Why aren't non-Victorian clubs demanding a fairer system?

[pirate bob]

Geelong finished 2nd last year and played Hawthorn, whose home ground is the MCG too, in the QF at the MCG and nobody said boo.

What advantage did we have in the QF considering the cats played 3 home games at the venue this year?

What happened in the QF is not new and is not going to change.

Just clarify where our leg up is?


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You won. Isn't that enough. Congratulations

Its been a big and unhappy week. Has it ever occurred to you that maybe some people are venting. We rarely saw a single Richmond supporter on this board for months. Now you just keep popping up everywhere like ******* weeds.

 

[Elite Crow]

Geelong finished 2nd last year and played Hawthorn, whose home ground is the MCG too, in the QF at the MCG and nobody said boo.

What advantage did we have in the QF considering the cats played 3 home games at the venue this year?

What happened in the QF is not new and is not going to change.

Just clarify where our leg up is?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Read the thread and also read the post by the Mod for the Tigers supporters to keep out.

 

[Relton Roberts]

You won. Isn't that enough. Congratulations

Its been a big and unhappy week. Has it ever occurred to you that maybe some people are venting. We rarely saw a single Richmond supporter on this board for months. Now you just keep popping up everywhere like ******* weeds.

The AFL doesn't need either of our clubs to be successful as they are both power clubs in their own state and can survive for a very long time without as we both have proven.

You had a fantastic season all bar one game, just don't throw all of the toys out of the cot, you'll be back!


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[frenchconnection]

Size shouldn’t be the deciding factor. AFL club supporters get stooged with tickets anyway.

If NFL can play games at 50k venues then the AFL can. Just ditch the ****en corporates and MCC/AFL members.

That is why most say the preliminary final is the most enjoyable for supporters to watch your team play and then to win and make the GF as the atmosphere on that day is electric, and the majority of the supporter base willing to pay the prices can watch their team play.

On GF day unfortunately due to the Corporates and to a lesser extent all other teams who get a seat allocation (2,000 each for all other 16 sides?) many genuine supporters of participating teams often miss out on being able to get a seat. Is the allocation 17,000 seats each for both of the participating teams or thereabouts, which is not much in the scheme of things!

 

[pirate bob]

The AFL doesn't need either of our clubs to be successful as they are both power clubs in their own state and can survive for a very long time without as we both have proven.

You had a fantastic season all bar one game, just don't throw all of the toys out of the cot, you'll be back!


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This isn't a case of throwing the toys out. This is a case of allowing some people to vent. Continually coming back and arguing about what is currently a moot point starts getting irritating after a while. As I said, we see no one for months, and then all of sudden ...

People will start to wonder if you're just here to gloat or to troll.

 

[Relton Roberts]

This isn't a case of throwing the toys out. This is a case of allowing some people to vent. Continually coming back and arguing about what is currently a moot point starts getting irritating after a while. As I said, we see no one for months, and then all of sudden ...

People will start to wonder if you're just here to gloat or to troll.

Not trying to argue more discuss.

I'll admit we had an extreme amount of luck, especially in the back end.
-matched up with a Victorian club for QF when it was looking likely having to play 1st final away.
-didn't have to make one change during finals (you guys copped 2 big injuries)
-matched up an interstate side in PF.

Don't think it's fair to say we won by the AFLs design.

If the AFL wants anything it's success in Sydney and especially GWS.


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[radiojake]

Mate atleast you're not being an arrogant flog like the other tiger poster

but there was no way Richmond weren't gonna lose the GF with the build up and the platter they had handed to them

2 full dress rehearsals in the lead up and then the big dance at your home ground

an entire media industry behind you

rotten umpiring to the get the game rolling

- to make things easier the Crows bloody capitulated too - but don't pretend it was this last factor alone

-- it was always going to be twice as hard for the Crows to win than Richmond last Saturday and they weren't up to it

 

[pirate bob]

Not trying to argue more discuss.

