St Kilda - surely its rebuild mode

[Righteo]

Got off to a slow start last year as well. Give it a few weeks to see if things improve first. Should be able to iron out some kinks next week against the GC.

Yeah I agree, they had a dreadful start last year and everyone wrote them off but they came charging back in the second half of the season and ended up making the finals. They should definitely keep an eye on the future but I think they have enough quality, especially with Lenny back, to make one last crack at the flag.

They still have a lot of players with considerable finals experience so if they make the finals, and they should, no team should be taking them lightly.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Can only think they've postponed the rebuild for a year due to the weakened draft. Suspect 2012 will be the last year at St.Kilda for a lot of players.

 

[Ed_Gein]

they won't improve on last year i don't think, and you could see it that perhaps maybe the players were deflated after losing the grand final the year before. or maybe it was the rough start to their year last year, that sapped their confidence. i think their premiership window is shut.

 

[PJ Power]

Was at the game today and finished the replay not long ago. At least 2 Saints goals came from non-decisions involving in the back - one where Milne got a Joe The Goose after Kosi rode Surjan into the ground and the one to Clinton Jones after a clear HITB 1 kick upfield. John McCarthy was also pulled down without the ball 35m out straight in front in Q4 which wasn't paid.

s**t happens.

Can't remember a team being second to the ball so often and having to rely on so many turnover goals. It's a cliche, but Port wanted it more. First to the ball more often than not and competed harder in the crucial contests when it mattered.

The bleating over the umpiring creating that result is embarrassing. Contested possessions were comfortably in Port's favour today and throughout the last quarter in particular, Port players wanted the ball much more, were more desperate and more courageous. With two of our best four players to come back in (Gray and Trengove) and another 8-10 "depth" players who can contribute reasonably at AFL level (Logan, Brett Ebert, Lobbe, Renouf, Pittard, Salopek, Banner, Hitchcock, Pfeiffer, Jonas, Moore), it's unlikely that Port will be the basket case that everyone expects them to be again this season.

On topic, the Saints still seem to have a list capable of making top 8. Their best 7 players are virtually on a par with any corresponding group in the competition (Goddard, Hayes, Montagna, Dal Santo, Riewoldt, Milne, Fisher). They will probably have concerns over the class of players ranked 15-22 on any given match day, but I seem to recall that also being a concern in 2009/2010. Probably need both more height and rebound in defence although their undersized backmen did quite well against Port's tall forward line today. Gram, Schneider and Gwilt will be important additions to their side in weeks to come.

 

[cynical]

should have been rebuilding midway through last year

they are way off the top sides

compare them to geelong over the past few years

the saints had a very good core and a gameplan that helped them get the jump on most teams in 2009, their team was not as good or as balanced as the geelong 09 team a superior gameplan allowed their bottom tier players to not be exploited too much

since that time they have been topping up with mature age hacks while geelong have been developing youth

our more balanced team and development of youth has allowed us to stay at the top for longer, the saints unfortunately can either hang around between 7th to 10th for a few years and then bottom out or they can bottom out now and challenge again a few years sooner (still a long way away)

geelong, pies, hawks, carlton, wce and freo are all above the saints by a fair amount

to be flag challengers you need a balanced team with your 16-25th players being fairly solid

 

[ManOfClay]

Lets be clear umps were atrociuos today with 31-19 frees and 4 50 meter penalties against (some just lame) but it happens interstate BUT that doesnt excuse the poor start, shabby disposal and overall loss.

There is no, I repeat no, rule that says the free kick count has to be even.

I watched the game, St Kilda gave away stupid frees. It wasn't the umpires fault that your players couldn't tackle right.

 

[Hump 17]

Hump17 told me that umpiring cost them today.



Sam Gilbert is capable of breaking the all time record of kicking out on the full.

Only 31-19 there way plus five fifties to zero all dubious at best. After watching Cloke monster his opponent on Friday night then to see Milnes chest mark 15 out directly in front taken off him it wreaks of inconsistancy.

 

[AFaiL]

Probbaly a tad early - and anyways, they are rebuilding. You don't need to gut the list and play 15 kids a week to do it. Stanley, Milera both got a good run on the weekend, showing good signs. And anyways, our pre-season has been really limited, and we haven't beaten David Rodan in years... Seriously, every time? If he started on the field, trust me it wouldn't have been close. He loves playing St Kilda.

 

[MarkT2]

I would think the rebuild has started and Watters is playing some of the younger players and will continue to play them. Meanwhile they still have to try and make the finals this year while they have some very good players still in their prime. If they don't make the finals or if they do make it and are also rans, I dare say there will be a cleanout of around 10 players a year for a couple of years but it is premature right now to give up on 2012 and to pension off the senior players.

 

[Defacto]

Some good news. Siposs had scans on his knee. No tear only bruising!!!!

 

[McCrann]

Lets be clear umps were atrociuos today with 31-19 frees and 4 50 meter penalties against (some just lame) but it happens interstate BUT that doesnt excuse the poor start, shabby disposal and overall loss.

Port wanted it more and have improved so kudos to them and as others have said , outside 2009, I cant remember winning over there against them to often...theyve been a bogey side for us for years.

You might want to check the 2011 yearbook. Beat them handily (And yes, they were rubbish last year).

 

[db swannie]

St Kilda losing to Poort does say a lot. It says it all really.


Poort...they lost to Poort...

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I think it is- not because of the result today though, the writing was on the wall in the off season, Lyon didn't go west just because he woke up and decided to shaft Mark Harvey- he knew the window was most likely closing..

