Voss, hird and Buckley again: coaching edition

[calyam]

Each of them was terrible in their own way.

Hird - ASADA
Voss - 'crazy' trades
Buckley - six consecutive seasons of getting worse.

Buckley has won 52 per cent of the matches he coached; Hird 49 per cent; and Voss a touch under 40 per cent.

Both Buckley and Hird had three 'winning' seasons - seasons where you win 50 per cent or more of your matches - while Voss had one. Buckley made the finals twice, with Hird and Voss making it once. Essendon would have made it in 2013 but were banned. Buckley and Voss each managed to win one final; Hird lost his only final.

Expectations on Buckley were far higher than for either Hird or Voss. The 2011 Collingwood team was outstanding and they were expected to remain that way. It is remarkable that Collingwood has managed to get worse each and every year that Buckley has been at the helm.

Purely on a win-loss basis I think Hird met expectations, until everything collapsed in 2015, but he was supported by dual premiership coach Bomber Thompson. Neither of the other two had a mentor as seasoned as Thompson. Off-field Essendon was a debacle and one of the least professional clubs the sport has ever seen.

Expectations on Voss were high after a really good 2009 campaign. After recruiting Fevola the wheels seemed to fall off and Brisbane were poor in his final four seasons as coach. The end result was the 'crazy' Vossy meme.

After their tenure it seems as though Essendon was left in the best place for future success. They are a better team that Collingwood at present and given their stock of key position talent they project to remain there in the near-future. Collingwood have good top-end talent (Pendlebury, Treloar, Sidebottom) but their list falls away rapidly. It seems like they have wasted the prime of Pendlebury's career. Brisbane are firmly in a rebuild and are also four years removed from Voss; those years have been a massive struggle but there appears to be light at the end of the tunnel with some impressive young talent coming on board.

 

[gavaniacono]

In terms of coaching it is a question of least bad. Line ball between V and B. H was calamitous, and let his ego make decisions in the end.

 

[Milanista28]

Hurley who is also an excellent defender and renowned for contested marking

No he's not.

 

[Rob]

I reckon to an extent the jury is still out on Voss and Hird. Voss was let down by his own recruiting and Hird was let down by his own ego. Can they actually coach? I'm not sure. I got the impression that Voss was on the right track when he got the arse.

Buckley seems to have had enough opportunity to get good results if he was actually any good as a coach.

 

[Suma Magic]

Hird is probably the worst coach of all time. If you include the management part of coaching, which you do.

The others are both average/poor. Buckley probably better.

 

[tesla1962]

Probably?

Carlisle has been outstanding.

33rd for Contested Marks as a CHB is amazing.

To put it into perspective - someone like Hurley who is also an excellent defender and renowned for contested marking, sits 65th.

You told us a while back that you don't watch AFL and it's becoming pretty obvious now. Looking at statistics and making things up is no substitute for actually watching the game. Carlisle and Hooker are both terrific contested marks, Hurley not so much. Hurley is an excellent defender but contested marking is not his strongest suit and definitely not something he is 'renowned' for.

 

[Roobs321]

A pointless thread concept, much ado about nothing, but Hird definitely demonstrated the superior coaching chops of the 3. You always felt he was shaping his team with a plan, whereas Buckley and Voss were generally mediocre. But his maladministration must be taken in account.

 

[Randomizor]

Hird is probably the worst coach of all time. If you include the management part of coaching, which you do.

The others are both average/poor. Buckley probably better.

If you include the management part there is no “probably” about it

 

[Suma Magic]

If you include the management part there is no “probably” about it

And given the thread isn't limited to game-day coaching or pure strategy, it's pretty clear that Hird is the worst of the three.

He's the worst coach of all time.

 

[Rilzi]

Hird probably had the best chance to be a good coach - given Essendon had Bomber in there as a mentor the future would have had either Hird maturing into a good coach or Bomber running things by proxy. But then, you know... it didnt work out that way. Ahem.

