Ross Lyon sacked.

[Goomba1973]

Mitchell knows he needs a few years. Smart guy and will be a premiership coach. Wife hated living in Perth.

Only want Caracalla or Ratten.

I think Suma would be a great fit. (yes he played for WC but he is a South Freo Boy at Heart). Highly credentialed coach at AFL Level as an assistant, WAFL as a head coach, Under 18s state team. Fremantle IMO need a Fremantle Identity. Bringing Worsfold to the club for WC was brilliant in what it did for attracting members, sponsors, on field success because he had a great history with the local footy public and the locals could relate to him.

 

[F_therest]

*looks at player list"

Levi Casboult

ends discussion.

Was that meant to be an insult to Carlton?

You do realise Casboult has been a gun KPP/support ruck and the best swingman in the comp this year don't you?

 

[Forward Press]

Was that meant to be an insult to Carlton?

You do realise Casboult has been a gun KPP/support ruck and the best swingman in the comp this year don't you?

Even if Casboult was still a spud or list clogger who cares? Carlton have their own crap to deal with as they look to push up the table with a new coach, I doubt they or their fans really care how Freo manage their list.

The only way Freo can become successful is by not comparing themselves to other clubs and forging their own path. Sadly it appears a fair proportion of their fans still define themselves as 'not the evil mob down the road' or 'well at least we didn't draft Paddy McCartin suck s*** Sainters'.

 

[F_therest]

Even if Casboult was still a spud or list clogger who cares? Carlton have their own crap to deal with as they look to push up the table with a new coach, I doubt they or their fans really care how Freo manage their list.

The only way Freo can become successful is by not comparing themselves to other clubs and forging their own path. Sadly it appears a fair proportion of their fans still define themselves as 'not the evil mob down the road' or 'well at least we didn't draft Paddy McCartin suck s*** Sainters'.

This is true.

Quite concerning if true about the meddling from Rosich (and possibly even Bell) in list management decisions from the Fox Sports article...apparently list management team wasn't that keen on Hogan, likely due to his foot and possible behavioural concerns, but sounds like Rosich demanded they do the deal.

From list management POV, Freo had been crying out for key forwards for ages, and yes they've seemingly sorted that issue out with Hogan/Lobb/Taberner...although there are still question marks on those 3. McCarthy & Kersten were OK deals at the time although neither have worked out.

But with losing Neale and very likely B Hill & Langdon, that's a big hit to Freo's midfield stocks. All mature players and 2 stars + a good player in that group...there will be a lot of pressure on Fyfe to carry the midfield next year, and guys like Cerra/Brayshaw/Blakely will need to step up but it's a shallow midfield unless you get Tim Kelly.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

I'm surprised Freo held on to him as long as they did. He's a terrible coach.

 

[Priddis Is Done]

The 2 things West coasts fans fear in life are.

1. west coast getting the wooden spoon
2. freo winning the flag.

Here's looking forward to the next 25 years being just as rubbish as the last 25 years.

Big ask, because it's been a truly awful, putrid, shambolic and amateurish diabolical journey.

Cockburns journey is better than any comedy show I've seen.

 

[Silent Alarm]

This is true.

Quite concerning if true about the meddling from Rosich (and possibly even Bell) in list management decisions from the Fox Sports article...apparently list management team wasn't that keen on Hogan, likely due to his foot and possible behavioural concerns, but sounds like Rosich demanded they do the deal.

From list management POV, Freo had been crying out for key forwards for ages, and yes they've seemingly sorted that issue out with Hogan/Lobb/Taberner...although there are still question marks on those 3. McCarthy & Kersten were OK deals at the time although neither have worked out.

But with losing Neale and very likely B Hill & Langdon, that's a big hit to Freo's midfield stocks. All mature players and 2 stars + a good player in that group...there will be a lot of pressure on Fyfe to carry the midfield next year, and guys like Cerra/Brayshaw/Blakely will need to step up but it's a shallow midfield unless you get Tim Kelly.

I think the Fox Sports article got it wrong about Bell, Rosich, and Ross Lyon with the Jesse Hogan trade.

Bell wasn't keen on him. Foot injury, wrong mindset, lots of innuendo about his 'dedication.' He was overruled by Rosich and Lyon because they saw Hogan as a great boost to dwindling membership and a possible short-term fix that'd shore up their flaky contract future.

