The 2017 Rolling All-Australian Thread

[GordonBlue]

Kruezer won the battle, but all Blues fans seem to preach is that he "smashed" Grundy when actually he really didn't, Grundy was nearly as good in the ruck.

I quoted Pies fans saying Kreuzer gave Grundy a master class in ruck.

Not one Blues fan went that far

 

[Bollox]

JPK simply doing what he does.
Starts well, but not quite AA form.
Then he gradually puts his foot down on the pedal, until we get that mid-late season moment of clarity when everyone realises they cant ignore the elephant in the engine room any longer. That is pretty much where we are at again now.

We spent the first half of the season so far as the worst. The second half of it as the best.
That turnaround was no accident, and wasnt due to guys like Franklin...it was the rest of the midfield that was so horribly out of form in the first month combined with a few too many injuries to key guys.

As a captain now he is also eligible for AA captaincy.

I'll make a prediction that very very soon he wont simply be one of the very first you pick, but by late season he also becomes the favorite for the AA captaincy.

Just as an example of how the vic media works....yesterday i saw an article headline saying what an inspiration Joel Selwood is as captain. He spent 30 seconds on the ground then got knocked the f out. He didnt get any team over the line, didnt do jack shit in fact, yet he still managed to be captain inspiration for the week. Its bizzaroland how some of the media work and how some fans lap that shit up.

 

[gandaal]

Kruezer won the battle, but all Blues fans seem to preach is that he "smashed" Grundy when actually he really didn't, Grundy was nearly as good in the ruck.

You do realise that Kreuzer got 9 coaches votes that game right? Grundy got zip.

Anyone who watched the game knew that Grundy was well beaten.

 

[Bollox]

Far too many getting sucked in to jamming their "next best" high disposal flanker type into a BP.

Year after year the selectors choose the entire FB line on their DEFENSIVE record, and especially favour their one on one defensive record. Yet year after year we go through this process of jamming whoever is leftover after picking the HBFers, into the BP's. In terms of predicting AA it is being lazy, sitting on the fence coz u cant figure out the best defenders, and also stems from parroting others.

Every chance there will be 3 KPD's picked, and it has been a pretty good season for KPD's...so dont be afraid to pick one at BP. For the back 6, the "3 big 3 small" theory is invariably the most commonly picked anyway. From memory there may have been just 1 bloke picked on the FB line in the last 5-7 years that hasnt had a minimum of a fantastic season as a more one on one type defender.

 

[Apex36]

This is a more general comment about defenders, but I find it interesting the way defenders are chosen. There seems to be 2 main type, rebounding defenders (JJ, Hunt, Yeo), or marking defenders (Howe, Laird, Rance).

A skill that appears to have been overlooked in importance, is being accountable to a man. A few (like Rance), defend a man and do their "AA skill" amazingly, and are usually the ones picked. It might not be as important now defence is largely a zone concept, but I feel like there are players out there who are amazingly consistent at the one skill nobody ever seems to care about.
But it can also lead to some massive over rating of defenders. For example, I remember Oxley taking about a bazillion marks against us one game. Problem was he isn't an accountable defender, so is now in the Magoos. But that kid was the next coming after that game.

Oxleys problem isn't that he's unaccountable, it's that he's soft as butter and as soon as the opposition puts someone on him he falls apart. Why Roos didn't put someone on him that day he carved you guys up still baffles me.

 

[Fonzeno1]

No Collingwood player should be in contention. High possession game style with zero affect. If all you do is stare at statistic, 5 Collingwood players make the AA team. If you look and results and watch the match, zero.

Hahaha thats like saying if you look at results and watch the match Rance should never have been all australian. It's clear your posts are biased by hate. FWIW Howe has been every bit as good as Rance this year and well better than Astbury.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Hahaha thats like saying if you look at results and watch the match Rance should never have been all australian. It's clear your posts are biased by hate. FWIW Howe has been every bit as good as Rance this year and well better than Astbury.

Lets not get carried away.

 

[adammania9]

Lets not get carried away.

Rance has been a little bit better but Howe's output cannot go unrewarded. Both players are the reason their teams don't get flogged most/every week(s)

 

[Cruiserweight Champ]

As of the completion of Round 14 - my updated AA team:

DEF: S.DOCHERTY A.RANCE J.LEVER

H/BK: J.HOWE M.HURLEY R.LAIRD

C/Line: S.PENDLES T.MITCHELL A.GAFF

H/FWD: T.GREENE A.DANIHER R.GRAY

FWD: E.BETTS J.CAMERON L.FRANKLIN

F/WERS: B.GRUNDY P.DANGERFIELD Z.MERRETT

I/CHNG: D.MARTIN, G.ABLETT, , A.TRELOAR, E. YEO

I believe Kreuzer is having a purple patch, and is the best performing ruckman over the last 6-7 weeks, but over the course of the season (14 matches played) - i still would have Grundy/Martin ahead of Kreuzer.

