Strategy Changes: Round 18 Freo vs Hawks

[chaosball32]

Voss in general has had reduced impact over the last few weeks as well, he's still doing some nice things like Amiss but I also personally believe our best mix will be one less tall whoever that is.

Just to add to this comment - look at the stats this season (Voss on the left, Amiss on the right).

Voss trumps him in just about everything, made even more impressive that Amiss averages 8% more TOG.

Not that you’d need the stats because if you’ve watched any Freo footy this season you’d know Voss has been a more valuable player for us this year.

That’s not to say Voss is the better player because I still think Amiss has the higher ceiling, but he’s clearly having the better season and if it’s between Voss and Amiss it has to be Voss right now.

This feels like the Sharp situation all over again where fans don’t want to admit that you can’t carry a player who’s having no impact every week no matter how hard their workrate is.

 

[wild side]

Be interesting to watch Meek v Darcy/Jackson.

They lost last week to Grundy, do that again and we are losing clearances.

 

[s_wd6]

Be interesting to watch Meek v Darcy/Jackson.

They lost last week to Grundy, do that again and we are losing clearances.

Pretty sure Darcy actually beat him h2h. Things just looked a lot worse because our mids were putrid

 

[malpaso]

Be interesting to watch Meek v Darcy/Jackson.

They lost last week to Grundy, do that again and we are losing clearances.

Meek was good last week against a tired Marshall (who got doubled by Darcy/Jackson on the road). He's no Grundy.

 

[ubiquitous226]

Just to add to this comment - look at the stats this season (Voss on the left, Amiss on the right).

Voss trumps him in just about everything, made even more impressive that Amiss averages 8% more TOG.

Not that you’d need the stats because if you’ve watched any Freo footy this season you’d know Voss has been a more valuable player for us this year.

That’s not to say Voss is the better player because I still think Amiss has the higher ceiling, but he’s clearly having the better season and if it’s between Voss and Amiss it has to be Voss right now.

This feels like the Sharp situation all over again where fans don’t want to admit that you can’t carry a player who’s having no impact every week no matter how hard their workrate is.

View attachment 2363353View attachment 2363354View attachment 2363355View attachment 2363356

Yeah to be clear I actually think Amiss should have a Peel spell, I don't see it as that big a deal to give him a chance to build some confidence, but obviously they think the best thing for the team and likely him is to work through it at an AFL level.

We haven't seen enough of Amiss' strengths this year, so even if Voss got the second defender if Amiss' did go to Peel I don't think it would end up worse.
I.e. I'd also be looking at dropping Amiss before Voss

Earlier in the year I thought it was a bad idea to drop him, but where we're at now and who we have available it's a viable option, and maybe the best one.

 

[go_the_dockers]

Yeah to be clear I actually think Amiss should have a Peel spell, I don't see it as that big a deal to give him a chance to build some confidence, but obviously they think the best thing for the team and likely him is to work through it at an AFL level.

We haven't seen enough of Amiss' strengths this year, so even if Voss got the second defender if Amiss' did go to Peel I don't think it would end up worse.
I.e. I'd also be looking at dropping Amiss before Voss

Earlier in the year I thought it was a bad idea to drop him, but where we're at now and who we have available it's a viable option, and maybe the best one.

I think once Switta, Young, Simpson are all available it becomes a lot harder.

Young could easily play as a 3rd or 4th tall forward as he comes up to speed, with small runs through the middle.

A forward line of

Treacy, Switta, Young
Jackson, Treacy, Bolton/Reid plus one of Voss/Amiss looks pretty good

Bolton, Reid, Young all running through the middle and wing

 

[FreoRicci]

Yeah to be clear I actually think Amiss should have a Peel spell, I don't see it as that big a deal to give him a chance to build some confidence, but obviously they think the best thing for the team and likely him is to work through it at an AFL level.

We haven't seen enough of Amiss' strengths this year, so even if Voss got the second defender if Amiss' did go to Peel I don't think it would end up worse.
I.e. I'd also be looking at dropping Amiss before Voss

Earlier in the year I thought it was a bad idea to drop him, but where we're at now and who we have available it's a viable option, and maybe the best one.

Think it’s too late for Amiss having a spell at Peel. Have to accept maybe his role is benefiting the forward final and he ll have to play through it.

