Preview Changes vs GWS

[Jars458]

You can't have your cake & eat it too. If Crouch stays when Grigg returns (and I think he will) then someone else will have to miss out. My preference would be to drop Reilly, but Laird or Brown would not overly surprise me. That's just my reading of the tea leaves.

Hmmm, Brown and Laird are pretty safe for mine. I think you may be right about Crouch in front of Grigg. I think Lynch comes in for Martin or Reilly.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Petrenko is the new Doughty? And you want to drop him?

Wait wait wait - Are we talking about the same Doughty?

231 game Doughty. The same Doughty who finished top 10 in our clubs Best & Fairest 5 times (4 of which were years we made the finals). The same Doughty who finished in our top 5 in the clubs best and fairest 3 times...

Yep and he epitomised our mediocrity over that 10 years. In those 10 years - how many good finals did he play?

We have won 4 final in 12 years and 1 final away from Adelaide.

As a club, we accept that mediocrity from players far too often and don't have the courage to trade or just delist them when they don't gave that ability.

Petrenko is just another player on that long list that won't amount to anything but will be given 200 games of utter crapness.

 

[Wright Away]

We dont need anyone to play Brent Reilly's role, all he does is defend poorly, turn the ball over and get caught holding the ball.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

The same Robert Shirley who repeatedly made Chris Judd his bitch (there would be literally nobody with a better record against Judd in his prime) and the same Robert Shirley who Gary Ablett once named on the Footy Show as the first player in his list of 'the best taggers in the game'?

Cool story.

Certainly helped in those preliminary finals in the 2000's against the west Coast.

Oh right - he was only a tagger and we still lost.

 

[Vader]

Hmmm, Brown and Laird are pretty safe for mine. I think you may be right about Crouch in front of Grigg. I think Lynch comes in for Martin or Reilly.

Lynch replacing Martin is a near certainty.

What happens with Grigg/Crouch/Reilly/Laird/Brown is far, far less certain - and could well cause the selectors some serious headaches.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

The same Robert Shirley who repeatedly made Chris Judd his bitch (there would be literally nobody with a better record against Judd in his prime) and the same Robert Shirley who Gary Ablett once named on the Footy Show as the first player in his list of 'the best taggers in the game'?

Cool story.

4 winning finals in 12 years says it all really.

We really are a great club at giving mediocre players long careers.

 

[AFC979810]

Yep and he epitomised our mediocrity over that 10 years. In those 10 years - how many good finals did he play?

We have won 4 final in 12 years and 1 final away from Adelaide.

As a club, we accept that mediocrity from players far too often and don't have the courage to trade or just delist them when they don't gave that ability.

Petrenko is just another player on that long list that won't amount to anything but we be given 200 games of utter crapness.

What are you on about? How many back pockets have won finals for their teams? Finals aren't won by the players in the 15-22 range. They are won by elite footballers. Look through the list of Norm Smith Medals - with the exception of Shaun Hart all are elite.

Do yourself a favour - just look through write ups of the last 15 grandfinals. See what players are important and which aren't.

Hawthorn didn't win the 2013 flag because their fringe players were better than ours. They won because their elite players were better than ours. As a club we need to be all about assembling the best 10-15 A grade players. These 10-15 are ten times more important than players 16-22.

 

[jackster83]

4 winning finals in 12 years says it all really.

We really are a great club at giving mediocre players long careers.

Not just players, lol.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

What are you on about? How many back pockets have won finals for their teams? Finals aren't won by the players in the 15-22 range. They are won by elite footballers. Look through the list of Norm Smith Medals - with the exception of Shaun Hart all are elite.

Did I say win?

No, I said played a good game. However, he didn't win those games for us but his inept performances went a long way towards losing them.

Hawthorn didn't win the 2013 flag because their fringe players were better than ours. They won because their elite players were better than ours. As a club we need to be all about assembling the best 10-15 A grade players. These 10-15 are ten times more important than players 16-22.

And how do you propose getting better players into the team when we won't drop anyone who doesn't have a future?

Those players should have been axed long before they had played 50 games but only at the Adelaide Football club do we keep players who try hard.

 

[AFC979810]

Certainly helped in those preliminary finals in the 2000's against the west Coast.

Oh right - he was only a tagger and we still lost.

Yup Shirley was to blame for 2005 (nothing to do our captain brownlow medallist being suspended for the St.Kilda game).

Also to blame in 2006 for Roo's parvo virus and Biglands Knee.

 

[huludicidal]

4 winning finals in 12 years says it all really.

We really are a great club at giving mediocre players long careers.

And yet, Shirley's record on the best mids in the comp was excellent.

Our poor record in finals is probably best explained by a combination of poor coaching and our big name players (yes I'm talking about legends of the club like Scott Thompson and Mark Ricciuto) repeatedly reserving their worst performances for the big games.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Yup Shirley was to blame for 2005 (nothing to do our captain brownlow medallist being suspended for the St.Kilda game).

Also to blame in 2006 for Roo's parvo virus and Biglands Knee.

LOL - now you remind me. Robert Harvey killed us that night. Another fine performance by the best tagger EVER!!

 

[GROTTO]

I use the AFL 360 analogy where they rate players in either A, B or C Class.

All teams have A Class players which tend to nullify each other out, its usually the team with more B class players compared to C class which is the difference.

Maybe someone with a lot more experience in understanding our list can maybe list our A,B and C.
Just generally speaking IMO our A class is Danger, Sloane, Talia and Tex, this is relative to all the remaining clubs.

This excludes Mercedes Benz.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

And yet, Shirley's record on the best mids in the comp was excellent.

