Game Day Pre-season Game v Bulldogs Saturday 1:10pm at Ikon Park

[Psicosis]

Feel sorry for Bonar having to play 3rd tall against a fwd line of Naughton, Lobbe, Jamara, and Darcy! I'd really like to see what he could do as a running half back don't know if he gets that opportunity. But if Corr is fit, you'd have to think he makes way, and personally feel that Young warrants selection over Perez at the moment.

Corr takes Bonars spot. However, the coaches would be well aware that what happened to a Bonar yesterday would have happened to Corr against that same forward line. Not many sides have 3 genuine KPD sized players, which is what we needed yesterday if we were going to get beaten so clearly in the middle.

 

[Masked Avenger]

Chom and Turner safe as houses.

Sugar looks reinvigorated this preseason. Chom needs games.

Perez, Bonar and Jack shouldn’t be playing firsts unless there’s nobody else available.

I expected more from Shiels too.

Don't get the Turner love Blackshadow. What does he bring that a Drury wouldn't?

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

We desperately need two damaging outside types that can accumulate the footy, and actually use the footy.

One across half back, and ideally one on the wing. Hard runners, who can find the footy at will.

A Sam Docherty or Bailey Dale type across half back.

A Bailey Smith or Andrew Gaff type on the wing.

We lacked it for so long. As much I’m happy with Brayden George I would’ve loved to have Lachie Cowan on the list developing as that half back distributor role.

I’m going to start off by saying that I really like all the players we have ended up with over the last three drafts, but:

We have been screaming for 4 types of players for years:

• skilful crumbing forwards who can actually kick goals and apply pressure
• proven skilful, hard running accumulating wingers
• hard running, metres gained type HB with killer smarts and skills
• KPF depth that actually take a mark

We drafted Drury through the rookie draft and move him from being a goal sneak to a HB playmaker, meanwhile 30% of our list are unproven or failed back flankers.
Goater and (especially) Bergman look like they could fill a running HB and a wing role in time. Meanwhile all our hopes are wrapped up in ensuring that 1)Comben can stay fit and 2)He is as actually good enough to make it.

 

[Psicosis]

Don't get the Turner love Blackshadow. What does he bring that a Drury wouldn't?

Well for one Drury is playing as a defender and has spent his first whole preseason training as one. And before “oh just throw him forward, he played their as a junior”, it’s a great way to completely shatter his confidence, the likelihood of it paying off would be low.

 

[ferball]

I would hope we will be looking right at Lorenz.

Would I transform our side? I guess its all relative.

 

[ferball]

Corr takes Bonars spot. However, the coaches would be well aware that what happened to a Bonar yesterday would have happened to Corr against that same forward line. Not many sides have 3 genuine KPD sized players, which is what we needed yesterday if we were going to get beaten so clearly in the middle.

Corr matched it with Buddy last year.

Frankly until our mids pull their fingers out then it doesn't matter who the third tall is against a side like that.

 

[Psicosis]

I’m going to start off by saying that I really like all the players we have ended up with over the last three drafts, but:

We have been screaming for 3 types of players for years:

• skilful crumbing forwards who can actually kick goals and apply pressure
• proven skilful, hard running accumulating wingers
• hard running, metres gained type HB with killer smarts and skills
• KPF depth that actually take a mark

We drafted Drury through the rookie draft and move him from being a goal sneak to a HB playmaker, meanwhile 30% of our list are unproven or failed back flankers.
Goater and (especially) Bergman look like they could fill a running HB and a wing role in time. Meanwhile all our hopes are wrapped up in ensuring that 1)Comben can stay fit and 2)He is as actually good enough to make it.

I keep hearing that Drury was a small forward/goal sneak…

The guy played predominantly midfield at CGS. Spent extended periods in the midfield at OakLeigh as well.

He isn’t some silver bullet to go forward and become the small we’ve been craving for a decade.

Clarkson has seen a HBF in him and I don’t really question his ability to identify small/medium defenders tbh.

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

I realise we still got flogged but we were playing, right? There are no North highlights here…

 

[berniemccarthy]

Goater will be one just need to find another...This kids got talent ...

Tucker.

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

I keep hearing that Drury was a small forward/goal sneak…

The guy played predominantly midfield at CGS. Spent extended periods in the midfield at OakLeigh as well.

He isn’t some silver bullet to go forward and become the small we’ve been craving for a decade.

Clarkson has seen a HBF in him and I don’t really question his ability to identify small/medium defenders tbh.

Neither do I. I do however find it strange that the recruitment team actively forsakes the small forward role while shifting aside the 15 or so players (many still untried) whose natural position is HB to make this Drury positional change work.

Look, we have to trust but many if the recruitment decisions over the last few years seem left of centre to say the least.

 

[Horace]

I think we were undone yesterday, firstly by the bulldogs having a four tall forward line, Darcy at 204 cm, Lobb, 207, Naughton 195 and Ugle- Hagan 197 versus Mckay at 201, Logue, 194 and Bonar at 188 as our tall defenders. With their midfield dominant our defence was never going to cope and Bonar must wonder why he is always asked to play against blokes who are giants compared to him. Dawson at 194 should have been there to just to take one of those ahead of Bonar.

