Essendon and North Melbourne - who finishes higher in 2023?

[eth-dog]

You've literally just added to my point.

LDU, Simpkin, Thomas, Scott, Larkey, Zurhaar, Mckay, Logue all coming through together and entering their prime together. That blows the list of Essendon players you mentioned out of the water.

You are absolutely kidding if you think Mcdonald wouldnt get a game in front of those blokes. Redman is a good player no doubt, but Mcdonald is better than all three you have mentioned. Best and Fairest winner also i believe.

If Mckay leaves no doubt huge issues. Could say the same about Parish and Redman.

I'd take McGrath, Draper, Parish, Langford, Caldwell, Ridley, Laverde, Wright, Durham, Redman, Zerk-Thatcher and Martin ahead of that group comfortably. And that's not even including the kids like Perkins, Cox, Reid, Hobbs, Tsatas, Jones and D'Ambrosio, most of whom have showed significantly more than North's kids. I mean, you've included Bailey Scott there. Seriously.

Luke McDonald is better than Jordan Ridley for winning the BnF in a team that won 3 games... Yet Ridley won Essendon's BnF the same year in a side that won twice as many games. Luke McDonald would absolutely not get a game ahead of them.

Redman is a very good player and I'd hate to see him go but it's not a position we're lacking in. Parish the same, although I wouldn't care if he went. No where near the same importance as what McKay is for North.

 

[Rob R]

Neither team is as they played last year. Essendon has more developed talent and should finish higher by a couple of wins but you never know what will happen with North having a good coach and Essendon likely to be undermined by Sheedy, Hird and their media mates.

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[buttox]

Essendon I think but it will be closer than most think.
Bottom 5 in no particular order.
Hawks, WC, GWS, north and Essendon.
Just imo ofc.

 

[The Nostradamus]

Also factor in dons have used car salesman norths sloppy seconds brad scott

Whereas we have 4 time premiership coach clarko

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Also factor in dons have used car salesman norths sloppy seconds brad scott

Whereas we have 4 time premiership coach clarko

No sense of irony here. No way.

 

[EBERT THE KING]

I'd take McGrath, Draper, Parish, Langford, Caldwell, Ridley, Laverde, Wright, Durham, Redman, Zerk-Thatcher and Martin ahead of that group comfortably. And that's not even including the kids like Perkins, Cox, Reid, Hobbs, Tsatas, Jones and D'Ambrosio, most of whom have showed significantly more than North's kids. I mean, you've included Bailey Scott there. Seriously.

Luke McDonald is better than Jordan Ridley for winning the BnF in a team that won 3 games... Yet Ridley won Essendon's BnF the same year in a side that won twice as many games. Luke McDonald would absolutely not get a game ahead of them.

Redman is a very good player and I'd hate to see him go but it's not a position we're lacking in. Parish the same, although I wouldn't care if he went. No where near the same importance as what McKay is for North.

Lets break that down a little:

Mcgrath - What has happened here? Stagnated massively. Needs a massive 2023 considering he was picked in front of Mcgluggage
Draper - Future star
Parish - Hit and miss. Seems as though Essendon fans could take him or leave him
Langford - Entering his 9th season and has really done nothing. One season of 20+ average possessions - Plodder
Caldwell - Yet to be determined how he goes
Ridley - Solid player, Looks promising
Laverde - See Langford
Wright - Good player, is it sustainable?
Durham - Yet to be determine how we goes
Redman - Good player
Zerk-Thatcher - Played less than 30 games in 5 years, hard to tell

The rest are kids. Perkins probably looks the best of the lot. Tsatsas might end up A grade.

Theres a hell of a lot of middle tier players in the list you mentioned. Plus Stringer, Setterfield and Shiel who are also B graders.

I just feel its really on the brink at Essendon.

I just think North have a higher ceiling, and have had players come along in key positions at a critical time, giving Clarko plenty to work with in all areas of the ground. Having Larkey, Mckay, LDU, Simpkin all in key areas of the ground gives great structure. Essendon just dont have that.

