News AFL 2020 Season postponed

[Toecrusher]

That is simply not true. A country cannot deny entry to any of its own citizens that hold a valid passport (or even if they dont yet they are still citizens and able to prove that) under international human rights law. To close borders and deny entry to citizens would be contravening a number of UN conventions, they may require them to enter a period of enforced quarantine upon reentry - which big deal we're supposedly doing that here too to people returning here - but no sorry that is not the same as closing the borders thus barring people from returning home if they wish nor have I heard of ANY country on the news doing that. It would cause international outrage, in fact nearly every country has been for at LEAST the past three weeks if not more urging any of its citizens abroad to cut short their holidays if they are on one and return home before further restrictions on travel are enforced...further restrictions meaning reduced flight availability and capacities and stricter border quarantine measures, not locked out entirely from coming home if youre trying to.

So sorry nice try you paint a sorry picture but its just not the reality. If they're crying on the phone because they cant get home its because they ignored the warnings all around them and the advice from their own countrys governments to come home now, and now theyre finding it a bit hard to get a flight with airlines grounded now theyve woken up to the fact "oh s**t this shits real", or they dont have enough money to get themselves home or support themselves for an extended stay here. Should we feel sorry for these people for their flagrant disregard in the pursuit of their own personal fun and leisure? If they get sick, should we as the taxpayer foot the bill for their medical treatment and possibly a bed in ICU if they need it...possibly denying that bed to one of our own vulnerable citizens, which may be the difference between their life or death? Should we as the taxpayer foot the bill for these people's welfare and financial support for an extended period, when we have many millions of our own fellow Australians who have lost their jobs and their incomes and ability to feed their families and protect them from illness through absolutely no fault of their own who need to be supported?
It is not being xenophobic or selfish at all to consider these questions when forming your opinion on the matter, so i respectfully disagree with your opinion on this issue. It is simply a very realist and rational view that despite what many seem to think our government and country does not have an endless supply of money to give away to everyone who has their hand out, it is going to come at a cost to all of us both now and for many months, years even into the future. Those backpackers you speak of are actually the selfish ones, they ignored orders from both our government and their own to go home, they chose to stay in a country with no money nor means with which to support themselves (which is actually against the conditions of their entry visa too) and they are the very ones who are part of the reason why the rest of us are being increasingly locked down and why the spread through our community is so rapid - why the hell are they huddling in groups crying when they should be distancing or simply staying indoors? So no sorry i dont feel sorry for them they havent contributed a dollar of tax in the form of the medicare levy to pay for the treatment theyll expect when they get sick, nor for the welfare payments theyll need to stay here cos they cant afford a flight home, nor will they contribute any future tax dollars that we'll all be paying off this event well into the future cos soon as they can theyll be on a plane and back home? And all of these dollars spent on them are dollars that couldve been instead given to one of our own needy or couldve gone towards hospital resources or extra ICU beds. They havent shown one iota of care or consideration for Australians by staying, so sorry its not selfish at all for us to look after our own first

Probably not a Big Footy subject, need to continue this on that other platform - Big Rant

 

[FrakturedHalo]

There are a whole range of temporary visas, and they dont apply to just tourists. Several of them do pay tax into the system as they come with work rights in fact. Subclass 500 and 485 amongst them.

In the end, do I want people stuck in the country by circumstances with no money and no ability to access benefits? I know what that looks like, as I have been volunteering for a refugee centre since I was 19. Its ugly. Its not just compassion, Its self interest. A society is generally as healthy as the least well off amongst us, they are still here, and dont just disappear because they fall on one side of a line or not, and we have to deal with the reality of what happens if we have 2 million potentially indigent folks. Its not going to help the public health crisis unfolding as we speak, thats for sure.

