Recommitted Josh Dunkley [contracted and staying at the Western Bulldogs]

[Lore]

2020 discussion here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-requested-a-trade-to-essendon.1250264/unread

*2021 discussion here*

 

[JayJ20]

Assuming this season is as average as most Essendon fans think, and I assume the club as they were desperate to keep next years first. Let’s say pick 5. Does anyone think they come back in for him next year? It would cost at the very least the hypothetical very good 2021 first they were so keen on keeping this year and a bit more.
If Essendon do better than anticipated I’d expect them to be all over him if he’s still up for it.

Yeah I think we will if he is keen. Depends on what type of year Dunkley has and what type of year we have. If we win the spoon (highly doubt it), then we probably won't. If we make finals (again doubt it), then we'll probably go all out to get him provided he has a decent year. If we finish 10th-16th, then I think we'd only do it for the right price.

Considering the Davey twins are coming in 2022 (with one possibly a first rounder), we'd look to trade our first for a 2021 first. Merrett will most likely leave if we have an average year, so that's a first round compensation. If we finish 15th, then we'd have pick 4 and pick 5 + another first in that scenario. More than happy to give Bulldogs 5 for Dunkley unless he has a disappointing year.

 

[Bulldogs85]

Yeah I think we will if he is keen. Depends on what type of year Dunkley has and what type of year we have. If we win the spoon (highly doubt it), then we probably won't. If we make finals (again doubt it), then we'll probably go all out to get him provided he has a decent year. If we finish 10th-16th, then I think we'd only do it for the right price.

Considering the Davey twins are coming in 2022 (with one possibly a first rounder), we'd look to trade our first for a 2021 first. Merrett will most likely leave if we have an average year, so that's a first round compensation. If we finish 15th, then we'd have pick 4 and pick 5 + another first in that scenario. More than happy to give Bulldogs 5 for Dunkley unless he has a disappointing year.

You might be more then happy to give up pick 5 for Dunkley but I highly doubt that Dodoro would he would want Dunkley + our first rounder for pick 5 lol

 

[Northernsoul74]

Yeah I think we will if he is keen. Depends on what type of year Dunkley has and what type of year we have. If we win the spoon (highly doubt it), then we probably won't. If we make finals (again doubt it), then we'll probably go all out to get him provided he has a decent year. If we finish 10th-16th, then I think we'd only do it for the right price.

Considering the Davey twins are coming in 2022 (with one possibly a first rounder), we'd look to trade our first for a 2021 first. Merrett will most likely leave if we have an average year, so that's a first round compensation. If we finish 15th, then we'd have pick 4 and pick 5 + another first in that scenario. More than happy to give Bulldogs 5 for Dunkley unless he has a disappointing year.

I didn’t think about potential Merrett compo. I’m expecting your pick to be right around the sweet spot on making it a difficult decision to give up but if you have 2 of them it could be on.

 

[Yoda_]

Hence my question if they wouldn’t pay this year I can’t see them paying next year. It was a very weird move on both Essendons and Dunkleys as it’s not clear how it could ever have happened. No criticism of Essendon as the price was extortionate but I just don’t get how it ever got to the point where a player asked for the trade.

With so much collateral built up in the 2020 draft, we’d hoped that would get the job done. Never mind the fact that Sammy Power wanted greater compensation than Lachie Meale, Adam Treloar, Dylan Shiel.

As has been mooted several times, we apparently had a third party lined up to help accomodate a trade but it fell over and we were left with egg on our face.

I don’t mind we didn’t bow to the Dogs demands, Josh is a nice player and all but is he a genuine top 10 player in the comp for the sort of price being asked? No. Not even in the Dogs best 3 mids.

Missing Josh has given us a chance to hit the draft, fill other places on the list and hold a (predicted) very good pick in a midfield heavy draft in 2021.


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[Hoges64]

With so much collateral built up in the 2020 draft, we’d hoped that would get the job done. Never mind the fact that Sammy Power wanted greater compensation than Lachie Meale, Adam Treloar, Dylan Shiel.

As has been mooted several times, we apparently had a third party lined up to help accomodate a trade but it fell over and we were left with egg on our face.

I don’t mind we didn’t bow to the Dogs demands, Josh is a nice player and all but is he a genuine top 10 player in the comp for the sort of price being asked? No. Not even in the Dogs best 3 mids.

