Who is accountable for our club's catastrophic misreading of our list?

Peter J

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Dec 24, 2008
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This was the side embarrassed on the SCG in the 2016 Semi Final. They’d been embarrassed by Hawthorn in the 2015 Semi too, but hey, something can go wrong once. So we stay pretty stagnant but then Groundhog Day.

Then why were we surprised they disappeared at the G in 2017. Here we are in 2019. 14 players from this side played in the Showdown - another 2 are on our list still, so 16!!!!

When is it enough!!!

1503251B-D304-4B90-9815-01D77CEDA4A0.jpeg
 

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Scorpus

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This was the side embarrassed on the SCG in the 2016 Semi Final. They’d been embarrassed by Hawthorn in the 2015 Semi too, but hey, something can go wrong once. So we stay pretty stagnant but then Groundhog Day.

Then why were we surprised they disappeared at the G in 2017. Here we are in 2019. 14 players from this side played in the Showdown - another 2 are on our list still, so 16!!!!

When is it enough!!!

View attachment 705855
And there are three players in that side that aren't there that you'd probably wish still were
 

Elite Crow

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MRB37 help me out if you can, how many players did they say we had under 23 against Port and how many Port did?

Did they also say we had the oldest team and 3rd oldest for the year?

What ever it was it was damming.

That’s what happens when you’ve got to pump games into Douglas and Mackay. Our selectors are morons.
 

MRB37

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MRB37 help me out if you can, how many players did they say we had under 23 against Port and how many Port did?

Did they also say we had the oldest team and 3rd oldest for the year?

What ever it was it was damming.

That’s what happens when you’ve got to pump games into Douglas and Mackay. Our selectors are morons.
We had Milera, Murphy and Gallucci with ROB currently 23, turning 24 in August. Port had Howard, Rozee, Burton, Butters, Duursma, Bonner, Powell-Pepper and Houston all under 23, with Amon and Byrne-Jones currently 23, turning 24 this year.

And yes, we had the oldest team out there last week with an average age of 26 years and 9 months. Just to drive it home, Port had a team average of 25 years and 4 months, but only as a team averaged 15 less games, 119 to their 104, which highlights again how much time has been put into their youngsters.
 

Elite Crow

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We had Milera, Murphy and Gallucci with ROB currently 23, turning 24 in August. Port had Howard, Rozee, Burton, Butters, Duursma, Bonner, Powell-Pepper and Houston all under 23, with Amon and Byrne-Jones currently 23, turning 24 this year.

And yes, we had the oldest team out there last week with an average age of 26 years and 9 months. Just to drive it home, Port had a team average of 25 years and 4 months, but only as a team averaged 15 less games, 119 to their 104, which highlights again how much time has been put into their youngsters.
That’s just s**t
 

1970crow

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Jun 7, 2011
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I've always felt that Noble was severely underrated by this forum.
We were no different when Noble was around, no different. He’s now benefiting from being part of an organisation that is geared differently. There’s almost no chance that he’s driving it. Fagan is the guy who is responsible for how the coaches and players go about it, he was their agent of change. Our problem is that Pyke hasn’t driven change, he’s just slotted into an existing system/culture that has existed for many years and heavily influenced by Noble.
 

1970crow

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It's interesting to see our cross-town rivals have, out of necessity mind you, tended to stick with the selection of their younger recruits, such as Rozee, Duursma, etc., where we have sent Jones back to the SANFL, and left him there for a good period, similar to the likes of Fogarty last year. If we are to progress this year, these players need to be backed in at the highest level - it's no point us being top of the SANFL. We need the exuberance of these younger guys in the AFL team - especially whilst we have some experienced heads still there. They add an energy and unpredictability to the side that is harder to plan for and negate.

Wrong thread - but I'd like to see Eddie 'managed' this week also (dropped actually, but we can't say that about a legend), and Douglas and Mackay omitted, as they are not going to take us to a flag. Bring in Jones, Stengle and Knight (or even Jordon Butts who's shown something this year). Perfect week to change the order of things, and get some vim and energy back into the side.
Did it with Milera too and Lever before that missed the conclusion to the year. We give them a taste of a few games and then rule a line through them. It repeats often enough that it’s not a player by player management decision, it’s a set play.
 

