Pre-Season Training 2018-19

[jonbe54]

Yeah that's it. That's why I tried to qualify it with 'sometimes'. It's not as black and white as that, but I can see why the humour in that tweet may have been missed.

Yep and not hard and fast even within those parameters - just like the rest of us there is the usual diversity from one individual to the next

 

[Sea fog]

You may ask.

But I didn’t see him. Then again I’m not a reliable observer, so he may have been out there, on the other side of the oval.

Darcy and Jamie did a lot of running. Up and back. They appear to have formed a bond. How long did they spend with the good German doctor?

Also no respite on the hair front - Darcy’s still sporting a very bad blonde do, looks like a cheap brassy dye. Poor effort.

Brodie won't be happy after tweeting immediately post-season that he wants rid of the long blond locks. It also means that if he ever makes it onto the park, the girly headband will come out again. That and Jamie's pink boots are a good match.

 

[Vicky Park]

As previously stated, none. My POV is that a landlocked facility can’t cater for a community club that turns over $80m+ annually. In 20 years time once AFLW is self sustaining where can we expand within the precinct?

It’s difficult for me to hop in my delaurean and go back to 2008 or thereabouts when business cases on this were put to the board, but in the intervening decade I would work backwards at the big developments within 10-15km of the CBD.

It depends on the financials. If we weren’t completely landlocked I would have no real issue with leasing given our purpose is non for profit, but that’s the difficulty of having such a prime location. I think in a perfect world Brunton Ave would close at the bridge connecting the MCG with Birrarung Marr with it only acting as service to underground MCG parking. The train tracks south of there are then all moved underground and the site above is redeveloped. If that were to happen the outside courts in the precinct could move and there would be room for plenty of growth.

Getting in on the ground floor of something like that would probably require us to go into partnership with the government, TA, the NBL and probably Super Netball. It would also completely change the landscape of the precinct.

I know this is off-topic, but I'd like to pick up on this issue of us being headquartered in the - officially titled - Melbourne Sports and Entertainment Precinct. To quote from their website, the precinct (stadiums, buildings, fields) accommodates the Collingwood Football Club (AFL, AFLW, VFL), Melbourne Football Club (AFLW), Melbourne Storm, Melbourne Victory, Melbourne Vixens, Collingwood Netball and Melbourne United teams. Then there's the tennis facilities (courts, offices, etc) and the multi-purpose entertainment venues. And if you stretch across to Yarra Park you can of course add the MCG (cricket, AFL clubs) and Richmond Football Club at the Punt Road Oval (AFL, AFLW, VFL).

Crowded isn't it?

As you rightly point out, we are landlocked, and we are competing for space with all the above.

I have previously been involved in some aspects of developing the precinct, including Olympic Park before the Pies moved in. While I agree that we have placed ourselves in the centre of Melbourne's sporting universe, we will outgrow the Holden Centre, if in fact we haven't already. Add to this the heritage controls over part of the Holden Centre, and all of Yarra Park and the MCG, which further constrain - although not totally prevent - additional development.

Gosch's Paddock is not heritage-controlled, but historical research indicates that it has literally been an open paddock (for grazing cows in the 19th century!) pretty much since the establishment of Melbourne. Try to develop that at your peril. Its a training ground at best.

Yarra Park is often cited as possible available space for an additional stadium/sports facility. But Heritage Victoria would not countenance that.

If the ever-growing tennis facilities are untouchable, then that leaves the railway corridor and Brunton Ave south of Yarra Park. At a crude guess, its not big enough to squeeze in a new (boutique?) stadium, but it can be built over (at huge cost).

In terms of new buildings at the Holden Centre, we could build something long and skinny in on our east side, adjoining AAMI Stadium, but on our south side its even tighter and we cant go up very far as there are over-shadowing controls that relate to the Yarra River.

We are squeezed in!

So back to your other point - I think we should be looking at developing a new facility. But where? Forget Victoria Park, too difficult, too political, too constrained and it also has heritage controls.

If we want to be in some proximity to the CBD, possible options include unused/underutilised land around the Port of Melbourne, but we need it to be public land, and a cooperative State Government (they've cooperated in the past ).

Other than that, its out to the north somewhere, to maintain our historical connection with the northern suburbs.

