What is required from here onwards to win the premiership?

[PhatBoy]

But that’s the whole point, we haven’t been good enough sure. But that’s not why we have been blasted out of the water so often in finals, it is plain as day that the intensity steps up from H&A to finals, and more often than not we have not stepped up with it. Short memories do not change history.

it’s happened twice in the last 5 years Sydney and Adelaide prelims.

I don’t count the Melbourne loss as we were 8th and they were 5th.

It’s not ‘Intensity.’ Do you think premiership players like Selwood, Duncan, Taylor and Hawkins, a Brownlow medalist like Dangerfield, hard edged defenders like Tuohy, Stewart etc get out in the middle at the start of a preliminary final where Sydney or Adelaide get the jump on us and stand around going ‘well that was a bit tougher than I expected I’m gonna go to water now.’

they don’t. Simply some teams will get out of the blocks and play great footy and it isn’t a case of suddenly ‘just handling the moment’ to be able to get back into it.

we’ve done the same to other teams in finals. Why don’t those things balance one another out if it’s all to do with an ability to handle pressure or intensity?

we did it ourselves to Richmond last year and the year before. They were good enough to have a counter for it, and one player in particular rose above the best we could throw at them and delivered them another flag

 

[LifeSpan-Void]

it’s happened twice in the last 5 years Sydney and Adelaide prelims.

I don’t count the Melbourne loss as we were 8th and they were 5th.

It’s not ‘Intensity.’ Do you think premiership players like Selwood, Duncan, Taylor and Hawkins, a Brownlow medalist like Dangerfield, hard edged defenders like Tuohy, Stewart etc get out in the middle at the start of a preliminary final where Sydney or Adelaide get the jump on us and stand around going ‘well that was a bit tougher than I expected I’m gonna go to water now.’

they don’t. Simply some teams will get out of the blocks and play great footy and it isn’t a case of suddenly ‘just handling the moment’ to be able to get back into it.

we’ve done the same to other teams in finals. Why don’t those things balance one another out if it’s all to do with an ability to handle pressure or intensity?

we did it ourselves to Richmond last year and the year before. They were good enough to have a counter for it, and one player in particular rose above the best we could throw at them and delivered them another flag

Whatever, if I point out the logical fallacies in your argument you’re just going to throw another manic wall of text at me as you do everywhere on the board. So I’m just going to say time will tell.

 

[standupand]

My favourite piece of spookery is "We didn't turn up"

Sometimes it is accurate though. Like the Brisbane game. Or when Richmond were stuck in traffic. They literally didn't turn up.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Sometimes it is accurate though. Like the Brisbane game. Or when Richmond were stuck in traffic. They literally didn't turn up.

Bawls.

 

[PhatBoy]

Whatever, if I point out the logical fallacies in your argument you’re just going to throw another manic wall of text at me as you do everywhere on the board. So I’m just going to say time will tell.

Yes it’s very stressful moving your eyeballs over a few screens of pixels I can understand the pressure of such a tough task making you go to water

 

[LifeSpan-Void]

Yes it’s very stressful moving your eyeballs over a few screens of pixels I can understand the pressure of such a tough task making you go to water

Time will tell, brother.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Time will tell, brother.

Only if you ascribe any future finals loss to a failure to handle "finals pressure".

Weren't you the one who just raised the issue of logical fallacies?

 

[LifeSpan-Void]

Only if you ascribe any future finals loss to a failure to handle "finals pressure".

Weren't you the one who just raised the issue of logical fallacies?

Depends on the nature of the loss. If we are seen to have played a hard-fought, all players left nothing in the tank loss then no. If our players are made to look flat-footed, nobody gives a Yelp and everyone is pointing at everyone else to guard grass… then that’s exactly how we have lost so many of our finals over the last 10 years.

 

[PhatBoy]

This has been a debate through many sports for decades.
Even now 30 years on people look at the Douglas Tyson fight and put it down to a) a fluke and b) Tyson not taking the fight seriously and getting ambushed.
And yes there IS a little bit of truth to both those theories.

when you watch the right and watch Douglas’ earlier fights the explanation more than anything lies with Douglas actually being a very skilful albeit underachieving boxer who fought a tactically fantastic fight, prepared perfectly, and was tougher on that night than most of Tyson’s opponents up to that point.

 

[allrighty]

That’s only if you look at it with a Geelong eye only.

