Current Trial 9yo Charlise Mutten - Blue Mountains * Justin Stein charged with murder

[Lady O]

You already knew that this was what went down in court today, or what was going to happen when you posted the above, didn't you. Where are you getting your inside info from, the Daily Tele?

View attachment 1988167

Nah, saw it on TV news.

 

[jason_recliner]

Utter trash. He's going away for a looooong time.

 

[Poppy Penny]

Utter trash. He's going away for a looooong time.

Hope so - my greatest wish

 

[Lady O]

You already knew that this was what went down in court today, or what was going to happen when you posted the above, didn't you. Where are you getting your inside info from, the Daily Tele?

View attachment 1988167

Good to see you are keeping up X

 

[Kurve]

'Alleged murderer of schoolgirl Charlise Mutten claims her mother is responsible for shooting death'​

'May 13, 2024 - 5:49PM'

'A toxicology report showed Charlise had tested positive for Mr Stein’s schizophrenia medication.'

That's disgusting, makes my skin crawl.

 

[Underarrest_]

Media reporting of the estimated 6 week trial by jury has re-commenced.
Reads like the jury was only selected this morning.

Charlise Mutten, 9, allegedly shot twice before body dumped in barrel

Justin Stein has pleaded not guilty to murdering his partner’s daughter as she visited his family’s Blue Mountains home in January 2022.

www.smh.com.au

'May 13, 2024 — 12.47pm'
...
the pair had mental health issues, with Kallista Mutten’s relating to substance abuse and post-traumatic stress disorder, while Stein was being treated for schizophrenia and had monthly injections for a heroin addiction. Kallista Mutten is among the witnesses expected to be called.
...'

Imagine being on the jury....

 

[Kurve]

Media reporting of the estimated 6 week trial by jury has re-commenced.
Reads like the jury was only selected this morning.

Charlise Mutten, 9, allegedly shot twice before body dumped in barrel

Justin Stein has pleaded not guilty to murdering his partner’s daughter as she visited his family’s Blue Mountains home in January 2022.

www.smh.com.au

'May 13, 2024 — 12.47pm'
...
the pair had mental health issues, with Kallista Mutten’s relating to substance abuse and post-traumatic stress disorder, while Stein was being treated for schizophrenia and had monthly injections for a heroin addiction. Kallista Mutten is among the witnesses expected to be called.
...'

They didn't find the gun responsible iirc. Do we know what kind of gun ballistics determined it as?

That she was shot twice is stomach churning. No way that could be an accident which is why he's accusing the mother.

 

[BFew]

Charlise's mother was using ice on the day Charlise was killed.

And some of the wording used in Court about the drug used to [try] and control [some of the symptoms of] schizophrenia, that was turned up in Charlise's toxicology report. Wording that suggests that it was a tablet form of anti-psychotic (assumed) as opposed to an injected (depot) form.

Charlise Mutten shot in face and back by stepfather before he dumped her body in barrel, court told

Justin Laurens Stein pleaded not guilty to the murder of Charlise Mutten on Monday, on day one of a six-week trial at the NSW Supreme Court in Parramatta.

www.abc.net.au

'Nine-year-old Charlise Mutten shot in face, back by stepfather before he dumped her body in barrel, court told'​

'Posted 2h ago
....
The court heard traces of a drug used to control schizophrenia were found in Charlise's system, ingested "either by design or accidentally".
...
"[Kallista Mutten] was a woman who had been an ice user since she was in her early 20s and she continued to use ice … [she] admitted to using ice on the very day the Crown says the child was killed," Ms Davenport said.
...'

 

[BFew]

They didn't find the gun responsible iirc. Do we know what kind of gun ballistics determined it as?

Court reports today infer that one of the stolen firearms was a ballistics match with the crime scene in some way.

Also, I think today was the first we'd heard of the hunting rifle scope.

Charlise Mutten shot in face and back by stepfather before he dumped her body in barrel, court told

Justin Laurens Stein pleaded not guilty to the murder of Charlise Mutten on Monday, on day one of a six-week trial at the NSW Supreme Court in Parramatta.

www.abc.net.au

'Mr McKay also told the jury he would present evidence the accused and his fiancée had broken into a house at Mount Wilson and stolen two firearms some time prior to the death, one of which he said was "of importance" to the Crown case in the current trial.

a hunting rifle scope, purchased online by Mr Stein, "made its way onto the stolen .22 bolt action rifle"'

 

[BFew]

The credibility, accuracy and believability of the witness(s) that have are claimed to have evidence of seeing Charlise in the caravan park after the time that the prosecution case says Stein murdered Charlise, are going to be all important, and might need to have the prosecution come up with an alternative timeline, if it's not too late to propose one after the trial has started (is that even allowed?)

