Preview Preview and Discussion Round 2 Hawthorn v Melbourne

[Taskmaster]

One thing I do know is that Bailey has to play. Its now or never, how long to we keep him in cotton wool. An 80% Bailey is 100% better than the spud (Renouf).

The sooner Renouf is out of the side the sooner our ruck division, will function.

Definate in = Hodge, Bailey

Outs = Birchall, Osbourne, Renouf, Ladson

Others to consider:

Puopolo, Smith, Cheney, Guerra, Murphy, Litherland, Lisle.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

We'll still play 3 of Whitecross, Shiels, Savage and Suckling.

One of those will go out, with Hodge coming in.

Then I think one of Ladson or Ozzie will get the chop to make way for Ellis.


My thinking is that we'll keep a few spots in the side to rotate the youth. (probably 3 is ideal, but we pushed it out to four because the guys had trained well, performed well presason and Hodge/Guerra were underdone.

Also think that Ellis will be rewarded for a good box hill showing from the reports I've read.

 

[Turly]

We'll still play 3 of Whitecross, Shiels, Savage and Suckling.

One of those will go out, with Hodge coming in.

Then I think one of Ladson or Ozzie will get the chop to make way for Ellis.


My thinking is that we'll keep a few spots in the side to rotate the youth. (probably 3 is ideal, but we pushed it out to four because the guys had trained well, performed well presason and Hodge/Guerra were underdone.

Also think that Ellis will be rewarded for a good box hill showing from the reports I've read.

I get the feeling your on the money with this speculation mate. Sooner or later the younger boys that are performing need to get a shot and I think we are finally seeing this now.

Savage and Shiels MUST stay in the side this week, they were awesome against the crows, thought they were to of the better players for us. Also really hoping suckers gets another gig this week, I saw a much improved player on saturday night and surely he deserves another chance.

Hodgey should be right to go this week, but the one I wanna see come up against his old side is cheney. He was pretty impressive from what i saw at the nab challenge games and especially at skilled against north, probably won't happen but I hope it does.

 

[Cynic]

Think Murphy would be a good inclusion against Melbourne. Lots of medium/small forwards for him to play on.

 

[Hawkhead#2]

Here's my team v Melb:

Ladson, Gilham, Suckling
Gibson, Stratton, Ellis
Savage, Mitchell, Young
Burgoyne, Franklin, Rioli
Guerra, Roughead, Hale
Renouf, Sewell, Hodge

Int: Shiels, Bruce, Lewis (Birchall)

In: Hodge, Ellis, Guerra
Out: Osbourne, Whitecross, Bateman

On the showing against the Crows, Shiels, Savage and Suckling deserve to keep their place in the team. Lewis, Roughead, Renouf, Bateman and Osbourne were poor and their spot should be reviewed, but Clarko loves Lewis. Dropping some players will remind them that their place in team must be earned - it is not a God given right since the '08 GF!

With Rioli spending more time on the ball, the Hawks need a small fwd (where is Hooper when you need him!). Guerra is comfortable with this role (Port, St Kilda) and played there last week for Box Hill. He will also provide defensive pressure in the fwd line.

Murphy is really stiff, but I just can't fit him in the team this week! Really good place to be compared to '09 when we struggled to get fit players on the park.

Players to potentially be dropped before the bye: Bateman, Osbourne, Birchall, Lewis, Roughead, Bruce, Gilham and Renouf.
Players to potentially come into the team before the bye: Bailey, Murphy, Cheney, Puopolo, Milne, Lisle and Smith (and Shoey if he gets his achilles right).

 

[Jaeger]

Think Murphy would be a good inclusion against Melbourne. Lots of medium/small forwards for him to play on.

Agreed.

Jurrah, Petterd, Bate and Maric could be a handful.

Can't remember who played on Jurrah last year.

Gibson on Jurrah

Gilham on Petterd

Ladson/Puopolo on Maric

Guerra on Bate

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

I know it's only round 2, but we really can't afford to start the season 0-2. This match will tell us a lot about where we are at as a club this year I think. We have come off a potentially dispiriting loss to Adelaide and it would be very easy to come out a bit flat this week.

