Mega Thread Nick Daicos - Can he be the GTWEB? Part 2

[doppleganger]

He's a fantastic ball winner with great endurance and speed. In finals he doesn't have the size or contested nature to impact what are much more highly contested games.

He already has proven himself in finals.

3rd in Norm Smith voting.

Involved twice in the biggest play that got Collingwood in front in the 23 GF, when he went to the middle and won 1st possession and then got the goal assists to DeGoey.

And then when needed a clam head to maintain possession in dying stages, he nailed his kick to WHE when under intense pressure.. majority of players just blast it out of their area and give it back to Brisbane.

His impact in the last couple of minutes of the 23 GF won us a flag.

And this year he dropped his 26.3 PF, that is maximum impact.

But yeah, back in his debut season he wasn't top2 on the ground according to coaches votes.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Keith Grieg on Daicos yesterday. 'I hope Nick Daicos wins the Brownlow. Some of the things he does, you sit back and say, how in the Hell did he do that?'

 

[Lunchtime]

Going the Mr. Disengenuos route I see.

3 of the 7 were in his debut season (even the disengenuos one will argue they shouldn't be included). How many players in their debut season are voted in best 2 players on the ground in a final?

And what is the big step between best 2 compared to best 3...or does it just happen that Daicos has multiple games where he was 3rd best according to coaches.

Great to see someone giving Mr Meow a challenge.

But in those 3 Finals games in his debut year...if he had an outstanding 3 games then you would be going on and on about and praising him. All because he wasnt dominant in those 3 games you are bringing out the "it was his debut" season.

Just another excuse and once again you change the scenario to suit your narrative.

Its a bit like in horse racing when the Australian-trained horse Verry Elleegant travelled to France and didnt do well....everyone was saying "oh well she is too old" well that narrative wouldn't have been said if she won races in France.

Stop with the excuses. Daicos is yet to have a breakout dominant game in a Finals match yet (that could change at some point).

 

[jonnobackpocket]

That's a way over-rating of his game. Obviously doesn't factor in the missed tackles, but he did open them up a fair few times, which I assume the high score was from. I hate to say it but I think it's going to be another shit GF with Cats absolutely torching then. We had a shocker. The whole game went to plan for Brissy, yet all their goals were sloppy shit from us, coughing up a heap of stoppage goals and pack marks to mediums - they'll get **** all of them against the Cats. And we actually cut through them pretty easily in transition but kept ****ing up due to an open forward line with Cox against Andrews and a +1 ahead of them as the option.

Collingwood supporters gracious as always, wasn’t Brisbane it was Collingwood. Taking it about as well as fat head Ed. Pathetic

 

[Lunchtime]

He already has proven himself in finals.

3rd in Norm Smith voting.

Involved twice in the biggest play that got Collingwood in front in the 23 GF, when he went to the middle and won 1st possession and then got the goal assists to DeGoey.

And then when needed a clam head to maintain possession in dying stages, he nailed his kick to WHE when under intense pressure.. majority of players just blast it out of their area and give it back to Brisbane.

His impact in the last couple of minutes of the 23 GF won us a flag.

And this year he dropped his 26.3 PF, that is maximum impact.

But yeah, back in his debut season he wasn't top2 on the ground according to coaches votes.

Already proven himself in Finals? Ridiculous statement. He has been serviceable without being dominant. He is yet to have one dominant game let alone a consistent run of dominant games in Finals footy - when it truly matters most.

 

[jonnobackpocket]

FMD. McCluggage? Imagine how much you'd carry on if Nick got blanketed by Mullin and was really ineffective in a final like McCluggage was against Geelong.

You might not realise it, but there's a reason why your expectations of Nick Daicos are so much higher than every other player in the comp..

Yep because moronic Collingwood supporters calling him the GOAT.

 

[Fadge]

Yep. As evidenced by this thread.

The idea that Daicos had the 2nd best game on the weekend is beyond insanity. It is just plain bullshit.

No argument from me.

 

[Fadge]

He has played 7 x finals. Yet to be voted by the coaches in the best 2 x players on the ground in any of those 7 x finals.

Not sure any other 'greats' of the game would have that sort of modest record in their first 7 x finals.

How many had played 7 finals in their first 4 seasons? 5 of the 7 in their first two seasons?

 

[jonnobackpocket]

Keith Grieg on Daicos yesterday. 'I hope Nick Daicos wins the Brownlow. Some of the things he does, you sit back and say, how in the Hell did he do that?'

Like managing to be an on baller not getting a kick for a whole 1/4 while the game is on the line how do you do that, you would think he would fluke one. Incredible effort.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

But in those 3 Finals games in his debut year...if he had an outstanding 3 games then you would be going on and on about and praising him. All because he wasnt dominant in those 3 games you are bringing out the "it was his debut" season.

Just another excuse and once again you change the scenario to suit your narrative.

Its a bit like in horse racing when the Australian-trained horse Verry Elleegant travelled to France and didnt do well....everyone was saying "oh well she is too old" well that narrative wouldn't have been said if she won races in France.

