Mega Thread The Mark Neeld Mega-Thread

[Hearts to hearts]

Yup, that was 2011.

Interestingly, what North are running looks fairly similar to Melbourne under Bailey.

What does that mean?

The problems go far beyond Neeld, but he is a major part of them too. I don't see how they can keep battling on without changes. Jackson can work on the off-field priorities and restructuring but they need to give the supporters something.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

I apologise I havent read the whole thread, but what about the chances of Alister Clarkson become coach of Melbourne in 2014. He is an ex-Melbourne player, and his old mate Todd Viney is at the Dee's.
Jeff Kennett suggested at the start of the year that maybe it is time for Clarkson to move on and to get a fresh set of eyes in at Hawthorn.......Clarkson certainly didnt object to Kennett's comments.

Just putting it out there......??

If that was the case, Melbourne would need to spend even further monies reinforcing all of the walls in the coaches box. If Clarkson occasionally found Hawthorn frustrating, he would find a whole new level with the Demons.

 

[Ando727]

Melbourne can't afford to sack him IMO.

39 tackles in a game of football is pathetic. We had a bloke lay 15 by himself yesterday.

I tackle my morning muesli with more commitment than my team tackles.

 

[Daytripper]

The player development side of Melbourne is woeful.

Poor Jimmy Toumpas came over this year with good wraps and I believe last game he started on the bench for Casey after looking completely lost in his first 3 games at senior level.

This is the number one issue that needs to be addressed. I would be throwing whatever it takes to get the very best in this field to the club.

 

[Slax]

Neeld looks resigned to his destiny of being sacked at some stage this season. I don't think that sacking him this week will achieve anything though, all that happens is that one of the assistants will be required to take over and looking at who is currently at Melbourne I can't see any of them doing any better than Neeld is now. What I believe Melbourne should do is go out and secure a replacement from outside of the club before they sack him. They also need to give the new head coach the power to sack any of the assistants he wants immediately and offer him a long term contact (end of 2017). To be a good coach you need good people around you. Geelong has done this well over recent years, just look at the assistants who are now senior coaches.

The problem at Melbourne is that they aren't even doing the little things right. They don't chase, tackle, run to space. Being under seige for so long has taken its toll on the playing group, they are drained emotionally and are going through the motions making them predictable and lethargic. It seems that the press and many in the public fail to see this as a problem, but just like how a bully will break the spirit of their victim, the press have broken the spirit of the Melbourne playing group. If you don't beleive it have a look at Essendon they're now starting to look flat as the drugs scandal is taking its toll (although playing Brisbane this week won't show it, but look at the following two weeks against Richmond and Sydney and you'll see).

Melbourne need to somehow find energy and that needs to come from an external source. Just not sure who would want to take it on though at the moment.

As for the comments about money, they got just over 13,000 to this game and without change the crowd figures won't improve. Members won't turn up to watch their team get flogged and for the most part oppossition fans won't turn up to watch their team barely get out of second gear to beat Melbourne by 10 goals.

 

[wallycleaver]

The player development side of Melbourne is woeful.

Poor Jimmy Toumpas came over this year with good wraps and I believe last game he started on the bench for Casey after looking completely lost in his first 3 games at senior level.

This is the number one issue that needs to be addressed. I would be throwing whatever it takes to get the very best in this field to the club.

This..

Feel so bad for kids like this . Believe poor bugger may have signed an extension? Right at the moment him and young Hogan I really feel for.

 

[dockshark]

Personally, I think that serial coach swapping is a mistake and that clubs should be smarter about it. IE- Only replace your coach if you are confident that you have a candidate that is superior quality. Just sacking him and then playing the field hoping someone suitable turns up would be a mistake. In all honesty I can't see too many people lining up for that job either, the Dees, are a basket case on and off the field, dropping sponsors as fast as they are dropping winnable games.

I think if the rumors about Roos are correct Neeld will be gone by lunchtime tomorrow imo.

 

[loki04]

This..

Feel so bad for kids like this . Believe poor bugger may have signed an extension? Right at the moment him and young Hogan I really feel for.

I don't any kid with half a brain would see out their 1st contract and ask to be traded or nominate for the draft.

 

[Demonic_Inferno]

They need a heart surgeon as a coach.

Apart from that they deserve everything that they are copping right now for cheating.

They have ruined a good coaches career and wrecked and sucked the life out of their young talented kids.

Thats what you get when you cheat karma did great on this one.

Hahaha...one or two games in '09 (which every other club in the league would have done) has almost nothing to do with this situation. Clueless.

 

[Brown Bottle]

The best coaches understand that there is no "one size fits all" approach with a playing list. Every player has different motivations. Every playing group has its own dynamic.