Missing Josh has given us a chance to hit the draft, fill other places on the list and hold a (predicted) very good pick in a midfield heavy draft in 2021.


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I give up. Honestly.

 

[Mofra]

Yeah I think we will if he is keen. Depends on what type of year Dunkley has and what type of year we have. If we win the spoon (highly doubt it), then we probably won't. If we make finals (again doubt it), then we'll probably go all out to get him provided he has a decent year. If we finish 10th-16th, then I think we'd only do it for the right price.

Considering the Davey twins are coming in 2022 (with one possibly a first rounder), we'd look to trade our first for a 2021 first. Merrett will most likely leave if we have an average year, so that's a first round compensation. If we finish 15th, then we'd have pick 4 and pick 5 + another first in that scenario. More than happy to give Bulldogs 5 for Dunkley unless he has a disappointing year.

That might work from Essendon's perspective - the Z Merrett compo would be a decent starting point for negotiations, then noting the Davey twins we start talking about a 2022 pick swap that costs Essendon zero points but moves us up the order. Might be able to fashion a win/win trade

 

[Bulldogs85]

With so much collateral built up in the 2020 draft, we’d hoped that would get the job done. Never mind the fact that Sammy Power wanted greater compensation than Lachie Meale, Adam Treloar, Dylan Shiel.

As has been mooted several times, we apparently had a third party lined up to help accomodate a trade but it fell over and we were left with egg on our face.

I don’t mind we didn’t bow to the Dogs demands, Josh is a nice player and all but is he a genuine top 10 player in the comp for the sort of price being asked? No. Not even in the Dogs best 3 mids.

Missing Josh has given us a chance to hit the draft, fill other places on the list and hold a (predicted) very good pick in a midfield heavy draft in 2021.


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Sam power said from day one he ever wanted a 3rd party involved

 

[JayJ20]

You might be more then happy to give up pick 5 for Dunkley but I highly doubt that Dodoro would he would want Dunkley + our first rounder for pick 5 lol

It depends on what type of year Dunkley has. If he has a good year, then it's not a debate. If he is still not selected in Bulldogs' first choice midfield, then I don't think we'll give up a top 5 pick.

I didn’t think about potential Merrett compo. I’m expecting your pick to be right around the sweet spot on making it a difficult decision to give up but if you have 2 of them it could be on.

It's straight forward if we finish bottom 4 or if we finish top 8, but the difficult decision comes if we finish between that. Say Dunkley has an AA year, polls well in the brownlow and we finish 12th. Do we give up two firsts? Do we back our list and take Dunkley? That would be a difficult call because Essendon supporters would be putting pressure on Dodoro and the club to take the picks to the draft.

I think we'll chase Dunkley if we lose Merrett. If we keep Merrett, then it depends on where we finish. It's unlikely we give up a top 4 pick without finding another first somewhere unless Dunkley has a crazy good year, but that increases the likelihood of Bulldogs keeping him. If he has an average year, then it's unlikely we give up a high first round pick, but we may still be willing to give a mid first-round if we finish high enough.

Nevertheless, our strategy of drafting KPPs + Perkins tells me we're keeping a spot for Dunkley open. Signing Kyle is probably another indication we're considering him.

That might work from Essendon's perspective - the Z Merrett compo would be a decent starting point for negotiations, then noting the Davey twins we start talking about a 2022 pick swap that costs Essendon zero points but moves us up the order. Might be able to fashion a win/win trade

Yeah we're in a better position to get a deal done this year. It all depends on where we finish, what happens to Merrett and what type of year Dunkley has.

 

[TheKITC]

It depends on what type of year Dunkley has. If he has a good year, then it's not a debate. If he is still not selected in Bulldogs' first choice midfield, then I don't think we'll give up a top 5 pick.

I think we'll chase Dunkley if we lose Merrett. If we keep Merrett, then it depends on where we finish. It's unlikely we give up a top 4 pick without finding another first somewhere unless Dunkley has a crazy good year, but that increases the likelihood of Bulldogs keeping him. If he has an average year, then it's unlikely we give up a high first round pick, but we may still be willing to give a mid first-round if we finish high enough...

Yeah we're in a better position to get a deal done this year. It all depends on where we finish, what happens to Merrett and what type of year Dunkley has.

Why are you seemingly pretending that Essendon hold all of the cards?

Dunkley still has a contract for another year after this one. Regardless of what kind of year he has, a mid-first round pick is clearly not getting it done for a contracted JD, end of story.

