POLL - Do you support KNEELING?

[Les Malone]

Soy is really unhealthy actually. I don't touch the stuff.

i sincerely doubt that

 

[DapperJong]

i sincerely doubt that

I ******* knew you were Wayne Glew.

 

[JackOutback]

An alternative narrative? Is a bit of everything possible ?

Some people are lazy is that disproportionate for indigenous australians? I don't know

"Not as clever as white people" how do you define cleverness ?, Taking a shot in front of goal? Making equity? now this is a landmine.
I've gone down the IQ and race rabbit hole, thoroughly interesting. Some of the things I've learnt : IQ is a great indicator for success in western society.
IQ does not establish a person's worth
Indigenous Australians score extremely low in IQ
Indigenous Australians score extremely high in visual memory IQ

If the above is true, you can assume from that indigenous people as a % will struggle in western society more then white people due to not having the problem solving skills that is required and that IQ predicts. That doesn't make IQ or society racist.
An analogy I can think off is Vo2 max and sprinting, just because black people are better at sprinting and vo2 max is a good predictor off top line speed it doesn't mean racing or vo2 max is racist.

I'm sure there is a nature vs nuture component as well.

Answer me this . If western society truly is racist and against indigenous or black people, why then are so many successful ?

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

I don't have the time at the moment to go through all of this, other than to say when people talk about systemic discrimination, they are referring to the system being weighted against them, a fact you seem to acknowledge by pointing out that 'western civilisation' is geared towards certain indicators that favour non-Indigenous people. And it's not enough to simply say that Indigenous people will therefore struggle because we can't change the rules of the game, because we can and there are advantages to doing so. Workplaces used to inherently favour males, females were seen as a disruptive element in many, but as society accepted that women had as much right to work as men, we started to accept that their differences could improve the workplace. That's the process we are in the early stages of now, learning to accept value in different points of view.

And exceptionalism doesn't demonstrate that discrimination doesn't exist. The fact that Barack Obama became president of the United States doesn't mean that black people don't experience disadvantage or discrimination, it simply means that he was exceptional enough to succeed despite the presence of disadvantage.

 

[Barrysballs]

I don't have the time at the moment to go through all of this, other than to say when people talk about systemic discrimination, they are referring to the system being weighted against them, a fact you seem to acknowledge by pointing out that 'western civilisation' is geared towards certain indicators that favour non-Indigenous people. And it's not enough to simply say that Indigenous people will therefore struggle because we can't change the rules of the game, because we can and there are advantages to doing so. Workplaces used to inherently favour males, females were seen as a disruptive element in many, but as society accepted that women had as much right to work as men, we started to accept that their differences could improve the workplace. That's the process we are in the early stages of now, learning to accept value in different points of view.

And exceptionalism doesn't demonstrate that discrimination doesn't exist. The fact that Barack Obama became president of the United States doesn't mean that black people don't experience disadvantage or discrimination, it simply means that he was exceptional enough to succeed despite the presence of disadvantage.

I suppose this is where we disagree, correct me if I'm wrong. There already is equality that we can agree to , as you are saying the discrimination is hidden and being outcome based must be racist because white people are better at the system. So You want to change the rules of the game which would then discriminate against white people and give black people irrespective of there ability a head start?

Your argument defines logic, every system is biased in the favour of those who are good at it

Should all white people start the 100m sprint at 90m mark to make up for a clearly discriminating system of track racing which being outcome based is in favour of people with black skin?

Of course not

 

[Maddo11]

Should all white people start the 100m sprint at 90m mark to make up for a clearly discriminating system of track racing which being outcome based is in favour of people with black skin?

You say this like persons of colour don't already start at the 110m mark when everyone else is up at 100.

 

[Barrysballs]

You say this like persons of colour don't already start at the 110m mark when everyone else is up at 100.

Not quite, POC or White you start at the 100m line in this country if you come from a 2 parent family.
The victim mentality which is being taught and believed is only causing harm

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Kummerspeck]

9

Not quite, POC or White you start at the 100m line in this country if you come from a 2 parent family.

There's literally nothing of value that says that this is the case

 

[Verdun]

You say this like persons of colour don't already start at the 110m mark when everyone else is up at 100.

Not quite, POC or White you start at the 100m line in this country if you come from a 2 parent family.
The victim mentality which is being taught and believed is only causing harm

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

The victims who get offended at those peacefully kneeling - yep agree.

 

[Dan26]

9
There's literally nothing of value that says that this is the case

Yes there is.

If you have a two-parent family, and you finish school, you are about 90% more likely to not be in poverty. Something like that anyway. Race has nothing to do with it.

I despise this racist attitude that all black people are the same. People should be treated as individuals. Do you think Barack Obama's kids are born into privilige? Yes. Lebron's James kids? Yes. Michael Jordan's kids? Yes. Countless others? Yes. What about a white family where I live out in the western suburbs of Melbourne that is on welfare generation after generation. Are they born into privilige? No.