Regarding Kersten, he was never going to be a great player. Freo took too long to focus on WA talent and bringing Perth boys home. The club went way too far and got in inevitable list cloggers like Shane Kersten, Travis Colyer, and Rhys Conca. I don't mind Kersto though simply because he hates Rosich and Ross Lyon.

McCarthy's best football was in support of Jeremy Cameron and Jon Patton at the Giants. He's always omitted when Hogan and Lobb are both in the forward line, but it's obvious that's when he should actually be playing. He's also getting dropped constantly and it's very, very obvious he's the sort of personality who needs some mollycoddling. He should be patronised for 4-6 games so he builds a rapport with the two proper key forwards and also gets some confidence.

I hope the next coach sees that.

 

[ziad]

I think the Fox Sports article got it wrong about Bell, Rosich, and Ross Lyon with the Jesse Hogan trade.

Bell wasn't keen on him. Foot injury, wrong mindset, lots of innuendo about his 'dedication.' He was overruled by Rosich and Lyon because they saw Hogan as a great boost to dwindling membership and a possible short-term fix that'd shore up their flaky contract future.

Regarding Kersten, he was never going to be a great player. Freo took too long to focus on WA talent and bringing Perth boys home. The club went way too far and got in inevitable list cloggers like Shane Kersten, Travis Colyer, and Rhys Conca. I don't mind Kersto though simply because he hates Rosich and Ross Lyon.

McCarthy's best football was in support of Jeremy Cameron and Jon Patton at the Giants. He's always omitted when Hogan and Lobb are both in the forward line, but it's obvious that's when he should actually be playing. He's also getting dropped constantly and it's very, very obvious he's the sort of personality who needs some mollycoddling. He should be patronised for 4-6 games so he builds a rapport with the two proper key forwards and also gets some confidence.

I hope the next coach sees that.

What Fox got it wrong?

 

[rumply]

Because he got hair plugs. Brent Guerra used to flog them for some hair studio, rocks up at the Dockers as an assistant, and a few weeks later ol' Ross's hair is instantly looking healthier.

can 100% confirm

 

[F_therest]

I think the Fox Sports article got it wrong about Bell, Rosich, and Ross Lyon with the Jesse Hogan trade.

Bell wasn't keen on him. Foot injury, wrong mindset, lots of innuendo about his 'dedication.' He was overruled by Rosich and Lyon because they saw Hogan as a great boost to dwindling membership and a possible short-term fix that'd shore up their flaky contract future.

Regarding Kersten, he was never going to be a great player. Freo took too long to focus on WA talent and bringing Perth boys home. The club went way too far and got in inevitable list cloggers like Shane Kersten, Travis Colyer, and Rhys Conca. I don't mind Kersto though simply because he hates Rosich and Ross Lyon.

McCarthy's best football was in support of Jeremy Cameron and Jon Patton at the Giants. He's always omitted when Hogan and Lobb are both in the forward line, but it's obvious that's when he should actually be playing. He's also getting dropped constantly and it's very, very obvious he's the sort of personality who needs some mollycoddling. He should be patronised for 4-6 games so he builds a rapport with the two proper key forwards and also gets some confidence.

I hope the next coach sees that.

Not sure how much influence was Lyon/Rosich but as an outsider i always did question Freo's tendency to recruit players with questionable character or mental application.

Off top of my head Kersten, McCarthy, Bennell, Hogan...in isolation the trade value for each was probably reasonable, but you just can't have too many of these types of players on your list, if any. As proven, they are unreliable and may hurt the culture of the team. Not everyone has to be a saint, see Martin & De Goey, but those 2 are hard working and competitive so can still be relied to perform on game day...Bennell/McCarthy/Hogan can't be trusted to give 100%. As you mentioned, they lack dedication.

Hope it's true about Bell and he sets Freo on the right path...getting rid of Rosich & Lyon is a good start. With the rumours of player/staff unrest, reading between the lines it would appear those 2 had too much power, and were probably difficult to work with or for...very much seem the types to meddle and overrule staff under them too much in a 'what i say goes' kind of way.

 

[Freomaniac]

Ridiculous argument.
Blues going forward are better positioned with their rebuild and have a lot of young talent to develop.
*Points to player list*

you can a make a case for either Carlton or Freo to be honest.

Both teams had done similar paths to rebuilds. Both knew that they had to do a 4 year rebuild in which year one you had to get KPPS and in year 2 to get many mids.


