Analysis 2019 List Management Discussion

[DangerousD]

At seasons end he will have only clocked 4 years with the Lions so he's no free agent

All players who have previously been delisted become delisted free agents at seasons end (if they’re out of contract), there are plenty of articles surrounding the rule change online.

The list of players isn’t super exciting but Sam Mengelola is on it (for next year), so is Mitch.

 

[DangerousD]

I don’t know, we apparently signed Curnow’s extension at $800k so it’s probably just a reality of how much star players are going to cost in the future. Cripps will be getting these sort of offers when he comes out of contract soon so we will be in a similar position of having to pay huge money.

This is actually the main reason I want us to chase Coniglio so hard. He could shoot us up the ladder and the sooner we are contending the sooner players will start taking unders to try win a premiership. Overpaying someone like Coniglio even say $300k, would mean we only have to get the 30 odd players who are not on minimum pay to take $10,000 less then they would’ve otherwise. If we had Coniglio on our list say this season we would be a very real chance of being 5 wins 1 loss. The excitement that would bring alone You could see players willing to stay on for say $350k instead of $400k, or $600k instead of $700k.

It’s still a huge risk to me. Imagine being Cripps or Doch going through hell at the Blues and finally seeing some light at the end of the tunnel, the club then sign Cogs for $1.2 then offer yourself way less.

The offers then come from other clubs at way overs, we are already paying understand and all of a sudden people are tempted to look elsewhere.

As much as I’d love Cogs, unless he does a Danger at the Cats, or a Lynch at the Tigs or even Shiel then I’d want to pass.

The Giants will lose more good players this season, they have re-signed Hopper, Himmelberg and supposedly Kelly.

Cameron is on a Mill, Greene supposedly $900,000 (they have already deferred his salary ahead to fit in the cap), Cogs will command at least a Mill, Whitfield will command a Mill.

It’s a fine line, overpay like the Swans and lose good players each season.

 

[DangerousD]

Yes it is.

Ok a few people have said this but no whys.

So why is it silly?

He is a good player
He is as tough as nails.
Can play midfield or half forward.
Is a FA at seasons end.
Won’t cost much $$$$$
Hasn’t had any off field issues (as far as I’m aware) since leaving
Fills a need.

I’m not seeing many negatives and the fact no poster has said anything other than, no, bad idea, I feel the objection is purely on stigma or, I can’t really find the word here to articulate my point, but it doesn’t seem based on football.

 

[thylacine60]

it takes a pretty good player to leave a club and return and perform - ablett, beams etc - people through no fault of their own tend to recall favourite player's highlight reels rather than their blooper tapes - yes, robbo has mongrel but we need a little more than that in a player - he seems to have improved on field but we can't be sure how many bridges he burnt on the way out - plus he'd be taking a spot from someone younger, possibly much more exciting

 

[barass70]

Lowson Cup

We’re not interested

 

[Bokan]

We’re not interested

Oh

On CPH1877 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Blue Flame]

We’re not interested

I don't suppose you might know who we are interested in?

 

[agro]

Hazarding a guess I’d say it was Frank Anderson.

 

[Blue Pulse]

Ok a few people have said this but no whys.

So why is it silly?

He is a good player
He is as tough as nails.
Can play midfield or half forward.
Is a FA at seasons end.
Won’t cost much $$$$$-Think you might be surprised, he is a senior player at Brisbane, few of
Hasn’t had any off field issues (as far as I’m aware) since leaving - Bubble of Brisbane, won't draw much attention to himself up there opposed to Melb, unfortunately Mitch has a head that knobs will target here.
Fills a need.-Would of been handy if a few years ago for protection and another hard person in the middle, our mids will be another season tougher next year.

I’m not seeing many negatives and the fact no poster has said anything other than, no, bad idea, I feel the objection is purely on stigma or, I can’t really find the word here to articulate my point, but it doesn’t seem based on football.

Answers above, probably was the best thing for his career was a kick up the backside and he has responded really well, might be really happy there.

 

[Blue Bloods]

Sounds promising except that unfortunately it doesn't guarantee he'll still be on the list at the end of the year when the culling begins. May also depend who we pick up through the trade/draft periods.

I'm confident they'll keep him on though, even rookie listed, so Russell can get him through a full preseason and get him out there. A fit Pickett is a dangerous weapon up forward.

I really hope we keep Pickett, I believe when we become a more mature team and start pushing for finals, Pickett will become a big cog in our team structure and play a more consistent game. A fit Pickett that is.

