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I post a lot of shityet you have 120,000 likes
how did you manage that ?
your going at 3 likes per post
Not a chance. Lose two great, prime age leaders for a single pick? That'd be terrible list management.Total hypothetical but would Tiger fans think pick 3 for Rioli and Baker (to different clubs) is reasonable if they did both want a fresh start and the Tigers wanted to get another pick at the very top of the draft?
Look, I don't go to many Eagles games, so I'm in no position to state what most of them are worth in the trade market, and I'm assuming you're the same insofar as seeing Richmond games. And there's no way I'm depending on the telly, radio and written media to evaluate a certain player's worth on the market.Rioli worth more than pick 3? Gee that’s a hot take. I’m not going to pretend to know how he’s rated internally but I’d be surprised if that was offered. Mind you he is under contract, you can name your price.
But even many of these names are something of a misrepresentation of the worth of Pick #3, at least over the last few years as academies, compos and father/sons have made sure that particular draft selection has been diluted.Here is the history of pick 3 over the last 20 years in very rough order of merit so we can see where the median value is...
Martin
Jackson
Sheezel
Walter
Griffen
Rankine
Mills
Callaghan
McLuggage
Angus Brayshaw
S Hill
Day
Mastern
Billings
Ellis
Tyson
Hansen
Phillips
Plowman
P Dow
So your median expectation with pick 3 is a Stephen Hill-Angus Brayshaw level player. But 9 of the 20 the club taking the player would probably quite like to have a second go at picking a player.
So the question is along the lines of is Rioli and Baker together at or near their peak worth one of S Hill or Angus Brayshaw?
I would say the Tigers would want a little more than pick 3 for those 2 players. Maybe pick 3 and pick 15 or a slightly higher pick like 12 with pick 30 going back or something like that. That is a fair trade. But you don't let these guys go voluntarily just for fair value. Richmond would want something a bit above fair value, especially for the contracted Rioli.
That’s the point I was making, on face value (footballing), pick 3 for Rioli seems like a good deal to me but I’m not privy to the intangibles he brings to the club. His leadership for the indigenous boys for example. At the eagles we knew internally what Lewis Jetta brought for Liam Ryan and Willie Rioli and there’s no draft pick you could assign that measured that worth. They’ve both had their issues and Jetta’s influence and guidance may have been the difference between them turning into really good footballers or making some poor choices and being delisted.Look, I don't go to many Eagles games, so I'm in no position to state what most of them are worth in the trade market, and I'm assuming you're the same insofar as seeing Richmond games. And there's no way I'm depending on the telly, radio and written media to evaluate a certain player's worth on the market.
But going to games and watching a bloke's role in real time is a tried and tested means of judging their impact on a footy field. Which is obviously the key ingredient, but there's also the value they bring as a clubman, a leader and a mentor to others on the playing list. For the most part us supporters are not privy to those last roles, but with Dan Rioli his influence as a leader within the club has been made abundantly clear. If you're not convinced of that, merely read the Konrad Marshall trilogy.
Look, you're a great poster EV, and most welcome here with your rational and sensible views - you actually bring fresh eyes to the conversation on this thread. But I'd be really careful trying to assign value to our club champions mate.
I don’t mind it ..,I’m starting the thread now. If Dan Rioli stays make him captain. Could not think of a better choice
Look, I don't go to many Eagles games, so I'm in no position to state what most of them are worth in the trade market, and I'm assuming you're the same insofar as seeing Richmond games. And there's no way I'm depending on the telly, radio and written media to evaluate a certain player's worth on the market.
But going to games and watching a bloke's role in real time is a tried and tested means of judging their impact on a footy field. Which is obviously the key ingredient, but there's also the value they bring as a clubman, a leader and a mentor to others on the playing list. For the most part us supporters are not privy to those last roles, but with Dan Rioli his influence as a leader within the club has been made abundantly clear. If you're not convinced of that, merely read the Konrad Marshall trilogy.
You're a great poster EV, and most welcome here with your rational and sensible views - you actually bring fresh eyes to the conversation on this thread. But I'd be really careful trying to assign value to our club champions mate.
But even many of these names are something of a misrepresentation of the worth of Pick #3, at least over the last few years as academies, compos and father/sons have made sure that particular draft selection has been diluted.