Land prices, booming population, these are all factors which make this - I think - an urgent issue.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

I know this is off-topic, but I'd like to pick up on this issue of us being headquartered in the - officially titled - Melbourne Sports and Entertainment Precinct. To quote from their website, the precinct (stadiums, buildings, fields) accommodates the Collingwood Football Club (AFL, AFLW, VFL), Melbourne Football Club (AFLW), Melbourne Storm, Melbourne Victory, Melbourne Vixens, Collingwood Netball and Melbourne United teams. Then there's the tennis facilities (courts, offices, etc) and the multi-purpose entertainment venues. And if you stretch across to Yarra Park you can of course add the MCG (cricket, AFL clubs) and Richmond Football Club at the Punt Road Oval (AFL, AFLW, VFL).

Crowded isn't it?

As you rightly point out, we are landlocked, and we are competing for space with all the above.

I have previously been involved in some aspects of developing the precinct, including Olympic Park before the Pies moved in. While I agree that we have placed ourselves in the centre of Melbourne's sporting universe, we will outgrow the Holden Centre, if in fact we haven't already. Add to this the heritage controls over part of the Holden Centre, and all of Yarra Park and the MCG, which further constrain - although not totally prevent - additional development.

Gosch's Paddock is not heritage-controlled, but historical research indicates that it has literally been an open paddock (for grazing cows in the 19th century!) pretty much since the establishment of Melbourne. Try to develop that at your peril. Its a training ground at best.

Yarra Park is often cited as possible available space for an additional stadium/sports facility. But Heritage Victoria would not countenance that.

If the ever-growing tennis facilities are untouchable, then that leaves the railway corridor and Brunton Ave south of Yarra Park. At a crude guess, its not big enough to squeeze in a new (boutique?) stadium, but it can be built over (at huge cost).

In terms of new buildings at the Holden Centre, we could build something long and skinny in on our east side, adjoining AAMI Stadium, but on our south side its even tighter and we cant go up very far as there are over-shadowing controls that relate to the Yarra River.

We are squeezed in!

So back to your other point - I think we should be looking at developing a new facility. But where? Forget Victoria Park, too difficult, too political, too constrained and it also has heritage controls.

If we want to be in some proximity to the CBD, possible options include unused/underutilised land around the Port of Melbourne, but we need it to be public land, and a cooperative State Government (they've cooperated in the past ).

Other than that, its out to the north somewhere, to maintain our historical connection with the northern suburbs.

Land prices, booming population, these are all factors which make this - I think - an urgent issue.

Although we only Lease the 'Glass House' is it heritage listed?
Is there a possibility to redevelop that structure (Upwards, Underground, Outwards?)

 

[legendstatus]

Bit of paraphrasing going on here!

Stevens believes he’s nursing a calf injury that will delay his start to full training. Scan this week and he ends the tweet by saying there’s worse times to have a niggle...

Close enough sunshine


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Vicky Park]

Although we only Lease the 'Glass House' is it heritage listed?
Is there a possibility to redevelop that structure (Upwards, Underground, Outwards?)

The Glasshouse, being the old Olympic Pool is heritage listed, and no opportunity to go upwards. It had been built outwards during its time as a basketball facility, but that was all removed and won’t be put back. Underground is hugely expensive.

 

[Scodog10]

Close enough sunshine


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

No issue from my perspective

There are some on here that tend towards the “woe is me” approach on injuries which does my head in so that was for their benefit.

 

[Bad Horse]

Give him a break, he's been in Germany. If you don't come back from Germany with some cheap brassy hair dye and heavy metal tunes running through your brain, you weren't really there.

He looks like he could be in Kraftwerk any way. Im looking forward to our grand final win celebrations being led by Darcy Brodie and Coxy debuting their german prog rock band Ruckwerk.

 

[Albert Parker]

I know this is off-topic, but I'd like to pick up on this issue of us being headquartered in the - officially titled - Melbourne Sports and Entertainment Precinct. To quote from their website, the precinct (stadiums, buildings, fields) accommodates the Collingwood Football Club (AFL, AFLW, VFL), Melbourne Football Club (AFLW), Melbourne Storm, Melbourne Victory, Melbourne Vixens, Collingwood Netball and Melbourne United teams. Then there's the tennis facilities (courts, offices, etc) and the multi-purpose entertainment venues. And if you stretch across to Yarra Park you can of course add the MCG (cricket, AFL clubs) and Richmond Football Club at the Punt Road Oval (AFL, AFLW, VFL).

Crowded isn't it?

As you rightly point out, we are landlocked, and we are competing for space with all the above.

