Autopsy Rd19 vs West Coast

[Pykie]

As big a midfield domination as I can remember in the last decade.

That, with arguably our best individual midfielder in that time (Higgins) being tagged out of a chunk of the game. (Boomer had great years, but i think this is the best all-round year I can remember from a midfielder in a long long time)

I think everyone will agree Ahern is the best midfield prospect we've had at the club since JWS and a young Wells.

Wells never fulfilled his potential, despite having an extremely good career here, we all know the taboo of 'he who must not be named'.


If Ahern gets proper AFL fit, * me, he's going to be a brute of a player. As was mentioned in the telecast, he's a kick first midfielder, which is rare in a type like his who can win the inside ball so easily.

His big improvement will come with his defensive acts, which are pretty non existent at the moment, because he is exerting all his tank hunting the ball. Someone like Higgins would lap him in a 2km time trial at the moment.

 

[Caracas]

Been disappointed with his whole career.

Atley is our “cream on top” player in chief. When the engine room delivers high-octane pressure, then Atley comes to the fore. He will be a crucial and necessary component of our flag assault. However, whenever the structure doesn’t hold up, he will be anonymous. I can deal with that.


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[ferball]

We weren't in the port game either.

Yeah true. I'd forgotten about that game.

The side is so structured because Scott's wants it that way obviously. Hardly any players play off instinct, and it's one of the reasons our small forwards cant kick a goal for s**t. I'm very sure they are capable, but Scott's wants them to lock the ball onto f50, which they rarely do anyway lol That would be one change I'd like to see!

I don't think its locking it in the forward 50 as much as in the forward half or out of their 50. We turn the ball over all over the ground but especially as the opposition go into attack and its been very productive for us to do that, when we bring pressure like the other day it pays dividends.

Same with when teams get a run on. Havnt seen Scott's change up to much when teams kick 5 in a row on us. Structure, structure, structure. It only works when the team as a whole play within it...

That's a fair point but I'd say one of the reason we haven't been able to stop run on's is lack of personnel capable of it. We obviously lack outside run and that's where we suffer. Sometimes we get beaten on the inside but its rare and when it happens (apart from the pies game and honestly can't remember the Port one) this season we still keep ourselves in the game. I think the structure is so rigid because it helps limit the exposure to our lack of depth, but also because that is how the game is going. Everything is structured because teams capitalise on turnovers so quickly.The speed of attack from turnovers is so full on these days. Instinct often involves players doing risky things and our structure seems to minimise exposure to the risks that result in easy scoring. Or at least that's what its aim is.

Dont even start me on stoppage set ups against cola, FFS. It was like Heeney was a ghost. Was it players sticking to structures when 7 points up or simply the players faults for not being able to stop easy clearances? We should of had an extra in at the coalface once we were up - positioned defensively. Mind you, plenty more went wrong than the above- cluster**** of the highest magnitude...

Anderson was off in that last quarter and LDU and Paul Ahern played alot of time in there. It cost us sure but it also helped develop those players. The following week when we were being flogged both of those players lifted heaps in the last quarter. Personally I think poor leadership onfield (something beyond the coaches ability to influence at that point) cost us the game. Older players had the chance to slow things down and control the game but couldn't control their adrenaline. It was specifically the players decisions on their own with little time left that lost us the game.

With Anderson available in the last i think the stoppage structure would have been alot better. LDU was unable to influence the contest at some of those stoppages because he's lacking the size and strength but if Anderson was available at that point he wouldn't have been in that position.

Imo our biggest issue in that game was not having Daw down back.

Stop acting like people are calling for a complete shuffle of the magnets when all it takes is the most minute tinkering to save a game or a small sacrifice to save a moment and get the ball on your terms.

I'm not doing that.

a/ what changes would you make,

and

b/ how do you know they'd work and not leave us exposed elsewhere.

No one wants taz up forward, but if he does go forward, I'd like to try it in the 3rd, not when the game is done and dusted with 8 mins to go...

