Preview Changes Vs Golden Toast

[threenewpadlocks]

Thanks, hadn’t read that but good to know. Was the “smashing” around the ground or in the actual center bounces, ruck contests, etc.

What does it matter though? Rucks still have to stay on the field and participate in the game beyond the ruck contests (and if we want to extend it toj the "physicality" side, marking contests). They can and by definition do provide negative or positive value relative to an average ruck in general play. As much as people have valid frustrations seeing one of our players get out muscled or whatever, it doesn't negate that the same player is reading the play, winning ground balls, executing skills in disposing of the ball accurately to teammates etc. If a ruck didn't do that, they would be a less valuable player.

If English smashed Darcy in a match sim, he was the better and more valuable player, irrespective of the facets within the ruck role that he was good or bad.

 

[doggies ftw]

It is pretty hit or miss but ranking 3rd last for intercepts over the last 3 years is something we cannot ignore.
Naughton offers an automatic fix to this.
If our defence can tighten up, I see no reason why we can't kick a winning score with our other assests in the front half

Well we had the opportunity to go someway to fixing this on the weekend with Jones, JOD, Buku, Red and what’d we do? Went short

I think people think Naughty is going to be this magic bullet at CHB and fix all our intercepting woes but it’s just not the case. Jones is close to the best intercept marker in the comp and whilst he’s improved us it hasn’t even made a dent.

Intercept marking is probably 20% the talent you’ve got and 80% based upon the work done by the mids further up the ground to restrict the quality of ball coming in. There’s no point Naughty sit at half back whilst the oppo short chips to free targets inside 50 like they did all day on Sunday.

Fix the pressure on the ball carrier further up field and I guarantee the likes of Jones, Red, Buku will offer adequate intercept marking

 

[BulldogMuscle]

Has English had the all clear following the head knock on Sunday?

He has a history of delayed concussion. His preseason delayed by "migraine-related symptoms".

Has he been passed for this week and the season?

God I hope your club is dumb enough to give him a grand father offer, I’m done with English as our number one ruck.

 

[Mofra]

Thanks, hadn’t read that but good to know. Was the “smashing” around the ground or in the actual center bounces, ruck contests, etc. To be clear my desired outcome is Darcy to replace Lobb not English. I think every game Darcy plays is a game closer to us winning a flag but I don’t feel the same about Lobb.


I feel like this board is going to be arguing past each other all year. Darcy doesn’t have to be “ready” (whatever that means) to get picked ahead of Lobb. He just needs to offer more than the alternative for the role. In the same way, Rhylee West didn’t need to have the same potential as his father to be better than McComb.

Centre-bounce & ruck stuff. English also has had many many more years in the system so does cover the ground better.
I think Darcy could potentially be the best forward/ruck in the comp in a couple of years and there's every chance he overtakes Lobb by the end of the year.

I've been in the 'Naughton forward' camp but if we lose to Gold Coast and we're still in the bottom 4 for intercept marks in defence, I'd be hoping we at least consider Darcy to deep forward, Lobb a bit higher and Naughton to CHB. It gets Naughton involved in the game and away from 'gorilla' FBs who monster him (Sam Collins isn't quick but he's damn strong) and gets Darcy more senior gametime.

 

[dardog]

Well we had the opportunity to go someway to fixing this on the weekend with Jones, JOD, Buku, Red and what’d we do? Went short

I think people think Naughty is going to be this magic bullet at CHB and fix all our intercepting woes but it’s just not the case. Jones is close to the best intercept marker in the comp and whilst he’s improved us it hasn’t even made a dent.

Intercept marking is probably 20% the talent you’ve got and 80% based upon the work done by the mids further up the ground to restrict the quality of ball coming in. There’s no point Naughty sit at half back whilst the oppo short chips to free targets inside 50 like they did all day on Sunday.

Fix the pressure on the ball carrier further up field and I guarantee the likes of Jones, Red, Buku will offer adequate intercept marking

I do completely agree regarding the pressure up the field, however we potentially have an AA calibre CHB at our disposal yet we continue to use him up front.
We now have the assests up in the forward half of the ground to cover Naughton back, a back combination of Jones, Naughton, Ed etc would instantly strengthen a real weak part of our game.
Jamarra has been our most dangerous forward for the best part of last year and looked it again on Sunday.
Lets give him more room, get a future star in Darcy some more looks.
I am not saying Naughton is a bad forward however I think we really aren't getting the best version out of him, too many times he goes missing.
We need to desperately change things ASAP, IMO it is worth a crack to see if this might get the team clicking.

 

[Sharkey66]

No it’s coming from the basis that when they both competed against Reeves in back-to-back weeks Darcy was better. That and various pre-season footage where Darcy was clearly holding his own or beating them (I accept it’s a limited sample).

I don't disagree.

