Swans 2017 , Longmire and their playing list.

[SSSSSS]

The advantages they have continue to be underplayed. Yeah they built a great culture and have some great home grown players and those they traded in for unders (eg Kennedy).

But they've had the luxury of the Tippett trade being a bust and it not affecting them due to COLA (yes I know that's wound down/gone now but was a factor at the time) which allowed them to pinch Buddy as well as taking 2 top 3 picks in Heeney and Mills for way unders due to the academy zones. There was also some trickery around Jack being drafted which the AFL looked the other way on.

For mine Longmire has underachieved considering the advantages he's got although to be fair they were crucified by the umps in last year's GF. The 0-6 start this year seems unforgiveable from the outside and has cost them a golden opportunity at redemption for last year's loss.

Didn't want to touch on the advantages Sydney gets because that usually devolves in an absolute shitfest from my experience but it's hard not to agree with you.

 

[J_Moore]

In assessing our list, I think people often overrate the quality of the midfield.

 

[Bulldogs Legend]

Hawks 2014 team would completely ream the Doggies of 2016. That is the one that got away for Sydney.

Pretty sure we played the Hawks two weeks before the Swans and crushed them both!!

 

[Bulldogs Legend]

I thought it was a good effort by the Swans they had the Runners up hangover to deal with!!!

 

[MotleyLemon]

In assessing our list, I think people often overrate the quality of the midfield.

3 AA mids in 2016?

 

[J_Moore]

3 AA mids in 2016?

Obviously they're very strong at what they do.

None are the complete midfielder, though. In particular, the major failing for all three is speed and field kicking.

We lack a really strong inside/outside player who can be relied upon to do a few jobs well, including distribute the all. Guys like Sloane, Beams. Bontempelli, Dangerfield (can't kick but pace out of packs helps cover that), most of the GWS midfield, etc.

I'd say one thing that everyone underestimated about the Crows mids this year is they've got 4 players that can do that job: Sloane, both Crouch boys, and Douglas.

The hope is Heeney will become that player (with Hewett as a solid B-grader backup), but he's not there yet.

 

[Kummerspeck]

The advantages they have continue to be underplayed. Yeah they built a great culture and have some great home grown players and those they traded in for unders (eg Kennedy).

But they've had the luxury of the Tippett trade being a bust and it not affecting them due to COLA (yes I know that's wound down/gone now but was a factor at the time) which allowed them to pinch Buddy

This makes no sense. Tippett was playing very well when Franklin came in and Franklin's contract was based around associated services payments which didn't attract COLA. I also fail to see how having a sudden 10% cut in your salary cap can just be dismissed.

well as taking 2 top 3 picks in Heeney and Mills for way unders due to the academy zones.

Melbourne has academy zones in traditional football areas. Sydney's are in places with most no connection to football. Doesn't seem like AFL favouritism to me.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Obviously they're very strong at what they do.

None are the complete midfielder, though. In particular, the major failing for all three is speed and field kicking.

We lack a really strong inside/outside player who can be relied upon to do a few jobs well, including distribute the all. Guys like Sloane, Beams. Bontempelli, Dangerfield (can't kick but pace out of packs helps cover that), most of the GWS midfield, etc.

I'd say one thing that everyone underestimated about the Crows mids this year is they've got 4 players that can do that job: Sloane, both Crouch boys, and Douglas.

The hope is Heeney will become that player (with Hewett as a solid B-grader backup), but he's not there yet.

Heeney will become that player and more, IMO.

 

[bungwahl]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/doubts-raised-over-jacks-draft-20111210-1ool4.html

And every club passed on him multiple times before the Swans took him at #58..

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

With McVeigh the only one retiring (I think?) and blooding a lot of youth the last two years and still making a GF and a semi in that time - I think they're well placed.

A decent second forward would really take them places.

They have a decent second forward in Reid, but they keep playing him in defence as the loose man. So often on Friday night, they had Franklin on two players, at least Reid provides a second option and maybe a chance to bring it to ground. Their defensive posts are largely strong, with Grundy, Melican, Aliir and Rampe as a pseudo-tall/third tall. Why the need to move Reid back?

But they seem to want to play Sinclair the rest ruck down there, who has played a few good games this year but otherwise has been average.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

In assessing our list, I think people often overrate the quality of the midfield.

It should be a lot stronger (another reason why letting Mitchell go was odd). Parker has the attributes but does struggle in big games, Jack looks past it. I think the early season injury/illness to Heeney hurt your midfield, as I suspect he was ear-marked to go in there but then got glanduler fever(?). Kennedy is a gun and Hannebury gives you great run through there and is a gun.

 

[Carlton_Blues]

My biggest issue is the coach and his lack of a plan B, C, etc. Our best is up there, but if that is stopped, Longmire has donuts.

A few good trades, and all of a sudden we are a lot better in 2018.

His playing list is more than capable. After watching the 2016 GF, should a coach be expected to have a plan B, C, etc to counter bad umpiring? In all fairness he'd have 2 GF wins against his name, and nobody would be questioning his ability right now.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Pretty sure we played the Hawks two weeks before the Swans and crushed them both!!

