Autopsy Round 19, 2021: West Coast v St.Kilda *SHARMAN DEBUT*

[gringo2011]

Like I said making excuse's
Every club has mitigating factors
We can except where we are or be brutal and honest and not except where we are

I think our list just isn't up with the top 4 clubs. Geelong have 2 yesterdays Max Kings in Tom Hawkins and Cameron. They have good youth still and plenty of mid to late career players that are more than serviceable then guys like Danger who can impact games. Then guys like Selwood who you would follow out of the trenches. Bulldog's have a Max King in Naughton, and a dream midfield with Bont who is an impact match winner. We look a bit like a bit less developed Port Adelaide to me. Lack a bit of the real star types but very even spread. Richmond are similar but have a few more stars including Dusty who would be the highest impact player in footy.

This year has been s**t and tested our depth which we haven't really cared about yet as we churn the list over. It will be better long term getting games into kids that might not have otherwise happened. I think we will change some stuff up but the pain will be worth it long term. So much rests on guys like Clark and King going up to the top of the tree, that happens and we are going to be a good side.

 

[kernelT]

As good as King was yesterday, our forward entries are still shite… King had to work 3 times as hard as the west coast forwards to get his goals… taking hangers over three players with 8 of his 9 marks contested. Compared to Darling and Kennedy making blocks so the other can get a 20 metre pass lace out.

If King didn't mark it yesterday, we pretty much kicked the ball straight to their defenders… his dominance masked how poor we were with forward 50 entries, we just have to find a way to improve here as you can't rely on contested marks to win games of footy, it's just really dumb footy.

 

[gringo2011]

There is a big Carlisle-shaped-hole in our team.

People underestimate how important he was to both our structure and defence last year. It’s like having both rucks playing, having two key defenders gives our smaller defenders (Highmore, Coffield, Wilkie etc) a license to intercept, roam and attack.

Christmas wish list:

- 197cm+ Key Defensive Player.
- Top 10 Draft Pick (ideally a midfielder).
- Draft Windhager/Owens/Peris.
- Club review + New club coaches.
- An off-season focused on accuracy, and kicking, as well as rehabbing injuries.
- Focus on revitalising players like Coffield, Long, Battle, even Billing’s (if still on list).
- Focus on development from players like, Allison, Sharman, Heath, Alabakis (if still on list).
- Delist/retire the 30+ year old players who aren’t getting a game.

Result:

Hopefully a St.Kilda Football Club which is both better positioned with personal and mental/physical resilience to attack the 2022 season. We have the tools, we have the talent and the potential. We will be younger, we will have fresh blood, and at that, St Kilda blood (not players taken from other clubs), and Steele has a year of leadership under his belt to take the reigns from Geary.

Our best 22 will be highly competitive both within the club and against other teams. And it will be up to the players to go marching in like a ******* Swiss army pocket knife tank and win 10 premierships in a row. As fans, we shouldn’t think that is too much to ask for right?

The interceptor doesn't have to be that tall. Highmore might be enough or Coff even if he can get back to last years form. Our midfield was messed around with and WC killed us when Kelly won multiple clearances and we didn't even slow him down. Our defence has held up recently because of the mids improving. Josh Kelly or a classy mid would probably do more for us than a tall defender.

 

[gringo2011]

As good as King was yesterday, our forward entries are still sh*te… King had to work 3 times as hard as the west coast forwards to get his goals… taking hangers over three players with 8 of his 9 marks contested. Compared to Darling and Kennedy making blocks so the other can get a 20 metre pass lace out.

If King didn't mark it yesterday, we pretty much kicked the ball straight to their defenders… his dominance masked how poor we were with forward 50 entries, we just have to find a way to improve here as you can't rely on contested marks to win games of footy, it's just really dumb footy.

It's the way we set up. They spread out and all make multiple leads to create space. They are very organised. We bunch up and drop the ball in the same spot every time. We actually looked our best when we played chaos balls forward because they couldn't pick us off.

 

[Ads734]

We

It could have gone a few different ways after half time. West Coast at home, with a crowd and good conditions are pretty much as good as any team. A game against a mediocre and depleted mid table side is their bread and butter, so I thought that our second half had substance to it.

King was enormous. He is going to an absolute nightmare for defenders. It’s all about confidence and the way we kick it into him. He doesn’t need crisp, perfect footy. He just needs a run and jump at it. We looked at our most dangerous yesterday when we kicked it from 70-90 metres from goal and quickly put it into the 50. He isn’t a lead up type. Nor is he a wrestler. Kick it long and quick and let him jump at it. He has some scary weapons. We need to build around him. There’s been a lot of commentary from fans about the way we use him, and the coaches have been vindicated somewhat here, on a few counts. I was certainly wrong about the Lloyd stuff. Club has kept it in house and that has been justified. One issue that I did back the club with was the positional use of him. There’s been plenty of calls to play him up the ground between the arcs as a marking target. His primary strength is his contested marking when he runs and leaps. It makes perfect sense to play him deep, particularly while his tank isn’t that advanced. He is going to be a pleasure to watch.