I'll admit we had an extreme amount of luck, especially in the back end.
-matched up with a Victorian club for QF when it was looking likely having to play 1st final away.
-didn't have to make one change during finals (you guys copped 2 big injuries)
-matched up an interstate side in PF.

Don't think it's fair to say we won by the AFLs design.

If the AFL wants anything it's success in Sydney and especially GWS.


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Most Adelaide fans have been fair in their assessment. We have continued to congratulate Richmond and their supporters.

You need to understand this is our board, a place where some people can vent. Many peoples responses are emotive. There are threads on the main board for you to argue these points, if you feel the need. How about treating people here with a little respect. Coming on here and arguing a moot point just casts you in bad light. Its not just all about you and all about what you think is fair. And does it really matter?

I am really trying to be polite here. Its time for you to go now

 

[TheLeftFist8]

If people can't understand being gifted a massive home ground advantage when they don't deserve it isn't a massive and unfair leg up then they will never get it. #vfllogic

 

[radiojake]

Ok i will leave. I genuinely enjoyed the discussion and i was not gloating i truely believe we are the better team and deserve it 100 percent.

Anyway ill leave on this note. you guys have a point in some aspects but the afl has always been this way. You cant just take credit out of a side who.wins a flag. They are bloody hard to win

Interstate sides get defined home adv and we dont. The neutral venues are 50-50. So it all evens out. It shouldnt be an excuse and it isnt. We were just the better team overall all year. Enjoyed talking to you guys and good luck next year.

I know, I know

responding to the bait

but you contradict yourself so often in such few sentences

Do you know what gloating actually means? You literally gloat with your first sentence after saying 'not gloating' as a preface -


Yeah home ground is an advantage, and we get it 10 times a year - but there is 10 times a year when we don't have it

Richmond only have a 'defined away disadvantage' 6 or 7 times a year - and then guaranteed, no matter the state of that particular AFL season, a home grand final - and you say it 'all evens out' ?

 

[DJMac]

i love how this has all of a sudden became an issue for many fans because the tigers won the flag.

It has always been this way, thats the way the afl run it, if your team is good enough they will win the flag, the grand final has always been at the g, its the way it has been for ages and noone kicked up a massive fuss about it, if a team is truly number 1 they will win anywhere

People have been complaining about it for many years. Just nobody in Melbourne wants to hear it. In their 3peat Hawthorn twice got home ground advantage against a higher ranked interstate opponent. Then Richmond this year. Yes it has been this way for years but that does not make it right. If you are good enough you win. Yes West Coast beat Hawthorn at Domain in the 2015 finals on the way to meeting them again at the G. Adelaide beat Richmond in Adelaide this year before conceding their home ground advantage to the lower ranked Richmond.

Almost every team plays better at home and those teams that have the MCG as their home ground have a huge and sometimes unfair advantage. I don't mind playing Richmond, Collingwood and Hawthorn etc in a GF at the MCG if they are the higher ranked team but the other way is not fair.

And why should interstate fans always have to travel to Melbourne with all the additional costs if they want to see their team play in the GF.

 

[BrissyCrow]

did i say something wrong? normally winning more games and winning the flag means you are the best team that year

If the G is to be used for the biggest game of the year and the AFL insist that it stays that way then I am prepared to accept that. But then I would expect that AFL to cease allowing clubs to use the G as their home ground. The G should be used each week for th special games (eg Anzac Day) and all clubs should only get to play the same number of games on the G during the year. This would mean the Vic clubs would have to find a home ground that they can play on even if they share that (eg Etihad) this way all clubs get the same exposure to the G and no club has an advantage come grand final day.

The game should be equitable for all clubs. If its not to be that way then lets disolve the AFL and we all move back to our state competitions. If this were to happen I would go back to watching my Glenelg and I would also return to being a Richnmond supporter. SO I do have a past relationship with the RFC.

