave a **** what people's skin colour was. Coz pigmentation or lack thereof really matters hey?

It really matters.... for melanomas

 

[ShanDog]

It really matters.... for melanomas

Great, there goes my Halloween costume idea...

 

[DrEvil_]

Great, there goes my Halloween costume idea...

What? You were going to dress up as a melanoma? That's pretty tasteless man.

 

[William Wonka]

I'm not personally offended by a Hitler costume... but then again I'm not Jewish, and don't have descendants who were affected by those atrocities.

The atrotcities committed by Nazi Germany went far far beyond just those committed against Jews.
Over 60 million people died (6 million Jews) and hundreds of millions more lives were shattered in inumerable ways due to the nazis wars of agression.
This means most people of the world (and certainly most Australians) were directly affected and is certainly something that ALL people ought to be offended and horrified by.

 

[ShanDog]

What? You were going to dress up as a melanoma? That's pretty tasteless man.

Tasteless is the best kind of outfit! lol