Society/Culture Victoria Cross winner Ben Roberts-Smith - Allegations of war crimes

[Big Papa Ted]

Interesting news on the Investigations front from the budget.

Previous government budgeted a total of $6 million dollars for the OSI to investigate war crimes.

Office of the Special Investigator: The wheels of justice grind exceedingly slow…

The Budget provides for the Office of the Special Investigator, located in the Attorney General’s portfolio, to receive $3.9 million to advise the Office

australiainstitute.org.au

New government has just boosted that to $129 million over the next 2 years.

Hopefully the massive increase aids in the effort to bring the filth to justice.

Glad to see it's getting proper funding, but christ $130 million?

 

[western royboy]

Glad to see it's getting proper funding, but christ $130 million?

Kathryn Campbell is on close to $1M per year…

 

[Big Papa Ted]

Kathryn Campbell is on close to $1M per year…

She's also completely f***ing useless

 

[western royboy]

She's also completely f***ing useless

Not disagreeing here but you get the point

 

[schneebly111]

Glad to see it's getting proper funding, but christ $130 million?

Yes. We need to spend whatever it takes to bring these war criminals to account, show the world we aren’t on the level of the SS or IJA, and bring justice to the Afghanis and their families who were murdered.

Whatever it takes.

 

[Big Papa Ted]

Yes. We need to spend whatever it takes to bring these war criminals to account, show the world we aren’t on the level of the SS or IJA, and bring justice to the Afghanis and their families who were murdered.

Whatever it takes.

I'm not disagreeing, but how does it cost $130 million.

Also in respect of due process, *accused war criminals

 

[schneebly111]

I'm not disagreeing, but how does it cost $130 million.

Good Lawyers are expensive. There’ll be a lot of travel involved, they need to interview everyone involved several times over. They need to make sure every t is crossed, every i dotted as the world and the ICC will be watching the process carefully. So the case will be expansive and hopefully not leave any legal get out of jail card for the scum.

Also in respect of due process, *accused war criminals

C’mon one was caught on camera committing blatant murder.

 

[Big Papa Ted]

Good Lawyers are expensive. There’ll be a lot of travel involved, they need to interview everyone involved several times over. They need to make sure every t is crossed, every i dotted as the world and the ICC will be watching the process carefully. So the case will be expansive and hopefully not leave any legal get out of jail card for the scum.



C’mon one was caught on camera committing blatant murder.

Yeah that one is a gimme tbf

 

[schneebly111]

Ben Roberts-Smith war crimes defamation verdict to be delivered on Thursday 1 June

Australia’s most decorated soldier will learn the outcome of his case against three newspapers over Afghanistan allegations, including the murder of civilians

www.theguardian.com

‘The stakes are incredibly high’: Judge to rule on Roberts-Smith case

It is the multimillion-dollar defamation battle billed as a test of public interest journalism and a quasi war crimes investigation. The decision is imminent.

www.smh.com.au

Interesting legal analysis in the SMH article, any legally minded persons can give their judgements on who’s got the better case?

 

[Malifice]

Ben Roberts-Smith war crimes defamation verdict to be delivered on Thursday 1 June

Australia’s most decorated soldier will learn the outcome of his case against three newspapers over Afghanistan allegations, including the murder of civilians

www.theguardian.com

‘The stakes are incredibly high’: Judge to rule on Roberts-Smith case

It is the multimillion-dollar defamation battle billed as a test of public interest journalism and a quasi war crimes investigation. The decision is imminent.

www.smh.com.au

Interesting legal analysis in the SMH article, any legally minded persons can give their judgements on who’s got the better case?

The newspapers made a number of imputations (alleged defamatory statements). Not just the one.

It's possible the Papers can rely on the truth defense (or public interest defense) to defend some of those imputations, but not others. Each imputation needs to be dealt with separately.

My reading of the case is BRS is 99 percent ****ed.

The real shitshow comes after the inevitable appeal is lodged and dealt with.

Lets find out on the 1st.

 

[western royboy]

“Whichever side loses the case may face up to $25m in costs.” - Lawyers…licenced thieves?

 

[kickazz]

“Whichever side loses the case may face up to $25m in costs.” - Lawyers…licenced thieves?

Big contributors to inflation for sure

 

[Malifice]

“Whichever side loses the case may face up to $25m in costs.” - Lawyers…licenced thieves?