Charlise Mutten shot in face and back by stepfather before he dumped her body in barrel, court told

Justin Laurens Stein pleaded not guilty to the murder of Charlise Mutten on Monday, on day one of a six-week trial at the NSW Supreme Court in Parramatta.

www.abc.net.au

'she told jurors the time that Charlise was killed and who was responsible were in contention.

She urged jurors to pay close attention to the last reported sighting of Charlise, foreshadowing calling evidence the child had been seen at the caravan park on January 13, when prosecutors say she had already been killed.'

 

[Underarrest_]

The credibility, accuracy and believability of the witness(s) that have are claimed to have evidence of seeing Charlise in the caravan park after the time that the prosecution case says Stein murdered Charlise, are going to be all important, and might need to have the prosecution come up with an alternative timeline, if it's not too late to propose one after the trial has started (is that even allowed?)

Charlise Mutten shot in face and back by stepfather before he dumped her body in barrel, court told

Justin Laurens Stein pleaded not guilty to the murder of Charlise Mutten on Monday, on day one of a six-week trial at the NSW Supreme Court in Parramatta.

www.abc.net.au

'she told jurors the time that Charlise was killed and who was responsible were in contention.

She urged jurors to pay close attention to the last reported sighting of Charlise, foreshadowing calling evidence the child had been seen at the caravan park on January 13, when prosecutors say she had already been killed.'

That’s strange. Be interesting to see what time the defence is proposing Charlise died.

 

[Kurve]

"[Kallista Mutten] was a woman who had been an ice user since she was in her early 20s and she continued to use ice … [she] admitted to using ice on the very day the Crown says the child was killed," Ms Davenport said.
...'

She was pregnant, if this whole thing couldn't be more horrible

 

[BFew]

Be interesting to see what time the defence is proposing Charlise died.

Some time on 13th Jan was reported today in the ABC article.

Whereas the prosecution says it was on the 12th ("or about"). Also in the ABC article I've quoted many times this evening.

"The Crown case will be that the accused was the person who shot Charlise Mutten and that that happened on or about the 12th of January 2022," Crown prosecutor Ken McKay SC said.

 

[Kurve]

Okay, so if the defence will try to throw the shooting off on to the mother, does that nullify any deal the prosecution might have with her? Or is it too late given her other charges have already been dealt with where imo, she got off light.

 

[BomberManU]

This whole mess is just ugly.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

And some social worker deemed it desirable for Charlise to spend time with her mother and her boyfriend, unsupervised, in a remote location, even knowing their history. What could possibly go wrong?

Hint: leopards don’t change their spots.

 

[Lady O]

And some social worker deemed it desirable for Charlise to spend time with her mother and her boyfriend, unsupervised, in a remote location, even knowing their history. What could possibly go wrong?

Hint: leopards don’t change their spots.

This was the question I wanted to ask. Was she forced to spend time with her Mother or did she go willingly. Thanks for answering it. You would have to be totally unaware of their history to have sent that child to stay with them.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

This was the question I wanted to ask. Was she forced to spend time with her Mother or did she go willingly. Thanks for answering it. You would have to be totally unaware of their history to have sent that child to stay with them.

Sorry, I’m making assumptions, I don’t know that Child Services were involved for sure, but they often are in cases like this. But, knowing how understaffed and overworked they are, maybe not. I seem to remember that the grandmother was not keen on her going but as it was only for two weeks in the holidays, thought it should be ok. Kallista, like so many other addicts with a dubious character, could probably spin a convincing story of turning over a new leaf and making wild promises.

 

[jason_recliner]

Charlise's mother was using ice on the day Charlise was killed.

The world could not be less surprised.

 

[jason_recliner]

And some social worker deemed it desirable for Charlise to spend time with her mother and her boyfriend, unsupervised, in a remote location, even knowing their history. What could possibly go wrong?

Hint: leopards don’t change their spots.

Yes, but this is the first time ever anything like this has happened - oh, right.

 

[jason_recliner]

Sounds he like he shot her when she was running away - probably threatening to tell somebody about his abuse - and then finished her off with a head shot.

 

[Underarrest_]

And some social worker deemed it desirable for Charlise to spend time with her mother and her boyfriend, unsupervised, in a remote location, even knowing their history. What could possibly go wrong?

Hint: leopards don’t change their spots.

Yes and her Mother could have visited Charlise in Qld without the boyfriend. Why throw a boyfriend into the mix. Work on creating a bond between Charlise and her Mother (if fit) in a safe space first.

 

[BFew]

I don’t know that Child Services were involved for sure, but they often are in cases like this.

https://correctiveservices.dcj.nsw.gov.au/documents/fh-chapter-9-caring-for-children.pdf

As per one of the options/possibilities in the below (assuming it applied back around 2017), neither NSW FACS or NSW Courts might have been involved at all, assuming that Charlise and her mother (Kallista) were residing in NSW and covered by NSW laws (as opposed to QLD laws where the Grandmother appears to have been living).

