2019 Non-Crows AFL Chat #3 - the off-season

[Doc_]

Must be a nightmare for females to provide a sample. We can at least give it a squeeze, let it go and then direct the flow into the container.

 

[jenny61_99]

It was an out of Comp test,

Doesn’t matter. It’s an automatic 4 year suspension.

 

[jenny61_99]

Must be a nightmare for females to provide a sample. We can at least give it a squeeze, let it go and then direct the flow into the container.

Also very messy!

 

[treeman]

It seems interesting that when an Australian athlete gets caught for drug testing there will always be those out there saying something has gone wrong.

But when it's an international athlete they are guilty as sin.

Rioli's story is another unique way to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Sent from my MI PAD 4 using Tapatalk

 

[GROTTO]

He used a white prosthetic?

You think youre being smart.

He might just have two of them.

 

[GROTTO]

I think you aren't getting it.

The ATHLETE is responsible. The ATHLETE. One more time. ATHLETE.

The testing officer is not responsible.

Would you agree that its "almost" impossible to produce a false sample if he followed protocol, ie to provide the sample in front of ASADA ?

So you are basically saying he must have gone for walkabouts and provided this sample from another source? If this happened yes, I do agree it would be naive on my part to not believe this.

What Im struggling to grasp then is that if he didnt follow strict ASADA protocols, why wasnt he immediately banned, there has been so much time that has elapsed?

A few things in all of this dont sit right with me.

 

[Scorpus]

Would you agree that its "almost" impossible to produce a false sample if he followed protocol, ie to provide the sample in front of ASADA ?

So you are basically saying he must have gone for walkabouts and provided this sample from another source? If this happened yes, I do agree it would be naive on my part to not believe this.

What Im struggling to grasp then is that if he didnt follow strict ASADA protocols, why wasnt he immediately banned, there has been so much time that has elapsed?

A few things in all of this dont sit right with me.

Yeah it would be very difficult for at least one test to be done not in protocol.

I think he was just an idiot and seized a split second moment to try and tamper the sample. As to why he wasn't immediately banned, they probably have to file reports, test the second sample and so on. I can't remember any time a player has been immediately banned, it's always a few weeks after

 

[Punchy Bassett]

When does Tom Boyd get a statue?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

It seems interesting that when an Australian athlete gets caught for drug testing there will always be those out there saying something has gone wrong.

But when it's an international athlete they are guilty as sin.

Rioli's story is another unique way to give him the benefit of the doubt.

You're right

Lisa Ondiecki - "they spiked my water bottles!"

Samantha Ryan (I think it was her?) - headache tablet

Shane Warne - chubby cheeks thinner for on camera appearance

 

[ad victoriam]

Doesn’t matter. It’s an automatic 4 year suspension.

ASADA conducted the test the AFL Drug Tribunal hears the Case,
If he had of supply a proper test it may have been a 1st or 2nd strike type issue or performance-enhancing situation.
Out of Comp the AFL are putting up the money for the testing.

 

[GROTTO]

You're right

Lisa Ondiecki - "they spiked my water bottles!"

Samantha Ryan (I think it was her?) - headache tablet

Shane Warne - chubby cheeks thinner for on camera appearance

I use the same excuses when I get banned on BF.

Someone stole my password, I was posting at an internet cafe and forget to log off, I am drunk alcohol made me do it.

 

[jenny61_99]

ASADA conducted the test the AFL Drug Tribunal hears the Case,
If he had of supply a proper test it may have been a 1st or 2nd strike type issue or performance-enhancing situation.
Out of Comp the AFL are putting up the money for the testing.

I don't believe it makes a difference. ASADA enforce the anti doping guidelines as prescribed by WADA. There is no "grey territory". IF the AFL Drug Tribunal find him not guilty, ASADA can appeal the decision. What happened in the Essendon case, the AFL Drug tribunal stated there was "insufficient evidence" to find the players guilty of doping to which ASADA did nothing (knowing full well WADA would come over the top). In this case though, if there is reason to believe Rioli swapped the evidence, or tampered with it in some way, then ASADA will act. Robbo made an interesting point last night that if the players are forced to drop trou then and there and pee into the cup (reckon that'd be hard for women) then how can he possibly put something other than pee in the cup? Could the ASADA agent not have followed protocol? (ie. did they allow him to go to the loo unsupervised)?

 

[ad victoriam]

I don't believe it makes a difference. ASADA enforce the anti doping guidelines as prescribed by WADA. There is no "grey territory". IF the AFL Drug Tribunal find him not guilty, ASADA can appeal the decision. What happened in the Essendon case, the AFL Drug tribunal stated there was "insufficient evidence" to find the players guilty of doping to which ASADA did nothing (knowing full well WADA would come over the top). In this case though, if there is reason to believe Rioli swapped the evidence, or tampered with it in some way, then ASADA will act. Robbo made an interesting point last night that if the players are forced to drop trou then and there and pee into the cup (reckon that'd be hard for women) then how can he possibly put something other than pee in the cup? Could the ASADA agent not have followed protocol? (ie. did they allow him to go to the loo unsupervised)?