 

[Mainy66]

Just to add to this comment - look at the stats this season (Voss on the left, Amiss on the right).

Voss trumps him in just about everything, made even more impressive that Amiss averages 8% more TOG.

Not that you’d need the stats because if you’ve watched any Freo footy this season you’d know Voss has been a more valuable player for us this year.

That’s not to say Voss is the better player because I still think Amiss has the higher ceiling, but he’s clearly having the better season and if it’s between Voss and Amiss it has to be Voss right now.

This feels like the Sharp situation all over again where fans don’t want to admit that you can’t carry a player who’s having no impact every week no matter how hard their workrate is.

View attachment 2363353View attachment 2363354View attachment 2363355View attachment 2363356

Goalless games - Amiss
2025 - 6
2024- 4
2023 - 3

 

[Paracleet]

The difference between Voss and Amiss is partly expectations as well. Amiss kicked stacks of goals as basically a teenager in the AFL as a top 10 pick, whereas Voss is a DFA.

Voss imo is actually still pretty poor at one important as aspect of the game for a key and that is at least halving contests. Not only does Voss not take contested marks (0.5 per game) he concedes them to his opponent. In fact his stats are more like a small. He is far above average in ground ball and tackles, below average in marking related ones. He is elite for pressure for a key forward, but if you reclassify him as a small suddenly it's average in the mattis117 sense of the word.

Amiss is in poor form but I don't think they think Voss can hold down a genuine key forward spot yet. For the moment the are probably thinking the team is better off with Amiss at least commanding an opponent that has to stay on him.

 

[ubiquitous226]

The difference between Voss and Amiss is party expectations as well. Amiss kicked stacks of goals as basically a teenager in the AFL as a top 10 pick, whereas Voss is a DFA.

Voss imo is actually still pretty poor at one important as aspect of the game for a key and that is at least halving contests. Not only does Voss not take contested marks (0.5 per game) he conceeds them to his opponent. In fact his stats are more like a small. He is far above average in ground ball and tackles, below average in marking related ones. He is elite for pressure for a key forward, but if you reclassify him as a small suddenly it's average in the mattis117 sense of the word.

Amiss is in poor form but I don't think they think Voss can hold down a genuine key forward spot yet. For the moment the are probably thinking the team is better off with Amiss at least commanding an opponent that has to stay on him.

That was always the knock on Voss before we recruited him, he plays more like a medium forward.
I think he's shown more than I expected at least in the contest aspects, probably helped by his general aggression and impact on all contests.

The bit that is hard to judge is how would Voss go without Amiss which is what I was alluding to.

 

[mattis117]

Just to add to this comment - look at the stats this season (Voss on the left, Amiss on the right).

Voss trumps him in just about everything, made even more impressive that Amiss averages 8% more TOG.

Not that you’d need the stats because if you’ve watched any Freo footy this season you’d know Voss has been a more valuable player for us this year.

That’s not to say Voss is the better player because I still think Amiss has the higher ceiling, but he’s clearly having the better season and if it’s between Voss and Amiss it has to be Voss right now.

This feels like the Sharp situation all over again where fans don’t want to admit that you can’t carry a player who’s having no impact every week no matter how hard their workrate is.

View attachment 2363353View attachment 2363354View attachment 2363355View attachment 2363356

Unfortunately, your comparisons are compromised by Voss playing a fair chunk of time in the ruck, so this is not like for like.

 

[mattis117]

Yeah to be clear I actually think Amiss should have a Peel spell, I don't see it as that big a deal to give him a chance to build some confidence, but obviously they think the best thing for the team and likely him is to work through it at an AFL level.

We haven't seen enough of Amiss' strengths this year, so even if Voss got the second defender if Amiss' did go to Peel I don't think it would end up worse.
I.e. I'd also be looking at dropping Amiss before Voss

Earlier in the year I thought it was a bad idea to drop him, but where we're at now and who we have available it's a viable option, and maybe the best one.

There seems to be a correlation between Darcy coming on and Voss having significantly less impact. Maybe time in the ruck got him up about, but perhaps not, he was on from bounce down vs Gold Coast, so I would say it's not all on Darcy coming in. Voss' intensity has been lacking since the bye.