I have previously been involved in some aspects of developing the precinct, including Olympic Park before the Pies moved in. While I agree that we have placed ourselves in the centre of Melbourne's sporting universe, we will outgrow the Holden Centre, if in fact we haven't already. Add to this the heritage controls over part of the Holden Centre, and all of Yarra Park and the MCG, which further constrain - although not totally prevent - additional development.

Gosch's Paddock is not heritage-controlled, but historical research indicates that it has literally been an open paddock (for grazing cows in the 19th century!) pretty much since the establishment of Melbourne. Try to develop that at your peril. Its a training ground at best.

Yarra Park is often cited as possible available space for an additional stadium/sports facility. But Heritage Victoria would not countenance that.

If the ever-growing tennis facilities are untouchable, then that leaves the railway corridor and Brunton Ave south of Yarra Park. At a crude guess, its not big enough to squeeze in a new (boutique?) stadium, but it can be built over (at huge cost).

In terms of new buildings at the Holden Centre, we could build something long and skinny in on our east side, adjoining AAMI Stadium, but on our south side its even tighter and we cant go up very far as there are over-shadowing controls that relate to the Yarra River.

So back to your other point - I think we should be looking at developing a new facility. But where? Forget Victoria Park, too difficult, too political, too constrained and it also has heritage controls.

If we want to be in some proximity to the CBD, possible options include unused/underutilised land around the Port of Melbourne, but we need it to be public land, and a cooperative State Government (they've cooperated in the past ).

Other than that, its out to the north somewhere, to maintain our historical connection with the northern suburbs.

Land prices, booming population, these are all factors which make this - I think - an urgent issue.

I acknowledge the potential space constraints of our current location but to play devil's advocate.

On what basis are we crowded? An large altitude room we barely use. A gym we probably don't need to share with Melbourne Rebels. A function space we wouldn't pack to capacity very often if ever. We are also capped for members at our Legends category because of Grand Final seating/ticketing capacity.

- Do we need to have a netball team?
- How many more admin people do we need as a not-for-profit and given a soft cap on non-salaried spending? (One of the things Scott Burns noted as he returned to the Club was just how many more staff were there than in his playing days.)
- Do we need a second Etihad-sized ground like Essendon have but probably no other Melbourne-based club?
- Will our space constraint become a competitive disadvantage?

We currently have a start of the art space, conveniently located near the MCG for easy access to assist recovery.
A space which gives us easy access to Gosch's Paddock (if required), the Tan Track etc too.
No issues like a Waverley location or St Kilda's facility in Casey where players were reticent to train either.

But you're right, the Port of Melbourne area, where Melbourne Grammar have built large sporting facilities, is probably where a larger parcel of land could be secured if desired. But I can't see any relative disadvantage to our peers at present.

 

[Vicky Park]

I acknowledge the potential space constraints of our current location but to play devil's advocate.

On what basis are we crowded? An large altitude room we barely use. A gym we probably don't need to share with Melbourne Rebels. A function space we wouldn't pack to capacity very often if ever. We are also capped for members at our Legends category because of Grand Final seating/ticketing capacity.

- Do we need to have a netball team?
- How many more admin people do we need as a not-for-profit and given a soft cap on non-salaried spending? (One of the things Scott Burns noted as he returned to the Club was just how many more staff were there than in his playing days.)
- Do we need a second Etihad-sized ground like Essendon have but probably no other Melbourne-based club?
- Will our space constraint become a competitive disadvantage?

We currently have a start of the art space, conveniently located near the MCG for easy access to assist recovery.
A space which gives us easy access to Gosch's Paddock (if required), the Tan Track etc too.
No issues like a Waverley location or St Kilda's facility in Casey where players were reticent to train either.

But you're right, the Port of Melbourne area, where Melbourne Grammar have built large sporting facilities, is probably where a larger parcel of land could be secured if desired. But I can't see any relative disadvantage to our peers at present.

Fair points, and you'll get no argument from me regarding the netball. One issue is whether the facilities we currenty have will serve us well in 5, 10, 15 years, and are we planning to stay ahead of the game. Are we still state of the art? The Hawks are leaving their 15 year old facility at Waverley Park; the Bombers and Saints are moving, or have moved, to bigger and better facilities.

I agree that we appear to have space. The large multi-purpose function room being a case in point. It's rented out as a commercial venture by the club, and I appreciate its value as a source of revenue. But are the club teams disadvantaged by this? The members/fans certainly are.