I was specifically talking about the announcement that 600 and 651 visa holders are eligible for the covid19 supplement, the other temporary visa holders are for want of a better word generally residents for purposes of work (or families of workers, students even etc) and therefore should rightfully receive assistance if they have lost their jobs or whatever as they pay tax the same as the rest of us then they should receive the same assistance if they need it as the rest of us due to this crisis.

 

[TradeDraft]

Pardon my ignorance but if 80% of staff have been laid off and the AFL/clubs are effectively earning little or no revenue, why are the players only taking a 50% hair cut to the end of May and why are executives/senior management at both club land and the AFL not taking bigger paycuts? To be frank, I don't quite understand why the players are being paid at all during these unprecedented times. Putting aside contractual obligations, it would be an appropriate goodwill gesture not to take a wage over the next 2 months and support the industry that has served them very well over the years. Any thoughts?

Then how people going to pay Bills?

 

[FrakturedHalo]

Probably not a Big Footy subject, need to continue this on that other platform - Big Rant

Lol sorry, it just makes me see red when someone tries to make a completely incorrect statement about a subject in which I have a little bit of knowledge & expertise in (law & international law) and use it as the basis of their assertion/throwing insults at people for being xenophobic and/or selfish? I had to rebut

 

[FrakturedHalo]

Besides its not like we have any actual footy stuff to talk about, and the Dayne Beams thread seems to have died a slow death.

Who made you the gatekeeper of discussion scope anyway?

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

Snowflakes chance in hell of starting the season again in May.

The clubs believe the re-commencement date is more early August.
Not sure what sort of season the AFL can conjure up if it is in August, especially with the T20 world cup in October.

 

[Kappa]

The clubs believe the re-commencement date is more early August.
Not sure what sort of season the AFL can conjure up if it is in August, especially with the T20 world cup in October.

"The clubs are praying the re-commencement date is early August"

Governement are expecting a 6 month shut down.

Also no chance the t20 world cup will go ahead, India will still be in full-blown Carona crisis by then and be unable to attend, same as Sri Lanka, Pakistan ect ect

 

[TradeDraft]

The clubs believe the re-commencement date is more early August.
Not sure what sort of season the AFL can conjure up if it is in August, especially with the T20 world cup in October.

I Guess then they want teams to play at least 2-3 Games a Week IF they going to get all Games In

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

I Guess then they want teams to play at least 2-3 Games a Week IF they going to get all Games In

I think we will see footy Monday thru to Sunday

 

[TradeDraft]

I think we will see footy Monday thru to Sunday

That what I am thinking IF they want to get all games in

and

Games on at the Same Time

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

"The clubs are praying the re-commencement date is early August"

Governement are expecting a 6 month shut down.

Also no chance the t20 world cup will go ahead, India will still be in full-blown Carona crisis by then and be unable to attend, same as Sri Lanka, Pakistan ect ect

Could be a stretch playing in August, but there are some good signs in this nightmare.
Wuhan is looking to re-open out of lockdown mid April, 4 months after the commencement of the virus. So there is some hope in that for us as a country.
Hopefully everyone takes the government directives of self isolation and staying indoors, only going out for necessities, we can see a decline in the curve sooner then 6 months.
India currently, for a nation with a population of 1.3 billion people, to have only 560 cases, is keeping it contained well with their self isolation.

 

[Quicky]

There are a whole range of temporary visas, and they dont apply to just tourists. Several of them do pay tax into the system as they come with work rights in fact. Subclass 500 and 485 amongst them.

In the end, do I want people stuck in the country by circumstances with no money and no ability to access benefits? I know what that looks like, as I have been volunteering for a refugee centre since I was 19. Its ugly. Its not just compassion, Its self interest. A society is generally as healthy as the least well off amongst us, they are still here, and dont just disappear because they fall on one side of a line or not, and we have to deal with the reality of what happens if we have 2 million potentially indigent folks. Its not going to help the public health crisis unfolding as we speak, thats for sure.