We're being beaten so we move our best defender out of the defense? That's one move I'm not in favour of.

Scott's is a good coach when we are ahead, but probably only average when we are behind... We lose more games that are close than we win and we hardly ever close a deficit at 3q time

Do you know what other coaches records are like wrt those stats? I don't but I do wonder if that is how things are now - that because the comp is so even the days of massive comebacks are over. According to the article here:

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/...k=b85e0d83f78282760f9beeb77e5d354f-1532997506

Lack of last quarter comebacks is a game wide trend according to the headline. (I can't read the article cos * the Hun.)


These days footy is a game of management as much as anything else and I'm just wondering if one of the reason we don't come back at 3/4 time is the emphasis we place on the first and third quarters and how much energy we usually spend in them. And whether that's based on analysis that shows its a lot harder to come back in the last against sides these days due to fatigue, structures being so important - especially when teams lock the ball down to protect a lead and other similar things related to the evolution of the game.

 

[King Corey]

Coaches votes

North v West Coast votes
10 – Ben Cunnington
8 – Paul Ahern
5 – Majak Daw
3 – Ryan Clarke
2 – Jeremy McGovern
2 – Todd Goldstein

I'd have thought Schofield was the pick of the eagles players. Although he infringed at times still used smart positioning and the conditions to his advantage to beat Brown several times. Brown had a significant size advantage too.

Ben (or maybe those instructing him) has got to stop falling into the Hale/Petrie trap of standing there and hoping he receives his rightful frees. It's a low percentage play.

 

[shimaburnsgrieg]

As big a midfield domination as I can remember in the last decade.

That, with arguably our best individual midfielder in that time (Higgins) being tagged out of a chunk of the game. (Boomer had great years, but i think this is the best all-round year I can remember from a midfielder in a long long time)

I think everyone will agree Ahern is the best midfield prospect we've had at the club since JWS and a young Wells.

Wells never fulfilled his potential, despite having an extremely good career here, we all know the taboo of 'he who must not be named'.


If Ahern gets proper AFL fit, **** me, he's going to be a brute of a player. As was mentioned in the telecast, he's a kick first midfielder, which is rare in a type like his who can win the inside ball so easily.

His big improvement will come with his defensive acts, which are pretty non existent at the moment, because he is exerting all his tank hunting the ball. Someone like Higgins would lap him in a 2km time trial at the moment.

On exposed form it is the best a new midfielder has looked at North since a young Wells was screaming through the centre of Etihad Stadium with pace, moves and ball use.

We haven't had someone like Ahern since probably Matty Larkin - ie someone who can make people miss, who has that extra second of time to weigh up options and then has the ability to execute.

Higgo would lap Ahern in a 2km trial? probably - well Higgo would lap Cunners twice in the same trail!

 

[Pykie]

On exposed form it is the best a new midfielder has looked at North since a young Wells was screaming through the centre of Etihad Stadium with pace, moves and ball use.

We haven't had someone like Ahern since probably Matty Larkin - ie someone who can make people miss, who has that extra second of time to weigh up options and then has the ability to execute.

Higgo would lap Ahern in a 2km trial? probably - well Higgo would lap Cunners twice in the same trail!

Yes,

But he didn't start running untill quite late. His upside is big, he was always a decent runner at junior level, he's not Cunners levels of running.

Coming over to North Melbourne with the injury, you would have had to work closely with the rehab team and the physios, what was that experience like? I imagine it was a cautious process…

The physios and the medical staff were massive. Daniel Jones was my rehab coach last year, and at the start he told me to be really cautious and to listen to my knee if it was sore, and so I pulled back a bit of training. I didn’t start running until the four-month mark which is pretty late. They listened to how I was feeling, so if I was sore they would pull back on sessions or give me a day off here and there. What is helping me now is knowing that I have taken things slowly and nothing is going to happen to my knee.

 

[archereleven]

As big a midfield domination as I can remember in the last decade.