Butler finally looked like 2020 Butler. Broke lines, took the game on, used the ball pretty well and hit the scoreboard. Is a pity it has taken so long. Needs to bounce back next year with regular footy close to the level he is capable of.

Jones and Hill were bloody outstanding. I thought both of them played their role perfectly. Hill understands that a long kick to a pack is not just a last resort/throwaway kick if done properly. A long kick to a pack should be placed in a specific spot with a target in mind. Hill places long kicks in spaces that allow forwards to run onto it. Very few players do this. Most just sit it on top of a pack and it becomes a wrestling contest. Jones had an excellent inside/outside game. His inconsistency is really frustrating, but he is so effective when he plays like that.

Crouch on the other hand, had an awful game. There was plenty of talk prior to him coming over about his disposal, and until yesterday, I thought that chat was overplayed. He was really poor yesterday though. It’d be different if he was going for difficult kicks, but he took an eternity to get rid of it, made poor choices and executed bad skills all day. One clearance, five contested possessions and two tackles so he didn’t do his usual inside work either. Easily his worst game with the club. I reckon he’d be top five in the B&F and has been a really good pick up, but that was a really poor game of football.

Coffield was poor too, I thought. He got mildly better throughout the day, but it concerns me how long it takes him to work into games. It isn’t a new issue either. He does this regularly. He takes an eternity to make a decision with ball in hand. Not in a Hunter Clark way where his composure allows him to weigh up the options and evade tacklers. More in a Raph Clarke way where he just stands still and hesitates. The other concern I have with Coff is that his strengths seem to be limited to his uncontested intercept marking. Reading the play and taking intercept marks is a valuable quality, the elimination final against the dogs a prime example with his five intercept marks, but it can’t be your only asset. It is just really difficult to produce on a consistent basis, particularly when you don’t really play like a tall. After four years, I still don’t see many strengths Coffield has once the ball is in his hands. He doesn’t use his pace to break lines or use his kicking to penetrate zones. Highmore has the same strength of intercept marking, but he can play on the opposition’s third tall. Coffield can’t really play on talls, so he needs to take an opposition small. But not their most dangerous tall, as he doesn’t have the physicality or competitiveness for that role either. So, he pretty much needs to take the opposition’s weakest small forward and take several intercept marks to have an impact. I want him to work out as his intercept marking is good to watch when he’s going, and he looked like a really quality player in the second half of last year. It just concerns me that he needs too much to go right for him to play well.

Wilkie and Howard had pretty ordinary games too I thought. West Coast want defenders to play a back shoulder style and we played right into their hands. They play a kick-mark style where they hit up at the ball carrier. Short kicks and uncontested marks. Howard’s style is ideal for teams who kick the ball long to contests, but I thought we were slow to adapt to their ball movement.

Rambled on and became more negative than I intended. I found the loss one of the more encouraging losses we’ve had in a long time. Premiership tilts require several elite players at the core of them. We now look like we will have at least two over the next few years. We need to build around King and Steele, and hope that another 2-3 go along with them to become elite players in the comp.

ll to be fair to Coff he hasn’t played in about a month no twos games either. Prior to his injury he was just about to hit form. I think yesterday he was the product often of being in i Venus ke positions. Ie getting the ball in tight situations then getting tackled by three players. The biggest concern for me is seemingly his loss of pace. Did he put too much weight on? Is he playing injured? I think he’ll get back to it. The level he was playing last year was very good.

 

[kernelT]

Feel for Wilkie who is getting a bit of a bashing in here, Darling only had 6 disposals, equal lowest for the year to when we played them in round 4.

Unfortunately he's one of those players who only needs a few kicks to kick a few goals.

Eagles forward line functions so well, they do a lot of blocking to create space for each other, would love to see our forward running into space like that.

 

[gringo2011]

His vision and disposal close in have great in past weeks but today he looked a bit off, not clean and it came undone.

I thought he was great early but then just disappeared in the second half. Maybe they sent someone to mind him. Steele and Dunstan need Crouch to help give them space.

 

[ValiantEel]

I think our list just isn't up with the top 4 clubs. Geelong have 2 yesterdays Max Kings in Tom Hawkins and Cameron. They have good youth still and plenty of mid to late career players that are more than serviceable then guys like Danger who can impact games. Then guys like Selwood who you would follow out of the trenches. Bulldog's have a Max King in Naughton, and a dream midfield with Bont who is an impact match winner. We look a bit like a bit less developed Port Adelaide to me. Lack a bit of the real star types but very even spread. Richmond are similar but have a few more stars including Dusty who would be the highest impact player in footy.

