North Melbourne v West Coast.. who will be better in 2024?

[Liam Boy]

North might win more games this year than previous, but it’s most likely going to need a very defensive gameplan from Clarkson to protect that back 6. Could mean some very unwatchable games.

Overrated factor imo. It's not going to be amazing but I don't think it's a decisive weakness they'll have to build the whole gameplan around. I don't know if losing McKay really hurts us that much, he has a unique skillset that makes him valuable but he sucked at playing zone defense, and it's looking like Logue will be back way sooner than expected. Corr is generally pretty reliable, just need one of Pink, K.Dawson, Nyuon or Comben to hold up for a few weeks back there. whether we keep Sheezel back there or try McKercher along with Fisher coming in the rebounders are looking pretty good, Bergman and Archer should be starting to put away their early career injury trouble, and Hardeman may surprise a few. I think there's enough talent back there for it to hold up relatively well, no way it's worse or even as bad as last year with Ziebell and Hall on their last legs and Young, Perez and Bonar getting games

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Overrated factor imo. It's not going to be amazing but I don't think it's a decisive weakness they'll have to build the whole gameplan around. I don't know if losing McKay really hurts us that much, he has a unique skillset that makes him valuable but he sucked at playing zone defense, and it's looking like Logue will be back way sooner than expected. Corr is generally pretty reliable, just need one of Pink, K.Dawson, Nyuon or Comben to hold up for a few weeks back there. whether we keep Sheezel back there or try McKercher along with Fisher coming in the rebounders are looking pretty good, Bergman and Archer should be starting to put away their early career injury trouble, and Hardeman may surprise a few. I think there's enough talent back there for it to hold up relatively well, no way it's worse or even as bad as last year with Ziebell and Hall on their last legs and Young, Perez and Bonar getting games

Obviously lots of what ifs in all that and a fair few question marks around your tall defenders.

 

[Swallow_Wood]

I dont care how old he is im saying he is not big. Put him next to Petracca and he would get ragdolled, as youd expect from most teenagers around his height.
I dont understand why its such a hard concept for you to grasp that as a second year player, he is simply not as physically developed as older players

Didn't mention his age mate. I said for his size his power and strength measurements are through the roof. And this off the back of lighter loads due to him and the club being conservative due to his hammy issues.

 

[Shueygod]

Does sheezel require the ball feed out to him?

Sheezel certainly isn’t an in and under player. Not sure why you didn’t answer my question?

 

[the big lebowski]

Sheezel certainly isn’t an in and under player. Not sure why you didn’t answer my question?

Same reason as you didn’t answer mine.

Does sheezel require the ball to be fed to him?

I’ll answer for you.

No. He won the same amount of contested possessions per game as Ginbey and more than Hewitt. He won twice the intercept possessions as Ginbey. And was only slightly behind them in clearances despite very little time in the midfield. When he did play in the midfield he had 5 clearances in a game. One less than Ginbey’s top of 6.

He also averaged 2.9 tackles per game, more than the 1.7 for Hewitt. Not that the boss levels of just under 6 for Ginbey and wardlaw but not bad.

All in all the incorrect picture you’re trying to paint of sheezel “needing to be fed the ball” on the periphery of the pack is demonstrably wrong.

Sheezel can be an inside/outside mid. An attacking half back. A damaging high half forward. Or a deep 50 goal kicker.

To answer your question. No daicos is not the contested beast Wardlaw is. That doesn’t mean he can’t win his own footy. Which he currently does to a higher level than sheezel, Ginbey, Wardlaw or Hewitt.

 

[Shueygod]

when was the last

Same reason as you didn’t answer mine.

Does sheezel require the ball to be fed to him?

I’ll answer for you.

No. He won the same amount of contested possessions per game as Ginbey and more than Hewitt. He won twice the intercept possessions as Ginbey. And was only slightly behind them in clearances despite very little time in the midfield. When he did play in the midfield he had 5 clearances in a game. One less than Ginbey’s top of 6.

He also averaged 2.9 tackles per game, more than the 1.7 for Hewitt. Not that the boss levels of just under 6 for Ginbey and wardlaw but not bad.