 

[james Dean]

As of the completion of Round 14 - my updated AA team:

DEF: S.DOCHERTY A.RANCE J.LEVER

H/BK: J.HOWE M.HURLEY R.LAIRD

C/Line: S.PENDLES T.MITCHELL A.GAFF

H/FWD: T.GREENE A.DANIHER R.GRAY

FWD: E.BETTS J.CAMERON L.FRANKLIN

F/WERS: B.GRUNDY P.DANGERFIELD Z.MERRETT

I/CHNG: D.MARTIN, G.ABLETT, , A.TRELOAR, E. YEO

I believe Kreuzer is having a purple patch, and is the best performing ruckman over the last 6-7 weeks, but over the course of the season (14 matches played) - i still would have Grundy/Martin ahead of Kreuzer.

Gaff?? Seriously? Over Josh Kelly?

 

[Monkey King]

I believe Kreuzer is having a purple patch, and is the best performing ruckman over the last 6-7 weeks, but over the course of the season (14 matches played) - i still would have Grundy/Martin ahead of Kreuzer.

Kreuzer has actually been pretty consistent all season, rather than hitting a purple patch. It's just the last 6-7 weeks his form has come under more notice having taken a couple of big scalps and people noticing that he keeps backing up his good form.

 

[Poorman53]

As of the completion of Round 14 - my updated AA team:

DEF: S.DOCHERTY A.RANCE J.LEVER

H/BK: J.HOWE M.HURLEY R.LAIRD

C/Line: S.PENDLES T.MITCHELL A.GAFF

H/FWD: T.GREENE A.DANIHER R.GRAY

FWD: E.BETTS J.CAMERON L.FRANKLIN

F/WERS: B.GRUNDY P.DANGERFIELD Z.MERRETT

I/CHNG: D.MARTIN, G.ABLETT, , A.TRELOAR, E. YEO

I believe Kreuzer is having a purple patch, and is the best performing ruckman over the last 6-7 weeks, but over the course of the season (14 matches played) - i still would have Grundy/Martin ahead of Kreuzer.

You're clearly just guessing about Kruezer. Witts beat him at Etihad in the first few rounds other than that he started year off really well. Just with all players that haven't made AA before takes time to be recognised. But Grundy has had a pretty good year also.

 

[Fonzeno1]

Lets not get carried away.

its not getting carried away. Just because rance has a track record people fail to see how good others have also been This year.
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/...ayerStatus2=A&tid2=15&pid2=2318&fid2=S&type=A
Add to this Howe is the number 1 intercept marker in the afl.
The number 1 contested marking defender.
And the number 2 overall marker in the afl.

 

[Eaglespur]

Gaff has been dog shit this season. Wouldn't even have him in west coasts top 10 performing players. In fact i think Jetta has been better (had a great last 3 or 4 weeks).

 

[Happy Mastenator]

its not getting carried away. Just because rance has a track record people fail to see how good others have also been This year.
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/...ayerStatus2=A&tid2=15&pid2=2318&fid2=S&type=A
Add to this Howe is the number 1 intercept marker in the afl.
The number 1 contested marking defender.
And the number 2 overall marker in the afl.

They play different roles so not sure why I'd care about basic stats.

Rance has been more valuable than Howe though by a fair way. He's still the best defender in the comp.

 

[AG]

As of the completion of Round 14 - my updated AA team:

DEF: S.DOCHERTY A.RANCE J.LEVER

H/BK: J.HOWE M.HURLEY R.LAIRD

C/Line: S.PENDLES T.MITCHELL A.GAFF

H/FWD: T.GREENE A.DANIHER R.GRAY

FWD: E.BETTS J.CAMERON L.FRANKLIN

F/WERS: B.GRUNDY P.DANGERFIELD Z.MERRETT

I/CHNG: D.MARTIN, G.ABLETT, , A.TRELOAR, E. YEO

I believe Kreuzer is having a purple patch, and is the best performing ruckman over the last 6-7 weeks, but over the course of the season (14 matches played) - i still would have Grundy/Martin ahead of Kreuzer.

Bold selections...

 

[nameless]

Funny seeing Kruezer continue to perform, when many were denied mentioning his name in this thread a few weeks ago.

Great to see him injury free and dominating.
I'd have him in at this stage.

 

[Fonzeno1]

They play different roles so not sure why I'd care about basic stats.

Rance has been more valuable than Howe though by a fair way. He's still the best defender in the comp.

Agreed they do play different roles and basic stats dont tell the whole story but a few stats do mean something and i would have contested marks, tackles, inside 50's, rebound 50's, 1%ers and intercept marks up there with stats that mean something for defenders. I never said howe was better i said he's been as good as rance.

 

[Fonzeno1]

Funny seeing Kruezer continue to perform, when many were denied mentioning his name in this thread a few weeks ago.