This year has been sh*t and tested our depth which we haven't really cared about yet as we churn the list over. It will be better long term getting games into kids that might not have otherwise happened. I think we will change some stuff up but the pain will be worth it long term. So much rests on guys like Clark and King going up to the top of the tree, that happens and we are going to be a good side.

Completely agree. Even last year when we made finals we were abysmal against top 4 teams and weren’t seriously challenging for a flag but making up the numbers. It’s a bitter truth but the truth nevertheless.

Premiership sides have built up a core group of draftees that take time to develop but once they do clubs can fill list holes from other teams.

The question remains can Clark, Coffield, King, Byrnes, Bytel and Connolly all become A graders?

 

[gringo2011]

Feel for Wilkie who is getting a bit of a bashing in here, Darling only had 6 disposals, equal lowest for the year to when we played them in round 4.

Unfortunately he's one of those players who only needs a few kicks to kick a few goals.

Eagles forward line functions so well, they do a lot of blocking to create space for each other, would love to see our forward running into space like that.

The midfield failed, our defence got hammered. It's exactly what happened early in the year. If the mids can't compete WC will smash you because they are one of the best aerial sides ever. Once they get a clean kick inside 50 it usually ends with a shot on goal.

 

[ValiantEel]

Wilkie was against Jack Darling

27

Jack Darling

Age

31

Ht

191cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.1

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

4.2

3star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.0

5star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.0

2star

K

4.3

2star

HB

3.7

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

2.4

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

14.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.0

5star

M

6.0

5star

T

4.0

5star

G

1.4

5star

. Unfairly criticised and I still rate him highly. We need another quality key defender to complement Howard.

 

[Jade Buddha]

Jones and coffield had one massive run in. Dunno if they showed it but team mates had to step in and have words with both of them.

Jones has a short wick. Has done it before to other players, remember the Hill incident.

 

[kernelT]

I see cliffs… which is pleasing.

 

[g_TRAIN]

Wilkie was against Jack Darling. Unfairly criticized and I still rate him highly. We need another quality key defender to complement Howard.

Yeah, he was undersized for the match up and both he and Howard got burnt a few times by some excellent delivery. Not much they could have done on a few occasions.

 

[ValiantEel]

Yeah, he was undersized for the match up and both he and Howard got burnt a few times by some excellent delivery. Not much they could have done on a few occasions.

Spot on. Their delivery was superb while ours was lacklustre. Max King made us look good yesterday.

 

[g_TRAIN]

As good as King was yesterday, our forward entries are still sh*te… King had to work 3 times as hard as the west coast forwards to get his goals… taking hangers over three players with 8 of his 9 marks contested. Compared to Darling and Kennedy making blocks so the other can get a 20 metre pass lace out.

If King didn't mark it yesterday, we pretty much kicked the ball straight to their defenders… his dominance masked how poor we were with forward 50 entries, we just have to find a way to improve here as you can't rely on contested marks to win games of footy, it's just really dumb footy.

This is true but our forwards need to start leading at the ball carrier more as Roo was saying during the call they need to make it so the midfielders can't ignore them.

Did you see some of the hard leads made by Kennedy and Darling yesterday? they absolutely demanded the ball be kicked to them and it makes the job much easier for the kicking player.

God help the competition once King learns to lead and take uncontested marks too!

 

[PandaG]

Autopsy complete

 

[Ducky Tie]

We

ll to be fair to Coff he hasn’t played in about a month no twos games either. Prior to his injury he was just about to hit form. I think yesterday he was the product often of being in i Venus ke positions. Ie getting the ball in tight situations then getting tackled by three players. The biggest concern for me is seemingly his loss of pace. Did he put too much weight on? Is he playing injured? I think he’ll get back to it. The level he was playing last year was very good.

Yeah his form in the back half of last year was excellent. He's clearly capable of playing really good footy, but I just worry that his style and mindset will make him an up and down player. Coming in after a month probably was a contributing factor, but it wasn't an outlier for him this year. He's been pretty ordinary in most games he's played. He is a confidence player who looks like he gets really nervous and indecisive when he is low on confidence. I've still got plenty of hope that he'll be a very good player, but I'd love to see him reduce the gap between his best and his worst.

 

[PandaG]

But also our balance is off and can see why club is not that eager to sign Spook
Can’t play
Steele, Dunstan, Ross and Crouch in the same team.

Spook needs to be replaced by Gresham or Clark.