All in all the incorrect picture you’re trying to paint of sheezel “needing to be fed the ball” on the periphery of the pack is demonstrably wrong.

Sheezel can be an inside/outside mid. An attacking half back. A damaging high half forward. Or a deep 50 goal kicker.

To answer your question. No daicos is not the contested beast Wardlaw is. That doesn’t mean he can’t win his own footy. Which he currently does to a higher level than sheezel, Ginbey, Wardlaw or Hewitt.

Daicos is a seagull just like Sheezel. I used him to prove contested possessions mean * all in terms of ball winning ability.

 

[the big lebowski]

when was the last

Daicos is a seagull just like Sheezel. I used him to prove contested possessions mean * all in terms of ball winning ability.

A seagull that got Brownlow votes and 6 coaches votes in his first game, and wins as much contested footy as seagull Ginbey and albatross Hewitt

Or is Ginbey a dodo? Can’t win more contested footy than a seagull in sheezel. Will be extinct soon if that’s the case.

 

[Shueygod]

A seagull that got Brownlow votes and 6 coaches votes in his first game, and wins as much contested footy as seagull Ginbey and albatross Hewitt

Or is Ginbey a dodo? Can’t win more contested footy than a seagull in sheezel. Will be extinct soon if that’s the case.

Sheezel may finish his career without a single hard ball get.

 

[the big lebowski]

Sheezel may finish his career without a single hard ball get.

Sure. If you erase 2023 and then he never plays another game.

 

[Liam Boy]

Sheezel may finish his career without a single hard ball get.

I'm not sure how you define a hard ball get but can I jog your memory?



his speciality is reading loose balls and leaving his opponent for dead. It looks uncontested because he gives them no chance of catching him.

 

[_Cerberus_]

People badly underestimating the Eagles. Had the worst injury run over a two year period I have ever seen. When they finally had a few back late in the season of 2023, they were more competitive and won a couple of games. They won't make the eight, but I wouldn't say they are sure things for the spoon either. They were more injured than "crap". Still expect a close game between the two head to head anyway, and not too far a part on the ladder. Tipping Eagles to just edge ahead this year, North to over take over and finish ahead next year.

 

[Jeremias]

West Coast IMO, assuming their injury list isn't as bad as it has been over the past two years.

Much better senior core + a significant home ground advantage in comparison.

North I see struggling big time for at least one more year.

 

[stallon]

Didn't mention his age mate. I said for his size his power and strength measurements are through the roof. And this off the back of lighter loads due to him and the club being conservative due to his hammy issues.

You did when you said hes strong for his age. Hes still a second year player

 

[stallon]

A seagull that got Brownlow votes and 6 coaches votes in his first game, and wins as much contested footy as seagull Ginbey and albatross Hewitt

Or is Ginbey a dodo? Can’t win more contested footy than a seagull in sheezel. Will be extinct soon if that’s the case.

LMAO

 

[Swallow_Wood]

You did when you said hes strong for his age. Hes still a second year player

Reread my post.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Simpson finally got stuck into players coming back unfit. NicNat was the size of a barn and Yeo came back in 22 with a Swiss roll hanging over his shorts. That all said you’d expect a better run with injury at WCE. They and Freo also have the misfortune of playing on the hard and unforgiving Optus deck.

With a reasonable run they will win more games, certainly more than an anaemic nmfc.

 

[Tandy]

WCE will bounce back. Actually overly optimistic about them. Allen will take a massive step, Harley Reid will be like a 3rd or 4th yr player instantly. Because he'll be leading from the front in the middle he will bring everyone along for the ride.
List make up:
30 yrs or older - 5 players
23-29 - 17
18-22 - 21

The players 30 or over are Darling, McGovern, Yeo, Cripps and Gaff. They'll either be best 22 or be pushed out of the way. Win/win. Finals within 3 yrs, followed by a short peak and another bottom out.

West Coast Playing List for 2024 - Draftguru

www.draftguru.com.au

 

[RHLK]

'The West Coast Eagles' are a product of 7West so, I'm guessing...WCE?

Nothing beats PR, even reality.