 

[mattis117]

I think once Switta, Young, Simpson are all available it becomes a lot harder.

Young could easily play as a 3rd or 4th tall forward as he comes up to speed, with small runs through the middle.

A forward line of

Treacy, Switta, Young
Jackson, Treacy, Bolton/Reid plus one of Voss/Amiss looks pretty good

Bolton, Reid, Young all running through the middle and wing

Critically, those three guys are all in our top 6 or so best ball users as well, and as Champion Data like to crap on about, this season is all about how well teams used the ball.

IMO we lost to Sydney because they used the ball better. Their kicking on the day was superb, both through the field and at goal.

 

[mattis117]

The difference between Voss and Amiss is party expectations as well. Amiss kicked stacks of goals as basically a teenager in the AFL as a top 10 pick, whereas Voss is a DFA.

Voss imo is actually still pretty poor at one important as aspect of the game for a key and that is at least halving contests. Not only does Voss not take contested marks (0.5 per game) he conceeds them to his opponent. In fact his stats are more like a small. He is far above average in ground ball and tackles, below average in marking related ones. He is elite for pressure for a key forward, but if you reclassify him as a small suddenly it's average in the mattis117 sense of the word.

Amiss is in poor form but I don't think they think Voss can hold down a genuine key forward spot yet. For the moment the are probably thinking the team is better off with Amiss at least commanding an opponent that has to stay on him.

I think this is exactly what JL has been on about, they don't see Voss as a key forward, but as a medium hybrid.

 

[chaosball32]

Unfortunately, your comparisons are compromised by Voss playing a fair chunk of time in the ruck, so this is not like for like.

Voss has only been the chop-out once in the past 5 games, and even then he is he’s still spending majority of his time forward. It’s not exactly like for like but it’s close enough. I would argue Voss being able to ruck makes him more valuable anyway.

 

[wakojako]

Hard to get mad about this loss when you are sitting by the poolside in Malaysia. If I was in Perth I probably would have popped a blood vessel based on some of these comments. Can anyone tell me if Jackson was played in the midfield much and how impactful he was?

 

[go_the_dockers]

Joe Briety confirmed Switta comes directly in. JL implied the same.

Hayden Young

26

Hayden Young

Age

24

Ht

189cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.0

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

3.2

3star

T

1.4

3star

CL

0.2

2star

D

10.0

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

3.4

2star

M

3.2

3star

T

1.4

2star

CL

0.2

2star

D

10.0

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

3.2

4star

T

1.4

4star

CL

0.2

2star

- 50/50 if he starts as sub or goes through the WAFL. Should be available for selection next week.

 

[s_wd6]

Hard to get mad about this loss when you are sitting by the poolside in Malaysia. If I was in Perth I probably would have popped a blood vessel based on some of these comments. Can anyone tell me if Jackson was played in the midfield much and how impactful he was?

Felt like every time he got his hands to the ball as a rover it ended up back in Grundys hands tbh

 

[mike91]

Think it’s too late for Amiss having a spell at Peel. Have to accept maybe his role is benefiting the forward final and he ll have to play through it.

It's not too late at all, that's literally soft coaching

 

[StingBitten]

What's Freo's draft hand for next season?

 

[go_the_dockers]

What's Freo's draft hand for next season?

We have all picks plus an extra 3rd rounder from Richmond.

 

[mattis117]

We need to get Cooper back in ASAP - we need his ball use of half-back desperately.

 

[go_the_dockers]

We need to get Cooper back in ASAP - we need his ball use of half-back desperately.

Cooper, Young and Switta all increase our ball use. Add them, and everyone else looks better.

 

[ubiquitous226]

We need to get Cooper back in ASAP - we need his ball use of half-back desperately.

I think Cooper will need to play at least a couple of games at WAFL, if we stay fit it'd be a pretty hard team to crack back into with limited experience.

Pretty excited for him to build into next year and beyond though, it was a small sample, but a great one at half back this year.

 

[Perfect Purple]

Club have just announced Son Son will do a lap of honour to say goodbye at this game at half time.

Geez I hope the rain that has been forecast for Saturday has eased by half time.

I had even thought about not going because of the weather but this has changed my mind.