That, with arguably our best individual midfielder in that time (Higgins) being tagged out of a chunk of the game. (Boomer had great years, but i think this is the best all-round year I can remember from a midfielder in a long long time)

I think everyone will agree Ahern is the best midfield prospect we've had at the club since JWS and a young Wells.

Wells never fulfilled his potential, despite having an extremely good career here, we all know the taboo of 'he who must not be named'.


If Ahern gets proper AFL fit, **** me, he's going to be a brute of a player. As was mentioned in the telecast, he's a kick first midfielder, which is rare in a type like his who can win the inside ball so easily.

His big improvement will come with his defensive acts, which are pretty non existent at the moment, because he is exerting all his tank hunting the ball. Someone like Higgins would lap him in a 2km time trial at the moment.

The week before, Collingwood dominated us to the same degree...

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Rick18]

A visual representation of how we slightly changed our ball movement + different forward positioning after half time.


(Can't believe I'm embedding my own tweets, but eh, what are you gonna do)

 

[archereleven]

Yeah true. I'd forgotten about that game.



I don't think its locking it in the forward 50 as much as in the forward half or out of their 50. We turn the ball over all over the ground but especially as the opposition go into attack and its been very productive for us to do that, when we bring pressure like the other day it pays dividends.



That's a fair point but I'd say one of the reason we haven't been able to stop run on's is lack of personnel capable of it. We obviously lack outside run and that's where we suffer. Sometimes we get beaten on the inside but its rare and when it happens (apart from the pies game and honestly can't remember the Port one) this season we still keep ourselves in the game. I think the structure is so rigid because it helps limit the exposure to our lack of depth, but also because that is how the game is going. Everything is structured because teams capitalise on turnovers so quickly.The speed of attack from turnovers is so full on these days. Instinct often involves players doing risky things and our structure seems to minimise exposure to the risks that result in easy scoring. Or at least that's what its aim is.



Anderson was off in that last quarter and LDU and Paul Ahern played alot of time in there. It cost us sure but it also helped develop those players. The following week when we were being flogged both of those players lifted heaps in the last quarter. Personally I think poor leadership onfield (something beyond the coaches ability to influence at that point) cost us the game. Older players had the chance to slow things down and control the game but couldn't control their adrenaline. It was specifically the players decisions on their own with little time left that lost us the game.

With Anderson available in the last i think the stoppage structure would have been alot better. LDU was unable to influence the contest at some of those stoppages because he's lacking the size and strength but if Anderson was available at that point he wouldn't have been in that position.

Imo our biggest issue in that game was not having Daw down back.



I'm not doing that.

a/ what changes would you make,

and

b/ how do you know they'd work and not leave us exposed elsewhere.



We're being beaten so we move our best defender out of the defense? That's one move I'm not in favour of.



Do you know what other coaches records are like wrt those stats? I don't but I do wonder if that is how things are now - that because the comp is so even the days of massive comebacks are over. According to the article here:

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/...k=b85e0d83f78282760f9beeb77e5d354f-1532997506

Lack of last quarter comebacks is a game wide trend according to the headline. (I can't read the article cos **** the Hun.)


These days footy is a game of management as much as anything else and I'm just wondering if one of the reason we don't come back at 3/4 time is the emphasis we place on the first and third quarters and how much energy we usually spend in them. And whether that's based on analysis that shows its a lot harder to come back in the last against sides these days due to fatigue, structures being so important - especially when teams lock the ball down to protect a lead and other similar things related to the evolution of the game.

Agree with a lot you have to say there ferball.

I'm a firm believer that talent > coaching and that's where we need to get better. Flexibility in selection is easier with a full list, but its definitely an area Scott's can get better in imo. Every struggling player doesnt need backing in...

Not sure on close games figures, but pretty sure we've only won 4/13 now with a kick in it and have come back from 24 points or more only once or twice in his whole tenure.



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[Heaps of fun]

A visual representation of how we slightly changed our ball movement + different forward positioning after half time.