We are almost at full strength on paper and it's really time for some of these boys to stand up and earn their paychecks. I am looking forward to this match and hope we can string together a consistent 4 quarter performance.

 

[Goody1971]

If we lose this one then Richmond will seriously think they have a good chance of beating us in round 3...

 

[HAWKSFAN]

I know it's only round 2, but we really can't afford to start the season 0-2. This match will tell us a lot about where we are at as a club this year I think. We have come off a potentially dispiriting loss to Adelaide and it would be very easy to come out a bit flat this week.

We are almost at full strength on paper and it's really time for some of these boys to stand up and earn their paychecks. I am looking forward to this match and hope we can string together a consistent 4 quarter performance.

0-2 with a near full strength side = s**t HITTING THE FAN...

If we are to be real top 4 contenders this year, we'll blow them away!!

 

[footycouch]

If we see ourselves as a top 8 side it is a must win.

You started last year horribly and still made top 8 and even if you do lose on Sunday you probably still will make finals. But it's still a game you hate to lose especially at this stage of the season

 

[Rioli magic]

One thing I do know is that Bailey has to play. Its now or never, how long to we keep him in cotton wool. An 80% Bailey is 100% better than the spud (Renouf).

The sooner Renouf is out of the side the sooner our ruck division, will function.

Definate in = Hodge, Bailey

On what grounds is Bailey currently ahead of Renouf apart from you want him to be?

Certainly hasn't shown it at AFL level, and currently isn't fit enough to run out a VFL practice match.

 

[footycouch]

I remember that match last year, and if i remember correctly the margin almost flattered the Dees, you completely smashed them

 

[spudmaster]

Agreed.

Jurrah, Petterd, Bate and Maric could be a handful.

Can't remember who played on Jurrah last year.

Gibson on Jurrah

Gilham on Petterd

Ladson/Puopolo on Maric

Guerra on Bate

Just having a read through some old notes Shepp

Last year round1 (haven't got the round20 notes on me at the minute)

Birchall played on Petterd and kept him scoreless, while Birch racked up 27 touches himself.

Gibson played on bate and Gibbo got 22 touches while Bate was largely ineffective.

Murphy played on Davey and kept him goalless

Suckling played on Dunn

Gilham played on Spencer and kept him goalless (Gilham played on Jurrah in the second meeting, Jurrah kicked 2.0)

From the looks of things we beat them all over the ground and stopped the ball even getting into their forward 50 which will have helped the defenders immensely.

Interesting to note the players that played that day - Brown, Hooper, Moss, Peterson, JKT who are now gone.

One thing we don't have to worry about is Bruce being one of, if not the best, for Melbourne. Both games last year he played well - the first he played on Ozzy and while Ozzy snagged 2 goals, Bruce otherwise won the contest. He then tagged Hodge in the round 20 match and kept him to 19 disposals and 2 goals, while racking up 26 touches himself.

In the round20 match which was considerably closer - fairly even until the final quarter, where the Hawks picked it up a notch

Rivers went to Roughy and kept him to two
Frawley kept Buddy to 3 (22 touches also for Bud)
Burgers picked up the intensity in the final quarter and was a big factor in us breaking away
Hodgey snared his 2 goals in the final quarter as well
X finished with 20 touches and 3 goals - bring him in!

Jamar won the hitouts against Reno and Skipper, but they each finished with 22 and 19 hitouts respectively, so we weren't completely smashed.

If nothing else, having Bruce not playing against us is a big plus as he's done well in the past either as a shutdown role on a goalsneak or as a tagger on our captain.

 

[Off The Couch]

If we lose this one then Richmond will seriously think they have a good chance of beating us in round 3...

That will be disappointing - I rarely get to see the hawks play and it's this game we are coming to Melbourne for. Personally I think we showed enough in the first half in Adelaide to think they can go on with the job - they just need to play tempo football.

 

[Jaeger]

Just having a read through some old notes Shepp

Last year round1 (haven't got the round20 notes on me at the minute)

Birchall played on Petterd and kept him scoreless, while Birch racked up 27 touches himself.

Gibson played on bate and Gibbo got 22 touches while Bate was largely ineffective.