Our poor record in finals is probably best explained by a combination of poor coaching and our big name players (yes I'm talking about legends of the club like Scott Thompson and Mark Ricciuto) repeatedly reserving their worst performances for the big games.

Crap.

Robert Harvey got like 35 touches in the 2007 GF and was getting tagged by Kane Johnson. However, the difference between Johnson and Shirley (who tagged harvey in the 2005 final) - Shirley didn't have the ability to hurt st kilda the other way. And that is my point.

He didn't have the ability to hurt the other team and if he wasn't tagging that game wasn't up to scratch, he was useless.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Getting this back onto topic - 2014 will be another wasted season if we continue to play players who don't have a future with this club.

Petrenko should go now.
Reilly should go as soon as Henderson is ready.
Martin, Jeansch and j-Pod don't have a future.

4 winning finals in 15 years is a dead set disgrace and we continue to follow this failed algorithm of bullshit.

 

[huludicidal]

LOL - now yiu remind me. Robert Harvey killed us that night. Another fine performance by the best tagger EVER!!

Shirley didn't play on Harvey that night (as stated previously, poor coaching was largely to blame for our finals chokes), but you actually needed to watch the game to know that.

 

[huludicidal]

Crap.

Robert Harvey got like 35 touches in the 2007 GF and was getting tagged by Kane Johnson. However, the difference between Johnson and Shirley (who tagged harvey in the 2005 final) - Shirley didn't have the ability to hurt st kilda the other way. And that is my point.

He didn't have the ability to hurt the other team and if he wasn't tagging that game wasn't up to scratch, he was useless.

You're right and Gary Ablett is wrong.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Shirley didn't play on Harvey that night (as stated previously, poor coaching was largely to blame for our finals chokes), but you actually needed to watch the game to know that.

So, the coach didn't have confidence to put the best tagger ever on a Brownlow medal winner?

Yeah - guess his tagging wasn't that good.

Also, who picks the players to play, that right the coach, so another stuff up by the club.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

You're right and Gary Ablett is wrong.

Didn't tag Robert Harvey. You just said so.

Maybe Gary Ablett was saying a name who quickly came to mind.

Can not have it both ways.

 

[AFC979810]

Did I say win?

No, I said played a good game. However, he didn't win those games for us but his inept performances went a long way towards losing them.

You are talking out of your ass. The above is complete and utter incorrect rubbish. It is 100% wrong.

Here is how he went in every one of our losing finals he played in over his 237 game career.

2002 - Losing Qualifying to Brisbane. Was in our best 3 players. 23 touches (2nd highest).
2002 - Prelim vs Collingwood. 16 touches (in top 7 possesion getters). In our top 10 players.

2003 - Losing final to Brisbane - did not play.

2005 - Admittedly poor game against St.Kilda (8 touches). Was average against West Coast (12 touches)- not our worst by any means.

2007 - Did not play in our losing final.

2008 - Vs Collingwood was in our best 3 players. Finished with 21 touches (2nd highest for Adelaide), 6 marks, 4 tackles and 5 frees for.

2009 - Was good in the 2009 final vs Collingwood (25 touches).

2012 - Losing final vs Sydney. Was probably our best on the day. 26 touches and 10 Marks going at 80% efficiency. 2 inside 50's and 2 rebound 50's.

2012 - Prelim. Was serviceable for us. Certainly nowhere near our worst, nor the reason we lost.

And how do you propose getting better players into the team when we won't drop anyone who doesn't have a future?

Those players should have been axed long before they had played 50 games but only at the Adelaide Football club do we keep players who try hard.

There are 22 spots on the field. You can look at the other 21. Doughty was a very very good player. He is not the type of player you move on.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Shirley didn't play on Harvey that night (as stated previously, poor coaching was largely to blame for our finals chokes), but you actually needed to watch the game to know that.

Who did he play on? Why didn't we play our best tagger on their best midfielder?

 

[huludicidal]

So, the coach didn't have confidence to put the best tagger ever on a Brownlow medal winner?

Yeah - guess his tagging wasn't that good.

Also, who picks the players to play, that right the coach, so another stuff up by the club.

A coaches mistake can't be blamed on the player. Now you're just being ridiculous. Shirley always tagged someone who the coach considered to be dangerous (eg Ablett, Judd) so he certainly had confidence in him. In this particular case I believe he was sent to Dal Santo (I know it wasn't Harvey, because Harvey had no tag all night and there was a lot of talk about it after the game). If Craigy could have his time again, he'd send him to Harvs.

On a sidenote, Scott Thompson (one of Harvey's many victims that night) had 15 disposals and 5 frees against in this game. Yuck.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

That's ok AFC 979810

We will keep playing mediocre players and continue to achieve **** all.

That's ok. If we have Shirley and doughty as our bench mark, we will be like Fitzroy.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

A coaches mistake can't be blamed on the player. Now you're just being ridiculous. Shirley always tagged someone who the coach considered to be dangerous (eg Ablett, Judd) so he certainly had confidence in him. In this particular case I believe he was sent to Dal Santo (I know it wasn't Harvey, because Harvey had no tag all night and there was a lot of talk about it after the game). If Craigy could have his time again, he'd send him to Harvs.

On a sidenote, Scott Thompson (one of Harvey's many victims that night) had 15 disposals and 5 frees against in this game. Yuck.

That's ok. You keep your dream alive.

However, 4 finals in 15 years suggests we keep too many crap players, too long. And we are continuing to do it this year.

 

[huludicidal]

Who did he play on? Why didn't we play our best tagger on their best midfielder?

The only explanation would be that Craigy thought Dal Santo's elite disposal would hurt us more.