Bolts on The Couch said Pickett was by far the fastest player on our list.

 

[bigdog43]

Sean Darcy is the ruckman we need to be targeting. Victorian boy, about to hit his prime and most importantly, he can play. Obviously next in line at Freo but we need to be asking the question.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

It’s still a huge risk to me. Imagine being Cripps or Doch going through hell at the Blues and finally seeing some light at the end of the tunnel, the club then sign Cogs for $1.2 then offer yourself way less.

The offers then come from other clubs at way overs, we are already paying understand and all of a sudden people are tempted to look elsewhere.

As much as I’d love Cogs, unless he does a Danger at the Cats, or a Lynch at the Tigs or even Shiel then I’d want to pass.

The Giants will lose more good players this season, they have re-signed Hopper, Himmelberg and supposedly Kelly.

Cameron is on a Mill, Greene supposedly $900,000 (they have already deferred his salary ahead to fit in the cap), Cogs will command at least a Mill, Whitfield will command a Mill.

It’s a fine line, overpay like the Swans and lose good players each season.

It’s a risk no doubt but I think it’s a calculated risk because of the reasons I stated plus he is a proven performer. The leadership group would need to be talked to first though I imagine.
I can’t see Doc getting a pay rise and no one else are going to take a risk of over paying him now. Cripps is going to be getting over a million next deal regardless. Being a captain of a top four side may be more tempting to take a pay cut rather than wanting more because we are overpaying a teammate. We also ignore that we are already overpaying his teammates like Marchbank, Setterfield, Lobbe ect. I’m sure he can see that.

On the Swans they haven’t overpaid for Franklin yet. He is worth atleast what he has currently been paid, it’s the next few years that he will be overpaid.

 

[DangerousD]

It’s a risk no doubt but I think it’s a calculated risk because of the reasons I stated plus he is a proven performer. The leadership group would need to be talked to first though I imagine.
I can’t see Doc getting a pay rise and no one else are going to take a risk of over paying him now. Cripps is going to be getting over a million next deal regardless. Being a captain of a top four side may be more tempting to take a pay cut rather than wanting more because we are overpaying a teammate. We also ignore that we are already overpaying his teammates like Marchbank, Setterfield, Lobbe ect. I’m sure he can see that.

On the Swans they haven’t overpaid for Franklin yet. He is worth atleast what he has currently been paid, it’s the next few years that he will be overpaid.

My point regarding the swans was in regards to bringing in Buddy and to an extent Tippett, as soon as they came in, they lost Mummy who was fantastic at the Giants in the seasons after. They let go of Membrey even though his output was better than Tippett, lost Tom Mitchell (I assume mostly due to $$$$)

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

My point regarding the swans was in regards to bringing in Buddy and to an extent Tippett, as soon as they came in, they lost Mummy who was fantastic at the Giants in the seasons after. They let go of Membrey even though his output was better than Tippett, lost Tom Mitchell (I assume mostly due to $$$$)

I actually forgot all about Tippet. Huge stuff up

 

[Jimmae]

That's a great point. That may allow us 2 picks, is that right? Or did we use Bugg's spot on Cottrell?

Jimmae

Yea, I believe that's correct.

We finished the draft with 1 spot remaining on our list, then Docherty did his ACL, followed by Pickett doing his patellar tendon (3 spots available)

We recruited Cottrel and Gibbons (1 spot available), then Bugg retired, so should have 2 spots available.

We're 40/4/1 (and thus with no mid-season draft spots) until one or both of Docherty and Garlett are placed on the season injury list (distinct from the LTI list).

It sounds like we may have just put Pickett on there, but not Docherty. I'll cover the draft order and permutations in the designated thread.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

We're 40/4/1 (and thus with no mid-season draft spots) until one or both of Docherty and Garlett are placed on the season injury list (distinct from the LTI list).

It sounds like we may have just put Pickett on there, but not Docherty. I'll cover the draft order and permutations in the designated thread.

That's what I thought as well Jimm, until I read this on the rules governing the mid season draft on the AFL website. It looks like we can place Doc as an 'inactive injured player', and still come back toward the end of the year if another player is placed on the list in the back end of the season.

From what I gather from this, we could get 2 picks in the mid season draft given Pickett has been ruled out for the year.

https://www.afl.com.au/news/2019-04...les-clubs-allowed-to-test-up-to-three-players

 

[Jimmae]

That's what I thought as well Jimm, until I read this on the rules governing the mid season draft on the AFL website. It looks like we can place Doc as an 'inactive injured player', and still come back toward the end of the year if another player is placed on the list in the back end of the season.