Stop with the excuses. Daicos is yet to have a breakout dominant game in a Finals match yet (that could change at some point).

Verry Elleegant?

Not sure you've got a good feel for the game son, poor analysis

 

[Corn Cobbers]

How many had played 7 finals in their first 4 seasons? 5 of the 7 in their first two seasons?

Also 5 wins 2 losses, elite

Dusty first 3 finals, 3 losses

 

[HairyO]

How many had played 7 finals in their first 4 seasons? 5 of the 7 in their first two seasons?

Chris Mew played in 7 Grand Finals in his first 7 years.

Brad Hill won 3 Grand Finals in his first 3 years.

Im sure you could find Brisbane players and Geelong players who were similar.

Selwood played in 12 finals in his first 4 years. I bet Hawkins is similar.

Edit: actually, Mew did play 7 GF in a row but not til he was a little older.
Derm and Dunstall both played in a heap of finals as soon as they started playing.

 

[doppleganger]

But in those 3 Finals games in his debut year...if he had an outstanding 3 games then you would be going on and on about and praising him. All because he wasnt dominant in those 3 games you are bringing out the "it was his debut" season.

It is about wanting to compare apples with apples

A nonsense to compare 3 finals in your debut season, with 3 of Dusty finals in 2017 when he was in season 8 and playing game 170 or so.

But that is what disengenuos posters stoop to.

Stop with the excuses. Daicos is yet to have a breakout dominant game in a Finals match yet (that could change at some point).

He is just consistently great.

23 PF - return game from his knee 2nd most disposals, 3rd most clearances and 2nd most inside 50s - 4th in coaches BOG
23 GF - most disposals, most CPs, 2nd most score involvements and the big plays to win the flag - 3rd in Norm Smith
25 QF - 2nd most disposals, 3rd most CPs, most inside 50s and most score involvements - 3rd in coaches BOG
25 PF - most disposals, most CPs, most clearances for the Pies - and highest rated player on the ground with a 26.3 rating

It is quite funny where only coming 3rd in Norm Smith or having most contested possessions and disposals, or easily most score involvements, or a player rating of 26.3 ain't considered dominant finals games.

 

[doppleganger]

Selwood played in 12 finals in his first 4 years. I bet Hawkins is similar.

What odds Joel wasn't even in top 2 best in any of his first 12 finals...his best game probably the 08 GF, but he was only 4th in Norm Smith voting.

No 'breakout dominant" games in any of his first 12 finals if using the moronic Tigers fans rating assessment.

 

[HairyO]

What odds Joel wasn't even in top 2 best in any of his first 12 finals...his best game probably the 08 GF, but he was only 4th in Norm Smith voting.

No 'breakout dominant" games in any of his first 12 finals if using the moronic Tigers fans rating assessment.

I dont recall. Derm kicked 5 goals in his very first game which also happened to be a Semi final.

I also think the ratings are a complete hoax and at some point everyone will agree to stop referring to them. Daicos would not have been the 20th best player on the weekend.

 

[doppleganger]

I dont recall. Derm kicked 5 goals in his very first game which also happened to be a Semi final.

Yep Derm had that great debut game.

He was the held goalless in his next five finals though.

I also think the ratings are a complete hoax and at some point everyone will agree to stop referring to them. Daicos would not have been the 20th best player on the weekend.

He was Pies best (or 2nd if you liked Elliott).

Player Ratings clearly closer to the mark than your 20th best player claim.

 

[Lunchtime]

It is about wanting to compare apples with apples

A nonsense to compare 3 finals in your debut season, with 3 of Dusty finals in 2017 when he was in season 8 and playing game 170 or so.

But that is what disengenuos posters stoop to.

He is just consistently great.

23 PF - return game from his knee 2nd most disposals, 3rd most clearances and 2nd most inside 50s - 4th in coaches BOG
23 GF - most disposals, most CPs, 2nd most score involvements and the big plays to win the flag - 3rd in Norm Smith
25 QF - 2nd most disposals, 3rd most CPs, most inside 50s and most score involvements - 3rd in coaches BOG
25 PF - most disposals, most CPs, most clearances for the Pies - and highest rated player on the ground with a 26.3 rating

It is quite funny where only coming 3rd in Norm Smith or having most contested possessions and disposals, or easily most score involvements, or a player rating of 26.3 ain't considered dominant finals games.

If he is "consistently great" in Finals then why dont the coaches echo this when they do the Gary Ayres votes?

 

[HairyO]

Yep Derm had that great debut game.

He was the held goalless in his next five finals though.

He was Pies best (or 2nd if you liked Elliott).

Player Ratings clearly closer to the mark than your 20th best player claim.

Elliott and Josh felt both far better. I also would have had Cameron ahead too. And I just think that regardless of what Daicos did in the first 3 quarters, he was absent in the 4th. That is his biggest issue. There are times when he has dragged Collingwood over the line but he is far more likely to be invisible when it matters.

And the arm flapping and yelling at umpires demanding free kicks and 50m penalties. If that was Nick Watson you lot would be trashing him relentlessly.