That's a nice story. But the doggies didn't crush either side. The 2014 Hawks would have dispatched your team last season easily. The 2014 Swans would have done the same.

 

[Bulldogs Legend]

That's a nice story. But the doggies didn't crush either side. The 2014 Hawks would have dispatched your team last season easily. The 2014 Swans would have done the same.

Yeah but that's all speculation lets just deal with the facts, we smashed you and the Swans and GWS away and WCE away to have the greatest Finals series of all time!!!

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I think Geelong using Clarkson's plan really caught Longmire by surprise.

But that surprise doesn't account for the amount of ridiculous skill errors that the players served-up. It was unbelievable.

The early Danger frees didn't help as it gave Geelong the early scoreboard pressure and belief that Sydney had denied them in last year's final.

And you'd think that they would have done something to rectify the loose Geelong back all game. Every time Sydney brought the ball forward Geelong had the extra man. At one point McVeigh was playing out of the square on two defenders... How does that even happen?

In fairness Scott/Geelong played a blinder and the Sydney players played the worst collective game I've seen them play that I can honestly remember to date.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Yeah but that's all speculation lets just deal with the facts, we smashed you and the Swans and GWS away and WCE away to have the greatest Finals series of all time!!!

Jog on, let the adults talk

 

[HairyO]

3 AA mids in 2016?

Carried by Kennedy. And exposed in finals over and over.

AA selectors time and again prove they have NFI about the game.

 

[threesixpio]

Yep agree

2016 was swans for the taking

Not enough fire in the belly. Except for Buddy. He craves premierships

 

[threesixpio]

I think Geelong using Clarkson's plan really caught Longmire by surprise.

But that surprise doesn't account for the amount of ridiculous skill errors that the players served-up. It was unbelievable.

The early Danger frees didn't help as it gave Geelong the early scoreboard pressure and belief that Sydney had denied them in last year's final.

And you'd think that they would have done something to rectify the loose Geelong back all game. Every time Sydney brought the ball forward Geelong had the extra man. At one point McVeigh was playing out of the square on two defenders... How does that even happen?

In fairness Scott/Geelong played a blinder and the Sydney players played the worst collective game I've seen them play that I can honestly remember to date.

Maybe we should fool Geelong into believing that we will play like Sydney and then they will play like Hawthorn and we will surprise them by playing like Geelong.

Ok I'm confused

 

[Gavin Excell]

Not enough fire in the belly. Except for Buddy. He craves premierships

Not so sure. Theres vision post match of JPK and hes quite distraught at the loss

 

[Gavin Excell]

I think Geelong using Clarkson's plan really caught Longmire by surprise.

But that surprise doesn't account for the amount of ridiculous skill errors that the players served-up. It was unbelievable.

The early Danger frees didn't help as it gave Geelong the early scoreboard pressure and belief that Sydney had denied them in last year's final.

And you'd think that they would have done something to rectify the loose Geelong back all game. Every time Sydney brought the ball forward Geelong had the extra man. At one point McVeigh was playing out of the square on two defenders... How does that even happen?

In fairness Scott/Geelong played a blinder and the Sydney players played the worst collective game I've seen them play that I can honestly remember to date.

Yes Henderson had a field day down back. Thought there would be a correction after half time but it never came

 

[Hawks81]

This makes no sense. Tippett was playing very well when Franklin came in and Franklin's contract was based around associated services payments which didn't attract COLA. I also fail to see how having a sudden 10% cut in your salary cap can just be dismissed.


Melbourne has academy zones in traditional football areas. Sydney's are in places with most no connection to football. Doesn't seem like AFL favouritism to me.

When are you going to Stop peddling half truths ?

 

[MickyG]

I think Geelong using Clarkson's plan really caught Longmire by surprise.

But that surprise doesn't account for the amount of ridiculous skill errors that the players served-up. It was unbelievable.

The early Danger frees didn't help as it gave Geelong the early scoreboard pressure and belief that Sydney had denied them in last year's final.

And you'd think that they would have done something to rectify the loose Geelong back all game. Every time Sydney brought the ball forward Geelong had the extra man. At one point McVeigh was playing out of the square on two defenders... How does that even happen?

In fairness Scott/Geelong played a blinder and the Sydney players played the worst collective game I've seen them play that I can honestly remember to date.

Geelong using Clarkson's game plan should not surprise though. He should be prepared and act. Instead we get stick to what we do, do it well enough and we will win. The commentary team is saying he should go one on one and for once they actually said something that's right.

I think the Swans must have over-trained during the week. In which case the coaches are to blame and not the players. Also, they should have been down in Melbourne preparing for the wet conditions a few days before the game - also on the coaches.

Every Geelong player was superb and pretty much every Swan player was terrible.

 

[HairyO]

I think Geelong using Clarkson's plan really caught Longmire by surprise.

Only one team beat the Swans in the last 3 months... and they did it twice.

If Scott didnt look closely at those games he'd be mocked for being a terrible coach.

Stands to reason we look at Longmire under the same microscope.

 

[threesixpio]

Not so sure. Theres vision post match of JPK and hes quite distraught at the loss

Former Hawthorn. Interesting pattern