Rate these 4 players

[LouisCK]

How is Henderson miles ahead of Watts currently?

He isn't, that guy is trolling.

Watts and Hurley didn't have, statistically speaking, much difference in 2011.

To say Henderson is miles in front of Watts is so insane that it can't be anything other than trolling.

 

[Donakebab]

He isn't, that guy is trolling.

Watts and Hurley didn't have, statistically speaking, much difference in 2011.

To say Henderson is miles in front of Watts is so insane that it can't be anything other than trolling.

Except they played much different rolls, Hurley had a much better year than Watts, yet again showing that just looking at stats is stupid.


But yeah he's trolling, Henderson may be slightly ahead of Watts currently, but I'd take Watts in the long run.


Up to date:
1. Reid
2. Hurley
3. Henderson
4. Watts

2012 onwards:
1. Hurley
2. Reid
3. Watts
4. Henderson

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Next year

1. Hurley
2. Reid
3. Watts
4. Henderson

Swap Reid and Watts for the next ten years. Hurley is my preference; a potential matchwinner at either end. Reid is a quality defender but not a game breaker. Watts is coming along well and should be a force within the next couple of years. Henderson can play a role and may become a reliable player but is a fair way off the other three.

 

[Monkey King]

To say Henderson is miles in front of Watts is so insane that it can't be anything other than trolling.

Given this thread lists only KPP's I think it fair to rate output on that basis and IMO Hendo has handled KP's at either end better than Watts. I wouldn't personally say he's miles in front, but it seems you'd be perturbed even at the notion of cm's.

 

[invinciBlues]

Watts is coming along well and should be a force within the next couple of years. Henderson can play a role and may become a reliable player but is a fair way off the other three.

I think its fairer to say both Henderson and Watts are a fair way off the other two. People who have watts at 2 or 1 over tens years, I have to ask, what have you seen that makes you think he'll be a top rated KPP?

Sure I saw him pick up a lot of possessions, but I never saw him have much of an impact playing in the spine (if at all). 3rd tall down back is hardly much to rate him on, and he didn't seem to provide much around stoppages or at ground level.

Its pretty safe to say that he and Hendo are about the same mark atm, with Hendo ahead slightly purely based on the fact he's played on some tougher opponents. But there's a decent gap between these two and Hurley and Reid. To say Watts will be rated higher than any of the other 3 in ten years is nothing but unadulterated speculation.

 

[LouisCK]

Yeah that was kind of my point before about Watts.

I don't even know if he'll stay as a KPP, and you certainly couldn't pin him as one in 2011.

He played midfield, wing, backline, forwardline in 2011. Sometimes as a big, sometimes as a mid-sized player.

Like I said before, he reminds me of Kouta. Nobody would ever say Kouta was a gun KPP. But you'd say he was a gun big man. That's where I think Watts is heading.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

For those non-Melbourne supporters ranking Watts as likely to be either the best or second best in the group after ten years (and that seems to be the consensus or close to it): Can I ask what it is about him that makes you confident he'll be one of the better players

He's a good kick, very good agility/athleticism for a big guy and his only real weakness is weakness itself. Once he bulks up he will be far more confident and aggressive at the contest. It's not easy competing against 95-100kg full backs when you're < 90kgs.

 

[Ambrosia]

Sam I'd have 5th and 1st/2nd

So it was Ben you were referring to. So you have Hurley being better next year but Reid better in 10?? Curios to hear why??

 

[Gone Critical]

Next Year
Reid
Hurley
Henderson
Watts

10 Years

Hurley
Reid
Watts
Henderson

Reid is the most established and already AA. I think he has a great long term future as a premier backman of the game. Definitely 1st pick for next year but has enough talent to maybe be the best in the longterm

Hurley is developing v well and may break out next year but Reid more reliable choice. However he has an Xfactor about he that makes him the no 1 choice for the long term based on that bad word potential

Henderson Solid and developing but probably not elite in the long term which Hurley and Reid could look forward to

Watts Least developed and shown the least so far but occasional glimpses and initial no 1 rating mean he is a good chance to go past Henderson in the long term. Not impossible but wouldn't expect him to match the 1st two

 

[Blue and Silver]

Yeah that was kind of my point before about Watts.

I don't even know if he'll stay as a KPP, and you certainly couldn't pin him as one in 2011.

He played midfield, wing, backline, forwardline in 2011. Sometimes as a big, sometimes as a mid-sized player.

Like I said before, he reminds me of Kouta. Nobody would ever say Kouta was a gun KPP. But you'd say he was a gun big man. That's where I think Watts is heading.

I'd say Kouta destroyed teams as a CHB.

Unless Watts can become a presence up forward I'd say he is better off using his skills and smarts up field and becoming a damaging Jared Brennan/Richo style tall outside mid.