Murphy played on Davey and kept him goalless

Suckling played on Dunn

Gilham played on Spencer and kept him goalless (Gilham played on Jurrah in the second meeting, Jurrah kicked 2.0)

From the looks of things we beat them all over the ground and stopped the ball even getting into their forward 50 which will have helped the defenders immensely.

Interesting to note the players that played that day - Brown, Hooper, Moss, Peterson, JKT who are now gone.

One thing we don't have to worry about is Bruce being one of, if not the best, for Melbourne. Both games last year he played well - the first he played on Ozzy and while Ozzy snagged 2 goals, Bruce otherwise won the contest. He then tagged Hodge in the round 20 match and kept him to 19 disposals and 2 goals, while racking up 26 touches himself.

In the round20 match which was considerably closer - fairly even until the final quarter, where the Hawks picked it up a notch

Rivers went to Roughy and kept him to two
Frawley kept Buddy to 3 (22 touches also for Bud)
Burgers picked up the intensity in the final quarter and was a big factor in us breaking away
Hodgey snared his 2 goals in the final quarter as well
X finished with 20 touches and 3 goals - bring him in!

Jamar won the hitouts against Reno and Skipper, but they each finished with 22 and 19 hitouts respectively, so we weren't completely smashed.

If nothing else, having Bruce not playing against us is a big plus as he's done well in the past either as a shutdown role on a goalsneak or as a tagger on our captain.

Great work SM.

Hard to read too much into the round 1 clash last year as Melbourne were deplorable. Much better side now.

Any of your notes on Rd 20 (if you find them) would be greatly appreciated as well.

I guess we will probably match up the same on Sunday since it's worked well in the past.

I forgot to mention Stratton before who could easily account for Petterd, Dunn or Watts.

The midfield match-ups will be interesting too.

Also, not sure if it's been said but I reckon Whitecross has to start this week and not be a sub. Needs the match fitness.

 

[Beandip]

The injury list for Melbourne has some positives for us at least.

Melbourne
Robert Campbell (Achilles) - 6-8 weeks
Troy Davis (thyroid disorder) - ongoing
Jack Fitzpatrick (foot) - test
James Frawley (shoulder) - test
Jeremy Howe (Ankle )- test
Kelvin Lawrence (hand) - test
Jordie McKenzie (groin) - 5 weeks
Cale Morton (hand) - 1 week
Tom Scully (knee) - 3 week

The bolded ones are good outs for us, as I'd I reckon even a broken down Campbell would towel up Renouf (mind you Jamar and Martin will do a fine job of it).
Scully is starting to impact games and show why he was a high pick, Morton is always handy, and Frawley is a solid defender.

 

[Deefence]

whats the chance of hodge playing this weekend?

 

[Turly]

The injury list for Melbourne has some positives for us at least.

Melbourne
Robert Campbell (Achilles) - 6-8 weeks
Troy Davis (thyroid disorder) - ongoing
Jack Fitzpatrick (foot) - test
James Frawley (shoulder) - test
Jeremy Howe (Ankle )- test
Kelvin Lawrence (hand) - test
Jordie McKenzie (groin) - 5 weeks
Cale Morton (hand) - 1 week
Tom Scully (knee) - 3 week

The bolded ones are good outs for us, as I'd I reckon even a broken down Campbell would towel up Renouf (mind you Jamar and Martin will do a fine job of it).
Scully is starting to impact games and show why he was a high pick, Morton is always handy, and Frawley is a solid defender.

Lol Frawley is a gun defender that was rewarded with AA honours last year, I'm hoping he doesn't play. Not that it would make any difference

 

[lethalselbow]

whats the chance of hodge playing this weekend?

Pretty good

 

[lethalselbow]

Whitecross has to have huge question marks against his name. Back to Box Hill I reckon. (About as nice as i could put it... has to go!)

Hopefully Hodge is fit. Would like to see Ellis back into the side as I think it's time he lived up to the hype! Gun player who is ready to shine, but not sure who would come out for him to fit in.

Out: Whitecross
In: Hodge
Pushing: Ellis.

Senior players who need to keep an eye on their game or else: Ozzie, Bateman, Ladson & Lewis.