 

[Arr0w]

WCE, still a strong ish spine, better ruck options

 

[Art OF war]

North Melbourne. Their midfield should be good enough to protect their backline. Eagles will be more competitive overall this year but still expect a fair few blowouts.

 

[ferball]

Literally Ginbey

Look he's a good player and tough, fast etc I genuinely like how he goes about it... but Warlord has something about him that is pretty nuts. I thought we'd see his manic ferocity from No Chase Jase. But we didn't obviously.

I have watched more of North than you think i have. Ive definitely watched more North than you have watched the Eagles at least. Remember this is a thread comparing the two teams, not arguing if one or the other has good youngsters

Probably. At least over the last 12 months as I've seen * all of other sides.

Its not really about our youth. Our injuries were as important as anything in us losing games last year, at least a few games. We lost a bunch by a goal/under and a couple more under 10 points. And they're hurting us now with our older backline players.

We didn't cop the floggings you lot did.

Stability at our club has been a s**t show since the end of 2018. For the first time since then things look ok for us on that front. If the first half of the season is stable off field the second half will be good on field.

Its probably the most important thing we have going for us.

 

[ferball]

Sheezel may finish his career without a single hard ball get.

You mean another single one cos he had a few last year that you obviously didn't notice.

 

[stallon]

Probably. At least over the last 12 months as I've seen * all of other sides.

Its not really about our youth. Our injuries were as important as anything in us losing games last year, at least a few games. We lost a bunch by a goal/under and a couple more under 10 points. And they're hurting us now with our older backline players.

From what I see, yes you had a few injuries, but not enough to make the season an outlier, just more injuries than average.
In the offseason, you lost a couple of your best experienced defenders, Mckay and Ziebell, and have gained a SANFL player and a half back who couldnt get games at carlton and thats about it, no young defenders who are likely to do much at all in the backline this year in terms of actually defending.
Im sure your midfield and forward line will improve, but will it be enough to make up for the disaster of a defence? Im not sure.

For the eagles, we will have natural progression, a bit all over the ground, and probably a little less than North, but the biggest thing we have is that if we can keep the injury list at a normal length, thats HUGE improvement on its own. The bits that guys like Yeo and Gov in particular played last year tells me that if they can stay healthy for 18+ rounds, I cant see us being bottom 2.

Take our end of season form, then add in some fitness to underdone guys who were rushed back from injury, and natural progression. North were probably more consistent all year.

We didn't cop the floggings you lot did.

You didnt cop the floggings, because if you compared the lists, your team was VERY healthy compared to us. There was no other club even remotely close to the eagles injury list last year, we were relying on the guys who are 40+ in the list in line for games to do serious work. I dont think fans of other clubs, or even a lot of west coast fans appreciate how detrimental the injury list was to us last year.
I dont like to make it seem like an excuse, but honestly there isnt a single club that would have been outside the bottom 2 with our injuries.

Stability at our club has been a s**t show since the end of 2018. For the first time since then things look ok for us on that front. If the first half of the season is stable off field the second half will be good on field.

Its probably the most important thing we have going for us.

Yeah agree if Clarko is there without distraction and everything else is fine, itll help for sure. I wonder how much of the gameplan they used last year was Clarkos, or if itll come more into play this year

Look he's a good player and tough, fast etc I genuinely like how he goes about it... but Warlord has something about him that is pretty nuts. I thought we'd see his manic ferocity from No Chase Jase. But we didn't obviously.

Theyre not the same player, but there is still similar upside imo, at least for this year in isolation. Itll be hard for Wardlaw to do his stuff for a whole year as a second year player, whereas Ginbey has the more defensive role and is much bigger than Wardlaw.

 

[VinnieB]

North still have a long way to go, because they might have talented kids, the rest of the team looks average. However, WCE are just rubbish. Can use injury as an excuse but most of the old blokes are well past it. Gaff is a prime example. They may win a couple of extra games when these guys are fit, but don’t think they’ll win more than 5 games.

 

[Seattle Mariners]

Maybe West Coast just.

I reckon one of the two is going to take a significant leap and finish 9th-12th and win 9 to 11 games.. Just not sure which one.