 

[le dominateur]

Yeah that was kind of my point before about Watts.

I don't even know if he'll stay as a KPP, and you certainly couldn't pin him as one in 2011.

He played midfield, wing, backline, forwardline in 2011. Sometimes as a big, sometimes as a mid-sized player.

Like I said before, he reminds me of Kouta. Nobody would ever say Kouta was a gun KPP. But you'd say he was a gun big man. That's where I think Watts is heading.

Kouta won the MVP in 2000, and absolutely destroyed teams, can't see Watts getting even close to this standard.

 

[HurleyTheFuture]

I may be wrong but I cannot remember when Hurley has been beaten in defence

 

[invinciBlues]

Like I said before, he reminds me of Kouta. Nobody would ever say Kouta was a gun KPP. But you'd say he was a gun big man. That's where I think Watts is heading.

Watts is nothing at all like Koutoufides. Sure, Kouta was an absolute superstar in the middle for sure, but yeah, you'd also say he was a gun KPP. Even held his own in the ruck from time to time. But he was a true utility. Anywhere you'd put Kouta you could be sure he'd have an impact.

And at stoppages and at ground level? Forget about it. Kouta was really in his own at this. Just loop it over their heads and *bam*. Another clearance/away from congestion.

Watts is really lacking in those two areas. Two areas that Kouta excelled at. So I kinda wonder why you're drawing a comparison between the two. I've just made a mental note to watch more melbourne games this year and see if there's something I missed. Its a real boon for your mob if they do have the next Kouta. Especially with the advances made in injury management over the years.

 

[David the Cat]

I like Reid...( and really like the Sydney member of the family as well!! )...


This year will be the making of Ben Reid IMO. It has been a long time since I have seen a player so demoralised as Ben Reid was in the GF. The look on his face, the utter desperation, was palpable, and while excuses can be made for him, it doesn't change the fact he has experienced the worst of all on the big stage.

Now we move to 2012...I think it may well make the guy...and he will come back better than ever for the experience. All the great players have been given a bath at some stage of their careers ( though perhaps not in a GF ...though I am sure there are examples ) and come back stronger and I sincerely hope that is the case with the young bloke. I will be particularly interested when he has to handle the big bodied CHF's ( Brown, Hawkins, Franklin )...

For me...

2011 Reid, Hurley Watts Henderson

2012 No change ( if Reid can bounce back )

10 years? well who knows.....maybe...Watts Hurley Reid ( no particular order...Watts will be very good too ........................................Henderson.


Sam Reid might be better than all of them.

 

[Donakebab]

Watts is nothing at all like Koutoufides. Sure, Kouta was an absolute superstar in the middle for sure, but yeah, you'd also say he was a gun KPP. Even held his own in the ruck from time to time. But he was a true utility. Anywhere you'd put Kouta you could be sure he'd have an impact.

And at stoppages and at ground level? Forget about it. Kouta was really in his own at this. Just loop it over their heads and *bam*. Another clearance/away from congestion.

Watts is really lacking in those two areas. Two areas that Kouta excelled at. So I kinda wonder why you're drawing a comparison between the two. I've just made a mental note to watch more melbourne games this year and see if there's something I missed. Its a real boon for your mob if they do have the next Kouta. Especially with the advances made in injury management over the years.

He could win the occasional hit out around the ground when no real tall was around, but if you thought he could actually compete as a ruckman than you're kidding yourself.

 

[LouisCK]

Watts is nothing at all like Koutoufides. Sure, Kouta was an absolute superstar in the middle for sure, but yeah, you'd also say he was a gun KPP. Even held his own in the ruck from time to time. But he was a true utility. Anywhere you'd put Kouta you could be sure he'd have an impact.

And at stoppages and at ground level? Forget about it. Kouta was really in his own at this. Just loop it over their heads and *bam*. Another clearance/away from congestion.

Watts is really lacking in those two areas. Two areas that Kouta excelled at. So I kinda wonder why you're drawing a comparison between the two. I've just made a mental note to watch more melbourne games this year and see if there's something I missed. Its a real boon for your mob if they do have the next Kouta. Especially with the advances made in injury management over the years.

Kouta in 2000 was the best player I've ever seen not named Carey. I wasn't saying Watts is as good, But at the same point of their careers there isn't much difference.

The fact you said Watts struggles at ground level makes it shockingly obvious you've seen very little of him. Its by far the best part of his game.

Seriously, I wasn't saying Watts is or will be as good as a prime Kouta - he has to prove it on field before anyone can even suggest that. But that's definitely the player that he reminds me of the most. The similarities far outweigh the differences imo. Kouta was always a player without a position, until he started peaking around 98 and submitted quite possibly the most dominant single season I've ever seen in 2000. Like you said, he's a true utility.

