Welcome Welcome to Hawthorn - Mabior Chol

[The Chad and I]

I commonly see loser spelled with a double ‘o’ also - it doesn’t mean it’s right.

Yes but the use of words make the meaning over the long run. That is how customs are created. Same goes for spelling but that’s far more resistant to this sort of thing.

 

[H00t]

I understand the idea of managing expectations however, Marbior Chol kicked 50 goals in 2023, 10 in the AFL and 40 in the VFL for an average 2.1 goals per game. Granted he played most games against VFL level full backs which inflated his numbers but the ball was also being delivered by VFL level midfielders which deflated those same numbers.

If we just look at his AFL games over the last 2 years he has 54 goals in 30 games = 1.8 goals per game.

Frankly, I am expecting 40 goals from Chol in 2024. That would be an average of 1.7 goals goals per game. Totally feasible.

AFL level is such a huge step up from VFL level that form at VFL level doesn’t really count for much. Players like Jeka have dominated VFL.

The problem with Chol is he’s only had 1 good year. He averaged under a goal a game every year for the tigers and even this year is he played all 23 games at his goal average for this year he would have kicked 29 goals.

He’s shown he can kick 40 goals in a year but there’s nothing to say he will ever do it again.

I hope it does happen, but it’s very far from a given.

 

[bigmaxi]

Not one to be overly optimistic but thinking Coleman 2024 and a Norm Smith 2025 should do it.

 

[extractasam]

I'm certain a lot of people just confuse 'lackadaisical' and 'laconic'

Genuinely never took the time to research it’s actual meaning in the dictionary but I guess footy people including myself have been using it in the wrong way for years

 

[suedehead]

AFL level is such a huge step up from VFL level that form at VFL level doesn’t really count for much. Players like Jeka have dominated VFL.

The problem with Chol is he’s only had 1 good year. He averaged under a goal a game every year for the tigers and even this year is he played all 23 games at his goal average for this year he would have kicked 29 goals.

He’s shown he can kick 40 goals in a year but there’s nothing to say he will ever do it again.

I hope it does happen, but it’s very far from a given.

When has Jeka dominated VFL?

Sent from my SM-F711B using Tapatalk

 

[extractasam]

When has Jeka dominated VFL?

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I remember him having a very hot streak in early 2021. Unfortunately I think it coincided with Kosi being in good form, think around the time he kicked 5 against the crows in Tassie

 

[H00t]

When has Jeka dominated VFL?

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Kicked 23 goals 20 from 8 VFL games back in 2021.

Even this year Brodie McLaughlin and Chris Burgess have matched Chol’s output while playing for the suns.

 

[Yardie]

Fair enough. I do know the literal meaning, but I swear I have heard it used commonly in this context tooo.

To be honest I've heard the same. But it just seems to be a bunch of ex-footballers trying to be smart and continually misusing the word. It is one of my pet hates (my eyes start twitching )

I was gobsmacked when Dermie used lackadaisical (and I've heard him use it a number of times) cause I had lumped him in with everyone else.

 

[Hawker399]

Once the season starts I predict that Chol will become our most polarising player. Even more polarising than Ginnivan.

 

[Alite]

AFL level is such a huge step up from VFL level that form at VFL level doesn’t really count for much. Players like Jeka have dominated VFL.

The problem with Chol is he’s only had 1 good year. He averaged under a goal a game every year for the tigers and even this year is he played all 23 games at his goal average for this year he would have kicked 29 goals.

He’s shown he can kick 40 goals in a year but there’s nothing to say he will ever do it again.

I hope it does happen, but it’s very far from a given.

The Tigers saw and played Chol as a developing ruckman. As a ruckman I certainly don’t judge Reeves on how many goals he kicks.

The only relevant years for the role that Chol will be playing at the Hawks are those that he spent at the Suns. There he was a fwd/ruck, as he will be at the Hawks. When considering at Chol it seems pretty clear that his years at the Sums are the most relevant.

I tried to find stats on Mitch Lewis the year before he became a Hawks regular (2021) to see if the “jump” that you wrote about is true. But strangely the info is difficult to find. I can say that he kicked 22 goals in the VFL in 2021 at 1.6 goals per game. And can also say that he kicked 22 goals at 1.6 goals per game at AFL level in that same year. So take from that what you will.

Scepticism is a great trait. It creates doubt that creates research and so improves knowledge. Your post has movitated me to improved my knowledge. Cheers H00t:

 

[Alite]

Laconic is closer to the word aloof than it is to lackadaisical.

I see Laconic as not doing / saying more than is needed. Further action is superfluous and possibly energy sapping.
It is a fantastic trait if the primary meaning is completed = all that is needed.

If you are Lackadaisical you gets fired from any job let alone as a player in the AFL.

Chol moves without panic. Pendles and Hustwaite likewise. Being laconic is an asset IF the player’s mind is moving at speed.

Side thought: With NicNat now retired could Chol be the highest leaping ruckmen (relief) in the comp? Most just stand there and use their bulk or height to protect a space for the tap. Others game the umpires and look for illegal contact.

With Reeves and Chol,…= one very tall player who is proven to be the second best tap-to-advantage ruck in the comp 2 years running, aligned with a guy who can jump over every other ruck in the comp.