You look at what Freo got in 2016 draft and trade periods after that drop. They get Logue a utility who is 192 cm, Darcy a ruckmn and Cox a Harry Taylor type Swing man that can play CHF and CHB. Duman is also a 192 cm defender

In the trades. Hamling is a key defender. Then got Kersten and McCarthy. Both are 190cm tall forwards that can play as 2nd talls as CHF.

Then in the 2017 draft, Freo mainly got mids in Brayshaw, Banfield, Cerra, Crowden and Giro and Tom North.

We timed Sean Darcys development well. You can debate about Sandilands playing this season. Once 2020 rolls around,. Darcy will be in his 4th year as a 22 year old as our number 1 ruck.

 

[F_therest]

I like that Bell has swept out Lyon & Rosich.

But according to the article he was part of the overruling the list management team to get Hogan and appointed Micallef who apparently was obviously too inexperienced and Bell was already offering the job to someone else 8 months later - that's 2 mistakes on his behalf.

Chaos in the front office and a toxic culture at training: Why the Dockers had to sack Ross Lyon

Chaos in the front office and a toxic culture at training: Why the Dockers had to sack Ross Lyon

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[Silent Alarm]

What Fox got it wrong?

Fox ran an article saying that Rosich and Peter Bell undermined the drafting department on getting Hogan – ie the drafting and trading team was 'nupped' by Bell and Rosich.

It was the other way around.

For one, Steve Rosich was running the trade period for Freo as the previous head had left. Freo basically didn't have a trading team and that's why our boogly-eyed ex-CEO was calling all of the shots. Peter Bell was brought in pretty much last minute to help negotiate. Rosich and Lyon made a lot of decisions together and that's why they've been turfed together. One of those decisions was to get in Hogan – Bell didn't want him.

So yeah, Fox got confused and have it wrong.

 

[kane249]

*looks at player list"

Levi Casboult

ends discussion.

Freo have their own version in Matt Taberner.

 

[justlookingaround]

Anyone have a clue what happened between Lyon and Sumich that led to them falling out?

 

[Silent Alarm]

Another classic example of Ross and Rosich is the trading of Lachie Neale and delisting of Shane Kersten.

This is all out there and known and published.

Lachie Neale goes to the club, says he wants to leave the Dockers, and he's going to the Brisbane Lions. Or wants to.

Rosich panics, gets his mate Ross on the buzzer, and asks what it could possibly be down to. Lyon goes 'oh well... uh-ah, I know him and Kersten don't get on!' Which I think is kinda true. They weren't fans of one another and in opposing cliques. Polar opposite cliques, actually.

Anyway, Rosich and Lyon meet up with Lachie Neale and their attempt at getting Neale to stay is this: 'we know you don't like Kersten, so how about we delist him immediately!'

Neale was appalled that the club would throw someone under the bus, he saw it as desperate, and also viewed it as another indictment – a classic example – of the shitty culture at Freo and the very reason he wanted out. Neale told them this and basically said 'I don't like the bloke but I don't hate him that much, I don't want to ruin his career.'

Damage was done. To both parties. Neale was 95% gone before that and 100 after it. Kersten got wind of it and was rightfully angry. A third-string player yes, but still an employer and still a team member in Shane Kersten was shamed and seen as completely disposable. It wrecked the morale of two blokes and saw two players leave. I'm pretty sure Kersto barely rocked up to training after that and was only officially axed later on – damage control, I'd imagine.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Anyone have a clue what happened between Lyon and Sumich that led to them falling out?

Egos.

But mostly because Ross Lyon is pig-headed. You can see that in his persistence with s**t plodders like Matt DeBoer and Nick Suban but also most obviously with his redundant game plan. Watch a press interview and look how good he thinks he is at deflecting blame – never that bad, 'I'm not a bad coach, the media have a witch-hunt against me!' (probably because you publicly belittle them, patronise them, an treat them like s**t: *******). The guy is complete arrogance.

I don't even know why he has assistants to be honest, it's not like any other opinion will be listened to up in the box.

Of course that's going to drive a lot of people to frustration.

Suma is a revered West Coast and South Fremantle person. He gets his attention when he walks into those two clubrooms. He isn't used to being ignored or spoken down to. And tbh in a professional environment, no one should cop it.