Know, all that my point is where you mention the AFL would go soft. When they cannot,
Question Was This an AFL Out Comp Test. or an ASADA in comp test,

 

[jenny61_99]

Know, all that my point is where you mention the AFL would go soft. When they cannot,
Question Was This an AFL Out Comp Test. or an ASADA in comp test,

Translation?

What I think you are asking - It doesn't matter.

 

[Vader]

Know, all that my point is where you mention the AFL would go soft. When they cannot,
Question Was This an AFL Out Comp Test. or an ASADA in comp test,

It was conducted on a Tuesday, which makes it out of competition.

He would not have been banned if his urine had shown the presence of recreational drugs, only performance enhancing drugs. The suggestion is that he panicked, and tried to do the old switcheroo. He probably wouldn't have been banned if he'd just pissed in the jar. Now he's looking at 4 years on the sidelines.

 

[ad victoriam]

Translation?

What I think you are asking - It doesn't matter.

Was this and Out Competition AFL illicit drug test or an in comp ASADA drug test.
And if it does not matter then why would you expect the AFL to be Soft.

 

[ams4crows]

Was this and Out Competition AFL illicit drug test or an in comp ASADA drug test.
And if it does not matter then why would you expect the AFL to be Soft.

I thought it was after the Richmond game done by ASADA

 

[NikkiNoo]

For some context, when I was involved in coaching state teams we had training regarding the drug testing. Most of my athletes were children, but they had to be advised on what the process was as coaches could only be present if they were selected by the athlete as their 'representative.' For females, they would have female representatives and they had to view the sample being provided. The hardest part of the testing was always having to drink enough water to ensure that you then could provide two samples! I know at one National Championships, one the poor athlete had to hang around for hours trying to get enough pee for two samples!

The current testing is pretty similar and outlined here - https://www.asada.gov.au/anti-doping-programmes/testing

For Rioli it seems that he used part of a sports drink instead of his urine. I saw reports that he was caught doing it at the time, but they have to wait for the sample and the B sample to be both tested before any ban can be put in place. West Coast were advised at the time and he was allowed to play in the first final with them all knowing that he was under investigation. https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/wi...y/news-story/459d17f0e9c9e9f37361bfec4d1b7686

 

[ams4crows]

So what you're saying is, he was frustrated he couldnt get two samples worth of pee and impatient to leave so just topped it up with Gatorade?

 

[hippyhippy]

North is having a very good cleanout ... for once i am jelous of them!!!

 

[NikkiNoo]

If what Rioli did is as reported on, then quite simply it is a 4-year penalty, with no chance of reduction.

From the WADA code
"For violations of Article 2.3 or Article 2.5, the period of Ineligibility shall be four years unless, in the case of failing to submit to Sample collection, the Athlete can establish that the commission of the anti-doping rule violation was not intentional (as defined in Article 10.2.3), in which case the period of Ineligibility shall be two years."

Article 2.3 is "Evading, Refusing or Failing to Submit to Sample Collection Evading Sample collection, or without compelling justification, refusing or failing to submit to Sample collection after notification as authorized in applicable anti-doping rules."

https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/default/files/resources/files/wada_anti-doping_code_2019_english_final_revised_v1_linked.pdf

 

[treeman]

For some context, when I was involved in coaching state teams we had training regarding the drug testing. Most of my athletes were children, but they had to be advised on what the process was as coaches could only be present if they were selected by the athlete as their 'representative.' For females, they would have female representatives and they had to view the sample being provided. The hardest part of the testing was always having to drink enough water to ensure that you then could provide two samples! I know at one National Championships, one the poor athlete had to hang around for hours trying to get enough pee for two samples!

The current testing is pretty similar and outlined here - https://www.asada.gov.au/anti-doping-programmes/testing

For Rioli it seems that he used part of a sports drink instead of his urine. I saw reports that he was caught doing it at the time, but they have to wait for the sample and the B sample to be both tested before any ban can be put in place. West Coast were advised at the time and he was allowed to play in the first final with them all knowing that he was under investigation. https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/wi...y/news-story/459d17f0e9c9e9f37361bfec4d1b7686

Thanks Nikki I appreciate your thoughts.

Sent from my MI PAD 4 using Tapatalk

 

[Dixie Normous]

Must be a nightmare for females to provide a sample. We can at least give it a squeeze, let it go and then direct the flow into the container.

They probably just have to squat over a bucket

 

[TRP1996]

When does Tom Boyd get a statue?

Chuck one up at Whitten Oval and it'll draw a weekly congregation.

 

[GROTTO]

Dangerfield apparently battling an injury tonight.

Glory be.

This isnt our first rodeo, we have been familiar with this story and how it will play out. Gets 30+ disposals and wins the game, Danger is Superman, loses and has a poor game, he has excuses lined up ready to fire back.