 

[hawkguru]

4 changes for me + some creative thinking
IMO this is getting close


Pup Gilham Gibson
Hodge Stratton Smith
Young Lewis Savage
Rioli Roughie Bateman
Hale Franklin Shiels

Renouf Burgoyne Mitchell

(I) Sewell WhiteX Ellis Bruce (sub)

(E) Ladson Suckling Guerra Osbourne

Hodge and Pup add some much needed starch to the defense. Hodge at hbf can float across the lines directing the play which he does so well. Can be used for the kick in role too while regaining 100% fitness.
Pup will add some run and carry with pace out of the last line as well as harassing the small melb fwd defensively.
Smith onto the hbf for mine. Some say hes not ready. I think this is the game to let him loose and see what hes got. I believe we have a beauty here lets let him learn on the run. Provides real pace and run out of the back. Able to deliver the ball long as well. Love to se him and Youngie carving thru the middle from opposite sides.
Ellis onto the interchange after reported good match for BH. Versatile enough to be played in a number of roles. Hopefully this applies all season. EARN your spot.

Only other change I'd like to see is Lewis brought back into the center again. I think we are wasting his talents. Hes a good inside mid , hard at the ball and could provide a valuable link between the back and fwds. Hes a good kick and generally makes good decisions. No lack of courage either. Apart from that could give Sammy a much needed spell, maybe a rotational between the 2. Playing in the center will also free him up to create as the play rebounds out our back end.

Bruce to play the sub role as can go back, fwd or mid. Not a gamebreaking role but a stabiliser if he plays to his potential.

Ladson and Suckling stiff to miss but matchups dont suit for this game.

Bailey to replace Renouf eventually.

Overall we add some grunt to the defense, some pace and rebounding out of the back, some creativity and genuine speed thru the center and wings, plus 3 small running/crumbing little guys at the feet of our 3 big targets.

Wont happen i know.....BUT.......Its getting close IMO Thoughts ?

nice lineup mate i would only swap goo 4 wx 4 hardness. i like the idea of smith in hb but he may run out of steam by halftime. i would suggest having him as the sub, his fresh pace would be more than handy 4 us in the last qtr or put him in 20min into the 3rd. we looked dead after halftime and all i can say about renouf is SHIZAHOUSEN!!! cant wait 4 bails

 

[Slattery_20]

On what grounds is Bailey currently ahead of Renouf apart from you want him to be?

Certainly hasn't shown it at AFL level, and currently isn't fit enough to run out a VFL practice match.

I can't help but also feel the expectation of what he can be/will be, is getting a bit confused for exactly what he is right now - essentially a very tall 2nd year (with all the time he's missed) ruck

Exactly like Gumby for us last year, the expectation was that of a 4th year, but he'd spent his entire 2nd & 3rd on the sidelines. Taking him as a 2nd year, he did OK, but it did take 3 or 4 weeks to really get much of a touch in the 1s.

You don't develop when you're not running let alone playing.

 

[Bosk]

In: New gameplan.
Out: Last quarter fadeouts.

 

[TimmehJC"]

I can't help but also feel the expectation of what he can be/will be, is getting a bit confused for exactly what he is right now - essentially a very tall 2nd year (with all the time he's missed) ruck

Exactly like Gumby for us last year, the expectation was that of a 4th year, but he'd spent his entire 2nd & 3rd on the sidelines. Taking him as a 2nd year, he did OK, but it did take 3 or 4 weeks to really get much of a touch in the 1s.

You don't develop when you're not running let alone playing.

Still lurking around here Slatts? Thought you'd be plenty excited with your own boys these days. Fairly right on Bailey though. No need to rush him, and with the sub rule we've gotta be careful. Ideally you'd be bringing him in for 50% game time, but we just can't afford that with this rule. Until he can run out pretty much full games at Box Hill with out any trouble it'll be hard to consider him.

Can't believe how quickly everyone jumped on Renouf. Had a good season last year in difficult circumstances, he is still very young in ruckman terms, and he had a bad game. He'll be fine.

 

[Hodginator]

Looks like Frawley might be back for the Dees.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...against-hawthorn/story-e6frf9jf-1226031250944

Also read on other site that Sewell may be in doubt with his calf injury