 

[ray_purchase]

A diving squib like Daicos will never be the GOAT. Wont even be in the discussion. Give up Collingwood supporters.

 

[doppleganger]

If he is "consistently great" in Finals then why dont the coaches echo this when they do the Gary Ayres votes?

Edited after PF vote release.

They usually do.

23 QF - DNP injured knee
23 PF - received coaches votes
23 GF - received coaches votes
25 QF - received coaches votes
25 PF - no votes

 

[sr36]

Collingwood supporters gracious as always, wasn’t Brisbane it was Collingwood. Taking it about as well as fat head Ed. Pathetic

Strange thread to be talking about the lack of graciousness of Pies supporters. It's a heap of Non-Pies talking about the best young kid in the comp we've seen since Chris Judd and claiming he's a seagull and a squib and carrying on when he's not best on ground despite playing a very good game - albeit with a couple of crucial missed tackles.

Brisbane were excellent - massacred us around stoppage and contest in general. Executed beautifully under pressure late in the game to exploit our comeback swarm. Dissected us with your kicking and really smart tactics to kick to a pack and box out our tall defenders for blokes at the front of the pack in the air and at ground level. Morris is an outstanding kid, just so smart and such a sacrificial game he played. But I don't think you defended the ground very well, which you have to against the Cats with their runners, particularly as it'll be stars ahead of the ball a heap - rather than Mason Cox. The selection of Cox assumed we could stop you kicking through us, so we'd have repeat entries into congestion, but we couldn't stop your spread and kicking game, so winning stoppage and moving it so easily and getting your forwardline set up meant you dictated the game.

However, you relied on goals in heavy congestion, be it pack marks or stoppages - I don't think that will work against the Cats. I think they'll be much stronger defensively than we were and much more efficient on fast breaks than we were. I can't really see how you'll beat them unless Fagan can pull a rabbit out of the hat, as I think with the lack of size up forward you'll have to aim for a similar style again and they'll torch you on transition in a way we were too sloppy and too weak ahead of the ball to do. I think it's going to be a smashing. Despite the 7th year in finals in a row, you've got a heap of kids in this team and it's been an outstanding effort to cover for crucial injuries, but I think you're in with little chance. Brisbane has developed really quickly into a fantastic footy club who is going to be thereabouts for a fair while to come - I just don't think this year is going to be a Premiership. I hope I'm wrong - I'll be barracking for Brissy.

 

[HBFlanker]

Will comfortably win the Brownlow tonight, but his performance in the last quarter on the weekend needs to be scrutinised.

Went missing unfortunately.

I nearly fell over when AFL.com had him as Collingwoods best player. Elliott and Darcy Cameron

14

Darcy Cameron

Age

30

Ht

204cm

Wt

103kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.3

1star

HB

2.7

2star

CL

0.3

2star

HO

5.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

CL

0.5

3star

HO

3.5

5star

D

6.0

2star

K

3.3

2star

HB

2.7

3star

CL

0.3

2star

HO

5.3

5star

were miles better

 

[sr36]

Will comfortably win the Brownlow tonight, but his performance in the last quarter on the weekend needs to be scrutinised.

Went missing unfortunately.

I nearly fell over when AFL.com had him as Collingwoods best player. Elliott and Darcy Cameron were miles better

I don't think he wins it this year.

 

[tmpies01]

Will comfortably win the Brownlow tonight, but his performance in the last quarter on the weekend needs to be scrutinised.

Went missing unfortunately.

I nearly fell over when AFL.com had him as Collingwoods best player. Elliott and Darcy Cameron were miles better

Not sure who mentioned it, could be Cornes… We relied too heavily on Nick’s run that he was likely gassed in the last quarter. It’s him or no one, and with Pendlebury going out early, it ruined other plans that we had in place. Domino effect.

Like Kane said, Nick can’t do it all. And he’s been carrying the club on his back for a long time. We need others to step up around him.

Not sure why people are calling him out over the other Pies players. It’s rare that he has a down quarter when his team needs him.

We really do forget that he’s only 22. Makes it all more impressive what he’s doing.

 

[HBFlanker]

Not sure who mentioned it, could be Cornes… We relied too heavily on Nick’s run that he was likely gassed in the last quarter. It’s him or no one, and with Pendlebury going out early, it ruined other plans that we had in place. Domino effect.

Like Kane said, Nick can’t do it all. And he’s been carrying the club on his back for a long time. We need others to step up around him.

Not sure why people are calling him out over the other Pies players. It’s rare that he has a down quarter when his team needs him.

We really do forget that he’s only 22. Makes it all more impressive what he’s doing.

The issue with Collingwood at the moment, for mine, is everythign goes through Nick. He is the Patrick Mahomes/Lebron James of Collingwood.

Its the underlying factor as to why Houston has been a bust. At Port, he was their playmaker. Their inside 50 kicker. Hes none of that at Collingwood, because they have a generational player in Nick, who does all that.

If he slows down, Collingwood slow down. I totally agree with Kane here.