Vic How would you rate Daniel Andrews' performance as Victorian Premier? - Part 6

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I didn't mean to derail the thread here. Is there another more appropriate thread for this? Happy to learn more and discuss each of these issues. But I know some usual suspects will come flying in with their usual crap if this goes any further here.

 

[Gralin]

I mean there's much in what he(?) says there that I broadly agree with.

If prison reform is what he's advocating. I wholeheartedly agree. It still chills me when a couple of years ago one of mine got sent to the slammer (no saint). He had a heart condition.

We asked that he be given his medication. The prisons said only what is prescribed by the prison doctor. The judge said, very pointedly, to the prison officer "You make sure he sees a doctor and is prescribed the necessary medication TODAY."

"Of course" was the answer.

He didn't see a doctor that day or the next, suffered a massive heart attack on the third day, and died 2 weeks later shackled to a hospital bed. No consequences for the prison.

I'm sorry that happened to you Bruce. Truly the system is ****ed. It's also working as designed which is why there are no consequences.

I'm for abolition and reinvestment into communities as opposed to throwing the money at more cops and prisons

Everywhere they've put money into communities they've reaped massive benefits

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I'm sorry that happened to you Bruce. Truly the system is f’ed. It's also working as designed which is why there are no consequences.

I'm for abolition and reinvestment into communities as opposed to throwing the money at more cops and prisons

Everywhere they've put money into communities they've reaped massive benefits

Again I feel I need to be more clear. One of my clients, not my family. I don't deserve personal sympathy here. But the indifference of the prison system really was something to behold.

 

[Sttew]

Protests erupt in capital cities over lockdowns and vaccine mandates - ABC listen

Tens of thousands of protestors took to the streets in Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane, Adelaide and Perth at the weekend to vent their anger at lockdowns and vaccine mandates. The demonstrations are part of a global movement of so-called 'freedom rallies', with the largest turn-out in Melbourne...

www.abc.net.au

Point taken... for this weekend, but can anyone tell me why Melbourne has had weekly protests for two months? Have the other cities had weekly protests?

 

[Crankyhawk]

So just to be clear you saying the fight for Indigenous Sovereignty, Land back etc is just feelings and not real?
Or are you talking about non Indigenous people agreeing with the above?

I'm saying that the First Nations trying to fight for soverignity is real and aiming to get land back is real. To them. But it is not important to mainstream and may (depending on how it is worded/ enacted) actively disenfranchise non First Nations people. Hence you get partisan opposition and presto - culture war.

 

[Gralin]

I'm saying that the First Nations trying to fight for soverignity is real and aiming to get land back is real. To them. But it is not important to mainstream and may (depending on how it is worded/ enacted) actively disenfranchise non First Nations people. Hence you get partisan opposition and presto - culture war.

yeah but its not a lef/right thing for Indigenous people, its happening all over the world though, not just here

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

if you're not leaving when the gallows and hang Andrew's chant comes out it's on you for being lumped in with the extremists

we've seen plenty of protestors say they aren't extremists but they've not denounced the extremists or distanced themselves from them, more just pretended its a beat up from the left and the media

Why should they leave if they're there for a legitimate purpose? You'd just look at it, say, that's a bit OTT, and walk on. As most people would have. It is a beat up, come on, the media love it.

 

[Turnover]

Part 6. Keeping up with dans lockdowns.

 

[Sttew]

Oh bullshit.

People were showing up with nooses.

Peaceful protest, my arse. 98% ordinary peaceful family people, my arse. I got off a train at Parliament on Saturday afternoon and the flag wavers hanging around that part of the city are nothing short of human garbage. My wife and I got harassed for the crime of wearing a mask whilst coming out of Parliament Station.

Stop defending them.

How big was the crowd in Melbourne on Saturday?

What percentage are you estimating are/were extremists?

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Why should they leave if they're there for a legitimate purpose? You'd just look at it, say, that's a bit OTT, and walk on. As most people would have. It is a beat up, come on, the media love it.

Problem is, they all cheered when the gallows arrived. 'Hang Dan Andrews' etc.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

How big was the crowd in Melbourne on Saturday?

What percentage are you estimating are/were extremists?

More than the 2% you are claiming.

 

[Sttew]

Were gallows taken along? Had death threats been made against pollies and their families?

The CFMEU protest/riots were arguably the worst we have seen in Melbourne. Full stop. I have no idea if any props like gallows were used, or whether threats were made against pollies. But Police had to use pepper spray and RUBBER BULLETS to quell the violence of the CFMEU riots, which saw cars vandalised, journalists assaulted and fights erupt in Melbourne's streets. And you're implying they were not as bad as the recent protests?

 

[Sttew]

More than the 2% you are claiming.

How many people were at the protest on Saturday and what % do you estimate were extremists? More than 2% isn't an answer because that could mean 2.1% or 90%

 

[Crankyhawk]

Do we know if we’re reporting hospitalisations similar to ICU cases? Where if the case has been cleared of Covid but still in ICU, it’s counted in it’s on seperate statistic. I wonder if there are more in hospital due to Covid but no longer counted in the official number.

