What They're Saying - The Bulldogs Media Thread - Part 4

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In footy clubs the coach still has a massive say in player access. And I’m sure Bevo would like this to be at a minimum when it comes to media. It’s up to Grant and Bains to overwrite this as they are meant to be Bevo’s bosses. No degree of pushing back from the media manager will change this.

May as well not have a media department then.

If Bevo, Bains and Grant think that members and supporters don't deserve to answers and to hear from the coaches, players and the club then all three should be sacked today. Once again we go back to Bevo having a 'huge say' - that's the problem. He has too much of a bloody say it seems.
 
Scott Gullen nailed it in his 5 issues with the dogs it is like he has been reading the dogs bigfooty

Barks to the wall 5 issues

Defence


Gardiner limited
Keath banged up
O'Brien a bust
Williams lost confidence

Bruce

Has become a better player by not playing given our reliance on Astro

Support


Losing King and Hansen

Absence

Bailey, Hunter, English, JJ and Duryea all absent for prolonged periods

Lewis Young

Why did the dogs let a 201 cm defender go

Selection why have the dogs played the likes of Schache, Roarke, Scott and McComb for prolonged periods
 
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Scott Gullen nailed it in his 5 issues with the dogs it is like he has been reading the dogs bigfooty

Barks to the wall 5 issues

Defence


Gardiner limited
Keath banged up
O'Brien a bust
Williams lost confidence

Bruce

Has become a better player by not playing given our reliance on Astro

Support

Losing King and Hansen

Absence

Bailey, Hunter, English, JJ and Duryea all absent for prolonged periods

Lewis Young

Why did the dogs let a 201 cm defender go

Selection why have the dogs played the likes of Schache, Roarke, Scott and McComb for prolonged periods
The Lewis Young one is one of the most baffling for me. They put years of development into him, we are screaming out for good key defenders and then we prioritise Gardner over Young, to the point where he decides to look elsewhere for opportunity. He is a perfect age, good size and basically exactly what we need and we drafted and developed him only to let him leave for peanuts and meanwhile we keep and play a guy who is smaller, less skilled and has a much lower ceiling.

Lipinski leaving I can understand and I genuinely wish him all the best at Collingwood. He was given lots of chances and we have an abundance of midfielders so letting one go is not the end of the world, but key position defenders is another story all together.
 
The Lewis Young one is one of the most baffling for me. They put years of development into him, we are screaming out for good key defenders and then we prioritise Gardner over Young, to the point where he decides to look elsewhere for opportunity. He is a perfect age, good size and basically exactly what we need and we drafted and developed him only to let him leave for peanuts and meanwhile we keep and play a guy who is smaller, less skilled and has a much lower ceiling.

Lipinski leaving I can understand and I genuinely wish him all the best at Collingwood. He was given lots of chances and we have an abundance of midfielders so letting one go is not the end of the world, but key position defenders is another story all together.
Has definitely made the most of his opportunity at Carlton. Started the year playing reserves with Oscar McDonald in front of him but with their entire backline going down he has been given the extended run in defence he never got with us.
 
So apart from letting Young and two assistant coaches go it’s all about the players and injuries?

Sounds like a whitewash.


Not really I think all 5 points are very valid and is fair precise of what us disappointed supporters have been saying all year.

Defence Is a big problem Not addressed by the club.
Attack No support and Bruce's absence never covered
Coaches Our game plan and structure has sucked all season. Giving away metres on the mark, one ruckman
Absences We have some key injuries and as had some effect
Lewis Young The non playing of Lewis Young and the backing of Gardiner just confounds us all. His selection of limited skills players continues example why play McComb in front of a Cleary or Bebendo. McComb is never going to make it the other 2 show promise and need games,


My precise is we have relied on our midfield to cover up our problems. It was good enough to get us to a GF last season but once matched or beaten we are in a world of pain. Defence substandard, forward line substandard, One ruck only substandard. This season is done even if we beat the saints we are not beating the dees, cats or Freo.