Yeah I have two monkey eyes though

 

[My Tilly]

This has been a debate through many sports for decades.
Even now 30 years on people look at the Douglas Tyson fight and put it down to a) a fluke and b) Tyson not taking the fight seriously and getting ambushed.
And yes there IS a little bit of truth to both those theories.

when you watch the right and watch Douglas’ earlier fights the explanation more than anything lies with Douglas actually being a very skilful albeit underachieving boxer who fought a tactically fantastic fight, prepared perfectly, and was tougher on that night than most of Tyson’s opponents up to that point.

Tyson couldn't take a decent hit and he was fortunate to have fought so many average boxers during his early years.
You saw what he was when he had to contend with the likes of Holyfield and Lewis, A class heavyweights who could take a hit.

 

[PhatBoy]

Tyson couldn't take a decent hit and he was fortunate to have fought so many average boxers during his early years.
You saw what he was when he had to contend with the likes of Holyfield and Lewis, A class heavyweights who could take a decent hit.

Well I don’t disagree with that either but the essence of what I’m saying remains the same it was over-analysed to death regarding what the ‘excuse’ or ‘cause’ of the result was. In reality one guy just outboxed the other on the night

 

[My Tilly]

Well I don’t disagree with that either but the essence of what I’m saying remains the same it was over-analysed to death regarding what the ‘excuse’ or ‘cause’ of the result was. In reality one guy just outboxed the other on the night

What is your view of us playing the finals at Subiaco?
Do you believe it will suit us or does it advantage the Bulldogs and those who we likely face in early stages?

 

[BotsMaster]

Has the Miers rumour been confirmed?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Nothing from Tom Browne yet.

 

[PhatBoy]

What is your view of us playing the finals at Subiaco?
Do you believe it will suit us or does it advantage the Bulldogs and those who we likely face in early stages?

I’m guessing you mean Optus stadium?

I think we’ve shown pretty convincingly that we aren’t relying on our own home ground dimensions to give us a leg up. Yes I’m sure the other finalists would stand a better chance at other grounds but it’s not like it suddenly crushes our chances. I think the Demons are probably the team it suits most as they’ve got the weakest forward line and at the very least, more space might at least give their forwards a bit more of an opportunity than a congested forward 50

 

[standupand]

Going by the ladder predictor, I give us about an 80% chance of finishing 2nd and playing Melbourne in a QF. Another decent possibility is finishing top and playing Brisbane. I know it's a few weeks away, but the final round against Dees is going to be big. Do we show our hand and try to inflict some psychological blows on them early? Or do we try not to give too much away in terms of how we're likely to set up against them if we're likely to meet the following week? Hopefully we knock them out of the 4 altogether. I still see them as a big threat.

 

[mcwilrob]

Getting to the pointy end of things now, and we have clearly established ourselves again as a contender.

Discuss what needs to happen from here on for us to win the premiership.

When we have lost games (both this year and last) it has been out inability to cope with high pressure from the opposition. We simply have to be better at soaking that up and then putting our own pressure on in return to regain ghe momentum and score. Accurate kicking is also important - ie take your chances

 

[geelong_crazy26]

When we have lost games (both this year and last) it has been out inability to cope with high pressure from the opposition. We simply have to be better at soaking that up and then putting our own pressure on in return to regain ghe momentum and score. Accurate kicking is also important - ie take your chances

the two most intense games I can recall this year are the bulldogs and port Adelaide games and we came out on top of those with wins, so I don’t really agree with that. The st kilda game was also very intense and we soaked that up for an impressive win.

so don’t agree with any of what you said.

the Brisbane game wasn’t a high intensity match at all IMO, it was quite an open scoring game with very little congestion and pressure to it. I don’t consider some scuffles as a reference to intensity.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Going by the ladder predictor, I give us about an 80% chance of finishing 2nd and playing Melbourne in a QF. Another decent possibility is finishing top and playing Brisbane. I know it's a few weeks away, but the final round against Dees is going to be big. Do we show our hand and try to inflict some psychological blows on them early? Or do we try not to give too much away in terms of how we're likely to set up against them if we're likely to meet the following week? Hopefully we knock them out of the 4 altogether. I still see them as a big threat.

I reckon we play our best regardless, and if Melbourne can find a way to beat us a fortnight later then good on them. The best team will find a way in finals.

 

[Wish Wellingtons]

Kick straight.

Maintain a loose man across half back.

Break even in the ruck.

 

[standupand]

it’s happened twice in the last 5 years Sydney and Adelaide prelims.

I don’t count the Melbourne loss as we were 8th and they were 5th.