Secondly, in contrast we had just two genuinely tall forwards in Larkey, 198 and Comben 199 versus three tall backs in Bruce, 198, Jones 197 and Keath 197. Comben was all at sea. Add to that the fact that when we came out of defence, our boys looked for Jones at every opportunity, just to help him slot back into the big time in the easiest possible fashion. Either Coleman-Jones should have played, to even things up or Goldy and Xerri should have rested up forward to try to even things up a bit.

Thirdly, in the second quarter, I felt that when the bulldogs kicked a couple of quick goals, we might have "dropped our bundle" a bit and thought, here we go again, nothing has changed. We carried that in to the third quarter unfortunately.

On a positive, note though, despite limited opportunities and the odds against him, Larkey kicked 3 goals.

I loved what I saw of Sheezel. Unless something goes wrong, this boy is going to give us much to be excited about in the years ahead.

Goater was good and his run down and tackle on one of the (many) players I detest at the bulldogs, Daniel, was a real highlight. Daniel has got away with too much against us in the past and Goater made him pay.

Bergman showed some good signs and kept ar it until the end.

He is much maligned here, but I thought Stevenson worked hard and did some nice things and if we can get to a stage where we have a forward line that can compete and at least bring the ball to ground, he, Sheezel and Curtis might reek havoc.

Logue was very good and will stiffen us up mightily, especially if he and McKay can work out how to combine together. McKay's game was off a bit until the last quarter. Also, I couldn't understand why Logue was doing some ruck work in defence. Surely that is the job for our ruckman to do, leaving Logue free to defend.

Anyway, I think we will improve by at least 50% this year. Three wins will get us there and who knows we might just win four or five.

Edit: I forgot Powell. Played very well and very good foot skills.

 

[ferball]

Anyway ... apart from Bailey Smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

(who will have games like LDU did last season this season,) the Bulldags midfield is essentially the same one that won them a flag a couple of months before we drafted Jy.

Meanwhile we had Powell, Phillips, Goater, Bergman, Sheezel, Curtis - all player drafted since covid started. We really missed Greenwood (or Jed) in the middle just to provide a big body. Frankly it wouldn't hurt to throw McDonald in there either, just for a bit of physicality.

 

[Le Grille]

Don't get the Turner love Blackshadow. What does he bring that a Drury wouldn't?

Turner was better than most yesterday if we are to reward performances he should play.

Long term I get it though

 

[Reginald0]

Add Corr and greenwood for some defence young too
for actual talent there is possibly maybe Stepho and TT
mystery man Tucker and forgotten man Taylor
also ccj
and lazz has certain abilities

so we have a few magnets on the board, which we will need
as I , and others no doubt keep saying, we have a fair few talented players but there doesn’t seem to be much teamwork, seems to be just a lack of awareness of the positioning of our guys v their guys in stoppages and general play
if they are just fundamentally better footballers precisely because they have those skills , and this is happening all over the park, then we are looking at the rebuild of all rebuilds

 

[Masked Avenger]

Well for one Drury is playing as a defender and has spent his first whole preseason training as one. And before “oh just throw him forward, he played their as a junior”, it’s a great way to completely shatter his confidence, the likelihood of it paying off would be low.

It's not about positions when discussing Turner. It's about is he best 23? A hard no for me and our time is better spent on unpacking the talents of younger players with likely more upside.

 

[Roosurgence]

Perez, Bonar, Turner and Chom are the ones who are in the gun for round 1 IMO

Ziebell should be, but you suspect he won’t?

He kills that back 6 structurally.

In fact I think Bonar is the one that gets burnt the most by Ziebell.

 

[Moti]

Here are my key takeaways 24 hours later:

- CCJ needs to play ahead of Xerri or Goldy. Not sure if he played at all yesterday, but we needed the flexible 3rd tall option. Interestingly we didn't use Goldy forward despite playing little in the ruck so not sure what the plan was e except that due to it being a praccy we erred on preservation than winning mentality;
- Sheezel showed in the final quarter why Jack should not be in the back 6, 7 or in the senior team. Played his role and was twice as effective. WE are trying to find Jack a spot and it shows. Shiels is the same.
- Goater is a wingman, not a HB. Should start there round 1;
- Scott has had a poor pre season and needs to be reflected in not being in the round 1 team;
- We have no small defenders or forwards, other clubs have 3-4, sad;
- Corr is definitely needed. Not sure what the rest of the back 6 looks like though as only LMac should be guaranteed and that is only because he is the captain. I would go with one of Bonar/Young, Hall (yes we need that run) and then throw a blanket over the other who needs to be a runner;
- Our midfield is too slow, I worry about the mix with Cunners despite the fact he played well. We would comfortably be the slowest team in the AFL and without TT, Hall and Wardlaw playing decent time this year, I have already rubbed 3-4 wins off my initial thoughts.
- Powell is a gun and should be playing decent centre square minutes. Philips was better later in the game after a poor start so hopefully it isn't just a reflection of the Dogs trailing off and more about his rhythm improving. I wonder if he has ever sprinted without looking like he is sitting at a desk;

 

[Roosurgence]

It's not about positions when discussing Turner. It's about is he best 23? A hard no for me and our time is better spent on unpacking the talents of younger players with likely more upside.