So some big decisions coming up

Does Dunks go if he does we will probably only get around pick 8 to 10
Does Astro go back and do we recruit another quality tall defender
Do we go after Lobb if so what does that do Sam's development
Do we recruit a speedy small forward who can create turnovers
Which new assistants to we get.
Who retires and get delisted
 
The Lewis Young one is one of the most baffling for me. They put years of development into him, we are screaming out for good key defenders and then we prioritise Gardner over Young, to the point where he decides to look elsewhere for opportunity. He is a perfect age, good size and basically exactly what we need and we drafted and developed him only to let him leave for peanuts and meanwhile we keep and play a guy who is smaller, less skilled and has a much lower ceiling.

Lipinski leaving I can understand and I genuinely wish him all the best at Collingwood. He was given lots of chances and we have an abundance of midfielders so letting one go is not the end of the world, but key position defenders is another story all together.

Play players in one position and teach them that position.

if a player cannot cut it in that position move them on don't turn a midfielder into a forward/HbF/HFF etc
 
Can someone paste the article please? Not just the paywalled link!
  1. It‘s the biggest question in football right now: What has happened to the Western Bulldogs? Last year‘s grand finalists have become boring, average and are not far away from being irrelevant. This was one of the most exciting teams in the game 12 months ago. So where has it all gone wrong? There doesn‘t seem to be one main obvious place to point the finger at, more a build-up of various things which have conspired to have the blowtorch pointing Luke Beveridge’s way. When he brought the club its second premiership in 2016, the thought of that man ever feeling any pressure at the Whitten Oval was laughable. The job for life was the call as a dynasty awaited. A decent premiership hangover was a problem for a couple of years but when the Dogs led by 19 points midway through the third quarter of last year‘s grand final against Melbourne – after another heroic march through September – the Bevo magic was back. Maybe he‘s lost his wand because all is not well out west with the next month set to answer a lot of questions. Watch every blockbuster AFL match this weekend Live & Ad-Break Free In-Play on Kayo. New to Kayo? Start your free trial now > The Bulldogs are currently a game outside the eight – they face St Kilda on Friday night who are one spot ahead of them in ninth – and then play the top three teams over the next three weeks. There are different ways to look at what has happened. Are they just purely having one of those years where nothing goes right? Is it just a loss of confidence? Or are they a fractured football club? Here are five issues haunting the Bulldogs:

    1. DEFENCE The stats over the past five weeks are embarrassing. The Dogs are ranked either 16th, 17th or 18th in categories such as points against, opposition scores per inside 50 and points against from turnovers. Personnel wise Ryan Gardner is limited, Alex Keath is banged up and asked to do too much, Bailey Williams has lost confidence while recruit Tim O‘Brien has been a bust and was dropped last week. They have no intercept markers anymore – Easton Wood’s retirement has cut deep – but the real issues are further up the field with the highly-rated midfield. “You can‘t defend when you’re all out offence in the midfielder. Last year they had total control of the ball around the contest so they could protect some issues down back but they don’t have that this year,” one rival club analyst said.



    2. JOSH BRUCE Bruce has become a better player by not playing. There is no doubt his presence helps relieve the pressure on Aaron Naughton and in his absence the Dogs have managed to scrape together enough decent scores, particularly thanks to the work of Cody Weightman, but it‘s not sustainable in big games against the top teams. Luke Beveridge has lost plenty of experience in his coaching circle.

    3. SUPPORT Losing long-time assistant Steven King was a blow the Dogs knew was coming but they were blindsided with highly rated Ashley Hansen went to Carlton. They were then late into the market for replacements with the inexperienced Matt Spangher and Marc Webb struggling to fill the void. All of this has added further pressure on Beveridge who had previously been accused of micromanaging.

    4. ABSENCE Every club has players missing but the Dogs have had it happen to the wrong people. Bailey Smith getting caught doing drugs and headbutting people hurt big time as did Lachie Hunter taking time away from the game. Ruckman Tim English having a number of concussion breaks, Jason Johannisen missing half the season, and Taylor Duryea‘s recent knee injury have all impacted continuity.

    5. LEWIS YOUNG Lewis Young has turned into Geoff Southby since he left but what can‘t be ignored is why the Dogs let a 201cm defender go who they’d put five years of development into. Selection has been an issue for a number of years with blind faith shown to players who many wouldn’t think deserve it – think the patience given to the likes of Josh Schache, Roarke Smith, Anthony Scott and Robbie McComb
 
Play players in one position and teach them that position.

if a player cannot cut it in that position move them on don't turn a midfielder into a forward/HbF/HFF etc

If we’d done that, we’d have not seen Boyd an AA half back, Naughton one of the best KPF in the league currently and Daniel and Dale AA half backs.