I often cite the poor amenities for fans at the Holden Centre. Outside of the cafe (if open) and the social club bar in the above-mentioned function space (very rarely open) - there is nowhere for fans to congregate, or watch training or a VFL/AFLW game in relative comfort. I concede that this may be a scheduling issue rather than a spatial issue, but dedicated fan-specific facilities are much needed.

We were also promised facilities which haven't materialised, and I'm assuming this is because they have been co-opted for one of the growing number of teams. The promised 'community centre' (no idea what it was intended for) - is that there?

All of this may not be pressing or urgent right now, but it will be. And one thing I'll give to Edie, he wont be standing still on this.

Now to contradict myself - Sarah Rowe (Irish AFLW recruit) described the Pies facilities for the women as the best she saw when visiting the different suitor clubs.

Then again, in the first AFLW season when I met some of the girls, they talked about the club providing dinner on only one night of training. They had to cook for themselves, or bring their own dinner, on the alternate night. Scheduling again?

 

[Saintly Viewed]

The great pity in all this is Victoria Park and I’m assuming the recalcitrant council.
As our home base, it’s gone now never to return, I accept that’s our reality.

But why couldn’t we buy the land and surrounds that could be for sale.
We still would pay rates.
The ground is only to bevdeveloped completely for our training needs and is set up as state of the art.
Ofcourse won’t happen.
Great shame.

By the way the ground should only ever have one name, Victoria Park.

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

Does this sound like we've gone off the deep end? Have we become Adelaide-esque?

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/...s/news-story/cdb95958a4c274f34aa59f47853a6e7a

Nathan Buckley has made a temporary return from an Italian holiday, with his players told there will be “nowhere to hide” over pre-season.

Buckley, in the middle of three months’ leave, this week flew back into Melbourne where he has popped in and out of the club ahead of Monday’s official start to pre-season training.

Pies fitness staff have taken charge of training since the club’s 1-4 year players returned on November 19, while senior players including skipper Scott Pendlebury, Lynden Dunn and Chris Mayne made early starts to their 2019 preparation.

After taking his side to within five points of a premiership, Buckley jetted to Europe. He spent time with English Premier League giants Chelsea, and caught up with club staff also overseas for a conference, before putting his feet up in Italy.

And Buckley will fly back to Italy once Collingwood takes its three-week Christmas break from December 18.

Technically, the coach won’t miss an official training session, but the lengthy Italian vacation is the latest showing of his new-found powers of delegation — seen by many as a major factor in the Pies’ stunning resurgence this year.

Collingwood president Eddie McGuire said in October that a healthy work-life balance was critical.

“You can go flat out, you can red-line it as much as you want to, but you need to get a break … It does make a huge difference,” McGuire said.

Former Western Bulldogs captain Luke Darcy went as far as to say Buckley’s off-season movements could “transform the whole industry”.

“This is a massive moment, I reckon, for AFL coaches, for the industry, for sport in general,” Darcy said.

“I reckon there will be people of all industries going, ‘If you can get balance, your family are happy, you’re happy, you’re going to perform better’.”

Collingwood strength and conditioning manager Kevin White said the players would be put under the microscope during summer.

“Last year was more generic in terms of the template we use for the football conditioning drills, whereas this year it’s working a lot more heavily … to separate the players in the specific roles they’ll be playing,” White told the club website.

“It’s very much guided towards one v one and putting players up against players they’re competing for their spot against, in front of myself, all the conditioning coaches, the other coaches and players.

“So there’s nowhere to hide. Players will either become more resilient and go to the next level or they’ll raise the white flag.

“We’ll see if they’re capable of playing Collingwood football.”

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

The above makes me worried that if we've become that cutthroat we could erase the camaraderie that we displayed this year.

 

[TradeDraft]

The above makes me worried that if we've become that cutthroat we could erase the camaraderie that we displayed this year.

and IF that happens back to the Bottom 6 we will go.

Shows that the Club has not Learned Much this Season and why we become so good.

Leading Teams Back?

 

[Soups]

The above makes me worried that if we've become that cutthroat we could erase the camaraderie that we displayed this year.

Nothing wrong with hard work and making ourselves better. You don’t think they would all be thriving to do whatever it takes? Just have a look at the nick of Daicos and Brown have come back in. They want to be in that side next year. And I should imagine everyone else that missed out will be doing the same.

 

[Soups]

and IF that happens back to the Bottom 6 we will go.

Shows that the Club has not Learned Much this Season and why we become so good.