For instance, if we had Pick #3 in 2023 there's no way we get Jed Walter (academy), or even Zane Duursma at the fourth selection (compo pick). We get Pick #5 (Nick Watson) or any non-F/S/acad/compo after him.
In 2022 with Pick #3 we don't get Sheezel, as F/S Will Ashcroft taken with (#2) - we get Wardlaw and down.
In 2021 with Pick #3 we don't get Callaghan, or even Naicos at #4, as he and F/S Sam Darcy (#2) ensure we only get Andrew and down.
In 2020 with Pick #3 we don't get Phillips (if we're daft enough to use it on him!), as Ugle-Hagan (academy) goes at #1, ensuring we only get McDonald and down.
In 2019 it's Ash and not Jackson, and so on well back into history.
With all due respect to the possible future improvement of each of these relative youngsters from the last four years, they're unproven in the heat of finals matches, except for McDonald who has triple the number of clangers in his finals appearances than goals, and the same number of clangers as marks! As a key forward!
Ash by far the best of that crop, but I'll still settle for the next 6-8 years of Dan Rioli if it's a choice of him or Pick #3. I would want two picks inside the top ten if we're to truly value add to our list, even in the longer term.
Don’t agree with that statement at all personallyIn regards to Dan Rioli he’s 27 years old and as hard as it is to say he will not be part of the next flag in fact no anybody above 25 years old will be.
I say trade anybody that we can get good value out of.
Baker
Rioli
Short
Graham
Are the only candidates really, everybody else will be worth a packet of chips. Which is not a bad thing as it means we still have plenty of decent players/good leaders at the club.
I disagree. Dan Rioli may well be a massive part of our next flag. Just like Chris Newman and Ivan Maric were significant parts of our 2017/19/20 flags.In regards to Dan Rioli he’s 27 years old and as hard as it is to say he will not be part of the next flag in fact no anybody above 25 years old will be.
With the plan to bring in a swag of top end talent ,they need to be lead by qty to develop the right way otherwise your paddlingI disagree. Dan Rioli may well be a massive part of our next flag. Just like Chris Newman and Ivan Maric were significant parts of our 2017/19/20 flags.
Agree with you totally. Unless GC were to come up with a godfather deal it would be pointless. Rather keep him and if he was to walk as a free agent next year we’d probably end with early compo next year. Ask for the world if he wants to leave or get the world next year.With the plan to bring in a swag of top end talent ,they need to be lead by qty to develop the right way otherwise your paddling
There isn't any player on our list within a country mile of a Dusty, Riewoldt, Rance or Cotchin in their primes.Don’t agree with that statement at all personally
We don’t know when our next flag will be and to say we won’t be in contention again in 5 years is hyperbolic
Similar things were said in 2016 about a lot of our players and I said the same about a lot of Pies and Geelong players in recent seasons and have had to eat my words
Ryan is 3-5 more kgs from being a good AFL player. Kid has enough ability just needs a bit more to his frame as he can get worked out of it a bit and pushed around.We are going to have to overpay to bring in an above average key forward …… we can’t keep going on just kicking it long to the options we have available ….. the coaches aren’t playing Ryan or Kosi even when we desperately need them so don’t think they rate them as highly as we like. Perhaps the coaches do rate Ryan but more as our next ruckman and not a forward but I’m not even confident of that either
Our forward line is also the worst in the competition with Lynch out.
Bolton would absolutely go ballistic under Harry & CharlieRealistically say a club came knocking... What do you kents reckon it would take to get Bolton out of Punt Rd?
U've all seen how dogshite our small forwards are, it would be the best trade since Judd for us even if we had to fork up a lot of picks.
Not unless we move some non spuds on which unfortunately I can't see our list manager doing, he's very conservative from what we've seen.Bolton would absolutely go ballistic under Harry & Charlie
too bad you will never get him (not for a long while anyway)
2 x top 10 picks but you have 0 chance to fit him in the carlton salary cap
Which Carlton players can you move to open up $1.5 mil over 6/7 yearsNot unless we move some non spuds on which unfortunately I can't see our list manager doing, he's very conservative from what we've seen.