That's exactly how I see Watts. He isn't going to strictly be a CHF, nor a CHB (even though he will play time at both positions depending on matchups). He'll spend time in the middle, and on the wing.

He's very much a Pav/Kouta/Goodes type player, but he's a work in progress (notably, none of those three guys set the world on fire their first 3 seasons either). I just think Kouta is the closest because Watts and Kouta both kill it at ground level.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Ben Reid's last game was a poor one, as he was rag-dolled by Hawkins who had been seriously questioned for his footy nouse and courage. I would like to believe that Reid's injuries prevented him from applying sufficient force against Hawkins. I also believe that great players can play through injury in these circumstances as Steve Johnson did.

For that reason, my order is: Hurley, Reid, Watts, Henderson.

 

[Fadge]

Ben Reid's last game was a poor one, as he was rag-dolled by Hawkins who had been seriously questioned for his footy nouse and courage. I would like to believe that Reid's injuries prevented him from applying sufficient force against Hawkins. I also believe that great players can play through injury in these circumstances as Steve Johnson did.

For that reason, my order is: Hurley, Reid, Watts, Henderson.

Johnson's role was a little different to Reid's. If N. Brown was fit, Reid would not have played throughout the finals series.

Regardless of that game, I'd pick Hurley ahead of Reid. Hurley has shown signs of being a superstar of the game, with the potential to win games off his own boot. They don't come along every day.

 

[Fadge]

He's very much a Pav/Kouta/Goodes type player, but he's a work in progress (notably, none of those three guys set the world on fire their first 3 seasons either). I just think Kouta is the closest because Watts and Kouta both kill it at ground level.

Though Goodes won a Brownlow in year 5.

Should we get on Jack for 2013? What odds?

 

[themidlandmaster]

I like Reid...( and really like the Sydney member of the family as well!! )...


This year will be the making of Ben Reid IMO. It has been a long time since I have seen a player so demoralised as Ben Reid was in the GF. The look on his face, the utter desperation, was palpable, and while excuses can be made for him, it doesn't change the fact he has experienced the worst of all on the big stage.

Now we move to 2012...I think it may well make the guy...and he will come back better than ever for the experience. All the great players have been given a bath at some stage of their careers ( though perhaps not in a GF ...though I am sure there are examples ) and come back stronger and I sincerely hope that is the case with the young bloke. I will be particularly interested when he has to handle the big bodied CHF's ( Brown, Hawkins, Franklin )...

For me...

2011 Reid, Hurley Watts Henderson

2012 No change ( if Reid can bounce back )

10 years? well who knows.....maybe...Watts Hurley Reid ( no particular order...Watts will be very good too ........................................Henderson.


Sam Reid might be better than all of them.

I can't see Reid doing that. Tarrant is a pure stopper, so he plays on the gorillas. Reid's thumping 50 metre kicks see him take the second tall usually. When N Brown returns he'll take over Tarrant's job

 

[LouisCK]

Though Goodes won a Brownlow in year 5.

Should we get on Jack for 2013? What odds?

Personally I wouldn't use the brownlow as any kind of indication to a players worth.

I've seen Woewodin win one, and both Yze and Trav Johnstone finish top 5. If Watts doesn't end up better than all of them I'll be pretty pissed off.

 

[AG]

I wouldn't put a line through Watts being a key position player. Once he fills out and therefore gains more confidence with his body he should be fine at CHF.

He looks better roaming around the ground right now but in 2 years he might be a 50+ goal key forward. I wouldn't make the comparisons with Goodes/Kouta/Pav/Richo just yet. There are some similarities there but hopefully he becomes a powerhouse key forward.

 

[Rustin Cohle]

I may be wrong but I cannot remember when Hurley has been beaten in defence

You've obviously never watched a Collingwood vs. Essendon match then.

 

[HurleyTheFuture]

You've obviously never watched a Collingwood vs. Essendon match then.

When was this I may have forgotten but I still love him as a defender as seen this year against Riewoldt, Tippet and JPod

 

[Obeanie1]

Now:

1. Reid
2. Hurley
3. Watts
4. Henderson

10 years:

1. Hurley
2. Watts
3. Reid
4. Henderson

Pretty much how I see it as well but I must admit that a couple of times later in the season Watts impressed me with how athletic he is and also with his skills. A big lad and I wouldn't be surprised at all if he turns out to be the best of this group and AA quality.

Hurley is a beast of a competitor and also highly skilled, a bit more mongrel in him as well.

Ried is hard to judge as he has been surrounded by an absolute gun side but has shown plenty and is also a very good player.

Henderson is a definate 4th in this group to date and will need to keep improving to leap up these rankings. Looks a better defender than forward to date.