It alway's surprises me that there is ever any debate about supporting the most vulnerable in our community as best we can. We were federated as an egalitarian welfare state. You'd hope that would be held sancrosanct by everyone. It's sad to see how that has been eroded by the greedy, the apathetic and the scared.

 

[Kappa]

Could be a stretch playing in August, but there are some good signs in this nightmare.
Wuhan is looking to re-open out of lockdown mid April, 4 months after the commencement of the virus. So there is some hope in that for us as a country.
Hopefully everyone takes the government directives of self isolation and staying indoors, only going out for necessities, we can see a decline in the curve sooner then 6 months.
India currently, for a nation with a population of 1.3 billion people, to have only 560 cases, is keeping it contained well with their self isolation.

The problem is once you re-open out of lockdown there's still every chance of the virus starting to spread again.

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

The problem is once you re-open out of lockdown there's still every chance of the virus starting to spread again.

That's where Wuhan will be a close watch over the coming months

 

[TradeDraft]

The problem is once you re-open out of lockdown there's still every chance of the virus starting to spread again.

Spot On and that why we won't be 100% Safe Until a Vaccine and then Curer come for it

 

[jackcass]

Two questions

1) Why are executives only taking a 20% cut?

They are executives, so likely they are psychopaths. They dont get the optics of this stink, because they only think of themselves, because they are psychopaths. Its what they do.

Seriously.

2) Zero for the players may be an extreme, but 50% for 2 months is insulting from the AFLPA when judged against the realities faced by their professional staff colleagues. The AFLPA have been used to getting everything they want, and havent adjusted yet to the new world. Dangerfield is an executive, see above. Seriously. He is a psychopath.

The dangerous game for the AFLPA is, the public will not be on their side on this one. And, at some point, in a gunfight between psychopaths, who has the bigger gun wins because there is nothing they wont do because they are psychopaths and they dont care about little people. And the AFL has access to a bigger gun, in the form of the ability to in effect let the clubs go broke, terminate all the contracts ( which they are able to do in event of insolvency), and start again by forming new corporate entities, licensing the new entities with all the trademarks previously associated with the old clubs. And in the end, absent a sensible deal from the AFLPA, thats whats going to happen. So the AFLPA has to get with the times or be run over.

Its also an interesting tactic for the AFLPA to overtly delink themselves from the fate of the people working for the club who they will need when this gets back in a way that smacks of "well, stuff you guys, theres only so much pie left and were eating all of it suckers."

Are the players refusing to take anything more than the initial 50% pay cut they offered though? Or have they made that initial offer and require additional information before they make any decisions beyond that initial 50%? These are significant decisions for the longer term future of players with potentially massive ramifications, and they're being asked for an answer yesterday because the AFL needs to negotiate a line of credit with the banks. I think in the fullness of time, players will agree to more significant cuts and they'll be making similar demands of the executive.

 

[jackcass]

Could be a stretch playing in August, but there are some good signs in this nightmare.
Wuhan is looking to re-open out of lockdown mid April, 4 months after the commencement of the virus. So there is some hope in that for us as a country.
Hopefully everyone takes the government directives of self isolation and staying indoors, only going out for necessities, we can see a decline in the curve sooner then 6 months.
India currently, for a nation with a population of 1.3 billion people, to have only 560 cases, is keeping it contained well with their self isolation.

Trumpy say's everything is rosey in the US and they'll be fully operational again by Easter. Can't understand why all these other countries are such laggards.

 

[deltablues]

Alcohol kills the virus (true). It’s the active ingredient in hand sanitiser.

** Do not drink hand sanitiser, beer and spirits are cheaper and far more accessible.

** Do not drink alcohol as a remedy, it’ll kill you long before it kills the virus.

Yes - I read that hand sanitizers should be a gel of at least 62% alcohol to be effective.

Just to be sure, I am also increasing my daily Mai Tai's from one to two .

 

[deltablues]

Depends if you long or short term share holder.
history shows the shares overall always rise again after falling.