1970crow

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Our best ball carrier who has been in woeful form. It's not that hard to understand really, Smith has struggled with the right checking, so we move him forward to free him up.

Again it didn't work that well, but these weird conspiracy theories people come up with are quite funny.
You’ve lost it now. Smith forward with Mackay returning has nothing to do with Mackay? Wow.
 

Sanders

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Noble wasn't as good when he was here. I think getting the arse might have made something click for him, certainly in terms of professionalism. Was far too close to certain players during his tenure here (see Dangerfield trade).

Taking Charlie Cameron with him has also done wonders for Brisbane
That’s certainly a convenient explanation, whether it is an accurate one is less clear
 

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Sanders

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What are we doing with Milera?

Last year he had a clear role and a very good season.

This year he's shuffled between forward, back and midfield and doesn't seem to have been used the same way twice.
What’s are we doing with him?

Confusing him. I would have thought that was obvious!
 

marty36

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Aug 17, 2009
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Just a quick one shorty

Would you say Tex, Sloane , Talia, Betts and Gibbs are the 5 highest paid players at our club

Do you rate their performances say like Geelongs top 5 highest paid players in Danger, Selwood Hawkins, Kelly, Henderson

How would you think any team would perform if there 5 highest paid players aren't performing to their ability

Those 5 would be taking over 30% of the salary cap leaving fringe players and rookies to carry the load whos wages suggest they are not ready or capable
 

Murray2503

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May 10, 2016
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Disagree, we were never contending this year. We misread the capacity of our list, the 'turn around' that old men would make, and our capacity to rebound.

This was a list that needed to be turned over.
2 years ago it should have been turned over after the grand final debacle. We are currently sending out the oldest team in the league each week with no chance of september success. Club cares more about making the finals than developing a team to genuinely contend quicker. Wrong.
 

marty36

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2 years ago it should have been turned over after the grand final debacle. We are currently sending out the oldest team in the league each week with no chance of september success. Club cares more about making the finals than developing a team to genuinely contend quicker. Wrong.
Who are the 5 oldest lists in the league ATM

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

Slippery Pete

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Jul 19, 2010
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This was the side embarrassed on the SCG in the 2016 Semi Final. They’d been embarrassed by Hawthorn in the 2015 Semi too, but hey, something can go wrong once. So we stay pretty stagnant but then Groundhog Day.

Then why were we surprised they disappeared at the G in 2017. Here we are in 2019. 14 players from this side played in the Showdown - another 2 are on our list still, so 16!!!!

When is it enough!!!

View attachment 705855

Underrated post.

About halfway through 2015 we narrowly beat a very crap Carlton on the MCG. They ran us off our feet, and I remember saying at the time (f’ed if I can find the post) that we were highly suspect on fast, wide tracks because we had no real outside talent (and that was when we had Cameron and Dangerfield).

In 2017 we were even slower than we were in 2015 (we moved the ball quick though which disguised it especially on the narrow AO), and in 2019 we’re slower than 2017.

We’ve gotten progressively slower every year since 2015, and we were slow then.

And we’ve done nothing to address it. Other than take Andy Otten up to the Gold Coast as our secret weapon.
 

Southerntakeover

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This was the side embarrassed on the SCG in the 2016 Semi Final. They’d been embarrassed by Hawthorn in the 2015 Semi too, but hey, something can go wrong once. So we stay pretty stagnant but then Groundhog Day.

Then why were we surprised they disappeared at the G in 2017. Here we are in 2019. 14 players from this side played in the Showdown - another 2 are on our list still, so 16!!!!

When is it enough!!!
Very good post, and yet our club's plan seems to be to turn the same team out in 2019 finals, and have that result in some sort of coup.
 

Slippery Pete

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Jul 19, 2010
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The issue of AO is very underrated.

AO is very narrow for a footy ground, and it’s a very different shape from the MCG which has much bigger wings and flanks. There is a lot more space to defend at the G and you have to do a lot more unrewarded running, especially as a key forward.