 

[eth-dog]

Lets break that down a little:

Mcgrath - What has happened here? Stagnated massively. Needs a massive 2023 considering he was picked in front of Mcgluggage
Draper - Future star
Parish - Hit and miss. Seems as though Essendon fans could take him or leave him
Langford - Entering his 9th season and has really done nothing. One season of 20+ average possessions - Plodder
Caldwell - Yet to be determined how he goes
Ridley - Solid player, Looks promising
Laverde - See Langford
Wright - Good player, is it sustainable?
Durham - Yet to be determine how we goes
Redman - Good player
Zerk-Thatcher - Played less than 30 games in 5 years, hard to tell

The rest are kids. Perkins probably looks the best of the lot. Tsatsas might end up A grade.

Theres a hell of a lot of middle tier players in the list you mentioned. Plus Stringer, Setterfield and Shiel who are also B graders.

I just feel its really on the brink at Essendon.

I just think North have a higher ceiling, and have had players come along in key positions at a critical time, giving Clarko plenty to work with in all areas of the ground. Having Larkey, Mckay, LDU, Simpkin all in key areas of the ground gives great structure. Essendon just dont have that.

Right.

The older, more experienced list that has won 9 games in 3 years isn't on the brink.

The younger list which won nearly triple the games they have in the same period is.

Essendon are so much better than North it isn't funny. The fact you think Luke McDonald is better than Jordan Ridley betrays how little you know

 

[DERO]

Can we at least agree that Hawthorn are a good chance for the spoon?

 

[EBERT THE KING]

Right.

The older, more experienced list that has won 9 games in 3 years isn't on the brink.

The younger list which won nearly triple the games they have in the same period is.

Essendon are so much better than North it isn't funny. The fact you think Luke McDonald is better than Jordan Ridley betrays how little you know

Norths list age is heavily skewed by Goldstein, who will finish up in 2023, and even then the whole "older, more experienced" angle has been completely debunked in recent years. Ziebell will finish up too.

I honestly dont know how you can say that Essendon will be so much better than North. it will be very close.

As mentioned previously, the ceiling of some of Norths younger players, who are entering their prime now, is just simply higher than Essendons.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

I can only think some folks are trolling Don fans. Of course Essendon will finish higher. North will be fighting the Hawks for the spoon.

 

[eth-dog]

Norths list age is heavily skewed by Goldstein, who will finish up in 2023, and even then the whole "older, more experienced" angle has been completely debunked in recent years. Ziebell will finish up too.

I honestly dont know how you can say that Essendon will be so much better than North. it will be very close.

As mentioned previously, the ceiling of some of Norths younger players, who are entering their prime now, is just simply higher than Essendons.

"Heavily skewed".

North have 6 players 30 years or older on their list, Essendon 2. North have 4 players with 200+ games, Essendon 1. North have 11 players with 100+ games on their list, Essendon 10.

North have an older, more experienced list than Essendon, so how exactly has that been debunked?And yet Essendon have still significantly outperformed them in season despite this.

You say they have a higher ceiling? Based on what? Their inferior results despite having a more mature list?

 

[TheUnicorn]

We judge players by their draft position not their skill on big footy dontcha know

 

[EBERT THE KING]

"Heavily skewed".

North have 6 players 30 years or older on their list, Essendon 2. North have 4 players with 200+ games, Essendon 1. North have 11 players with 100+ games on their list, Essendon 10.

North have an older, more experienced list than Essendon, so how exactly has that been debunked?And yet Essendon have still significantly outperformed them in season despite this.

You say they have a higher ceiling? Based on what? Their inferior results despite having a more mature list?

Im not sure what your argument is here? My argument is that North have a higher ceiling, and i think that starts this year. Nothing to do with older players, however i think they add significant leadership, which Essendon also lack outside of Heppell.

I base this off watching and forming an opinion on both teams. I think Essendon have massive issues in the defensive half. I also also think north have a better group of younger players all coming through together.

 

[eth-dog]

Im not sure what your argument is here? My argument is that North have a higher ceiling, and i think that starts this year. Nothing to do with older players, however i think they add significant leadership, which Essendon also lack outside of Heppell.

I base this off watching and forming an opinion on both teams. I think Essendon have massive issues in the defensive half. I also also think north have a better group of younger players all coming through together.

Essendon are younger and better than North.

North don't have defensive issues despite being worse defensively by every metric, but Essendon do.

