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Topkent

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Israel Folau should be allowed to play RL.
Doesn't matter how stupid his religious beliefs are
 

Jordie_tackles

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Israel Folau should be allowed to play RL.
Doesn't matter how stupid his religious beliefs are
I can see your point, but also you can’t just say the things he says in the public eye he is in. It isn’t that he can’t have those opinions but if the league doesn’t want to deal with it and agree with it then I think it is a fair road block to him playing.
 

Topkent

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I can see your point, but also you can’t just say the things he says in the public eye he is in. It isn’t that he can’t have those opinions but if the league doesn’t want to deal with it and agree with it then I think it is a fair road block to him playing.
So you think all Muslims who make their wives wear burkas shouldn't be allowed to work in Australia?
 

Topkent

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I don’t want to have a big argument on this topic but burkas were not the opinions I was referring to.
That's fine neither do I. But I'd doubt you agree with people saying no Muslims are ever allowed to work for their company because of their religious beliefs then.
 

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Russian Demon

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So you think all Muslims who make their wives wear burkas shouldn't be allowed to work in Australia?
Wearing a burka isn't in conflict with the law. And if he comes out swinging in the media saying all women have to wear them then he'll run into more issues.

Sport is a business. If an employee continually uses the media to promote ideas in conflict with the law, then enough people will shun the business as to make it a good business decision to not employ them.

If you think this is about ideals and not dollars you've got rocks in your head.
 

Dory_77

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Yeah League has enough blokes with sketchy records running around (tbh, AFL is probably similar) to suggest it isn't some principled stand they're taking to not sign Falou.

Would the $ he brings scoring tries outweigh the $ lost from folks who think he's a dickhead?
 

Proper Gander

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I agree with Topkent (and am as surprised as anyone).

Folau has some out there beliefs that are almost certainly upsetting to some. But he’s not Robinson Crusoe on that Island.

He’s not being punished for his beliefs as such, more for his urge to share them on public platforms that get seen by media and then sponsors.

This stuff is always going to happen though. I would let him play as a sportsman for as long as he is skilled enough to deserve a spot. The other stuff, his public views, will surely get called out by people who disagree etc.

I’m as lefty, pinko, socialist, princess, w***er as they come but I’m uncomfortable with stripping a talented person of the job they do well for the reason that he speaks on another platform of views people don’t like (I totally hate his views for what it is worth)
 

Topkent

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Wearing a burka isn't in conflict with the law. And if he comes out swinging in the media saying all women have to wear them then he'll run into more issues.

Sport is a business. If an employee continually uses the media to promote ideas in conflict with the law, then enough people will shun the business as to make it a good business decision to not employ them.

If you think this is about ideals and not dollars you've got rocks in your head.
Neither is having a religious belief
 

Topkent

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I agree with Topkent (and am as surprised as anyone).

Folau has some out there beliefs that are almost certainly upsetting to some. But he’s not Robinson Crusoe on that Island.

He’s not being punished for his beliefs as such, more for his urge to share them on public platforms that get seen by media and then sponsors.

This stuff is always going to happen though. I would let him play as a sportsman for as long as he is skilled enough to deserve a spot. The other stuff, his public views, will surely get called out by people who disagree etc.

I’m as lefty, pinko, socialist, princess, w***er as they come but I’m uncomfortable with stripping a talented person of the job they do well for the reason that he speaks on another platform of views people don’t like (I totally hate his views for what it is worth)
It's not really a belief if you can't share it is it?

Then it's just an internal thought.
 

Proper Gander

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It's not really a belief if you can't share it is it?

Then it's just an internal thought.
Dunno. But I imagine he regards himself as a evangelist or something, so telling him to keep his ideas to himself probably isn’t going to work because sharing the Word is part of his mission and all.

I‘m not sure he does that much harm. His views are so out there, people mostly laugh or dismiss it as sh*t. I haven’t met anyone yet who is modelling their life on the utterings of Issy Folau, anyway. And it’s not like he preaches from the football field. I reckon just let him play and people will unfollow him on Twitter if they reckon his beliefs are stupid. Sorted. Most people wouldn’t even be aware of this if news.com weren’t one step behind him waiting for him to post some drivel about homosexuals and the devil
 

Topkent

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Dunno. But I imagine he regards himself as a evangelist or something, so telling him to keep his ideas to himself probably isn’t going to work because sharing the Word is part of his mission and all.

I‘m not sure he does that much harm. His views are so out there, people mostly laugh or dismiss it as sh*t. I haven’t met anyone yet who is modelling their life on the utterings of Issy Folau, anyway. And it’s not like he preaches from the football field. I reckon just let him play and people will unfollow him on Twitter if they reckon his beliefs are stupid. Sorted. Most people wouldn’t even be aware of this if news.com weren’t one step behind him waiting for him to post some drivel about homosexuals and the devil
I also think it's healthier to let him have that crazy person opinion, and then just let everyone tell him how crazy he is.

Let people come to games with rainbow signs that say fu** Izzy for all I care. Bottom line he should still be able to earn a living.
 

Proper Gander

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I also think it's healthier to let him have that crazy person opinion, and then just let everyone tell him how crazy he is.

Let people come to games with rainbow signs that say fu** Izzy for all I care. Bottom line he should still be able to earn a living.
There is something to be said for letting nutters stay out in the open and visible. Once you censor views then crazies are driven underground which can become more problematic because they get a martyr complex and feel they are being suppressed and vilified which tends to strengthen their convictions. And people who believe they are under attack can get pretty nasty.

I get that there is now a bit of a crackdown on media disinformation etc where it can incite insurrection and violence, though I’m not too sure where it all ends at this point.

But Folau doesn’t seem to quite fit that category. I haven’t read anywhere that he advocates gay bashing (having said that, I haven’t paid close attention to his pronouncements). He’s more just promoting a fundamentalist Christian view that homosexuality is a sin. It’s not exactly new or surprising. Most traditional religions take a pretty dim view of homosexuality if the person takes a literal approach to scripture. I think their views are dead stupid but you can’t chase every religious person out of their employment. Just put in place some regular workplace rules that prevent hassling colleagues with religious or political crap in the workplace, or spouting general bigoted stuff in any setting that represents your employer.
 

Russian Demon

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I also think it's healthier to let him have that crazy person opinion, and then just let everyone tell him how crazy he is.

Let people come to games with rainbow signs that say fu** Izzy for all I care. Bottom line he should still be able to earn a living.
He can earn a living, just not with a company that feels their sales and revenue are put at risk by the fact he goes out of his way to espouse them publicly.

Honestly, wouldn't matter if it was that he liked pineapple on pizza if the NRL watching public decided that was heinous enough to stop spending their hard earned on the code.

Why is this being dragged into some religious freedom debate when its not. He can say what he likes, just doesn't get to force a business to employ him if saying it goes against their rules.

Not liking gay people isnt a belief that is made more legitimate because you attribute it to a magic fairy.
 

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