There's an article out there that says they just about had a punch-up at training and players had to stop Suma from smacking the toad out.

Seems Sumich is still kinda half-welcome at Freo and the club's open to his return. I think that says a bit about who sided with who.

Yesterday was an amazing day.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Also don't tell the Freo board this, they'll say I'm lying or trying to big note myself with made-up gossip. Except all of that above information is from publications like The West Australian and Fox Footy. Snakey campaigners they may all be, but no football club – or a person like Ross Lyon – is going to allow them to keep up articles like that. They'd tell them to take down the fiction or there'll be legal issues. It's only printed, published, and up there because it's true and that's the point of journalism.

 

[dumdum]

Ross The Boss to Mentor Stuart Dew? Gold Coast Suns keeping an eye on axed AFL coaches as they search for mentor for Stuart Dew

 

[Kwality]

Ridiculous argument.
Blues going forward are better positioned with their rebuild and have a lot of young talent to develop.
*Points to player list*

Did you blokes headhunt Brad Lloyd as Head of Football?

I'd be worried by this:

Go look at every 1st round pick freo has had from 2008-2017.

only 3-4 guys are left.

Stephen Hill (2008), Griffen Logue (2016), Adam Cerra (2017) and Andy brayshaw (2017).

If you wanna know all about our 1st rounders from 2009-15.

I will name 3 stand outs.... Anthony Morabito (2009), Jayden Pitt (2010) Michael Apeness (2013). All 3 were talented but careers were hurt by injury.

The other 1st rounders were either averge players or duds.

Living in Melbourne I understand how big the Lloyd name is in footy, but ...

 

[Kwality]

Was that meant to be an insult to Carlton?

You do realise Casboult has been a gun KPP/support ruck and the best swingman in the comp this year don't you?

Eagles happy with Oscar Allen, would Levi hold a spot in that 22. Oscar 2019 isnt a gun.

 

[clobba]

Left Saints because he could, the contract had a hole in it, own it & change lawyers.

Was never so happy as when he left, next coach sorta killed that but hell at least it wasn't Ross

 

[Freomaniac]

I feel like in soccer they sack coaches too easily, but in the AFL they give them too much security. Richardson should have been given the arse earlier, instead he was allowed 5 years of mediocrity, and Ross wasn't far behind with 4.

I would say soccer and Basketball basketball is a totally different beast compared to Aussie rules when it comes to coaching.

In soccer. you got coaches that are in their 50s, 60s and even in their 70s. Older coaches are more valued regardless of trophies or lack there of. You could have a 20 year coaching career and manage 4-5 different clubs. The clubs dont all need to be in the same nation.

you got well paid managers that in a space of 12 years go to 3-4 different clubs. You can spend 4 years in england, 2 years in germany, 3 years in portugal and 3 years in France as an example.

I have seen managers such as Eddie Howe at Bournemouth guide that club from league 2 in the English 4th division to the premier league. As of 2019, he is still at the club.

Basketball you got 30 NBA teams. Again its not rare for a coach to have a 20 year career with 4-5 different teams as well.

Yes greg popovich has spent 20 years at San Antonio spurs.

Larry Brown as a Ross Lyon type coach in the NBA guiding average teams to playoffs with defensive tactics. He has Managed teams like the clippers, Pacers, 76ers and Pistions.

You can debate about sacked coaches in the AFL. this isnt the 1980s where coaches are sacked 1 year into a 2 or 3 year deal.

Richardson should of been sacked earlier. true in a way. 1st couple of years, they were bad.

they then improved in 2016 and 2017. They did give him a 2 year extension because they looked like they were on track to make finals in 2018. We all know they fell into a heap in 2018.

 

[WilloTree]

Freo have their own version in Matt Taberner.

 

[Freomaniac]

Did you blokes headhunt Brad Lloyd as Head of Football?

I'd be worried by this:


Living in Melbourne I understand how big the Lloyd name is in footy, but ...

true....

If Ross Lyon was going to be sacked, I wanted a similar chance similar to what Port did in 2012-13. shake up the footy department.

Port got rid of Matty primus as coach in 2012, they also got rid of Cam Falhoon or whatever that dudes name is and got Cameron Burgess as a fitness coach or Performance Director coach etc.

Also helps changing a scout or 2. overlooking Local WA talent only for them to slip into the eastern states or even worse, west coast is inexucuseable