By the way this has been a an issue for our supporters since we joined along with a few other issues and yes I daresay that if you were a South Aussie you would be raising the questions about the so called level playing field.

 

[ButterMill]

Cats fan here. Didn't like being told we couldn't use our home ground. Then hearing that we should suck it up because we have an advantage during the home and away season because we play at our home ground.

AFL isn't fair. The fixture is created each season. The location of games is selected, the funding is equalised kind off. It's all a bit of a song and dance at times. Not slighting Richmond, they smashed us and were awesome through finals.

However, you guys can hang your hat on your home ground and the support you show your team. Watching on TV, Adelaide games are fantastic. The atmosphere genuinely improves the spectacle for those of us watching as neutral supporters. Compare a North vs Gold Coast game at Etihad, it sounds like an indoor swimming pool, a handful of voices bouncing around and whistles. But a game with the Crows or Port, nearly every game has that buzz.

 

[1achie]

Unfortunately you've summed it up here for me.
The levels of nonsense in this competition seem endless.

Love the club. Love the game. Hate this corrupt lop-sided competition.
I'd love to walk away from the competition but not from the game and our club.

The frustration it causes makes you wonder why you bother when there's so many inequalities.

Couldn't agree more.
Although if the Vic media get their wish with their latest self-fulfilling prophecy and Sloane does in fact leave then I reckon that would be the final straw for me and it would be Double Blues only from that point on.

 

[1achie]

Sure it's lopsided... 10 of the 18 clubs are Victorian

50% of the matches in 2017 were played in Victoria

Of the 7.3 million people who went through the turnstiles in all AFL games this year, 4.4 million (60.3%) were here in Victoria and just 39.7% attended the matches at venues outside Victoria.

It's a similar discrepancy for TV ratings with the vast majority of the audience here in Victoria

How's that for lopsided?

Why the hell should the Grand Final be played anywhere else but the MCG? The Granny will never be rotated around all the capitol cities, so there isn't much point in whining about this. It's just not gonna happen. The GF is locked in at the MCG until 2037 and it is 100% certain that the AFL and MCG will renew their deal when the time comes.

I don't see Liverpool or Man United whining about having to travel to London for the FA Cup at Wembley Stadium.

This is exactly why we need an AFL version of the Superleague. Victorians will always have the opinion that we're extremely lucky they let us join their league, and we should just shut and put up with the way it is or leave.
So let's set up a truly National league and you Vic's can have your own little league with no upstarts or "plastic franchises" and everyone will be happy.

BTW the Premier League clubs only really care about the premiership hence why they don't complain about playing the FA cup at Wembley (which is a neutral venue anyway).

 

[Back One Out]

This is exactly why we need an AFL version of the Superleague. Victorians will always have the opinion that we're extremely lucky they let us join their league, and we should just shut and put up with the way it is or leave.
So let's set up a truly National league and you Vic's can have your own little league with no upstarts or "plastic franchises" and everyone will be happy.

BTW the Premier League clubs only really care about the premiership hence why they don't complain about playing the FA cup at Wembley (which is a neutral venue anyway).

I'm just stating the facts. It's not some "arrogant Victorian bias". West Coast, Brisbane and Adelaide joined the VFL competition which was then rebranded as the AFL. The finals continued to be played at the MCG and VFL Park, Waverley just as they'd been prior to 1987. The Brownlow Medal, Coleman Medal and Norm Smith Medal also continued as they were.

10 Victorian clubs remain in this competition (in addition to the 8 non-Victorian clubs) and the majority of paying spectators and regular TV viewers reside here in this state, as well as the league administration. The AFL is not going to throw away 115 years of Grand Final tradition (and all the money they make from MCG finals) in order to placate people from Adelaide or Perth over a "neutral venue". Wake up!

Do you seriously think the AFL is going to leave the Grand Final venue up in the air until the Preliminary Finals are decided and then schedule the game (on 7 days notice) at the SCG, or the Adelaide Oval or the new stadium in Perth. You've got rocks in your head if you believe that's a possibility. It's just not going to happen. (That's why I say "just quit moaning about it and accept it". Not being a campaigner. Just trying to help you face facts...)