The narrow minded approach when developing players is not ideal.
 
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Play players in one position and teach them that position.

if a player cannot cut it in that position move them on don't turn a midfielder into a forward/HbF/HFF etc
It’s mindboggling what we expect of players who haven’t even found their feet at AFL level, it’s honestly so *ing stupid. Guys like Scott, Hannan, Schache - they haven’t even found a single position they’re consistent in and we expect them to be able to go down back and lock down on elite AFL forwards, then go forward and play key position etc. Lewy Young obviously the big one

It’s just unforgivable, who gives this s**t the okay?

I think Bevos philosophy’s are just fundamentally flawed, the way he sees the game is there’s two types of players - talls and smalls, and every single one of them should be able to rotate through all roles.

Whilst every other coach is having success finding niche roles for specific players that play on their strengths, and letting them build consistency in that role.

All of Bevos successes with player movements have been finding specific roles that suit a players individual strengths and leaving them there. Daniel to ‘Quarterback’, Dale to HB, Wally to FF etc. so then why does he think other players can play any role on the *ing field
 
If we’d done that, we’d have not seen Boyd an AA half back, Naughton one of the best KPF in the league currently and Daniel and Dale AA half backs.

Being so narrow minded when developing players is a terrible way to go about it.
They were all moves that played to the specific strengths of the individual players, and covered weaknesses in their game I.e he gave them roles - and then we kept them there to get consistency in the role.

Completely different to Young playing FB, FF and ruck in a 15 min period in the 3rd quarter, Schache playing forward all finals, training in defence all preseason and then lining up on the wing round 1 etc
 
  1. It‘s the biggest question in football right now: What has happened to the Western Bulldogs? Last year‘s grand finalists have become boring, average and are not far away from being irrelevant. This was one of the most exciting teams in the game 12 months ago. So where has it all gone wrong? There doesn‘t seem to be one main obvious place to point the finger at, more a build-up of various things which have conspired to have the blowtorch pointing Luke Beveridge’s way. When he brought the club its second premiership in 2016, the thought of that man ever feeling any pressure at the Whitten Oval was laughable. The job for life was the call as a dynasty awaited. A decent premiership hangover was a problem for a couple of years but when the Dogs led by 19 points midway through the third quarter of last year‘s grand final against Melbourne – after another heroic march through September – the Bevo magic was back. Maybe he‘s lost his wand because all is not well out west with the next month set to answer a lot of questions. Watch every blockbuster AFL match this weekend Live & Ad-Break Free In-Play on Kayo. New to Kayo? Start your free trial now > The Bulldogs are currently a game outside the eight – they face St Kilda on Friday night who are one spot ahead of them in ninth – and then play the top three teams over the next three weeks. There are different ways to look at what has happened. Are they just purely having one of those years where nothing goes right? Is it just a loss of confidence? Or are they a fractured football club? Here are five issues haunting the Bulldogs:

    1. DEFENCE The stats over the past five weeks are embarrassing. The Dogs are ranked either 16th, 17th or 18th in categories such as points against, opposition scores per inside 50 and points against from turnovers. Personnel wise Ryan Gardner is limited, Alex Keath is banged up and asked to do too much, Bailey Williams has lost confidence while recruit Tim O‘Brien has been a bust and was dropped last week. They have no intercept markers anymore – Easton Wood’s retirement has cut deep – but the real issues are further up the field with the highly-rated midfield. “You can‘t defend when you’re all out offence in the midfielder. Last year they had total control of the ball around the contest so they could protect some issues down back but they don’t have that this year,” one rival club analyst said.



    2. JOSH BRUCE Bruce has become a better player by not playing. There is no doubt his presence helps relieve the pressure on Aaron Naughton and in his absence the Dogs have managed to scrape together enough decent scores, particularly thanks to the work of Cody Weightman, but it‘s not sustainable in big games against the top teams. Luke Beveridge has lost plenty of experience in his coaching circle.