Turner was ok yesterday. Unless we are going to turnover a massive amount of players from yesterday, then I can’t see him losing his spot.

But like most, you would hope by mid season or earlier we have moved on and he is playing VFL.

 

[Le Grille]

I just don’t see it with Bonar I’d bring in Corr for him.

 

[spurs]

Ziebell should be, but you suspect he won’t?

He kills that back 6 structurally.

In fact I think Bonar is the one that gets burnt the most by Ziebell.

JZ will play round 1, but I suspect he will be phased out by the end of this year. Bonar needs a matchup that works. No more playing on the gorilla forwards, that’s not his job.

 

[Roosurgence]

Here are my key takeaways 24 hours later:

- CCJ needs to play ahead of Xerri or Goldy. Not sure if he played at all yesterday, but we needed the flexible 3rd tall option. Interestingly we didn't use Goldy forward despite playing little in the ruck so not sure what the plan was e except that due to it being a praccy we erred on preservation than winning mentality;
- Sheezel showed in the final quarter why Jack should not be in the back 6, 7 or in the senior team. Played his role and was twice as effective. WE are trying to find Jack a spot and it shows. Shiels is the same.
- Goater is a wingman, not a HB. Should start there round 1;
- Scott has had a poor pre season and needs to be reflected in not being in the round 1 team;
- We have no small defenders or forwards, other clubs have 3-4, sad;
- Corr is definitely needed. Not sure what the rest of the back 6 looks like though as only LMac should be guaranteed and that is only because he is the captain. I would go with one of Bonar/Young, Hall (yes we need that run) and then throw a blanket over the other who needs to be a runner;
- Our midfield is too slow, I worry about the mix with Cunners despite the fact he played well. We would comfortably be the slowest team in the AFL and without TT, Hall and Wardlaw playing decent time this year, I have already rubbed 3-4 wins off my initial thoughts.
- Powell is a gun and should be playing decent centre square minutes. Philips was better later in the game after a poor start so hopefully it isn't just a reflection of the Dogs trailing off and more about his rhythm improving. I wonder if he has ever sprinted without looking like he is sitting at a desk;

Agree. Corr should replace Ziebell and Hall replaces Perez and then that backline starts to look a million times better.

Bonar is the interesting one. Does he look better when played in a position where he isn’t having to defend a tall. I can take or leave Bonar and would hope we have options pushing to take that spot.

I’m a big Chom fan and think he could be the missing piece. But we need a lot more than we got that yesterday. It’s like he is too hyped up and not settled. He plays like a chook with its head cut off. Let’s hope that’s a settling and experience thing.

What do you do with Sheezel? In a perfect world you have two of him. One up forward and one down back. Kid oozes quality and it’s no coincidence when the ball was in his hands we looked better coming out of the back half. Thomas is he wasn’t such a flog should be playing that role.

So many holes and gaps and a long way to go. We are starting to accumulate some genuine talent but still a lot of list cloggers to remove.

 

[spurs]

.
- Scott has had a poor pre season and needs to be reflected in not being in the round 1 team

Has he? What happened?

 

[Roosurgence]

JZ will play round 1, but I suspect he will be phased out by the end of this year. Bonar needs a matchup that works. No more playing on the gorilla forwards, that’s not his job.

Bit that is the issue when you have Ziebell in that back 6. It throws the balance out. Both should not be in the same team.

At the moment we seem happy to play an unbalanced back 6 to accomodate Ziebell.

If anyone other than bringing experience is able to tell me what Ziebell brings to that back 6 I would love to know?

Can’t defend. Can’t provide third man coverage and can’t play the role of a distributor. Yes he is courageous, but he has to be because he can’t get himself into position to impact the contest in our favour.

 

[Roosurgence]

Has he? What happened?

The biggest knock I have on Scott is that he is a poor man’s Sam Gibson which is not flattering at all.

He just finds the worst times to fumble and slow down play.

 

[spurs]

Bit that is the issue when you have Ziebell in that back 6. It throws the balance out. Both should not be in the same team.

At the moment we seem happy to play an unbalanced back 6 to accomodate Ziebell.

If anyone other than bringing experience is able to tell me what Ziebell brings to that back 6 I would love to know?

Can’t defend. Can’t provide third man coverage and can’t play the role of a distributor. Yes he is courageous, but he has to be because he can’t get himself into position to impact the contest in our favour.

Not saying JZ should be in the team, but I think Clarko wants to play him first. Hall and Corr are desperately needed in our backline IMO.