Draft Review 2015 - Redo the 2015 AFL Draft

[Arr0w]

What ?

There are plenty of tall defenders who had good third years. Rance, Davis, Stratton, Andrews, Talia, who won the RS in his third year, to name a few. Even our own Oscar McDonald had a good and better third year than Weitering. I'd mention Lever, but you'd just say he played the easy intercept role. And I'm sure there are plenty of others.

Btw, being a young key defender is much easier than being a young key forward. Do I start listing all the key forwards who had good third years ?

So now you are cherry picking just one year?

Compare the 1st 3 years of any KPD's output in the last 10 years. JW's numbers are top 3

 

[Arr0w]

Oliver will be one of the 3-4 gun mids of his era.

Weitering ain’t catching him in this draft. He may end up close to the best defender in this draft which would be a great result from here.

Any club would be happy with that outcome, for both players

 

[Rich01]

Any club would be happy with that outcome, for both players

Every club would love a reliable defender.

Most would take the generational mid though.

Both will play for 10+ years.

 

[Arr0w]

Every club would love a reliable defender.

Most would take the generational mid though.

Both will play for 10+ years.

Happy to reassess both of their next 3 years with you, as well as the reliable and generational

 

[Weiterbot23]

This is my prediction for this draft class rankings after this season and beyond

1 - Clayton Oliver
2 - Charlie Curnow
3 - Harry McKay
4 - Eric Hipwood
5 - Callum Mills
6 - Aaron Francis
7 - Sam Weideman
8 - Josh Dunkley
9 - Jade Gresham
10 - Jacob Weitering


11 - Daniel Rioli
12 - Tom Phillips
13 - Ryan Burton
14 - Tom Doedee
15 - Wayne Milera
16 - Jacob Hopper
17 - David Cuningham
18 - Darcy Parish
19 - Harrison Himmelberg
20 - Ben Keays

 

[Rich01]

Happy to reassess both of their next 3 years with you, as well as the reliable and generational

I’m sure you would be.
At this stage that’s how they are tracking.

 

[Arr0w]

I’m sure you would be.
At this stage that’s how they are tracking.

Rich01 you are bordering again on being a troll. I nor anyone else is disputing Oliver is ahead of all others in his draft year, so stop deflecting from my initial post

 

[Rich01]

Rich01 you are bordering again on being a troll. I nor anyone else is disputing Oliver is ahead of all others in his draft year, so stop deflecting from my initial post

Not sure why you are getting upset.
What’s your initial post I keep apparently ‘deflecting’?

 

[Slysh]

This is my prediction for this draft class rankings after this season and beyond

1 - Clayton Oliver
2 - Charlie Curnow
3 - Harry McKay
4 - Eric Hipwood
5 - Callum Mills
6 - Aaron Francis
7 - Sam Weideman
8 - Josh Dunkley
9 - Jade Gresham
10 - Jacob Weitering


11 - Daniel Rioli
12 - Tom Phillips
13 - Ryan Burton
14 - Tom Doedee
15 - Wayne Milera
16 - Jacob Hopper
17 - David Cuningham
18 - Darcy Parish
19 - Harrison Himmelberg
20 - Ben Keays

You don't have Hardwick in the top 20? On output at the moment he would probably be in the top 5. Must think a lot of these guys have a hell of a lot of improvement in them.

 

[Arr0w]

Not sure why you are getting upset.
What’s your initial post I keep apparently ‘deflecting’?

You: Weitering looks like he will be a reliable ten year player which is what you want from a draft pick, but probably expect a bit more from someone picked at 1

Me: Pick 1 = Should be the best player in the draft, always amused me. How many pick 1's have been the best player in their respective drafts in the last 20 years, not to mention redoing top 10's

You: 2015 is no exception to the above. Don’t think anyone is arguing the point that Weitering isn’t close to the best player in this draft.

Not sure why you would then shift the interaction to a comparison to one player, Oliver. You go further as a prediction of the future by saying Weitering will be reliable, yet bestowed "generational" on Oliver. As you know, mid size players show their prowess earlier than KPP's, I think both sides would be happy with the current outcome and a bit more time is needed before we have the final outcome.