You can very conceivably have a game plan that masters AO but it easy to dismantle at the G.

If you look at the premiership teams who played on very narrow home grounds like West Coast (when they played at Subiaco) and Geelong, they had a lot of scares at the MCG. West Coast had a shocking record there for a lot of years, and all three of their flags (when they played at Subi) came against teams just as unfamiliar with the G as they were. (They must’ve thought it was an issue because the new Perth stadium was designed to be much closer to the dimensions of the ‘G. First year - flag!)

Geelong were literally unbeatable at home from 2007-2011 but had a lot of scares and unexpected losses at the MCG. They were a whisker away from losing the 2007 prelim to a very average Collingwood, and only wet weather and really slow conditions saved them from losing to St Kilda in 2009. They had really bad losses to Hawthorn in 2008 and Collingwood in the 2010 prelim.
 
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mcattack

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Apr 14, 2019
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The issue of AO is very underrated.

AO is very narrow for a footy ground, and it’s a very different shape from the MCG which has much bigger wings and flanks. There is a lot more space to defend at the G and you have to do a lot more unrewarded running, especially as a key forward.

You can very conceivably have a game plan that masters AO but it easy to dismantle at the G.

If you look at the premiership teams who played on very narrow home grounds like West Coast (when they played at Subiaco) and Geelong, they had a lot of scares at the MCG. West Coast had a shocking record there for a lot of years, and all three of their flags (when they played at Subi) came against teams just as unfamiliar with the G as they were. (They must’ve thought it was an issue because the new Perth stadium was designed to be much closer to the dimensions of the ‘G. First year - flag!)

Geelong were literally unbeatable at home from 2007-2011 but had a lot of scares and unexpected losses at the MCG. They were a whisker away from losing the 2007 prelim to a very average Collingwood, and only wet weather and really slow conditions saved them from losing to St Kilda in 2009. They had really bad losses to Hawthorn in 2008 and Collingwood in the 2010 prelim.
Hopefully our new training facility has dimensions of the G.
 

Peter J

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Dec 24, 2008
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The issue of AO is very underrated.

AO is very narrow for a footy ground, and it’s a very different shape from the MCG which has much bigger wings and flanks. There is a lot more space to defend at the G and you have to do a lot more unrewarded running, especially as a key forward.

You can very conceivably have a game plan that masters AO but it easy to dismantle at the G.

If you look at the premiership teams who played on very narrow home grounds like West Coast (when they played at Subiaco) and Geelong, they had a lot of scares at the MCG. West Coast had a shocking record there for a lot of years, and all three of their flags (when they played at Subi) came against teams just as unfamiliar with the G as they were. (They must’ve thought it was an issue because the new Perth stadium was designed to be much closer to the dimensions of the ‘G. First year - flag!)

Geelong were literally unbeatable at home from 2007-2011 but had a lot of scares and unexpected losses at the MCG. They were a whisker away from losing the 2007 prelim to a very average Collingwood, and only wet weather and really slow conditions saved them from losing to St Kilda in 2009. They had really bad losses to Hawthorn in 2008 and Collingwood in the 2010 prelim.
Spot on. Interesting that the new Optus Oval in Perth was constructed to meet the dimensions of the MCG.

No coincidence that a good side like WCE has now improved its record there, including a GF win.
 

Scorpus

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Spot on. Interesting that the new Optus Oval in Perth was constructed to meet the dimensions of the MCG.

No coincidence that a good side like WCE has now improved its record there, including a GF win.
Not quite true:

MCG - 160x141m
Perth Stadium - 165x130m
Subiaco Oval - 175x122m
Adelaide Oval - 167x123m
SCG - 155x136m
Docklands Stadium - 160x129m
Giants Stadium - 164x128m
Kardinia Park - 170x115m
Carrara Stadium - 161x134m
Gabba - 156x138m

Optus is 7m wider than AO and 2m shorter, but the MCG is 5m shorter and 11m wider

The stadium that remains the closest in dimensions to the MCG is the Gabba
 
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