 

[hatescaptcha]

I wouldn’t be against pumping games into guys like Freijah. The quicker he gets up to speed the better.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[54Bulldog16]

I watched a bit of the GC Suns game last week, Casboult is the size of a house. Bulked up massively and it’s not doing his agility any favours. He will absolutely ragdoll Khamis.

 

[_Cerberus_]

Darcy is still only 21. Hardly any rucks are ready to go at that age, particularly not ones built the way he is. He’ll have to spend most of his time forward for at least another year or two.

The idea that he could come in this week and hold his own against Witts is just wishful thinking. He’d get smashed.

This. Just because he beat some ordinary Rucks in the Hawks. Doesn't mean it has proven he can and will hold his own against other AFL Rucks.

Gawn, Witts, Darcy, Marshall etc, will physically smash him size and strength wise. Sure Darcy might have more heart and mongrel than English. But Lobb has been able to negate some of the damage at ruck contests now and then when called in. Doubt Darcy would have single handily turned the Cats game last season. He isn't ready yet, and I still think he will be a better forward than a ruck. As some have said, he has barely played any games the last few years on all levels, to be labelled our saviour just yet.

I'd like to see him get a run in the forward line though. Since Naughton is a flat track bully, Lobb unsighted most games, and our smalls refuse to play small. I'm sure Jamarra would love another forward who will have a proper crack up there.

 

[doggiesin08]

What does it matter though? Rucks still have to stay on the field and participate in the game beyond the ruck contests (and if we want to extend it toj the "physicality" side, marking contests). They can and by definition do provide negative or positive value relative to an average ruck in general play. As much as people have valid frustrations seeing one of our players get out muscled or whatever, it doesn't negate that the same player is reading the play, winning ground balls, executing skills in disposing of the ball accurately to teammates etc. If a ruck didn't do that, they would be a less valuable player.

If English smashed Darcy in a match sim, he was the better and more valuable player, irrespective of the facets within the ruck role that he was good or bad.

Because if Darcy is only the relieving ruckman (replacing Lobb) then I’m less worried about his ability to contribute effectively if the “smashing” came from being worked over around the ground (which won’t happen as the relieving ruck). If Darcy was getting smashed in the actual ruck contest then I’ve completely misread the situation. That’s why it matters.

 

[Golden_6]

I watched a bit of the GC Suns game last week, Casboult is the size of a house. Bulked up massively and it’s not doing his agility any favours. He will absolutely ragdoll Khamis.

We're probably going to need to bring an underdone Keath in to try and combat Casboult. Obviously you want to try and play your own game but if Bevo lines up Buku on Casboult then it further entrenches him into the bottom 4 echelon of coaches in the league at current.

 

[doggies ftw]

If Naughtys not in the forward line Marra gets smashed by May himself on the weekend. Also you can’t play Lobb and Darcy together.

If s**t really hits the fan I’m not totally opposed to building a forward line around Darcy, Marra, Bedendo, Cody & smalls for a completely different look and a backline of Jones, Naughty & JOD etc. but I think people need to realise Marra isn’t going to have it so easy without Naughty there and if we continue to just bomb it into the forward line Marra will get rinsed trying to play one-on-one on May, Collins, Taylor. All well and good to call Naughty a flat track bully (bullshit call btw) but if he’s not there to take the heat I’d hate to see what those guys do to Marra

Also in that situation when English is on the pine and Darcy is in the ruck we’re back to Marra and small ball up forward. Not necessarily a bad thing if our ball movement is quick but if we’re stop and start around the boundary. Small ball is a no go

 

[Optimistic Dog]

I think if Buku is allowed to play a Alir type role he has the attributes to be a fine intercept mark. My only query does he have the smarts to read the play. If Bevo does not try this, it is a wasted opportunity. To do this we need another tall in the backline and it cannot be JOD this week. So, it is either Keath in or Astro to goes back.

 

[Dazb86]

If a new coach came in I think we'd line up with Naughton and Jones as KPD'S, English and Darcy as Ruck/Forwards and Jamarra as the KPF.

That leaves more positions for powerful runners on the field and doesn't leave us short for marking power.

 

[_Cerberus_]

All well and good to call Naughty a flat track bully (bullshit call btw)

Maybe it was a little harsh. But I wouldn't say it is BS. I posted stats in the Naughton FWD or DEF thread last year, pointing out a changing trend. You either ignored it or laughed it off, cannot remember. Bottom line was, in the first half of his career he was very balanced and kicked heaps of goals. Broken down Vs the top 6, middle 6, and bottom 6 teams. He had a few bags vs the tops six teams and his goals were evenly spread, and more consistent.

The last half of his career has seem him become found out a little, maybe because Bruce is no longer there taking the toughest defenders. And his goals vs the best teams in the league have dried up. His averages per game vs the top 6 teams each year has regressed. Maybe there is a billion excuses for it outside of him.