You say North have a higher ceiling, based on what? Their inferior record in terms of wins, their inferior defense, their inferior forward line, their inferior midfield? Essendon have significantly outperformed them all over the ground despite being younger an less experienced.

It's the vibe, it's Mabo.

 

[The Nostradamus]

Inferior midfield lol

No team in the comp is stopping LDU Simpkin Phillips Powell Wardlaw Sheezel in 2 years time

With other high end talent in Sleevo and Thomas rotating through mid and forward

 

[Yoda_]

Im not sure what your argument is here? My argument is that North have a higher ceiling, and i think that starts this year. Nothing to do with older players, however i think they add significant leadership, which Essendon also lack outside of Heppell.

I base this off watching and forming an opinion on both teams. I think Essendon have massive issues in the defensive half. I also also think north have a better group of younger players all coming through together.

I don't buy the "Essendon has defensive issues", we finished 6th best for points against, better than Melbourne, Geelong, Bulldogs despite being pathetic as a clearance team (3rd last).


I will give you the leadership or lack thereof but as an Essendon supporter, hoping the next wave of dudes finally step up and take control of the group.

 

[Yoda_]

Inferior midfield lol

No team in the comp is stopping LDU Simpkin Phillips Powell Wardlaw Sheezel in 2 years time

With other high end talent in Sleevo and Thomas rotating through mid and forward

Settle down,

Gold Coast's will be right there beside you. They just have the KPP's to challenge further than a 7 - 14 spot

 

[The Nostradamus]

Settle down,

Gold Coast's will be right there beside you. They just have the KPP's to challenge further than a 7 - 14 spot

McKay and Larkey are our bookends and I’d happily take them over what others have

 

[Yoda_]

McKay and Larkey are our bookends and I’d happily take them over what others have

McKay is under rated, will give you that.

Larkey I am personally not sold on, goes missing in half his games and then skews his stats for the year with a couple of boom games.

 

[eth-dog]

Inferior midfield lol

No team in the comp is stopping LDU Simpkin Phillips Powell Wardlaw Sheezel in 2 years time

With other high end talent in Sleevo and Thomas rotating through mid and forward

What a powerhouse.

Not as if they were 14th in clearance difference and 16th in contested possession difference...

 

[Jeremias]

Inferior midfield lol

No team in the comp is stopping LDU Simpkin Phillips Powell Wardlaw Sheezel in 2 years time

With other high end talent in Sleevo and Thomas rotating through mid and forward

Lol. Even by your standards this is a horrendous take.

In 2 years time most midfields in the comp would be pretty confident coming up against that group.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

North Melbourne.

Better list, far superior coach.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Lol. Even by your standards this is a horrendous take.

In 2 years time most midfields in the comp would be pretty confident coming up against that group.

Maybe he was off by a year or two, and wrong about Stephenson and Thomas, but that future North midfield is going to be very good (LDU is almost at an elite level now) and I think Phillips and Powell will thrive under Clarko

Sheezel is probably going to end up the best player of his draft class (even better than Ashcroft) and Wardlaw, if his body holds up, is going to be a contested possie beast.

Definitely taking North's list going forwards over Essendon (which has a significantly smaller ceiling on current and exposed form)

 

[TheUnicorn]

Maybe he was off by a year or two, and wrong about Stephenson and Thomas, but that future North midfield is going to be very good (LDU is almost at an elite level now) and I think Phillips and Powell will thrive under Clarko

Sheezel is probably going to end up the best player of his draft class (even better than Ashcroft) and Wardlaw, if his body holds up, is going to be a contested possie beast.

Definitely taking North's list going forwards over Essendon (which has a significantly smaller ceiling on current and exposed form)

plz no hurt my feelings

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Definitely taking North's list going forwards over Essendon (which has a significantly smaller ceiling on current and exposed form)

Season's greetings Elmer.

Have to take issue with you. North just turned in one of the worst seasons on record. They have recruited B graders there for super boosting purposes and drafted some promising kids.

Their list is poor from drafting and trades. Clarko has a massive challenge to get them to ground zero from where they are at which is at bottom of a sink hole.

Realistically if they can get their % to the high 70s and jag one or maybe two more wins they will have done well.

The Dons are further advanced and provided Scott can keep poisonous media types like Watson and Robbo at bay, they have a chance of a small improvement. The key is getting more established players to run both ways.