Leading Teams Back?

We need to better ourselves. Things needs to be shifted for next season because we fell short. No point doing the same because teams will go past us. Maybe what we are doing is going to give us the edge to win the flag. Have to look at this as a positive imo.

 

[ClaytonM]

and IF that happens back to the Bottom 6 we will go.

Shows that the Club has not Learned Much this Season and why we become so good.

Leading Teams Back?

Jesus that is a big conclusion basic on one comment.

 

[neilk]

and IF that happens back to the Bottom 6 we will go.

Shows that the Club has not Learned Much this Season and why we become so good.

Leading Teams Back?

We’ll be good Dave. Nothing wrong with healthy competition for spots in the team. It’s always there and the players know what’s required to win a spot in the starting 22

 

[Obese Arachnid]

The above makes me worried that if we've become that cutthroat we could erase the camaraderie that we displayed this year.

“It’s very much guided towards one v one and putting players up against players they’re competing for their spot against, in front of myself, all the conditioning coaches, the other coaches and players.

Is this the line you're concerned with?

It's been done since the game existed. Happend when I played juniors, it's great for competition of spots.

 

[35Daicos]

Nothing wrong with hard work and making ourselves better. You don’t think they would all be thriving to do whatever it takes? Just have a look at the nick Daicos and Brown have come back in. They want to be in that side next year. And I should imagine everyone else that missed out will be doing the same.

Wrong thread?

 

[76woodenspooners]

Underground is hugely expensive.

Probably tight restrictions on going underground as the Burnley tunnel runs right underneath our facility / training oval.

 

[76woodenspooners]

In terms of new buildings at the Holden Centre, we could build something long and skinny in on our east side, adjoining AAMI Stadium, ...

Wouldn’t that struggle to get approval due to blocking the sight lines to AAMI Park?

... but on our south side its even tighter and we cant go up very far as there are over-shadowing controls that relate to the Yarra River.

I think there is a bit of space there on that south side.

Would have thought we’d be OK with the overshadow controls if we use the (old) Glasshouse as a precident. That’s probably equivalent to a 5 / 6 story building, and any new building in the south side of the oval would be no closer nor higher than that.

I wonder if the engineering behind the New Glasshouse allows us to extend that up at all?

Incidentally, last I saw, there are areas of the old Glasshouse that don’t look to be properly utilised. The old bar area looks to be a junk area. There were suggestions years ago of building a mezzanine level above the seating area on the northern side to hold a museum.

So back to your other point - I think we should be looking at developing a new facility. But where? Forget Victoria Park, too difficult, too political, too constrained and it also has heritage controls.

Yarra Bend Park?

There’s all the space in the world there, but there would be a limit to how much could be practically built on that land, so we’d probably be worse off. No public transport there.

I guess it depends what our needs are? Do we need more training ovals? More office space? One idea might be to get some land way out of Melbourne as a training facility for when the team wants to train behind closed doors, or to have a change of scenery.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Probably tight restrictions on going underground as the Burnley tunnel runs right underneath our facility / training oval.

Ah perfect.
Giant sink hole

 

[Vicky Park]

Wouldn’t that struggle to get approval due to blocking the sight lines to AAMI Park?

Doubt it 76. There are no sight lines of that nature protected via the planning controls. While you might want to see AAMI when looking/approaching from the west, there are no controls in place to ensure these views are maintained.

Would have thought we’d be OK with the overshadow controls if we use the (old) Glasshouse as a precident. That’s probably equivalent to a 5 / 6 story building, and any new building in the south side of the oval would be no closer nor higher than that.

Unlike the views referred to above, there are controls and constraints which protect the river from overshadowing, and protect sunlight to the public parkland/space on north side of the river. The controls are much tougher than they were when the old Olympic Pool was built in the 1950s. The current height and placement of the recent Glasshouse building was likely constrained by these controls.

 

[loki04]

“It’s very much guided towards one v one and putting players up against players they’re competing for their spot against, in front of myself, all the conditioning coaches, the other coaches and players.

Is this the line you're concerned with?

It's been done since the game existed. Happend when I played juniors, it's great for competition of spots.

Nothing wrong with that but this line is very similar to the philosophy that Daveron employed when he started flogging them on the track and coincidentally started our retched run of injury. Happy to break a few eggs to make an omelette iirc.

“So there’s nowhere to hide. Players will either become more resilient and go to the next level or they’ll raise the white flag."