Legal issues when caring for a child with a parent in prison

Kinship care
In NSW a parent can arrange for immediate family to care for their child without having to involve FACS or a court order.

If there’s no court order, the parent keeps their legal rights and can take back the child’s care as soon as they’re released.

It’s a good idea to get the parent to sign a statement saying they’ve placed the child in the family’s care, and to get the child’s Medicare number.
...
Children’s Court
FACS may get involved if concerns are raised about possible harm to a child.

This can include concerns about children being moved around a lot or not having a stable parent figure, especially when they’re very young. FACS is also called when police arrest a parent and there’s no one to look after the children.

Most of the time FACS staff prefer children to remain with immediate family. Sometimes this can be arranged informally, without needing to go to court.

But if there are big concerns about the children, or issues about the children going back home after the parent is released, the matter may go before the Children’s Court.

Sometimes children will be placed in the care of family, but the Court may allocate parental (i.e. legal) responsibility to the Minister for Community Services, or may order that this be shared between FACS and a relative.

This means FACS may be involved in decisions like where the child lives, visiting arrangements to see parents, and decisions about their education or medical care.

If the Court is involved and you want to be considered as a carer for the children, contact FACS as soon as possible.

If you are considered, FACS will need to visit your home and prepare a report.

You may also be able to be a party to the court case. If you want to do this, you’ll need a solicitor.

Depending on your income, you may be able to get Legal Aid for this.... If you’re concerned that children will be at risk of harm if they return to a parent on their release from prison, phone FACS helpline ...

Family Court
If you’re caring for your grandchildren and you believe that it’s in their best interests for them to have legal security in your care, you may be able to get a residence order from the Family Court.

This can be an option where FACS isn’t involved. Family Court action can be quite expensive, as you may not be able to get Legal Aid...
...'

 

[jason_recliner]

https://correctiveservices.dcj.nsw.gov.au/documents/fh-chapter-9-caring-for-children.pdf

As per one of the options/possibilities in the below (assuming it applied back around 2017), neither NSW FACS or NSW Courts might have been involved at all, assuming that Charlise and her mother (Kallista) were residing in NSW and covered by NSW laws (as opposed to QLD laws where the Grandmother appears to have been living).

Legal issues when caring for a child with a parent in prison

Kinship care
In NSW a parent can arrange for immediate family to care for their child without having to involve FACS or a court order.

If there’s no court order, the parent keeps their legal rights and can take back the child’s care as soon as they’re released.

It’s a good idea to get the parent to sign a statement saying they’ve placed the child in the family’s care, and to get the child’s Medicare number.
...
Children’s Court
FACS may get involved if concerns are raised about possible harm to a child.

This can include concerns about children being moved around a lot or not having a stable parent figure, especially when they’re very young. FACS is also called when police arrest a parent and there’s no one to look after the children.

Most of the time FACS staff prefer children to remain with immediate family. Sometimes this can be arranged informally, without needing to go to court.

But if there are big concerns about the children, or issues about the children going back home after the parent is released, the matter may go before the Children’s Court.

Sometimes children will be placed in the care of family, but the Court may allocate parental (i.e. legal) responsibility to the Minister for Community Services, or may order that this be shared between FACS and a relative.

This means FACS may be involved in decisions like where the child lives, visiting arrangements to see parents, and decisions about their education or medical care.

If the Court is involved and you want to be considered as a carer for the children, contact FACS as soon as possible.

If you are considered, FACS will need to visit your home and prepare a report.

You may also be able to be a party to the court case. If you want to do this, you’ll need a solicitor.

Depending on your income, you may be able to get Legal Aid for this.... If you’re concerned that children will be at risk of harm if they return to a parent on their release from prison, phone FACS helpline ...

Family Court
If you’re caring for your grandchildren and you believe that it’s in their best interests for them to have legal security in your care, you may be able to get a residence order from the Family Court.

This can be an option where FACS isn’t involved. Family Court action can be quite expensive, as you may not be able to get Legal Aid...
...'

Regardless, FACS should have been involved as her 'mother' is criminal junkie trash and hooked up with criminal junkie trash she met through prison. Grandparents, teachers, parents of friends, anybody should have referred Charlise to the Department, I'd be shocked if they hadn't, and I'm sure they're involved.

 

[Underarrest_]

Regardless, FACS should have been involved as her 'mother' is criminal junkie trash and hooked up with criminal junkie trash she met through prison. Grandparents, teachers, parents of friends, anybody should have referred Charlise to the Department, I'd be shocked if they hadn't, and I'm sure they're involved.

Very strong words, but I tend to agree. FACS should always be involved in these types of cases to at least provide some guidance to family around any visitations or safety.
This poor little girl seemed to be safe and happy living with her Grandmother. It’s horrendous she had to go through what she did.