Chol can be as minimalist as he wants in his movements. Once he takes his ~15% game time in the ruck, we will see him embarrass a few full time ruckmen.

And the funniest thing will be: he will seemingly do it without actual effort = laconic

 

[MrPremiership]

More on Mabior, less on dictionaries

 

[H00t]

The Tigers saw and played Chol as a developing ruckman. As a ruckman I certainly don’t judge Reeves on how many goals he kicks.

The only relevant years for the role that Chol will be playing at the Hawks are those that he spent at the Suns. There he was a fwd/ruck, as he will be at the Hawks. When considering at Chol it seems pretty clear that his years at the Sums are the most relevant.

I tried to find stats on Mitch Lewis the year before he became a Hawks regular (2021) to see if the “jump” that you wrote about is true. But strangely the info is difficult to find. I can say that he kicked 22 goals in the VFL in 2021 at 1.6 goals per game. And can also say that he kicked 22 goals at 1.6 goals per game at AFL level in that same year. So take from that what you will.

Scepticism is a great trait. It creates doubt that creates research and so improves knowledge. Your post has movitated me to improved my knowledge. Cheers H00t:

It definitely is frustrating to find VFL stats.

Lewis and Larkey are two that prove you can make the jump up from VFL to AFL level and continue to perform well. Even going back a bit Podsiadly. Larkey and Pods being the only 2 VFL leading goal kickers since 1999 to really stamp themselves at AFL level.

So it’s not that it can’t be done. Just that there’s a lot of players who play well at VFL level that can’t replicate it at the top level.

Chol has shown he can play well at AFL level. It’s a big ask on him to replicate it though.

I also will note Chol playing more ruck at the tigers. I know he spend time there but I thought he played more forward as well which is my bad.

 

[Alite]

It definitely is frustrating to find VFL stats.

Lewis and Larkey are two that prove you can make the jump up from VFL to AFL level and continue to perform well. Even going back a bit Podsiadly. Larkey and Pods being the only 2 VFL leading goal kickers since 1999 to really stamp themselves at AFL level.

So it’s not that it can’t be done. Just that there’s a lot of players who play well at VFL level that can’t replicate it at the top level.

Chol has shown he can play well at AFL level. It’s a big ask on him to replicate it though.

I also will note Chol playing more ruck at the tigers. I know he spend time there but I thought he played more forward as well which is my bad.

I appreciated your considered response. You have discussed my reply and come to a similar conclusion.

Your type of response in BigFooty is rare and always appreciated: kudos to you.

Aside: I was there when Pods destroy the Hawks at Docklands. Do you know he was on the Cats staff as a fitness coach at before he (most likely) embarrassed a few Geelong defenders in a kick-around. J Pods story is awesome.

 

[chopflop]

I commonly see loser spelled with a double ‘o’ also - it doesn’t mean it’s right.

Edit - not inferring you’re a loser, just it’s so often misspelled it makes me sad.

Inferring vs. Implying.... intentional?

 

[dermott]

Inferring vs. Implying.... intentional?

And was misspelled deliberately misspelt or is Ned choosing to use American English?

 

[Philhawk]

For me, Chol is going to single handedly be he most influential player on our season next year. His pre-season and mentality is going to be absolutely crucial.

We all know he's clearly got the talent, but it's going to be his eagerness and desire to chase once the ball hits the ground / present up and down the wing to no avail that's going to make or break our season.

His desire to unshackle Lewis, which is the key to maximising our midfield delivery into the forward 50, is going to be just so crucial.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

And was misspelled deliberately misspelt or is Ned choosing to use American English?

I am from Punxsutawney after all.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Inferring vs. Implying.... intentional?

Sure...intentional!

 

[WWSD]

I would much rather see Chol play as a permanent forward than having to do any ruck work. Ramsden should be the second ruck. I think the space on the MCG will suit Chol’s style of play perfectly. He will likely beat most key defender's when the ball hits the ground with his speed and athleticism.

 

[TylerDurden]

 

[lyger]

Mentioned in the article;

“Chol was told by Hawthorn he was going to play as a deep forward that could at times chop out in the ruck, with Mitch Lewis likely to push further up the ground.”

 

[VandoHawk]

Mentioned in the article;

“Chol was told by Hawthorn he was going to play as a deep forward that could at times chop out in the ruck, with Mitch Lewis likely to push further up the ground.”

This really does make me excited.
Chol kicked 44 goals playing as the deepest forward for GC. When King came back, he was pushed out.
Lewis always struck me as a CHF being forced to be a full forward. His contested marking, aggression and link up play is top notch for a big guy.
Very possible that we get the best out of both our pillars with one move. Fingers crossed.

 

[lyger]

This really does make me excited.
Chol kicked 44 goals playing as the deepest forward for GC. When King came back, he was pushed out.
Lewis always struck me as a CHF being forced to be a full forward. His contested marking, aggression and link up play is top notch for a big guy.
Very possible that we get the best out of both our pillars with one move. Fingers crossed.

Agreed. And it’s great that Chol has the agility, speed and skills to play further up the field. I can see us interchanging Lewis and Chol depending on the match ups, to our advantage.

 

[threesixpio]

I'm certain a lot of people just confuse 'lackadaisical' and 'laconic'

“Lactose intolerant” is the one that always gets me