I watched a junior footy team win a GF a couple of seasons ago. Prior to the 2nd Semi the Coach developed an extensive game plan, talked to each of the kids about what they needed to do to win the game, etc. They got smashed. They scraped through the Prelim and fronted up for the GF. Prior to the GF the Coach took the kids into the rooms and asked them to shuffle. He turned on LMFAO and let them go at it for about 15min. Barely a mention of game plans but for with two or three players individually. Then they ran out and won the GF by 6 goals against the unbeaten flag favourite.

No, I'm not advocating shuffling to LMFAO as the solution to Melbourne's woes. I am suggesting that this coach worked out that his players cared more about playing with their mates and having some fun than anything else, and that was when they were at their best. Bailey was roundly criticised (like Knights) for not developing defensive aspects, but perhaps there's some merit in letting the group play their natural game & bond on the field before working on the more detailed aspects of a game plan. Let's face it, these guys are at Ground Zero right now, and beating them with a stick (metaphorically speaking) clearly hasn't worked.

 

[I Remember Bluey]

How? He's not out there playing

And thank god for that.

 

[Tulip]

The suggestion that Neeld's tough approach was arrogant and showed he couldn't communicate with young players really grates with me. So he should come in softly, softly and coddle them? A kick in the pants is exactly what some of these players needed. There was a bunch of top 10 draft picks simply not living up to their potential. If a kick up the pants turned them into pea hearts not willing to play for their club, their fans, hell, their own careers, that is a greater indictment on them than it is on Neeld.

Most of those players were in their 2nd and 3rd years when Neeld came in, and an incompetent structure and idea had allowed them to be the ones we relied on. Instead of developing them, he ripped their confidence out.

 

[La Vache]

Melbourne should do anything that will win them a few games before the year's out. By hook or by crook. The members are dropping off now and unless they start winning they will continue to do so. Competitiveness will not win them back now, nor will having a young list or Jesse Hogan or even a new coach. Only the four points.

Every single Melbourne supporter I know cannot be stuffed going any more. That's 7 people of which 3 are club members and 2 MCC members. None of them will be bothered for the rest of the year and if this continues they will absolutely not part with their money next season. Shit-can them all you want but they have had it. The Demons have a small supporter base as it is and every club has only so many die-hard supporters. I'd say that about two-thirds of any membership base would be pending results over a certain period of time. Then they find something better to do on the weekends.

The reality is that you can cry and cry about the bottom line until your bottom lip has gravel rash but your supporter base is your lifeline, insurance and backbone. For Melbourne the tipping point has arrived, saving money by keeping this coaching staff will conceivably cost them thousands of members for the foreseeable future.

I would absolutely fire Neeld, and his assistants. And pay whatever it takes to get a coach and staff, at a likely cost of millions, who gives them a chance of winning a few matches NOW. There are people out there who could at least (most?) coach a cohesive unit with Clark, Howe, M Jones, N Jones, Viney, Frawley, Dawes, Grimes, Trengove, Strauss, Terlich, Gawn and Garland and a Casey team that is flogging them in the VFL. You wouldn't expect much, but at the rate they're going they will only win one more match for the season. The aim should be to defeat the bulldogs, suns , GWS and a couple of surprise victories against whoever? They will not achieve this with Neeld, Royal or Rawlings.

Get someone in weeks before the Queens Birthday against Collingwood and throw everything at that match. A win against a Pies' team currently in indifferent form would give the whole club a boost.

 

[nobbyiscool]

There are so many bigger problems at Melbourne than Neeld. Their player development. Their drafting. A culture that apparently doesn't value hard work.

Sacking Neeld doesn't fix these problems in the way that Sanderson and Hinkley provided quick fixes.

But with all that said, the question is a simple one - can Neeld move Melbourne forward?

I'm starting to think the answer is no.

John Worsfold should be high on their hit list already. I think he'd be better for them even than Roos.

 

[pazza]

He pissed off blokes like Moloney, Green, Rivers and Petterd for spuds like Pederson, Gillies, Brynes & Rodan.

He has overseen young players with potential like Frawley & Trengove regress at an alarming rate. Meanwhile spiking bullshit in press conferences about good training standards and other crap. And he has done all this while getting more coaching support and facilities than any other Melbourne coach has ever had.

I would say that the players who have left since he arrived, left because they lacked the ticker to stick it out. Had they stayed, then he wouldn't have had to put others in their place. Moloney et al are at fault...NOT THE BLOODY COACH.

 

[PatrickBateman]

The last thing the Melbourne hierarchy want is Neeld sacked...

Why?

It will simply prove who the incompetent ones really are when the next guy also fails.