Its been said as nauseum, you either pay the asking price from the club he has years on his contract with or you don't. The Doggies have every right to put whatever price they want on a contracted player; whether anyone else thinks it's low, high or fair really has no bearing. Anything else is just fluff.

 

[JayJ20]

Why are you seemingly pretending that Essendon hold all of the cards?

Dunkley still has a contract for another year after this one. Regardless of what kind of year he has, a mid-first round pick is clearly not getting it done for a contracted JD, end of story.

Its been said as nauseum, you either pay the asking price from the club he has years on his contract with or you don't. The Doggies have every right to put whatever price they want on a contracted player; whether anyone else thinks it's low, high or fair really has no bearing. Anything else is just fluff.

It's unlikely we give up a top 4 pick without finding another first somewhere unless Dunkley has a crazy good year, but that increases the likelihood of Bulldogs keeping him. If he has an average year, then it's unlikely we give up a high first round pick, but we may still be willing to give a mid first-round if we finish high enough.

I literally mentioned Bulldogs keeping him in the sentence before. When did I say Essendon holds all the cards? I'm only saying what Essendon would likely want to give, not what Bulldogs would accept.

If Dunkley has another average year, then there's no way Essendon give up a top 5 pick. He'll stay at Bulldogs if that's what they request.
If he has a good year, then I can see Essendon paying up. Fairly straight forward.

 

[TheKITC]

I literally mentioned Bulldogs keeping him in the sentence before. When did I say Essendon holds all the cards? I'm only saying what Essendon would likely want to give, not what Bulldogs would accept.

If Dunkley has another average year, then there's no way Essendon give up a top 5 pick. He'll stay at Bulldogs if that's what they request.
If he has a good year, then I can see Essendon paying up. Fairly straight forward.

Your post infers it (as I said) by even mentioning things like "still be willing to give a mid first-round" and being in a better position to get the deal done in 2021 and "it all depends on where we finish, what happens to Merrett and what type of year Dunkley has." None of that really matters, because a mid first is 100% not getting the deal done and what kind of year JD has or what Essendon wants to give is not relevant. The price is either met or it isn't and I cannot see the Dogs changing their mind given he will still be contracted, just like Carlton did with Gibbs.

I don't have a direct quote, but I'm pretty sure the asking price from the WB equated to more than a top 5 pick, so if you're banking on that being enough I think you and other fans will be disappointed again.

 

[JayJ20]

Your post infers it (as I said) by even mentioning things like "still be willing to give a mid first-round" and being in a better position to get the deal done in 2021 and "it all depends on where we finish, what happens to Merrett and what type of year Dunkley has." None of that really matters, because a mid first is 100% not getting the deal done and what kind of year JD has or what Essendon wants to give is not relevant. The price is either met or it isn't and I cannot see the Dogs changing their mind given he will still be contracted, just like Carlton did with Gibbs.

I don't have a direct quote, but I'm pretty sure the asking price from the WB equated to more than a top 5 pick, so if you're banking on that being enough I think you and other fans will be disappointed again.

I'm really not getting into a circular argument about this.

 

[La Dispute]

I think it's more a case after a year the Bulldogs would be more open to letting him go, pending his form and how he fits into their overall structure going forward. His best position is clearly playing as an inside midfielder, but he may still not get the minutes he'd like with all of Bontempelli, Macrae, Treloar, Liberatore and Smith in the team. Next to Bontempelli he's the most capable forward, so he might be used a fair bit off a flank.

It's a good situation for the Bulldogs to be in. Use 2021 to assess their squad with Treloar, and if they believe Dunkley is expendable they'll be well compensated, provided Essendon follow through this time around.

 

[Northernsoul74]

I think it's more a case after a year the Bulldogs would be more open to letting him go, pending his form and how he fits into their overall structure going forward. His best position is clearly playing as an inside midfielder, but he may still not get the minutes he'd like with all of Bontempelli, Macrae, Treloar, Liberatore and Smith in the team. Next to Bontempelli he's the most capable forward, so he might be used a fair bit off a flank.

It's a good situation for the Bulldogs to be in. Use 2021 to assess their squad with Treloar, and if they believe Dunkley is expendable they'll be well compensated, provided Essendon follow through this time around.

Yep but the price isn’t going to drop from 2 good 1st rounders to 1 mid first rounder.