And because he knew the blame for the window closing blame squarely with himself and his fellow coaches and recruiters, who wasted pick after pick, year after year, and failed to develop what little youth they were left with.

 

[joop]

Rebuild!!!

I dont know why we perisit with players that arent going to win us a flag. yes we got close but we didnt win one.

I'd be happy to say goodbye to Gram, Geary, Clarke, Blake, Ray, Jones, POLO, even armitage.,

play cripps, ross, siposs, ledger, simpkin, stanley, saad and see if we can build a side with those guys

 

[Jentleman Geff]

St Kilda losing to Poort does say a lot. It says it all really.


Poort...they lost to Poort...

They lost to Port in 2010.

 

[Ricmel]

St Kilda losing to Poort does say a lot. It says it all really.


Poort...they lost to Poort...

We always lose to Port and they will win more games in Adelaide than they lose this year.

I think Saints should be in rebuild mode but "unfortunately" they still have a team that is probably going to win 10 - 13 games a year.

Would probably be better to whip down to the bottom of the ladder for a year or two and be back in contention in 5 years. As it is, the team is probably going to be too good to pick up some really high draft picks.

 

[PAFC_1870]

St Kilda losing to Poort does say a lot. It says it all really.


Poort...they lost to Poort...

What a load of crap.

Port are a better team then last year, by a long way.

They actually have coaches for one, FFS.

St Kilda can't rely on Riewoldt anymore, even their coach admitted as much on radio in the most honest interview I have heard on 5AA last week. He admitted he's a 30yo with a degenerative knee among many other interesting things about the team. Respect for the man to say what he did. I'd strongly suggest all Saints fans interested to go on to 5AA website as they usually have a recording you can download...

 

[Ricmel]

And because he knew the blame for the window closing blame squarely with himself and his fellow coaches and recruiters, who wasted pick after pick, year after year, and failed to develop what little youth they were left with.

This is such a ridiculous statement.

Saints bottomed out in 2000 - 2002. In that period the recruited the core of the team that but for a toe poke and a bad bounce, with an ounce of luck could have had 2 flags.

We have not had high drafts picks for many years now. The only recruiting mistake I think Saints made was taking Ball before Judd.

Otherwise we have simply turned over a few low draft picks for players we thought could fill positions.

 

[Jentleman Geff]

I think the worst thing that happened to them was Riewoldt's hammy. They started 2010 as well as 2009 and then he went down. To lose your best player for half the season and have him come back with a distinct loss of form and make the GF (and draw it) is a credit to them

Then they made the finals in 2011 with Hayes gone for the year. How many other clubs could lose their two best players in consecutive years and still compete? Geelong's the only one I can think of whose coped with similar loss of players in living memory.

People like to stick it to St Kilda, but they have a resilience that few other clubs have.

 

[PAFC_1870]

I think the worst thing that happened to them was Riewoldt's hammy. They started 2010 as well as 2009 and then he went down. To lose your best player for half the season and have him come back with a distinct loss of form and make the GF (and draw it) is a credit to them

Then they made the finals in 2011 with Hayes gone for the year. How many other clubs could lose their two best players in consecutive years and still compete? Geelong's the only one I can think of whose coped with similar loss of players in living memory.

People like to stick it to St Kilda, but they have a resilience that few other clubs have.

Primus and Francou, out for 2 years. Best ruckmen in the comp and best clearance player in the comp at the time. Still won the flag.

But back on point, the Saints have missed their window, but to their credit they held onto it for a long time. I feel sorry for them that they didn't pinch a flag though.

 

[Ricmel]

I feel sorry for them that they didn't pinch a flag though.

You know I think 2004, along with 2009, is probably the year we should have won a flag. The prelim against Port in Adelaide was one of the best games of footy ever played and had we pinched it I think we'd have won that year.

 

[Hump 17]

What a load of crap.

Port are a better team then last year, by a long way.

They actually have coaches for one, FFS.

St Kilda can't rely on Riewoldt anymore, even their coach admitted as much on radio in the most honest interview I have heard on 5AA last week. He admitted he's a 30yo with a degenerative knee among many other interesting things about the team. Respect for the man to say what he did. I'd strongly suggest all Saints fans interested to go on to 5AA website as they usually have a recording you can download...

I think this post tells us a lot. Port at home first up was always going to be tough game no matter who played them. Given that weve had a less than ideal preperation we where always going to be up against it.

 

[NUFC Tiger]

It's a bit early to make this kind of call - I think how they perform over the opening 5-6 games will show whether they are a finals team or not.

I'm not sure they have the quality to make the top 8 let alone win a flag but I certainly won't be writing them off just yet. A lot of big players with big game experience still on the list. They will be a hard game on their day.

 

[PAFC_1870]

You know I think 2004, along with 2009, is probably the year we should have won a flag. The prelim against Port in Adelaide was one of the best games of footy ever played and had we pinched it I think we'd have won that year.

Agreed. The winner of 04 was always gonna win, best game I have seen, skills were top notch as was the pressure.

The tied GF was heartbreaking. Deserved that IMHO.

 

[Jentleman Geff]

Primus and Francou, out for 2 years. Best ruckmen in the comp and best clearance player in the comp at the time. Still won the flag.

But back on point, the Saints have missed their window, but to their credit they held onto it for a long time. I feel sorry for them that they didn't pinch a flag though.

Tredrea was your best player, and had he gone down in 2004 you would have lost that year.