By the way, players like Curnow, Hipwood, Milera, Mills, Gresham, Rioli could surpass both of them by the end of their careers

 

[Rich01]

You: Weitering looks like he will be a reliable ten year player which is what you want from a draft pick, but probably expect a bit more from someone picked at 1

Me: Pick 1 = Should be the best player in the draft, always amused me. How many pick 1's have been the best player in their respective drafts in the last 20 years, not to mention redoing top 10's

You: 2015 is no exception to the above. Don’t think anyone is arguing the point that Weitering isn’t close to the best player in this draft.

Not sure why you would then shift the interaction to a comparison to one player, Oliver. You go further as a prediction of the future by saying Weitering will be reliable, yet bestowed "generational" on Oliver. As you know, mid size players show their prowess earlier than KPP's, I think both sides would be happy with the current outcome and a bit more time is needed before we have the final outcome.

Just because someone has a different opinion to you doesn’t mean it’s trolling.

However all the above is true. Champion Data in this year’s prospectus called Oliver out as having the best year by a 21 year old since player rating we’re recorded.

In fact they believed Cripps, Bont and Oliver would be the next big three (replacing Dusty, Danger and Fyfe). Generational was the term they put on those three (pretty as I know but in footy terms actually not far off).

But yeah Weitering may end up ok too.
He has a long way to go to get there and all we are doing in a 2015 DRAFT THREAD is assessing the talent that was picked in that draft.

Talking about these players and comparing their careers ain’t trolling, but if you are feeling like it’s getting a bit much, perhaps the Carlton board will project a more sugary and likable
view for you to digest.

 

[Arr0w]

Just because someone has a different opinion to you doesn’t mean it’s trolling.

However all the above is true. Champion Data in this year’s prospectus called Oliver out as having the best year by a 21 year old since player rating we’re recorded.

In fact they believed Cripps, Bont and Oliver would be the next big three (replacing Dusty, Danger and Fyfe). Generational was the term they put on those three (pretty as I know but in footy terms actually not far off).

But yeah Weitering may end up ok too.
He has a long way to go to get there and all we are doing in a 2015 DRAFT THREAD is assessing the talent that was picked in that draft.

Talking about these players and comparing their careers ain’t trolling, but if you are feeling like it’s getting a bit much, perhaps the Carlton board will project a more sugary and likable
view for you to digest.

Again you can't help yourself, with your snide remarks, but try and stay on course as to the original interaction

As for CD, is that the same mob that rated Dumont and Daw elite, yet the likes of Cripps and many others didn't feature?

Computers don't have a feel for the game

 

[Rich01]

Again you can't help yourself, with your snide remarks, but try and stay on course as to the original interaction

As for CD, is that the same mob that rated Dumont and Daw elite, yet the likes of Cripps and many others didn't feature?

Computers don't have a feel for the game

Snide. Lol. I merely suggested if the view presented is not suitable to you to go read your team board, you’re the one they called me a troll for discussing the topic. I may have underestimated your sensitivity.

If CD doesn’t do it for you for Oliver, weight of possession (heavy contested but still high de) in games might help.
AFL player rankings give a pretty good view of a players worth though.

His selection in the AA team would also help you at the age of 21. And perhaps if you saw him play and the influence he has on games that may help you even further.

He’s on track no doubt to be one of the next dominant mids in the game.

Not sure why anyone would be disagreeing with this, but you are trying hard.

Perhaps it’s the ‘feel of the game’ you say computers just don’t have. The ‘feel for the game that’s backed up by stats and accolades supports Champion Data’s view. Oliver is a gun.

 

[Lore]

Dunno about feel for the game but my feel for this thread is going to involve thread bans pretty soon.

Keep it civil and on topic. Thanks.

 

[Arr0w]

Snide. Lol. I merely suggested if the view presented is not suitable to you to go read your team board, you’re the one they called me a troll for discussing the topic. I may have underestimated your sensitivity.

If CD doesn’t do it for you for Oliver, weight of possession (heavy contested but still high de) in games might help.
AFL player rankings give a pretty good view of a players worth though.

His selection in the AA team would also help you at the age of 21. And perhaps if you saw him play and the influence he has on games that may help you even further.

He’s on track no doubt to be one of the next dominant mids in the game.

Not sure why anyone would be disagreeing with this, but you are trying hard.

Perhaps it’s the ‘feel of the game’ you say computers just don’t have. The ‘feel for the game that’s backed up by stats and accolades supports Champion Data’s view. Oliver is a gun.

Stop feigning innocence, you are a known troll.