Great to see him injury free and dominating.
I'd have him in at this stage.

Agreed i would have him in at this stage aswell. I think it will come down to who has a better second half of the year with a bit of favour given to who plays in a team winning games.

 

[ferrisb]

Funny seeing Kruezer continue to perform, when many were denied mentioning his name in this thread a few weeks ago.

Great to see him injury free and dominating.
I'd have him in at this stage.

Carlton fans (with a chunk of bias) have been saying all year how good he has been.

Almost everyone else have said we were a) dreaming or b) while he is playing well, he's not even close to being in contention, let alone the team.

He's now on 38 AFLCA votes for the year (a ranking I rate very highly). He's 5 points off the league top 10, which is almost exclusively midfielders. By comparison I think Jacobs has 18 votes and Ryder has 36. Not sure about others (Witts/Grundy et al)* IMHO he's in the conversation.

Part of the conversation (or a side-topic) is can you have an AA ruckman who isn't dominant in the middle but great elsewhere? I don't know if you can('t). But he is playing ruck. And the coaches are saying regularly he is one of the best on the ground. It would be akin to picking a CHF who doesn't kick anywhere near the most goals, but has more marks, goal assists and tackles than the other guys?




* I also feel the need to blast the AFLCA and all other media for only publishing the league top 10. It's really annoying! Ahhhh, there, I feel much better.

 

[Scotland]

Every chance there will be 3 KPD's picked, and it has been a pretty good season for KPD's...so dont be afraid to pick one at BP. For the back 6, the "3 big 3 small" theory is invariably the most commonly picked anyway. From memory there may have been just 1 bloke picked on the FB line in the last 5-7 years that hasnt had a minimum of a fantastic season as a more one on one type defender.

People are obsessed with getting the highest disposal players into the back 6.

Most teams are Rance + 1 of Hurley or McGovern + 4 high possession players. A team with Laird, Docherty, Howe and Yeo playing back would probably get slaughtered. Alex Rance leads the comp with 139 1%ers. Laird has 20. Docherty 35. Howe 55. Yeo 34. Out of all these guys I'd say Howe is the most defensively minded, and even he is an attacking defender. I'd be going with the 3 key defenders. You'd take Rance or McGovern playing as the third tall over Howe or Yeo any day of the week.

 

[PowerForGood]

As of the completion of Round 14 - my updated AA team:

DEF: S.DOCHERTY A.RANCE J.LEVER

H/BK: J.HOWE M.HURLEY R.LAIRD

C/Line: S.PENDLES T.MITCHELL A.GAFF

H/FWD: T.GREENE A.DANIHER R.GRAY

FWD: E.BETTS J.CAMERON L.FRANKLIN

F/WERS: B.GRUNDY P.DANGERFIELD Z.MERRETT

I/CHNG: D.MARTIN, G.ABLETT, , A.TRELOAR, E. YEO

Funnily, I wouldnt have any Port Adelaide player in the AA 22 at this stage even Gray. Too many quiet games.

 

[LeverPuller]

People are obsessed with getting the highest disposal players into the back 6.

Most teams are Rance + 1 of Hurley or McGovern + 4 high possession players. A team with Laird, Docherty, Howe and Yeo playing back would probably get slaughtered. Alex Rance leads the comp with 139 1%ers. Laird has 20. Docherty 35. Howe 55. Yeo 34. Out of all these guys I'd say Howe is the most defensively minded, and even he is an attacking defender. I'd be going with the 3 key defenders. You'd take Rance or McGovern playing as the third tall over Howe or Yeo any day of the week.

This is why Nev Jetta should be in the team. Best defensive small by a mile.

 

[eth-dog]

People are obsessed with getting the highest disposal players into the back 6.

Most teams are Rance + 1 of Hurley or McGovern + 4 high possession players. A team with Laird, Docherty, Howe and Yeo playing back would probably get slaughtered. Alex Rance leads the comp with 139 1%ers. Laird has 20. Docherty 35. Howe 55. Yeo 34. Out of all these guys I'd say Howe is the most defensively minded, and even he is an attacking defender. I'd be going with the 3 key defenders. You'd take Rance or McGovern playing as the third tall over Howe or Yeo any day of the week.

Yep. For me it should be Rance, Hurley and Talia as the talls then 4 medium/smalls in Laird, Docherty, Yeo and Hibberd IMO.

 

[Scotland]

This is why Nev Jetta should be in the team. Best defensive small by a mile.

I'd be on board with that. Not that I have followed his season specifically all that closely.

We pick guys like Gray, Wingard, Betts, Greene etc. but don't place much of an emphasis on the opponents that shut them down.

Yep. For me it should be Rance, Hurley and Talia as the talls then 4 medium/smalls in Laird, Docherty, Yeo and Hibberd IMO.

AA back 7?