    3. SUPPORT Losing long-time assistant Steven King was a blow the Dogs knew was coming but they were blindsided with highly rated Ashley Hansen went to Carlton. They were then late into the market for replacements with the inexperienced Matt Spangher and Marc Webb struggling to fill the void. All of this has added further pressure on Beveridge who had previously been accused of micromanaging.

    4. ABSENCE Every club has players missing but the Dogs have had it happen to the wrong people. Bailey Smith getting caught doing drugs and headbutting people hurt big time as did Lachie Hunter taking time away from the game. Ruckman Tim English having a number of concussion breaks, Jason Johannisen missing half the season, and Taylor Duryea‘s recent knee injury have all impacted continuity.

    5. LEWIS YOUNG Lewis Young has turned into Geoff Southby since he left but what can‘t be ignored is why the Dogs let a 201cm defender go who they’d put five years of development into. Selection has been an issue for a number of years with blind faith shown to players who many wouldn’t think deserve it – think the patience given to the likes of Josh Schache, Roarke Smith, Anthony Scott and Robbie McComb

Thanks for posting.

Pretty disappointing depth of analysis to be honest. Merely asks questions that you would hope a proper analysis would attempt to answer.

The most interesting tidbit is the comment from a rival club analyst about not having control of the ball this year, but even that just alludes to the issue without explanation.
 
They were all moves that played to the specific strengths of the individual players, and covered weaknesses in their game I.e he gave them roles - and then we kept them there to get consistency in the role.

Completely different to Young playing FB, FF and ruck in a 15 min period in the 3rd quarter, Schache playing forward all finals, training in defence all preseason and then lining up on the wing round 1 etc

That’s what player development is about. Finding a role for every player that suits their strengths and ability.

Trying every player in one role and ditching them if it doesn’t work out, as the poster wanted, isn’t the right way to go about it.

Young was struggling in his development, so seeing what fit for him was not a bad decision by the club. He just couldn’t see it out, which is disappointing.
 

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Yeah that Gullan piece is not article, just some dot points with tongue in cheek comments thrown in, I can understand why the club wouldn't comment. That being said the club needs to be put under the microscope starting with Bevo.
 
If we’d done that, we’d have not seen Boyd an AA half back, Naughton one of the best KPF in the league currently and Daniel and Dale AA half backs.

The narrow minded approach when developing players is not ideal.

My point is once you have decided Naughton is going to be your forward, Daniel and Dale are going to be HBF you persist with it till you decide they are not up to it don't try reprogram them to something else. Preseason and VFL is where you experiment and not for a quarter here or there.

I know of one player who trained a whole preseason in one line only to be playing everywhere except that line.

You may call it development I call it you either dont think they can make it in that position or you don't have the confidence in your development system to teach them how to play that position. I lean to the latter.

Boyd is different mature player coming towards end of his career.

What is Cordy's position? Schache position? Scott position? Hannan's position? What is Buku position ? McComb position? Where do you see Bedendo wing? HFF? etc etc
 
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That’s what player development is about. Finding a role for every player that suits their strengths and ability.

Trying every player in one role and ditching them if it doesn’t work out, as the poster wanted, isn’t the right way to go about it.

Young was struggling in his development, so seeing what fit for him was not a bad decision by the club. He just couldn’t see it out, which is disappointing.

And breed Jack of all Trades and masters of nothing.

Confusion reigns at WO
 
It's the media team's job to provide frank and fearless advice to all in the organisation from the President to the CEO down. If they've ignored that and chosen to shut up shop then we're in deeper trouble than we realise

Are you talking about the clubs media team? If thats the case you've got it arse about.

The media teams job is to put forth a consistent club wide narrative that everything is wonderful. The board and the football department would be fully aware of all the outside noise about our failings this year. Indeed they'd only need to watch any of our games to understand this. What they dont need is any advice from the people tasked with delivering snappy social media posts that are in line with that narrative.

The tail never wags the dogs.
+1 This.

The fact that none of the higher ups are allowing anyone to speak with the media and it's a flat out 'no' is worrying as hell.