Both hired KC's, (four figures an hour), the trial lasted weeks (plus COVID delays), and there were a shitload of procedural hearings and filings.

12.5 million a pop still sounds excessive though. Don't think anyone's doing 12,000 hours of billable work on this sucker.

It'll still be in the millions though.

 

[schneebly111]

The newspapers made a number of imputations (alleged defamatory statements). Not just the one.

It's possible the Papers can rely on the truth defense (or public interest defense) to defend some of those imputations, but not others. Each imputation needs to be dealt with separately.

Thanks.

What would happen if there was a split ruling. So the judge finds that the newspapers accused him of 6 murders, but only 3 have been proven to be likely true. They proved that he burned his hard drives but probably didn’t bash his mistress?

Does the judge then order defamation costs to be paid by the newspapers even though it’s been shown he did horrible things?

 

[Malifice]

Thanks.

What would happen if there was a split ruling. So the judge finds that the newspapers accused him of 6 murders, but only 3 have been proven to be likely true. They proved that he burned his hard drives but probably didn’t bash his mistress?

Does the judge then order defamation costs to be paid by the newspapers even though it’s been shown he did horrible things?

If the judge finds a single imputation to be not sufficiently grounded in fact (and that BRS has suffered loss from that false and defamatory imputation) then damages will be awarded accordingly.

There were lots of imputations so it might be the case 1 or more don't meet that threshold, and he obtains small (pyrrhic) victory.

Most look pretty reasonably grounded in truth to me though.

Plus there is also the question of public interest as well.

My call is it largely or wholly goes against him, and he appeals (if he can), but we'll find out next week.

Its been apparent that the Feds (watching intently from the back of the court room) have possibly been holding off criminal proceedings until this has all settled.

An appeal of this matter likely buys him more time before any potential criminal hearing at the very least.

 

[kranky al]

If the judge finds a single imputation to be not sufficiently grounded in fact (and that BRS has suffered loss from that false and defamatory imputation) then damages will be awarded accordingly.

There were lots of imputations so it might be the case 1 or more don't meet that threshold, and he obtains small (pyrrhic) victory.

Most look pretty reasonably grounded in truth to me though.

Plus there is also the question of public interest as well.

My call is it largely or wholly goes against him, and he appeals (if he can), but we'll find out next week.

Its been apparent that the Feds (watching intently from the back of the court room) have possibly been holding off criminal proceedings until this has all settled.

An appeal of this matter likely buys him more time before any potential criminal hearing at the very least.

Hed have been better off flogging his vc and pissing off somewhere theres no extradition treaty. The court case has just made it worse for him in the court of public opinion.

 

[JackOutback]

My call is it largely or wholly goes against him, and he appeals (if he can), but we'll find out next week.

Just how much do we think Kerry is willing to bankroll this, though?

 

[Malifice]

Just how much do we think Kerry is willing to bankroll this, though?

Dont know. He might take his VC collateral and distance himself from the whole thing.

I'll say this (broadly). If the papers get done for defamation for reporting something with this much background evidence as to its truth (multiple witnesses, an active federal investigation etc) and that is also in the public interest (VC winner, war crimes etc) then that's a pretty scary precedent going forwards.

 

[schneebly111]

Hed have been better off flogging his vc and pissing off somewhere theres no extradition treaty. The court case has just made it worse for him in the court of public opinion.

Yeah it’s seems most of the 19 accused are still in Australia, the dude already charged was living in NSW. You’d think he and the others would’ve pissed off to a non-extradition country the second evidence of him executing a prisoner came to light? Obviously these guys aren’t as smart as they think they are.

 

[BigTacoBandit]

I'm not disagreeing, but how does it cost $130 million.

Also in respect of due process, *accused war criminals

The latest Guardian article mentions there are "40 to 50 investigations underway". $3 million per investigation seems about right.

 

[Malifice]

Ben Roberts-Smith verdict live: judgment due in former Australian soldier’s defamation case – latest news

Here we go.

 

[nobbyiscool]

This judge should've considered the fact that he'd be looking down to read. His combover game is weak AF.

 

[Smoooothy]

This judge should've considered the fact that he'd be looking down to read. His combover game is weak AF.

he's not fooling anyone with that combover

 

[western royboy]

BRS “cooked”

 

[nobbyiscool]

Jesus H Christ, he's being murdered like an Afghan civilian.