The MCG is a neutral venue on Grand Final day in any case. The Crows had almost as many fans at the game as Richmond. It's deceitful to make out your boys were up against a hometown Richmond crowd. Tickets were split 50-50.

As for your idea of a Super League, it would last about 5 seconds without Victorian clubs. It's not even possible anyway. The AFL own all the trademarks of each club. The AFL will continue on with the Crows, Power, Swans, Giants, Lions, Suns, Eagles and Dockers. You would have to start up a whole bunch of new teams to compete against the existing 18 clubs. Good luck with that pipe dream.

 

[Horace]

Just popped over to see how things are here with all of the fallout in the last week. Can't help but feel for you people with everything that has happened (even though I'm still hurting after 1998)

Anyway my view on the GF is that it should not automatically be at the MCG. For arguments sake when eventually you play the Power in a GF or the Eagles play the Dockers in a GF, I believe those games should be played in SA and WA respectively. This year it should have been at the Adelaide Oval, because your boys finished top at the end of the H&A and ended up the highest ranked PF winner. If the tigers had have occupied your position on the ladder at the end of H&A and become the highest ranked PF winner then the MCG should be the venue.

One day there will be a Crows v Power GF and an Eagles v Dockers GF. What a disgrace it will be if those GF's are played at the MCG, robbing so many diehard supporters who watch their team every 2nd week, from being able to see their team in action on GF day.

I'm an AFL member and got to this years GF; and have been to most GF's since I have been an AFL member. I love the experience of seeing the GF live, but I really question why I am able to get there ahead of the diehard supporters of the competing clubs. Yes AFL membership costs a lot of money, but the system still seems unfair to me.

Just my two bobs worth.

 

[1achie]

I'm just stating the facts. It's not some "arrogant Victorian bias". West Coast, Brisbane and Adelaide joined the VFL competition which was then rebranded as the AFL. The finals continued to be played at the MCG and VFL Park, Waverley just as they'd been prior to 1987. The Brownlow Medal, Coleman Medal and Norm Smith Medal also continued as they were.

10 Victorian clubs remain in this competition (in addition to the 8 non-Victorian clubs) and the majority of paying spectators and regular TV viewers reside here in this state, as well as the league administration. The AFL is not going to throw away 115 years of Grand Final tradition (and all the money they make from MCG finals) in order to placate people from Adelaide or Perth over a "neutral venue". Wake up!

Do you seriously think the AFL is going to leave the Grand Final venue up in the air until the Preliminary Finals are decided and then schedule the game (on 7 days notice) at the SCG, or the Adelaide Oval or the new stadium in Perth. You've got rocks in your head, if you believe that's a possibility. It's just not going to happen. (That's why I say "just quit moaning about it and accept it". Not being a campaigner. Just trying to help you face facts...)

The MCG is a neutral venue on Grand Final day in any case. The Crows had almost as many fans at the game as Richmond. It's deceitful to make out your boys were up against a hometown Richmond crowd. Tickets were split 50-50.

As for your idea of a Super League, it would last about 5 seconds without Victorian clubs. It's not even possible anyway. The AFL own all the trademarks of each club. The AFL will continue on with the Crows, Power, Swans, Giants, Lions, Suns, Eagles and Dockers. You would have to start up a whole bunch of new teams to compete against the existing 18 clubs. Good luck with that pipe dream.

So put up and shut up is our only option!
Well done to you for confirming what everyone here hates about the VFL

 

[Bojangles17]

Whilst the afl are subsiding the new franchises 10s of millions and a few of the smaller melb based teams , you can be assured that they will maximize every cent they can get ,100k at the GF turns alot of coin with tkt starting at $250+. Playing at a stadium with 60,000 capacity would produce a significant shortfall

 

[BrissyCrow]

Cats fan here. Didn't like being told we couldn't use our home ground. Then hearing that we should suck it up because we have an advantage during the home and away season because we play at our home ground.