They owe it to the fans to front up and tell us what the * is going on with the club, as opposed to me having to hear it from people who work there in a 'don't say anything but...' capacity.
What would you expect to come from a club representative who spoke to the media. Some home truths, laying waste to any internal issues or their burning the joint to the ground? Thats not how damage control works.

When was the last time that a club came out and honestly addressed the concerns of "fans" and their expectations? Never. They'll just hunker down for a bit wait for the storm to pass and just re-forge and package a new narrative for us to swallow.

Thats how damage control works.

They understand that most fans are lifers and will come back into the fold as soon as we have a win. Nothing exemplifies this more than the mood of this board that rises and falls on our win loss ratio. Yet here we are. FMD One just needs to take a look at the ultimate scapegoat thread dedicated to Ryan Gardner to fully understand this.

Personally, I dont need to hear from the club right now. Indeed my ears dont need to hear Bevo's pressers at all, because I don't need to hear a top down massaged narrative explaining what is going on, when what is going on is happening in front of my eye balls.

Thanks for posting.

Pretty disappointing depth of analysis to be honest. Merely asks questions that you would hope a proper analysis would attempt to answer.

The most interesting tidbit is the comment from a rival club analyst about not having control of the ball this year, but even that just alludes to the issue without explanation.
Meh. It reads like a compendium of things said ad nauseam this board.

The only real insight was the one covering the assistant coaches and the poaching of Ass Hanson. Something that seemingly left us standing whilst everybody else sat down with their preferred assistants.

Hopefully the club makes good on the talk of shaking up this part of the football dpt.
 
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Meh. It reads like a compendium of things said ad nauseam this board.

The only real insight was the one covering the assistant coaches and the poaching of Ass Hanson. Something that seemingly left us standing whilst everybody else sat down with their preferred assistants.

Hopefully the club makes good on the talk of shaking up this part of the football dpt.

Even that was just regurgitating something that had already been noted previously.
 
Not really I think all 5 points are very valid and is fair precise of what us disappointed supporters have been saying all year.

Defence Is a big problem Not addressed by the club.
Attack No support and Bruce's absence never covered
Coaches Our game plan and structure has sucked all season. Giving away metres on the mark, one ruckman
Absences We have some key injuries and as had some effect
Lewis Young The non playing of Lewis Young and the backing of Gardiner just confounds us all. His selection of limited skills players continues example why play McComb in front of a Cleary or Bebendo. McComb is never going to make it the other 2 show promise and need games,

...
What you are saying is somewhat different to the outline of what Gullan said.

You are starting to get to the root causes (see bolded bits above). Gullen wasn't. Or at least he wasn't brave enough to say so outright. He seems to be hoping we can read between the lines but an approach like that is easily ignored.

If it's not a whitewash it's a very gentle treatment, mostly stating the obvious. I don't expect him to have the answers but he could certainly be asking more searching questions.

Oh and I don't get whatever he's saying about Bruce being better by not playing. Seems like gibberish. Could someone explain it to me please?
 
What you are saying is somewhat different to the outline of what Gullan said.

You are starting to get to the root causes (see bolded bits above). Gullen wasn't. Or at least he wasn't brave enough to say so outright. He seems to be hoping we can read between the lines but an approach like that is easily ignored.

If it's not a whitewash it's a very gentle treatment, mostly stating the obvious. I don't expect him to have the answers but he could certainly be asking more searching questions.

Oh and I don't get whatever he's saying about Bruce being better by not playing. Seems like gibberish. Could someone explain it to me please?

His value is more apparent in his absence.
 
  1. It‘s the biggest question in football right now: What has happened to the Western Bulldogs? Last year‘s grand finalists have become boring, average and are not far away from being irrelevant. This was one of the most exciting teams in the game 12 months ago. So where has it all gone wrong? There doesn‘t seem to be one main obvious place to point the finger at, more a build-up of various things which have conspired to have the blowtorch pointing Luke Beveridge’s way. When he brought the club its second premiership in 2016, the thought of that man ever feeling any pressure at the Whitten Oval was laughable. The job for life was the call as a dynasty awaited. A decent premiership hangover was a problem for a couple of years but when the Dogs led by 19 points midway through the third quarter of last year‘s grand final against Melbourne – after another heroic march through September – the Bevo magic was back. Maybe he‘s lost his wand because all is not well out west with the next month set to answer a lot of questions. Watch every blockbuster AFL match this weekend Live & Ad-Break Free In-Play on Kayo. New to Kayo? Start your free trial now > The Bulldogs are currently a game outside the eight – they face St Kilda on Friday night who are one spot ahead of them in ninth – and then play the top three teams over the next three weeks. There are different ways to look at what has happened. Are they just purely having one of those years where nothing goes right? Is it just a loss of confidence? Or are they a fractured football club? Here are five issues haunting the Bulldogs:

    1. DEFENCE The stats over the past five weeks are embarrassing. The Dogs are ranked either 16th, 17th or 18th in categories such as points against, opposition scores per inside 50 and points against from turnovers. Personnel wise Ryan Gardner is limited, Alex Keath is banged up and asked to do too much, Bailey Williams has lost confidence while recruit Tim O‘Brien has been a bust and was dropped last week. They have no intercept markers anymore – Easton Wood’s retirement has cut deep – but the real issues are further up the field with the highly-rated midfield. “You can‘t defend when you’re all out offence in the midfielder. Last year they had total control of the ball around the contest so they could protect some issues down back but they don’t have that this year,” one rival club analyst said.



    2. JOSH BRUCE Bruce has become a better player by not playing. There is no doubt his presence helps relieve the pressure on Aaron Naughton and in his absence the Dogs have managed to scrape together enough decent scores, particularly thanks to the work of Cody Weightman, but it‘s not sustainable in big games against the top teams. Luke Beveridge has lost plenty of experience in his coaching circle.

    3. SUPPORT Losing long-time assistant Steven King was a blow the Dogs knew was coming but they were blindsided with highly rated Ashley Hansen went to Carlton. They were then late into the market for replacements with the inexperienced Matt Spangher and Marc Webb struggling to fill the void. All of this has added further pressure on Beveridge who had previously been accused of micromanaging.

    4. ABSENCE Every club has players missing but the Dogs have had it happen to the wrong people. Bailey Smith getting caught doing drugs and headbutting people hurt big time as did Lachie Hunter taking time away from the game. Ruckman Tim English having a number of concussion breaks, Jason Johannisen missing half the season, and Taylor Duryea‘s recent knee injury have all impacted continuity.

    5. LEWIS YOUNG Lewis Young has turned into Geoff Southby since he left but what can‘t be ignored is why the Dogs let a 201cm defender go who they’d put five years of development into. Selection has been an issue for a number of years with blind faith shown to players who many wouldn’t think deserve it – think the patience given to the likes of Josh Schache, Roarke Smith, Anthony Scott and Robbie McComb
almost a perfect summation
 
Not sure if it's a good or bad thing for us at the moment, but if that article was about Essington or Collingwood it would have been a double page spread rehashed over two or three consecutive days...

Maybe we need that kind of blowtorching right now?
 
Pathetic, seriously pathetic. Our media team are clearly a bunch of muppets because they've failed PR 101.

1) Ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away and 2) If you don't fill the information vacuum you can guarantee somebody else will and likely make the problem worse or the journo will just make it up

D***heads.
Discussing the problem publicly doent make it go away either.

If is possible Grant and Bains knew what questions would be asked and felt answering publicily isnt helpful. For example there is no pointing the club publicily discussing how bad our assistants are if there is a clear plan to rectify at seasons end.
 
What you are saying is somewhat different to the outline of what Gullan said.

You are starting to get to the root causes (see bolded bits above). Gullen wasn't. Or at least he wasn't brave enough to say so outright. He seems to be hoping we can read between the lines but an approach like that is easily ignored.

If it's not a whitewash it's a very gentle treatment, mostly stating the obvious. I don't expect him to have the answers but he could certainly be asking more searching questions.

Oh and I don't get whatever he's saying about Bruce being better by not playing. Seems like gibberish. Could someone explain it to me please?

Learned one I think it is quite easy to understand we have now proven we do not have anyone to replace him so his value goes up. Just like economics the scarcer the product the more valuable it is.

Why I like Gullan's article was most of his points has only been expressed as directly on social media (bulldogs bigfooty). It is the most direct I have seen in the mainstream media.
 
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