Again, no one is disputing Oliver as being best of his draft class at this point in time, but for some reason all you want to do is compare Oliver to Weitering

Would be interesting to know who you think the best 18 players are in order at this point, as well as how you think they will end their careers

As we all know, no recruiter selects the best player at every selection and they never will

Guys like Curnow, Doedee, Gresham, Hardwick, Dunkley etc would all be re rated higher

But you stick to just one player as part of your rhetoric

 

[Holy Rioli]

This is my prediction for this draft class rankings after this season and beyond

1 - Clayton Oliver
2 - Charlie Curnow
3 - Harry McKay
4 - Eric Hipwood
5 - Callum Mills
6 - Aaron Francis
7 - Sam Weideman
8 - Josh Dunkley
9 - Jade Gresham
10 - Jacob Weitering


11 - Daniel Rioli
12 - Tom Phillips
13 - Ryan Burton
14 - Tom Doedee
15 - Wayne Milera
16 - Jacob Hopper
17 - David Cuningham
18 - Darcy Parish
19 - Harrison Himmelberg
20 - Ben Keays

Still no Blake Hardwick?

 

[Lore]

Stop feigning innocence, you are a known troll.

Again, no one is disputing Oliver as being best of his draft class at this point in time, but for some reason all you want to do is compare Oliver to Weitering

Would be interesting to know who you think the best 18 players are in order at this point, as well as how you think they will end their careers

As we all know, no recruiter selects the best player at every selection and they never will

Guys like Curnow, Doedee, Gresham, Hardwick, Dunkley etc would all be re rated higher

But you stick to just one player as part of your rhetoric

I'm not entirely sure that he is a troll. But you seem certain, so if that's honestly what you think why do you keep taking the bait? Report and ignore. "You are" type statements are not going to get us anywhere.

I think what's actually happening here though is that you're looking at taking the best player in the draft *at the time* while Rich01 is looking at who the best kid from that draft is with the benefit of hindsight (which is kind of the point of this thread, btw). You don't even really disagree with each other.

 

[Rich01]

Stop feigning innocence, you are a known troll.

Would be interesting to know who you think the best 18 players are in order at this point, as well as how you think they will end their careers

But you stick to just one player as part of your rhetoric

Mate you call me a troll in one sentence then ask my opinion in another.

Best I just put you on ignore now so I don’t upset you further with any other difference of opinion. Cheers mate.

 

[Arr0w]

I'm not entirely sure that he is a troll. But you seem certain, so if that's honestly what you think why do you keep taking the bait? Report and ignore. "You are" type statements are not going to get us anywhere.

I think what's actually happening here though is that you're looking at taking the best player in the draft *at the time* while Rich01 is looking at who the best kid from that draft is with the benefit of hindsight (which is kind of the point of this thread, btw). You don't even really disagree with each other.

Lore, perhaps look at the start of the exchange. Given you are directing this solely in my direction is also interesting

Happy to leave it there

 

[Arr0w]

Mate you call me a troll in one sentence then ask my opinion in another.

Best I just put you on ignore now so I don’t upset you further with any other difference of opinion. Cheers mate.

Haha still trying to get a rise, try it on someone else.

Post your top 10, I will do the same, then we can all assess it

 

[Lore]

Lore, perhaps look at the start of the exchange. Given you are directing this solely in my direction is also interesting

Happy to leave it there

If you have an issue with his posts, report them and they will be reviewed, as I said earlier.

 

[Arr0w]

If you have an issue with his posts, report them and they will be reviewed, as I said earlier.

That's fine I will play the same fiddle

Cheers

 

[Rich01]

Best mids in order

Clayton Oliver
Callum Mills
Josh Dunkley
Jacob Hopper
Braydon Sier
Darcy Parish

Best forwards in order

Charlie Curnow
Eric Hipwood
Sam Weideman
Harry McKay
Harry Himmelberg

Best Key/Intercept
Defenders in order

Tom Dodee
Aaron Francis
Jacob Weitering


Best General Defenders in order

Blake Hardwick
Tom Philips
Ryan Burton

Best General Forwards (good list here)

Jade Gresham
Sam Menegola
Tippa
Tom Papley
Daniel Rioli
Wayne Milera

 

[Arr0w]

Interesting lists

I thought this was a 2015 draft redo.

 

[Weiterbot23]

You don't have Hardwick in the top 20? On output at the moment he would probably be in the top 5. Must think a lot of these guys have a hell of a lot of improvement in them.

He is coached by Clarkson, I could put a jumper on in that system and play my role