 

[lionbear]

I would say that the players who have left since he arrived, left because they lacked the ticker to stick it out. Had they stayed, then he wouldn't have had to put others in their place. Moloney et al are at fault...NOT THE BLOODY COACH.

So will you being apologising to Knights?

 

[Mr Magic]

I would say that the players who have left since he arrived, left because they lacked the ticker to stick it out. Had they stayed, then he wouldn't have had to put others in their place. Moloney et al are at fault...NOT THE BLOODY COACH.

TBH I think a lot was driven by egos and most involved have no idea what they are talking about, or had no say if they did!!

 

[pazza]

So will you being apologising to Knights?

I was one of the few Essendon fans who couldn't understand why Knights was treated like he was. Certain senior players current and departed have a lot to answer for. Said that then, say it now.

 

[lionbear]

I was one of the few Essendon fans who couldn't understand why Knights was treated like he was. Certain senior players current and departed have a lot to answer for. Said that then, say it now.

No worries, my apologies, it was more tongue in cheek

 

[smitchell]

I hear you. It's really difficult to know what are the next steps, when everyone's backing away. I do think the AFL needs to help, like what they did with Sydney in the early 90's and help convince the right people to commit.

In hindsight, we were very lucky to get Barassi, Colless, Kelly, Roos and Lockett all to the club within 24 months. High quality leadership experience is so hard to get access to, especially if their are no egos attached. Outside of Roos, that list is pretty much ego-less, which neutered any potentially damaging politics.

What was Plugger like as a clubman?

 

[Brown Bottle]

I would say that the players who have left since he arrived, left because they lacked the ticker to stick it out. Had they stayed, then he wouldn't have had to put others in their place. Moloney et al are at fault...NOT THE BLOODY COACH.

The main reason that people leave organisations - their boss. By so far the #1 reason that everything else barely registers. How many people on here have left a job for that exact reason i wonder? So is that a question of "ticker" for them also?

 

[00Stinger]

I would say that the players who have left since he arrived, left because they lacked the ticker to stick it out. Had they stayed, then he wouldn't have had to put others in their place. Moloney et al are at fault...NOT THE BLOODY COACH.

They stuck it out under Bailey and were happy to do so, so I can't agree with you for not wanting to stick it out.

You have your two vice captains (Rivers & Moloney) who have finished 1 & 2 in the previous years b & f and put their bodies on the line for the club over 7-9 years. Then a new coach comes in saying the club lacks hardness and leadership and his first job is to sack them both from the leadership group. Now this would be fine if they were not replaced with two kids who had about 30 games experience each. Then proceeds to play them both out of position for the year, basically giving them the idea that they are no longer required.

The coach came in with a hard ass attitude that backfired, now he is trying to back track. He came in trying to emulate Malthouse, that's fine when you have been a well respected, top level coach for 20 odd years, not when you are an unproven coach.

It may not be the coaches fault, but in 1 & 1/2 years one bloody player has improved (Jones). The rest have all stagnated or gone backwards, I'm sorry but that is the coaches fault. Now he is churning out bullshit like we need another rebuild, we never needed a rebuild in the first place, the blocks were in place to build from.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

The player development side of Melbourne is woeful.

Poor Jimmy Toumpas came over this year with good wraps and I believe last game he started on the bench for Casey after looking completely lost in his first 3 games at senior level.

This is the number one issue that needs to be addressed. I would be throwing whatever it takes to get the very best in this field to the club.

Last game for Casey he had 26 touches, 10 marks, a goal and was named our best or 2nd best...

 

[pazza]

They stuck it out under Bailey and were happy to do so, so I can't agree with you for not wanting to stick it out.

You have your two vice captains (Rivers & Moloney) who have finished 1 & 2 in the previous years b & f and put their bodies on the line for the club over 7-9 years. Then a new coach comes in saying the club lacks hardness and leadership and his first job is to sack them both from the leadership group. Now this would be fine if they were not replaced with two kids who had about 30 games experience each. Then proceeds to play them both out of position for the year, basically giving them the idea that they are no longer required.

The coach came in with a hard arse attitude that backfired, now he is trying to back track. He came in trying to emulate Malthouse, that's fine when you have been a well respected, top level coach for 20 odd years, not when you are an unproven coach.

It may not be the coaches fault, but in 1 & 1/2 years one bloody player has improved (Jones). The rest have all stagnated or gone backwards, I'm sorry but that is the coaches fault. Now he is churning out bullshit like we need another rebuild, we never needed a rebuild in the first place, the blocks were in place to build from.

Did Neeld have the final say on Grimes and Trengove as captains, or was it the Board pulling on the coach's coat-tails.

Only the playing group pick the captains.