That's the problem with identity politics and lumping all black people as being the same and all whites as being the same, Everyone is different and we should all be treated as individuals, not as members of a race.

And if we are going to play this identity politics game, why not do it with Asian Australians? Asian Australians are more successful than whites, make more money than whites, and do better at school? Using the leftie logic, shouldn't we be making up policies to help white people to deal with all that evil Asian privilige?

The left are very good at coming up with "NAMES" that you cant possible disagree with. Like "Black lives matter". Who would disagree with that name? But underneath is an undercurrent of extreme Marxism, hatred of capitalism, and obscene racism. Just look what they've done in Seattle today. Racial segregation is back, and just like in the 60's the left and Democrats are to blame.

 

[Verdun]

Like "Black lives matter". Who would disagree with that name? But underneath is an undercurrent of extreme Marxism, hatred of capitalism, and obscene racism.

Lots of labels goin on there, love identity politics Dan26??

 

[Dan26]

 

[RobbieK]

Yes there is.

If you have a two-parent family, and you finish school, you are about 90% more likely to not be in poverty. Something like that anyway. Race has nothing to do with it.

I despise this racist attitude that all black people are the same. People should be treated as individuals. Do you think Barack Obama's kids are born into privilige? Yes. Leborn's James kids? Yes. Michael Jordan's kids? Yes. Countless others? Yes. What about a white family where I live out in the western suburbs of Melbourne that is on welfare generation after generation. Are they born into privilige? No.

That's the problem with identity politics and lumping all black people as being the same and all whites as being the same, Everyone is different and we should all be treated as individuals, not as members of a race.

And if we are going to play this identity politics game, why not do it with Asian Australians? Asian Australias are more successful than whites, make more money than whites, and do better at school? Using the leftie logic, shouldn't we be making up policies to help white people to deal with all that evil Asian privilige.

The left are very good at coming up with "NAMES" that you cant possible disagree with. Like "Black lives matter". Whi would disagree with that name? But underneath is an undercurrent of extreme Marxism, hatred of capitalism, and obcene racism. Just look what they've done in seattle today. Racial segregation is back, and just like in the 60's the left and Democrats are to blame.

All this post demonstrates is that you have failed to understand what "white privilege" means.

It doesn't meant that all white people live relatively privileged lives. It doesn't mean that there aren't people of colour who live relatively privileged lives too.

What it means is that in our society race can be a barrier to success. If you are white, you have the privilege of not having to combat that prejudice. So white privilege just means that in all the hurdles you have to face in life, and we all have hurdles to a varying number and degree, your race isn't one of them. You may well face other significant barriers, possibly because of your socio-economic status, or your gender, or your sexuality, or your religion, or a disability.

The idea that everyone in our society is starting a 100m sprint at the same starting line is simply asinine. There are some people who are starting that sprint 1m from the finishing line. There are other people who are going to need to run a few laps of the oval before they even get to the start. There are a range of reasons for this. Race is one of them.

That you can name a couple of high profile people of colour who have managed to find success despite that barrier doesn't mean the barrier doesn't exist. It just means they had to work that much harder to overcome it. Some people are set so far behind the starting line that no amount of hard work can get them to the finish line.

 

[Dan26]

Lots of labels goin on there, love identity politics Dan26??

The left love identity politics. They have to love it, because it is their pathway to winning elections. Put everyone into a group, gaslight that group to make them think they are disadvantaged in the most equitable civilization the world has ever seen. Do this with as many groups as possible. Create a false narrative that there are black-hating racists everywhere (there aren't.) Rinse and repeat. If you make people believe absurdities, you can make them commit atrocities.

 

[Barrysballs]

9
There's literally nothing of value that says that this is the case

Nothing except all the research proving it?

Google is your friend


On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Verdun]

The left love identity politics. They have to love it, because it is their pathway to winning elections. Put everyone into a group, gaslight that group to make them think they are disadvantaged in the most equitable civilization the world has ever seen. Do this with as many groups as possible. Create a false narrative that there are black-hating racists everywhere (there aren't.) Rinse and repeat. If you make people believe absurdities, you can make them commit atrocities.

I have not mentioned left / right but why are you relying on identity politics??:

' extreme Marxism, hatred of capitalism, and obscene racism. '

 

[Dan26]

All this post demonstrates is that you have failed to understand what "white privilege" means.

I know exactly what it means and it;s absolute unmitigated rubbish.

It doesn't meant that all white people live relatively privileged lives. It doesn't mean that there aren't people of colour who live relatively privileged lives too.

What it means is that in our society race can be a barrier to success.

No it's not. Maybe it used to be, but not now.

CLASS can be a barrier to success. But not race.

So white privilege just means that in all the hurdles you have to face in life, and we all have hurdles to a varying number and degree, your race isn't one of them. You may well face other significant barriers, possibly because of your socio-economic status, or your gender, or your sexuality, or your religion.