 

[La Dispute]

Yep but the price isn’t going to drop from 2 good 1st rounders to 1 mid first rounder.

It'd be the Merrett compensation pick plus a future with something like a second going back IMO.

 

[Virgin Dog]

If nothing else changed, I'm sure we'd be more likely to let Dunkley go this year than we were last year.

Problem is, if anything at all is to happen to Libba, who has been injury prone his whole career, it changes everything. Smith and Treloar are, for the most part, one way runners, while Lipinski has absolutely no defensive game. We need the more defensively minded mids to balance things out.

Losing Libba and Dunkley in a single offseason is absolutely not an option. A Libba retirement or ACL makes Dunkley absolutely untradeable unless someone like West sees dramatic improvement this year and solidifies his spot in the side

 

[La Dispute]

If nothing else changed, I'm sure we'd be more likely to let Dunkley go this year than we were last year.

Problem is, if anything at all is to happen to Libba, who has been injury prone his whole career, it changes everything. Smith and Treloar are, for the most part, one way runners, while Lipinski has absolutely no defensive game. We need the more defensively minded mids to balance things out.

Losing Libba and Dunkley in a single offseason is absolutely not an option. A Libba retirement or ACL makes Dunkley absolutely untradeable unless someone like West sees dramatic improvement this year and solidifies his spot in the side

Is Smith's defensive game fixable though? You'd think the Bulldogs midfield is stacked even if you remove someone like Dunkley, and West looks like the kind of guy you can back to be a solid B-grade inside midfielder to replace Liberatore.

Could be a really smart piece of trading if you can obtain a couple of high picks for a guy who isn't going to make or break the squad (IMO). I've always liked Dunkley as a player, but there's still an oversupply of quality ballwinners even when you look at the worse case scenario.

 

[JayJ20]

Yep but the price isn’t going to drop from 2 good 1st rounders to 1 mid first rounder.

Do you think he's worth a top 5 pick if he has a bad year? Bulldogs can demand, but I highly doubt we'd say yes. He'd just remain a Bulldogs player until he is out of contract.

Form will dictate how much clubs are willing to give. If he is AA, then two good firsts no questions asked. If he is injured and out of form, then no one is handing over a top 5 pick. Bulldogs will choose whether or not it's worth trading him.

Daniher, who is a KPF mind you, went from two firsts to pick 7 and we were very lucky we received that. If we finished any higher, we'd have received a mid-first for him in a weak draft. Our bad year essentially saved us.

If nothing else changed, I'm sure we'd be more likely to let Dunkley go this year than we were last year.

Problem is, if anything at all is to happen to Libba, who has been injury prone his whole career, it changes everything. Smith and Treloar are, for the most part, one way runners, while Lipinski has absolutely no defensive game. We need the more defensively minded mids to balance things out.

Losing Libba and Dunkley in a single offseason is absolutely not an option. A Libba retirement or ACL makes Dunkley absolutely untradeable unless someone like West sees dramatic improvement this year and solidifies his spot in the side

Yep I agree. Bulldogs will weigh up how expendable he is. Any injuries and he becomes a required player. I'd even add to it and say Dunkley's year will dictate how willing Bulldogs are. If he is AA and polls well in the brownlow, then Bulldogs would be crazy to trade him unless Essendon give them an offer they can't refuse.

 

[Virgin Dog]

Is Smith's defensive game fixable though? You'd think the Bulldogs midfield is stacked even if you remove someone like Dunkley, and West looks like the kind of guy you can back to be a solid B-grade inside midfielder to replace Liberatore.

Could be a really smart piece of trading if you can obtain a couple of high picks for a guy who isn't going to make or break the squad (IMO). I've always liked Dunkley as a player, but there's still an oversupply of quality ballwinners even when you look at the worse case scenario.

I think Smith can fix it - the kid is as rough as anyone, just has a tendency to only run forward. He's far from soft so you'd think the defensive aspect could be coached into him. Problem is if we don't.

I'm confident in West becoming a good long term midfielder. Kid plays at full intensity at all times, and showed some incredible glimpses of his inside work in the limited games he's played so far. If Smith develops his defensive game, or if West is performing as a consistent member of the 22, then I'd be fine with milking Dunkley for all he's worth at the trade table.