It’s not ‘Intensity.’ Do you think premiership players like Selwood, Duncan, Taylor and Hawkins, a Brownlow medalist like Dangerfield, hard edged defenders like Tuohy, Stewart etc get out in the middle at the start of a preliminary final where Sydney or Adelaide get the jump on us and stand around going ‘well that was a bit tougher than I expected I’m gonna go to water now.’

they don’t. Simply some teams will get out of the blocks and play great footy and it isn’t a case of suddenly ‘just handling the moment’ to be able to get back into it.

we’ve done the same to other teams in finals. Why don’t those things balance one another out if it’s all to do with an ability to handle pressure or intensity?

we did it ourselves to Richmond last year and the year before. They were good enough to have a counter for it, and one player in particular rose above the best we could throw at them and delivered them another flag

I agree with a lot of your points here. However I do think there developed over the 2010s a bit of mantra that if you want to beat Geelong you need to bring the pressure. Some sides could do it, but would need to expend a lot of energy tickets in the process. Look at how well Adelaide and Sydney did the weeks following their big wins against us in preliminary finals. They couldn't back it up. The difference last year and this year is that we have gotten a lot better at absorbing the pressure - taking the sting out of a game when its necessary and putting the sting back into it when it suits us. We could have very well won the flag last year if we had executed better on the day. From my perspective it wasn't just a super-human performance by one player that was our downfall. He simply finished off their structural ascendency. In that game it was us who didn't play smart, expended our tickets early, perhaps over-anxious we didn't stick to what had worked through the year - even in the first half when we were on top.

 

[kittypurry]

When we have lost games (both this year and last) it has been out inability to cope with high pressure from the opposition. We simply have to be better at soaking that up and then putting our own pressure on in return to regain ghe momentum and score. Accurate kicking is also important - ie take your chances

I think I have to disagree with you here. The Dogs was by far the highest pressure game of the year and we won.

We lost this year due to things like flatness (Brisbane) or not playing the Geelong way (Crows.) Melbourne we were undermanned and struggling after a short pre-season. Sydney we should have won if not for a bizarre umpiring decision. Against the Crows, Demons and Swans we were still trying to find our feet during the season. That's why we lost those three games--short pre-season, undermanned, mentally fatigued after last year and the short break between seasons, the coaching staff trying to settle on the correct game plan and so on.

We cope with high pressure extremely well. That is the advantage of having an experienced team. We regain momentum extremely well too--we did so quickly against both Freo and Port.

To win the flag, I think we just need to be fit and lucky with injuries. On our best day we can beat anyone in the competition and I haven't felt that way since 2011. I'm not saying it will be a walk in the park, what with the Dogs up and about and Swans the dark horse, but for the first time in a decade I feel like we have a red hot shot here!

 

[Turkey Tom]

Getting to the pointy end of things now, and we have clearly established ourselves again as a contender.

Discuss what needs to happen from here on for us to win the premiership.

Good Luck.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Good Luck.

when it’s as even as it is at the top end, we need all the luck. There is nothing in it this year and it will be thin margins

 

[DanA]

Lets not forget against Melbourne:

• Jack Henry played CHF
• Dangerfield, Cameron, and Rohan we're not playing
• Atkins was still learning to be a defender
• We weren't yet getting the most out of Isaac Smith
  7

  Isaac Smith

  Age

  35

  Ht

  188cm

  Wt

  83kg

  Pos.

  M/F

  Career

  Season

  Last 5

  D

  21.3

  5star

  K

  13.0

  5star

  HB

  8.4

  5star

  M

  5.5

  5star

  T

  2.9

  4star

  CL

  1.7

  4star

  D

  19.4

  4star

  K

  11.1

  4star

  HB

  8.3

  4star

  M

  3.8

  4star

  T

  2.5

  3star

  CL

  1.3

  4star

  D

  19.2

  5star

  K

  10.6

  4star

  HB

  8.6

  5star

  M

  7.6

  5star

  T

  2.0

  4star

  CL

  0.6

  3star

• We were still stuck in 2020 ball movement mentality (down back); and
• Gawn gave Stanley a bath (one of his off days)

Against Brisbane we had an interstate game, off the back of a 6-day break following easily our two most intense games (Port/Bulldogs). I suspect the players were mentally fried and that goes to explain a bit of our behavior (especially Stewart). Brisbane are a good team, and were flying at the time so it didn't take a lot for us to fall in a heap.

For us to do something this finals series I think the primary factor will be the health of our list. If we can have Cameron in the side, add Duncan, and then have the rest of the list relatively fresh then we are extremely tough to beat.