OK, having a look now

On the dedicated COVID wards (currently 2 wards, 30 current patients, bed capacity 39 total)
- 7 are deemed clear but still in hospital for other reasons
- 3 are more than day 10 of infection but less than day 14 and still have respiratory Sx (so I'm not sure whether they count as clear or not, suspect not counted as clear as the 7 deemed clear there is a big message on their file saying they are clear)
- ICU have 4 active covid patients and 3 cleared patients
- theres 1 other patient who was covid but moved to a different ward now cleared

So that gives 24 - 27 active cases and 12 cleared cases who went to hospital due to COVID.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

How many people were at the protest on Saturday and what % do you estimate were extremists? More than 2% isn't an answer because that could mean 2.1% or 90%

What I know is that my wife and I were minding our own business when harassed by a group of sovereign citizens not wearing masks, draped in Australian flags walking through Parliament station. And they weren't the ones outside swinging nooses around looking for a lynching.

But you are the one claiming that 98% of those there were peaceful, reasonable people. Not me. So it's up to you to provide your numbers. Not me. Is it acceptable that my wife and I were approached and yelled at by the people you are defending?

 

[Crankyhawk]

yeah but its not a lef/right thing for Indigenous people, its happening all over the world though, not just here

So then the left part of my comment (which you did also ask and state) is the political leanings of the non first nations people who support/ sympathise with those objectives. At least to my perception. It might not be correct.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

The CFMEU protest/riots were arguably the worst we have seen in Melbourne. Full stop. I have no idea if any props like gallows were used, or whether threats were made against pollies. But Police had to use pepper spray and RUBBER BULLETS to quell the violence of the CFMEU riots, which saw cars vandalised, journalists assaulted and fights erupt in Melbourne's streets. And you're implying they were not as bad as the recent protests?

You said that Dan Andrews said nothing. Surely actions speak louder than words. Don't the Police work for him?

You make a lot of nonsense claims and from what I can see can't back any of them up.

Did your mate Morrison denounce those carrying gallows to the more recent protests? Why shouldn't Andrews call him out on it? It's just the sort of divisive politics you and your mob relish. Pathetic.

 

[adogsfan5]

You said that Dan Andrews said nothing. Surely actions speak louder than words. Don't the Police work for him?

You make a lot of nonsense claims and from what I can see can't back any of them up.

Did your mate Morrison denounce those carrying gallows to the more recent protests? Why shouldn't Andrews call him out on it? It's just the sort of divisive politics you and your mob relish. Pathetic.

Cryptkeeper! Long time no see!

 

[sherb]

I mean there's much in what he(?) says there that I broadly agree with.

If prison reform is what he's advocating. I wholeheartedly agree. It still chills me when a couple of years ago one of mine got sent to the slammer (no saint). He had a heart condition.

We asked that he be given his medication. The prisons said only what is prescribed by the prison doctor. The judge said, very pointedly, to the prison officer "You make sure he sees a doctor and is prescribed the necessary medication TODAY."

"Of course" was the answer.

He didn't see a doctor that day or the next, suffered a massive heart attack on the third day, and died 2 weeks later shackled to a hospital bed. No consequences for the prison.

That's just awful. I'm so sorry.

 

[sherb]

The CFMEU protest/riots were arguably the worst we have seen in Melbourne. Full stop. I have no idea if any props like gallows were used, or whether threats were made against pollies. But Police had to use pepper spray and RUBBER BULLETS to quell the violence of the CFMEU riots, which saw cars vandalised, journalists assaulted and fights erupt in Melbourne's streets. And you're implying they were not as bad as the recent protests?

No, I'm not implying that at all.

I'm saying that gallows/death threats up the ante in a personal way against politicians and I would fully expect politicians (especially those targeted) to comment as a result.

 

[sherb]

Did your mate Morrison denounce those carrying gallows to the more recent protests? Why shouldn't Andrews call him out on it? It's just the sort of divisive politics you and your mob relish. Pathetic.

I'll bet Morrison would denounce gallows if they were brought to a protest against him and/or his government.

 

[Sttew]

You said that Dan Andrews said nothing. Surely actions speak louder than words. Don't the Police work for him?

You make a lot of nonsense claims and from what I can see can't back any of them up.

Did your mate Morrison denounce those carrying gallows to the more recent protests? Why shouldn't Andrews call him out on it? It's just the sort of divisive politics you and your mob relish. Pathetic.

Why don't you answer my questions? You have avoided them twice. How many people attended the protests on Saturday and what % were extremists?

Andrews didn't denounce the CFMEU rioters on the day. But he came out next day spoke for 15 seconds saying "it wasn't on" and then said he was busy and couldn't take any questions. Very weak leadership.

And yes, it does seem the Police work for Dan. There ought to be separation between government and the Police force, but seemingly Police could be told by the Andrews government not to interview ministers and investigate potential wrongdoings of ministers in relation to the red shirt scandal.

Scomo is not my mate, but he has denounced violence and extremists. He also respects the rights of ordinary citizens jacked off with authoritarian governments like the Andrews government

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Why don't you answer my questions? You have avoided them twice. How many people attended the protests on Saturday and what % were extremists?

20k attended, 10% extremists.

It was organised by the extremists.

 

[Sttew]

I'll bet Morrison would denounce gallows if they were brought to a protest against him and/or his government.

He's already denounced use of gallows and threats, as anyone would/should. But that does not mean everyone at protests should be tainted by the same brush as the extremists, does it?

 

[sherb]

How many people were at the protest on Saturday and what % do you estimate were extremists? More than 2% isn't an answer because that could mean 2.1% or 90%

Try making that argument regarding BLM rallies/protests in the USA to a right-winger.

If you listened to a RW person, you'd think those protests had been 100%, looting, rampaging, violent, property damaging, fire lighting riots with not a decent, peaceful protestor to be found anywhere.

Off topic I know, but I just found your assessment interesting in that regard.