I'd have been filthy if we accepted that offer of 8 + 27 last year, but this time around it may be a little more bearable. Still would hope for more, but only if we spin it into a player rather than taking the picks to the draft

 

[Bulldogs85]

Who is to say if Josh Dunkley

5

Josh Dunkley

Age

27

Ht

191cm

Wt

87kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.8

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.3

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

3.2

5star

D

20.7

5star

K

7.0

3star

HB

13.7

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

5.3

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

14.2

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

7.0

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

4.0

5star

CL

1.4

4star

wanted out again this year he will request a trade to Essendon. He could very well do what Josh Caddy

22

Josh Caddy

Age

31

Ht

186cm

Wt

87kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.0

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

7.8

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

3.5

5star

CL

2.5

4star

D

13.5

3star

K

7.5

3star

HB

6.0

3star

M

4.8

4star

T

1.5

2star

CL

0.7

3star

D

14.0

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

4.0

3star

M

4.2

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

1.8

4star

did all those years ago and request a trade to a different Melbourne club

 

[Northernsoul74]

Do you think he's worth a top 5 pick if he has a bad year? Bulldogs can demand, but I highly doubt we'd say yes. He'd just remain a Bulldogs player until he is out of contract.

Form will dictate how much clubs are willing to give. If he is AA, then two good firsts no questions asked. If he is injured and out of form, then no one is handing over a top 5 pick. Bulldogs will choose whether or not it's worth trading him.

Daniher, who is a KPF mind you, went from two firsts to pick 7 and we were very lucky we received that. If we finished any higher, we'd have received a mid-first for him in a weak draft. Our bad year essentially saved us.

Yep I agree. Bulldogs will weigh up how expendable he is. Any injuries and he becomes a required player. I'd even add to it and say Dunkley's year will dictate how willing Bulldogs are. If he is AA and polls well in the brownlow, then Bulldogs would be crazy to trade him unless Essendon give them an offer they can't refuse.

No doubt if he’s poor that sinks his value but if he has “a bad year” would you still want him and still would you still be offering to double his salary?

 

[JayJ20]

Who to say if Josh Dunkley wanted out again this year he will request a trade to Essendon. He could very well do what Josh Caddy did all those years ago and request a trade to a different Melbourne club

That's correct, but we're discussing what Essendon/Bulldogs would do if Dunkley wants to go to Essendon.

FWIW, I think he's more likely to stay at Bulldogs. Bulldogs will be more conscious of giving him time in the middle and he'll be happy again. The hub really exacerbated any problems players had so I don't think his trade request means he is fixated on leaving.

 

[JayJ20]

No doubt if he’s poor that sinks his value but if he has “a bad year” would you still want him and still would you still be offering to double his salary?

I say we'd still be interested, but only for the right price.
We do have a lot of space in our salary cap especially if Merrett leaves so salary wouldn't be an issue. I don't think we'd be offering anything crazy though. We didn't even offer him crazy money last time so I doubt we'd increase our offer if he has a poor year.

 

[La Dispute]

No doubt if he’s poor that sinks his value but if he has “a bad year” would you still want him and still would you still be offering to double his salary?

It's a bit of a catch 22, but ultimately if he has a year like 2020 it'd be based on being unable to play his natural role and at that point you'd rather he requests a trade while he's contracted than wait until he's a free agent. I'd bank on him being worth more at the end of 2021 than 2022.

 

[Virgin Dog]

Who is to say if Josh Dunkley wanted out again this year he will request a trade to Essendon. He could very well do what Josh Caddy did all those years ago and request a trade to a different Melbourne club

That is true, we're all just discussing the prospect of an Essendon trade scenario again. There's every chance that a club like Richmond, with Cotchin retirement on the horizon, could come after him. Geelong may like him as a Selwood replacement (not only as a player but as a leader too). Carlton may like him too, and he'd instantly bring their midfield from B-grade (good, but not outstanding) to among the best in the competition. The only Victorian clubs that he truly would not suit at all would be Melbourne and North, who have abundance of inside grunt and a lack of quality outside run and good users (which are not strengths of Dunkley). There's a lot of great opportunities for Dunks if he doesn't get the role he wants with us in 2021, and I'm sure he'd have many suitors. All we know right now is that Essendon made their interest clear, and who is to say that interest will wane at all over the course of this season?

If all bridges are not yet burned between the Dunkley family and Sydney, there's always that chance too. I could not think of a more perfect Josh Kennedy replacement, they're a team presumably on the rise with some exciting youth, and will have bulk cap space once the Franklin contract ends