But if we are paying a million a year for the next 10 years, he needs to start beating the Mays more often in while. I know you're his biggest fan girl and always super defensive of him from even the slightest criticism. But surely you can admit he needs to start impacting vs the best sides in the league. Heaps of zero and one goal games vs them in recent times. Shouldn't be smashed by skinny kids with 100 games less experience either.

I also never singled him out. I said whole forward line needs to pull their finger out. All they do its cut each other off all the time, don't play the role their position needs off them. Poor delivery inside 50 aside, half the reason is on our lack of structure, work rate, chemistry and people trying to play the individual game over the team game up front. We are not going far kicking less than 10 goals a game. Jamarra was the only player who looked likely all game, Weightman was hot early, then vanished. I agree Jamarra would be stuffed without Naughton there.

 

[Mr. Walker]

May is one if the biggest nobs going around. Total phukwitt

Harmes deserved the week - for stupidity if nothing else. What i don't get is that May can hold him down on the ground for long after the ball has gone and it is no free. Its just chooklotto with some rule interpretations

 

[Dogsman16]

Naughton is right up there with pressure acts as a KPF plus goal assists.

In fact I would put money down that he is in the top 3-4 KPF’s in both of those statistics in the comp.

Add in that he takes away the number one defender from Jamarra, he’s an invaluable commodity.

Against the May’s, Weiterings, Collins type of defenders he needs to be up the ground. They just hold, block and it’s not effective as a deep forward unless the ball is flying in at speed.

 

[Oliver G]

Bevo leaving his presser this week to the last minute...

 

[doggies ftw]

Maybe it was a little harsh. But I wouldn't say it is BS. I posted stats in the Naughton FWD or DEF thread last year, pointing out a changing trend. You either ignored it or laughed it off, cannot remember. Bottom line was, in the first half of his career he was very balanced and kicked heaps of goals. Broken down Vs the top 6, middle 6, and bottom 6 teams. He had a few bags vs the tops six teams and his goals were evenly spread, and more consistent.

The last half of his career has seem him become found out a little, maybe because Bruce is no longer there taking the toughest defenders. And his goals vs the best teams in the league have dried up. His averages per game vs the top 6 teams each year has regressed. Maybe there is a billion excuses for it outside of him.

But if we are paying a million a year for the next 10 years, he needs to start beating the Mays more often in while. I know you're his biggest fan girl and always super defensive of him from even the slightest criticism. But surely you can admit he needs to start impacting vs the best sides in the league. Heaps of zero and one goal games vs them in recent times.

I also never singled him out. I said whole forward line needs to pull their finger out. All they do its cut each other off all the time, don't play the role their position needs off them. Poor delivery inside 50 aside, half the reason is on our lack of structure, work rate, chemistry and people trying to play the individual game over the team game. We are not going far kicking less than 10 goals a game. Jamarra was the only player who looked likely all game, Weightman was hot early, then vanished.

Kick a single ball even slightly to his advantage and I’ll start complaining about him not beating these guys. Whilst we roll an extra up to the stoppage and let Lever play loose in front all day, nah I ain’t criticising him for not performing

 

[Bulldogs85]

 

[weltschmerz]

How many days of Naughton back would it take before dozens of "why is Bevo playing his star key forward back, he must be looking at other clubs who want him as a forward" articles come out?

 

[Generation West]

Geez I’m flat after that performance.

Unfortunately I have no confidence in Bevo. He has lost me before and won me back, but that was so disheartening.

We as a club are imposters thinking we match it with the most consistent teams in the game.

Season 2024 is going to be like every other year - a roller coaster where we win against mediocre teams, but also loose against bottom 8 teams and definitely lose against the top sides, with an occasional victory against good opposition which the coach will hang his hat on.

Our players aren’t as talented or hungry as they need to be and the coach has no way of getting us ahead of the curve - we play catch up every year.

So disappointing.

 

[lachy]

If Naughtys not in the forward line Marra gets smashed by May himself on the weekend. Also you can’t play Lobb and Darcy together.

Marra leads and moves. Naughty's started off doing that then stopped. I would want May on Marra as he would run him around and take him out of position

 

[Dogsman16]

Marra leads and moves. Naughty's started off doing that then stopped. I would want May on Marra as he would run him around and take him out of position

If Marra can turn a 2 goal game into a 4 goal game with accurate goal kicking then he may grab the number one defender. And Naughton would dominate on the number 2.

 

[weltschmerz]

Out: Harmes (suspension), McNeil, Vandermeer
In: Macrae, Daniel, Clarke

Give Clarky a go, have him pressure and harass at ground level. Daniel as a link up high half forward. Would also consider getting Keath in to play on Casboult, possibly for Coffield.