As for the impact on the clubs? After Hird Essendon cleared out the club like a forest fire - management, the board, coaching staff, everything. Sure its been a few seasons of pain, but the club is stronger now than its been in a long time. Brisbane are in a similar boat though its taken them a little longer sort themselves out. Collingwood? Seems a death of a thousand cuts. Each year they've gotten a little worse and there's no guarantee that Bucks is going to go - would Eddie really admit he was wrong?

 

[Blue1980]

I'm unsure how much of Hirds good work was bomber's good work as it seemed a hell of a lot worse in 2015 (though there were extenuating circumstances).

Regardless for the whole package, Hird is the worst for the damage he did.

Buckley has led the club nowhere and its hard to say if he has created an unbalanced list or is just a s**t coach.

I think a fair bit of column b

 

[Percel]

Title should read Hird/Bomber, Voss or Buckley?

 

[indygo]

I remember that during Voss' head coaching days he was labeled a poor teacher/communicator with the younger players during his tenure. Hence Brisbane losing the majority of their young top draft picks after 1 or 2 years to other clubs. I would have thought that Brisbane would be a pretty nice place to live and play the game so it must come back to Voss and his coaching techniques. Didn't he join Port as an assistant in 2015? Coinciding with Ports failed couple of years after their breakout 2014,

 

[Snake_Baker]

The old adage about top players becoming coaches remains true.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Hird the worst by a country mile.

I mean, I'm choking on my own bemusement here that it's even being discussed.


Then Voss.


Then Buckley. Apart from not having a good strategy, and not being able to get his players to carry it out, and for his poor interpretation of what makes a good footballer - he's not that bad a coach.

 

[lamaros]

Are you kidding?
Without the scandal the bombers would have had Hooker Hurley and Carlisle with Daniher as their 4 key pillars with Hibberd and Crameri as capable second talls. Really just missing some midfield depth

If we had Crameri we wouldn't have Zach Merrett, our best player.

Carlisle and Hibberd would be nice this year, but especially in regard to Hibberd that's not to do with Hird. They got better deals than the club could offer.

 

[Topkent]

If we had Crameri we wouldn't have Zach Merrett, our best player.

Carlisle and Hibberd would be nice this year, but especially in regard to Hibberd that's not to do with Hird. They got better deals than the club could offer.

Forgot about Ryder as well. He can play

 

[lamaros]

Forgot about Ryder as well. He can play

Again, had nothing to do with Hird. Ryder got a big payout instead of having to carry on with the end of a front ended contract, and had some personal issues forcing a move.

We probably got screwed more in the trade than we might otherwise have without the saga negotiating tactic, perhaps.

Hird ****ed the club up in many ways, there is absolutely no doubt, but Carlisle aside players leaving was not one of them.

 

[Sttew]

This is a joke right?


We're talking about the same James Hird yeah?

Firstly, it was not Hird - he was like a little school boy being tutored by talented senior and assistant coaches like no other "senior" coach has had

 

[yeahmate]

Hird by a mile. Brilliant strategist and prepared to do whatever it takes. Not only changed the physiology of his players but also left an indelible mark on them as footballers and people. Would have got away with it too if not for the meddling of a corrupt AFL and shadowy international new world order figures. No doubt he will rise again in future when the club most needs him.

 

[_Mike_]

EXCLUSIVE: COLLINGWOOD chief executive Gary Pert has met with the Magpies' entire playing list to discuss the future of under pressure coach Nathan Buckley as... Read more

 

[parmy2balmey]

hopefully vossy gets the job at collingwood

 

[M Malice]

There will be no Hodge/Clarkson succession plan, take it to the bank. Any favorite son wanting to coach their team will have to do an apprenticeship at another club first from this year forward.

 

[Plugger35]

I don't think Voss was that bad as a coach, Brisbane played finals under him and even in his last year they were still competitive and playing decent footy.

When you look at how poor Brisbane have been since he was sacked it makes you think he didn't do such a bad job after all.

Hird and Buckley both him covered as worse coaches, Collingwood have got progressively worse under Buckley and Hird wrecked Essendon on and off field.

 

[M Malice]

hopefully vossy gets the job at collingwood

Like it, the merry go round, Voss to Pies as head coach Buckley to Lions as the NEAFL coach and Eade to Port as an assistant coach.