Think of it like owning properties.
if you buy a house for $100,000 and years later some legitimately offers you $1 million then in theory you have $900 k to the good - but only in theory (if you wanted to sell it).

Same thing if the same person came back in a down turn and said now I’m offering $500 k.
in theory you have “lost” $500 k of value, but it’s only theory unless you want to sell the property.

in shares, besides the dividends you may get, the value of the share is only a theory if you’re not selling.

If the Club has shares, and has no intention of selling, it’s all academic, as who cares what the current value may be.

The dividend, that’s a different matter so depending on what you’re getting may be a skinny outcome or fat hen outcome.

Unless the entity in which you bought shares in goes down the tubes...

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

Trumpy say's everything is rosey in the US and they'll be fully operational again by Easter. Can't understand why all these other countries are such laggards.

If we believed what Trump says, then we believe in Santa Claus. New York and California, in particular, won't be functional for many months to come.

 

[FrakturedHalo]

It alway's surprises me that there is ever any debate about supporting the most vulnerable in our community as best we can. We were federated as an egalitarian welfare state. You'd hope that would be held sancrosanct by everyone. It's sad to see how that has been eroded by the greedy, the apathetic and the scared.

Thats not actually what the post was about or the topic of debate, which was probably actually my fault for not explaining properly what I was talking about and causing confuzzlement. My original post was a rant questioning the wisdom of the federal government - well no it was an amendment put forward by the Greens then supported by Labor holding the government over a barrel before theyd pass through their assistance and stimulus package - to include 600/651 visa holders - tourists, so people who ostensibly already have money if they can come to Australia on a holiday and pay our comparatively expensive prices, and who in no way would have been receiving an income anyway whilst here - who find themselves stuck here because they refused to cut short their holiday and heed the warnings and go home, or theyre infected with coronavirus so are in either hospital or in quarantine, why they have been deemed to be eligible to receive financial assistance via Centrelink same as our own citizens who through no fault of their own have lost their jobs, their incomes and means of providing for their families. Because I for one find that inexplicably insane given we find ourselves in this very position due to in large part those very tourists entering the country and spreading the infection around in the first place, and when we have hospital resources and ICU beds and our own vulnerable people here (who Im sure would love to take a holiday too if they could afford it but they cant cos theyre now out of a job) that that money should be spent on, not selfish people who didnt give a toss about the rest of us to heed the warnings and requests from our government to leave and continued their holiday stay

 

[FrakturedHalo]

Yes - I read that hand sanitizers should be a gel of at least 62% alcohol to be effective.

Just to be sure, I am also increasing my daily Mai Tai's from one to two .

Just switch around the quantities in the recipe : 1/4 cup Bacardi, 50mls pineapple juice etc, and you should be right

 

[Help My Club]

Then how people going to pay Bills?

With all due respect, I think this question is more relevant for everyday Aussies who have lost their livelihood and in many instances, may struggle to find work again.

As for the players, the large majority are on significantly above average wages and any sensible minded player should have a good savings regime. The exception might be young players just entering the game. As for those long standing senior players who have been on excellent money for many years, suggest they could or should be able to cope with a 2 month window of zero pay to be reviewed at the end of May. Further thoughts?

 

[jackcass]

If we believed what Trump says, then we believe in Santa Claus. New York and California, in particular, won't be functional for many months to come.

What are you suggesting about Santa?

 

[wicksy]

Pardon my ignorance but if 80% of staff have been laid off and the AFL/clubs are effectively earning little or no revenue, why are the players only taking a 50% hair cut to the end of May and why are executives/senior management at both club land and the AFL not taking bigger paycuts? To be frank, I don't quite understand why the players are being paid at all during these unprecedented times. Putting aside contractual obligations, it would be an appropriate goodwill gesture not to take a wage over the next 2 months and support the industry that has served them very well over the years. Any thoughts?

Hey, they only earn an average of $350k a year... What more do you want from them!?