From what I gather from this, we could get 2 picks in the mid season draft given Pickett has been ruled out for the year.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/2019-04...les-clubs-allowed-to-test-up-to-three-players

View attachment 665484

I suppose it wouldn't be the AFL without them changing the rules on the fly.

We'd have the first pick of the second round if we opt to use it, but if Docherty is ahead of schedule, I don't know how that will go down exactly. Will he be allowed to play VFL until an opportunity arises?

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

I suppose it wouldn't be the AFL without them changing the rules on the fly.

We'd have the first pick of the second round if we opt to use it, but if Docherty is ahead of schedule, I don't know how that will go down exactly. Will he be allowed to play VFL until an opportunity arises?

As a guess, I'd say no (unless it's a Hawthorn player of course)....only because he's a Carlton listed player regardless of whether he's playing for the NB's or the senior team.

If Doc's back for the last month, there'll be no doubt injuries to other players, which would open up a spot for him.

It'll be interesting to see how it all unfolds mid season, although my tip is that we'll just take one pick, for the Pickett injury.

 

[Keyza]

I suppose it wouldn't be the AFL without them changing the rules on the fly.

We'd have the first pick of the second round if we opt to use it, but if Docherty is ahead of schedule, I don't know how that will go down exactly. Will he be allowed to play VFL until an opportunity arises?

I am sure we will have another injury by then so Docherty can be put back on the senior list in place of this yet to be named unfortunate player.

 

[MITSUHIRATO]

Papley will cost us the Adelaide selection.

Contracted, 22 years old, key player in his current side and we are a desperate buyer given the role he plays.

Unless we parlay that Adelaide pick into two later picks - the Swans will rightly demand it.

 

[VeinGlorious]

Papley will cost us the Adelaide selection.

Contracted, 22 years old, key player in his current side and we are a desperate buyer given the role he plays.

Unless we parlay that Adelaide pick into two later picks - the Swans will rightly demand it.

Is Papley worth a late first? I’d do it but would possibly want something coming back. Maybe a 3rd and Paps for our Adelaide 1st.

 

[MITSUHIRATO]

Is Papley worth a late first? I’d do it but would possibly want something coming back. Maybe a 3rd and Paps for our Adelaide 1st.

I might be too optimistic, but I think we’ll get a mid-range pick (8-11) from Adelaide.

I think I’d try and break it down to two later picks and use them both on Papley and Langdon (Freo).

 

[Jeremias]

I might be too optimistic, but I think we’ll get a mid-range pick (8-11) from Adelaide.

I think I’d try and break it down to two later picks and use them both on Papley and Langdon (Freo).

That would be an amazing result if we pulled that off at the end of the year.

Very keen on both, to add one would be a positive, to add both would be sensational.

And I reckon you're pretty spot on with their values, just need to hope Adelaide come to the party and miss the finals or fall out very early on.

 

[zeggie]

It’s still a huge risk to me. Imagine being Cripps or Doch going through hell at the Blues and finally seeing some light at the end of the tunnel, the club then sign Cogs for $1.2 then offer yourself way less.

The offers then come from other clubs at way overs, we are already paying understand and all of a sudden people are tempted to look elsewhere.

As much as I’d love Cogs, unless he does a Danger at the Cats, or a Lynch at the Tigs or even Shiel then I’d want to pass.

The Giants will lose more good players this season, they have re-signed Hopper, Himmelberg and supposedly Kelly.

Cameron is on a Mill, Greene supposedly $900,000 (they have already deferred his salary ahead to fit in the cap), Cogs will command at least a Mill, Whitfield will command a Mill.

It’s a fine line, overpay like the Swans and lose good players each season.

Exactly. There is zero chance we will overpay Cogs or Kelly. We could have matched Shiel's offer but didn't. SOS is all about salary cap balance. I recall him being disgusted with what certain players were being paid when he came across.

Hawks lost a lot of players when they paid heaps for new recruits. Sydney have lost a lot of good players because they couldn't pay them enough. Several teams have paid top dollar for recruits end of last year who are yet to perform.

Don't forget Buddy's 'popularity' at Sydney when he joined on massive dollars compared to his team mates. A lot of them hated him..especially when he went missing finals time x2.

Keep getting good value, improve the team, the team will get more games under their wing and more cohesion. Then we will hopefully dominate.

 

[DangerousD]

We could have matched Shiel's offer but didn't.

Our offer to Shiel was higher than the Dons.