We should really try for Narkle or Fiorini and any 200cm player that can jump, compete and actually read the play.
Also if we get Ben King

34

Ben King

Age

23

Ht

202cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

2.2

2star

M

3.5

4star

T

0.5

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

5.6

2star

HB

1.9

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.5

5star

D

6.8

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

2.4

3star

M

3.2

4star

T

0.2

3star

G

1.0

4star

we will win a flag in the next 5 years

 

[kernelT]

Contested marks
Max King

12

Max King

Age

23

Ht

202cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.3

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

2.6

2star

M

2.7

3star

T

0.7

3star

G

1.4

5star

D

7.3

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

2.6

2star

M

2.7

3star

T

0.7

1star

G

1.4

5star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

2.8

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

0.6

3star

G

1.4

5star

8 (of 18)
West Coast 12

 

[PandaG]

Also Coff is not fit enough.
Obviously drank a bit of his own bath water after a good year in 2020, didn’t work hard enough in preseason and has never caught up.

needs to get much much fitter. Should call petracca to ask him what it takes. Similar look to the pre-ripped fit petracca of 2021.

or Jack Steele

9

Jack Steele

Age

28

Ht

187cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.9

5star

K

8.7

3star

HB

12.2

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

6.8

5star

CL

3.6

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

16.8

4star

K

5.0

2star

HB

11.8

5star

M

2.6

3star

T

6.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

should spend more time with guys from our club instead of western bulldogs posers, and help the kid get fit for elite AFL footy

 

[Mowman]

I think our list just isn't up with the top 4 clubs. Geelong have 2 yesterdays Max Kings in Tom Hawkins and Cameron. They have good youth still and plenty of mid to late career players that are more than serviceable then guys like Danger who can impact games. Then guys like Selwood who you would follow out of the trenches. Bulldog's have a Max King in Naughton, and a dream midfield with Bont who is an impact match winner. We look a bit like a bit less developed Port Adelaide to me. Lack a bit of the real star types but very even spread. Richmond are similar but have a few more stars including Dusty who would be the highest impact player in footy.

This year has been sh*t and tested our depth which we haven't really cared about yet as we churn the list over. It will be better long term getting games into kids that might not have otherwise happened. I think we will change some stuff up but the pain will be worth it long term. So much rests on guys like Clark and King going up to the top of the tree, that happens and we are going to be a good side.

Yep, we know what we get from Billings - Ross and Dunstan. They are not going to take us to the next level move at least 2 of them on and hope that we get improvement from Clark - Byrnes - Connnelly - Gresham - Coffield - Paton - Battle. Take a couple of picks (hopefully 2 in the top 20) to draft. I think yesterday showed a midfield of Steele - Crouch & Dunstan showed it will work against similar midfields to ours but when put up against a very good midfield its just not there and found wanting. I would rather us take a chance with a mini reset then be a middle of the road side for the next few years

 

[kick it lace out]

His vision and disposal close in have great in past weeks but today he looked a bit off, not clean and it came undone.

Dunstan had a poor second quarter (defensively) with Tim Kelly getting away from him. Kelly is a gun, and you cannot afford to give a guy like that so much space. With NicNat banging it down his throat at clearances, it seemed they just walked it out of stoppages. If you watch the replay, keep an eye on how we set up at the first bounce at the beginning of the second half. Ross went in and played on Kelly, and the rest is history. I thought the coaches were too slow to respond to Kelly’s dominance in that second quarter and in hindsight, should have moved Ross on to him earlier.

 

[StCicatriz]

Jones has a short wick. Has done it before to other players, remember the Hill incident.

I couldn't tell if he was losing it because coffield wasn't on his man or because he expected him to jump.

If its because he expected him to jump it was seriously unfair. Coffield had been blocked by two wce opponents. There was no way he could go.

Jones should have made a contest too.

 

[tristenlvm]

Byrnes is our Stevie baker replacement.

Connoly is doing a great job.

Wilkie so often 3rd man up, can't blame him for losing against the bigger body of darling with some of those deliveries.

What hurt was the middle, and we just never had players at the drop of the ball. How about kicking to a contest up field from Jones, hill and billings so when it drops they are there. Too often we were left watching on the wing as it rebounded.

Long is hungry, keep him in there. Kent is hungry too but both lack the finish of lonie, let's get him back and drop one of these guys. I think buttler needs to be dropped to get some form back, he's playing his role but not standout. Missing higgins and Clarke badly.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[D2D3]

Also Coff is not fit enough.
Obviously drank a bit of his own bath water after a good year in 2020, didn’t work hard enough in preseason and has never caught up.

needs to get much much fitter. Should call petracca to ask him what it takes. Similar look to the pre-ripped fit petracca of 2021.

or Jack Steele should spend more time with guys from our club instead of western bulldogs posers, and help the kid get fit for elite AFL footy

Bit rough on Coffield here. He's had a disapointing year but had 17 in his first game back yesterday and worked his way back into it. Some of his best work yesterday was in the last so not sure fitness is the issue for him.