(Can't believe I'm embedding my own tweets, but eh, what are you gonna do)

That kick from Clarke was a beauty.

 

[Only Forwards]

As big a midfield domination as I can remember in the last decade.

That, with arguably our best individual midfielder in that time (Higgins) being tagged out of a chunk of the game. (Boomer had great years, but i think this is the best all-round year I can remember from a midfielder in a long long time)

I think everyone will agree Ahern is the best midfield prospect we've had at the club since JWS and a young Wells.

Wells never fulfilled his potential, despite having an extremely good career here, we all know the taboo of 'he who must not be named'.


If Ahern gets proper AFL fit, **** me, he's going to be a brute of a player. As was mentioned in the telecast, he's a kick first midfielder, which is rare in a type like his who can win the inside ball so easily.

His big improvement will come with his defensive acts, which are pretty non existent at the moment, because he is exerting all his tank hunting the ball. Someone like Higgins would lap him in a 2km time trial at the moment.

How long from here to AFL fit?

 

[archereleven]

How long from here to AFL fit?

Aherns a mature body, surely 2 preseasons will have him at peak conditioning...

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[Ischenko]

Watching the replay, few thoughts:

• JZ and Wood need more goal kicking practice. They have both cost us this year (and won games for us, in fairness) and will do so again unless they nail more simple shots.
• Dumont was even better than I remembered. Often sets the tone early.
• Midfield as a unit - including Goldy - awesome. Add one more class player plus Jacobs and we're away. Ahern and Anderson's emergence mean we no longer need a Kelly and a Martin.
• Wright was pretty good, and is nowhere near as done as some on here suggest.
• Turner doesn't get dropped because he is just so ******* hard. Skills could be better of course, but you need lots of hard players.
• Williams was brilliant too.

All in all if we can tidy up the forward 50 entries we are right back in the thick of it. Reckon this might be a late season turnaround. Here's hoping.

 

[Caracas]

Wood has got the potential to be so, so good. For a big, tall guy, he moves so fluidly and is as good as anybody in the AFL “below the knees”. Just finish it off, Mason!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Benno_900]

A visual representation of how we slightly changed our ball movement + different forward positioning after half time.


(Can't believe I'm embedding my own tweets, but eh, what are you gonna do)

This is sensitive information - privatise please.

 

[GarnerSmash]

A visual representation of how we slightly changed our ball movement + different forward positioning after half time.


(Can't believe I'm embedding my own tweets, but eh, what are you gonna do)

What that highlights to me is how s**t WCE were is tracking our run and pressuring at the coal face. In the vision from behind the goal you see Walker, Higgins and Cunners innspace as Cunners kicks the ball. They were ******* cooked. A top team just doesn't allow that to happen.

 

[Firestarter]

What that highlights to me is how s**t WCE were is tracking our run and pressuring at the coal face. In the vision from behind the goal you see Walker, Higgins and Cunners innspace as Cunners kicks the ball. They were ******* cooked. A top team just doesn't allow that to happen.

It's not their fault, it waa the wind.

/s

 

[Mav]

A visual representation of how we slightly changed our ball movement + different forward positioning after half time.


(Can't believe I'm embedding my own tweets, but eh, what are you gonna do)

Not sure how different that is from our 6th goal in the second quarter. As soon as we won the ball Jy went forward into space and delivered to JZ who (along with Brown) was not moving forward to the ball carrier.

 

[Rick18]

Not sure how different that is from our 6th goal in the second quarter. As soon as we won the ball Jy went forward into space and delivered to JZ who (along with Brown) was not moving forward to the ball carrier.

Yeah it happened once or twice late in the second quarter. Must have worked as a lightbulb going off or something, because it was much more consistent after half time.

 

[Mav]

Yeah it happened once or twice late in the second quarter. Must have worked as a lightbulb going off or something, because it was much more consistent after half time.

theres nothing like playing with confidence!