AFL isn't fair. The fixture is created each season. The location of games is selected, the funding is equalised kind off. It's all a bit of a song and dance at times. Not slighting Richmond, they smashed us and were awesome through finals.

However, you guys can hang your hat on your home ground and the support you show your team. Watching on TV, Adelaide games are fantastic. The atmosphere genuinely improves the spectacle for those of us watching as neutral supporters. Compare a North vs Gold Coast game at Etihad, it sounds like an indoor swimming pool, a handful of voices bouncing around and whistles. But a game with the Crows or Port, nearly every game has that buzz.

I have to say that I (the Crows) dont like playing at the cattery but that is irrelavent.Geelong should get to play half their games at the cattery and if they are entitled to it they should be allowed to play their finals there as well. To me its just logical.

 

[dean33]

That's actually irrelevant.

Even if the Vic teams lose they still get an advantage. An advantage that they didn't earn.

The AFL is a joke of a competition run by jokes. Lucky for them the game is so good otherwise it would die.

We invest so much support our team, only to be handicapped. It's bullshit.

ok im gonna put my 2 cents in, how many games do victorian teams get a real home ground advantage in as opposed to interstate sides? Every interstate side gets 10-11 real home ground advantage games. Vic clubs only get a home ground advantage when playing interstate sides, so mabe 5-6 per year.

You don't think those extra 5 games a year you get an advantage doesn't help your final ladder position? You think the eagles make the 8 if they weren't a perth team? The system we have will never be 100% fair however its the best we have, interstate sides have won the grand final at the MCG before, its not like it never happens.

 

[DD#23]

ok im gonna put my 2 cents in, how many games do victorian teams get a real home ground advantage in as opposed to interstate sides? Every interstate side gets 10-11 real home ground advantage games. Vic clubs only get a home ground advantage when playing interstate sides, so mabe 5-6 per year.

You don't think those extra 5 games a year you get an advantage doesn't help your final ladder position? You think the eagles make the 8 if they weren't a perth team? The system we have will never be 100% fair however its the best we have, interstate sides have won the grand final at the MCG before, its not like it never happens.

this is a good point, but you should also factor in that Melbourne teams travel half as much as the interstate sides too.

for what its worth, I'd take a lower ladder position after the home and away games for a Grand Final on my home deck any day of the week.

 

[MattyB_76]

Victorian teams are the cishet middle-aged white dudes of the AFL, while the other teams are the minority/POC groups.

I've never fully grasped the concept of 'privilege' til now. I ******* hate the term 'privilege' (since I'm a cishet middle-aged white dude), but it's perfectly accurate.

 

[dogs105]

ok im gonna put my 2 cents in, how many games do victorian teams get a real home ground advantage in as opposed to interstate sides? Every interstate side gets 10-11 real home ground advantage games. Vic clubs only get a home ground advantage when playing interstate sides, so mabe 5-6 per year.

You don't think those extra 5 games a year you get an advantage doesn't help your final ladder position? You think the eagles make the 8 if they weren't a perth team? The system we have will never be 100% fair however its the best we have, interstate sides have won the grand final at the MCG before, its not like it never happens.

And have 10 games with home ground advantage against us

 

[dean33]

this is a good point, but you should also factor in that Melbourne teams travel half as much as the interstate sides too.

for what its worth, I'd take a lower ladder position after the home and away games for a Grand Final on my home deck any day of the week.

Unfortunately we are never going to have a 100% fair system, from the fixture to the travel to the grounds played on. I'm no doubt biased but I can't imagine the grand final being played anywhere else. I still remember the year it was played at Waverley when the G was under construction and it just didn't feel right. For what its worth I thought you guys added to the atmosphere on grand final day and every Crow fan I spoke to prior, during and after was very good natured. Bad luck on the day and all the best for 2018.