What possible hurdles does a black person face in 2020 in western civilization? There are NO laws that discriminate against them. None. There is affirmative action which actually discriminates against white people. If you work hard, you will get a job, and be successful. I'm a manager and i've hired a number of black people, none of which had anything to do with race. I picked them because they would be good employees. if anything people are so anxious to prove they are not racist, that any discrimination goes the other way.

Not long ago, a white student was charged under 18C of the racial discrimination act because he called criticized a University computer classroom, which was "aboriginal only". So, by being ANTI-racist, he was charged with racism. Do you think if the roles were reversed an aboriginal would be charged? NO friggin way.

The idea that everyone in our society is starting a 100m sprint at the same starting line is simply asinine. There are some people who are starting that sprint 1m from the finishing line.

Class is the reason, and pretty much the only reason. Not race. No one cares about skin colour. Except you it seems.

If you are born into a two-parent family and you finish school, you will almost certainly not be in poverty, regardless of your skin colour. The Democrats in the USA destroyed the black family in the 60's by incentivizing women to have kids out of wedlock. The majority of all black criminals have no father growing up in their house.

 

[Kummerspeck]

Nothing except all the research proving it?

Yes there is.

There's no research in the Australian context that says that everyone from two parent families have identical or similar opportunities or outcomes regardless of race. Sorry.

Edit: I'm happy to learn, though. Please post where you got these ideas from.

 

[Dan26]

There's no research in the Australian context that says that everyone from two parent families have identical or similar opportunities or outcomes regardless of race. Sorry.

Edit: I'm happy to learn, though. Please post where you got these ideas from.

"Being raised in a married-couple household led the poverty rate for black children to go down 73 percent compared to mother-only households and 67 percent compared to father-only households. And as evidence of the power of family structure to transcend race, 31 percent of white children raised in mother-only households live in poverty, versus just 12 percent of black children living with their married parents. "

 

[Verdun]

"Being raised in a married-couple household led the poverty rate for black children to go down 73 percent compared to mother-only households and 67 percent compared to father-only households. And as evidence of the power of family structure to transcend race, 31 percent of white children raised in mother-only households live in poverty, versus just 12 percent of black children living with their married parents. "

Ummmmm that does not discount race or give a source, good work Dan26

 

[Kummerspeck]

"Being raised in a married-couple household led the poverty rate for black children to go down 73 percent compared to mother-only households and 67 percent compared to father-only households. And as evidence of the power of family structure to transcend race, 31 percent of white children raised in mother-only households live in poverty, versus just 12 percent of black children living with their married parents. "

Thank you for posting this unsourced section from a report from a conservative American think tank on family structures in the United States. It doesn't refute what I posted but thank you for your effort.

 

[Dan26]

Ummmmm that does not discount race or give a source, good work Dan26

Race has nothing to do with it. There are no policies that discriminate based on race anymore. Where you born in the CLASS structure, and whether you are born into a two-parent family will determine whether you are in poverty or not. Leftists like you seem to have a really low opinion of black people. You seem to think they are all just useless and can't make it in a country literally has NO laws that discriminate against them.

I'm sick of the left thinking that black people are stupid and need help. It's so disgustingly racist. One of the most intellectually dishonest narratives out there is that the left care about black people. They don't. They want them to continue thinking they are victims so that they keep voting for the political parties that give them money. The left have no incentive whatsoever to keep blacks out of poverty.

 

[Kummerspeck]

Race has nothing to do with it. There are no policies that discriminate based on race anymore. Where you born in the CLASS structure, and whether you are born into a two-parent family will determine whether you are in poverty or not. Leftists like you seem to have a really low opinion of black people. You seem to think they are all just useless and can't make it in a country literally has NO laws that discriminate against them.

This class structure seems like a bit of a bummer, and you're railing against it a fair bit. Sounds a bit leftist to me.

 

[RobbieK]

This class structure seems like a bit of a bummer, and you're railing against it a fair bit. Sounds a bit leftist to me.

Marxist even...

 

[Dan26]

Thank you for posting this unsourced section from a report from a conservative American think tank on family structures in the United States. It doesn't refute what I posted but thank you for your effort.

There is date out there everywhere on two parent families.

2 minute google search from the coversation. https://theconversation.com/one-in-four-children-from-single-parent-families-live-in-poverty-15097

"24.1% of children in one-parent households lived in poverty, up from 20.8% in 2001. The proportion of children from two-parent households decreased slightly throughout the decade, to 7.6% in 2010. "


There is data everywhere out there. The analysis on all this has been done. If you are both into a family with two parents you are almost certain to not be in poverty. It's not up to me to prove something so obvious. If you disagree with the norm, it's up to YOU to prove otherwise.

 

[Barrysballs]

There's no research in the Australian context that says that everyone from two parent families have identical or similar opportunities or outcomes regardless of race. Sorry.

Edit: I'm happy to learn, though. Please post where you got these ideas from.

My bad, I did extropolate from the numerous amounts of research done in western society countries.

I did like this as the new standard of evidence for this thread

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app