Unpopular Opinions (Wrestling Edition)

[cheesedogg]

i've had some rather unpopular opinions about the attitude era for a few years now (coincidentally from around the same time i went back and actually watched all of it) but i'll let mr. dean ambrose sum up my thoughts this time

A lot of people talk about the attitude era being so great but a lot of it was terrible crap, sex jokes and over-the-top terrible bad comedy. It was Jerry Springer-like. They made a joke about a woman's breasts. Hilarious, but where's the wrestling? I look back on a lot of stuff now, and I was a 13 year old kid and I was like 'they made a dick joke so its hilarious' but I look back on that stuff now and I'm like where's the wrestling? It's just a lot of crappy jokes.

Totally agree but the only thing I will say is that despite getting us on board at that age they did also appeal to most age demographics at the time because they were kinda in touch with what was 'cool' and moving parallel to what the fans wanted at the time. Thinking back all stuff like Jerry Springer, American Pie (and every other comedy movie like it), Jackass, etc, all that kind of stuff was massive coinciding with the attitude era so only natural it's popularity was booming at the time.

They have tried and are trying to do the same ever since, in recent times it is their massive social media push as that is the defining thing of our current time if you know what I mean only when we are getting fed stuff like NeNe or whatever it was last week obviously aint gonna work.

 

[Damon_3388]

Totally agree but the only thing I will say is that despite getting us on board at that age they did also appeal to most age demographics at the time because they were kinda in touch with what was 'cool' and moving parallel to what the fans wanted at the time. Thinking back all stuff like Jerry Springer, American Pie (and every other comedy movie like it), Jackass, etc, all that kind of stuff was massive coinciding with the attitude era so only natural it's popularity was booming at the time.

They have tried and are trying to do the same ever since, in recent times it is their massive social media push as that is the defining thing of our current time if you know what I mean only when we are getting fed stuff like NeNe or whatever it was last week obviously aint gonna work.

I think the difficult part is that what's universally "cool" now in the same way American Pie, Jackass, etc. was 15 years ago is so broad and undefined. Like, what is actually "cool" now in the music, film or TV world to the majority teenagers? I'm only 26 myself, and I really don't know. Little wonder that wrestling people and writers in their 30s, 40s, 50s don't.

For example, the Internet and memes especially have really blurred the lines between genuine popularity, ironic popularity and temporary curios. It's harder than ever to gauge what is genuinely getting over with the public, or what's getting over because it's "so bad it's good", etc.

 

[cheesedogg]

 

[Partridge]

i've had some rather unpopular opinions about the attitude era for a few years now (coincidentally from around the same time i went back and actually watched all of it) but i'll let mr. dean ambrose sum up my thoughts this time

Interesting that he mentioned Jerry Springer. It's documented that Russo used to watch it TO GET IDEAS. That tells you all you need to know about his 'wrestling' knowledge.

 

[Raymond Rougeau]

Its like video games I share stuff from 80s nwa wwf and 90s puroresu with my son and he likes it as much as what he sees on the market now boy we had it so good

 

[Damon_3388]

Just watching the Chris Jericho episode of 'The Monday Night Wars', it could be argued that WWE mis-used Jericho more than WCW did.

Jericho was 28 years old when he debuted in WWE on August 9, 1999, having spent the previous three years in WCW (debuting there on August 26, 1996). His best years were ahead of him, but it simply wasn't his time to be "the man" yet. For the most part, wrestlers peak in their 30s, and WCW had a lot of guys who were in their 30s, who could and were drawing, whose time it was then to be on top and leading the way. I understand he was over with the fans, and if you're over, it really doesn't matter how old you are, but if you had the talent roster at your disposal that WCW had circa 1998-1999, would you really be pushing a young, small-ish guy to be "the man" alongside or ahead of the other big names that were there? I don't think so. Furthermore, how many guys that have been pushed to the moon into main event status in their 20s have had any real longevity as full-timers in the business? Not that many.

Jericho got impatient, and he jumped ship. Good on him, it is an individual business after all, but I don't think WCW should really be demonised for that. Guys like Eddie Guerrero (32 years old when he made his WWE debut), Dean Malenko (39 years old), Perry Saturn (33 years old) and Chris Benoit (32 years old, but had already won a World Championship in WCW) were all further along in age than Jericho, so they were more justified in being dissatisfied at a lack of push and/or their place on the card (even though the were all consistently visible mid-card talents in the WCW landscape).

Once Jericho got to WWE, he eventually rose to World Championship status at 30-31 years of age, before spending a few years as a glorified midcarder, before seemingly being out of wrestling at age 34. He eventually came back, two years later, rose to World Champion status once again (and had actually learnt by this time how to be a serious hateable heel, rather than a comedy heel with a babyface's crowd-popping, high-flying moveset), but then floated back to the midcard/tag level once again, while occasionally dipping into the main event area, before leaving, coming back, leaving, coming back and leaving again.

Most of what should have been Jericho's absolute peak years were spent as either King of the Midcard (but even his record nine WWE Intercontinental Championship reigns only total 316 days with the title), or on hiatus from wrestling (he's spent more than 4 1/2 years in total off WWE television in the past decade), and there's really not a whole lot that is/was memorable about his actual World Championship reigns either. He really seems like a guy who was given the World Championship on occasion as a résumé piece, simply for him and the company to be able to say that he was a World Champion at some point. He never really came across as "the man", even when holding the big strap(s).

 

[Ry009]

If they only decided to let Jericho keep the championship that night against HHH.....

 

[Demonic Ascent]

wwe has heaps of great wrestling and the chances of seeing a really good or great match on any given tv show are as high or higher than theyve ever been (especially if you include nxt). the top 10 tv matches of 2013 would stack up VERY well against the top 10 from any other year in the companies history.

i think people who complain about the lack of wrestling 'these days' have an incredibly romanticized view of the past.

I agree it's actually over exposed if anything. The problem is a good wrestling show isn't just comprised of good wrestling.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

and just on the attitude era again, overrated doesnt necessarily mean bad. the thing is that people (usually people who are relying on their decade plus memories and some cherry picked highlight footage) often carry on like it was flawless masterpiece tv week after week when the reality is it was sleazy crash tv designed for horny teenagers and drunk college kids. had its times of greatness but also had more than its fair share of utter horsehit, although things improved greatly in in 2000.

i watched most of it back (missed a few ppvs and b shows) a couple of years ago and my view of it fell quite a bit. i would be surprised if there arent a few more people in that boat once the network comes along.

and if you wanted some regular good wrestling that lasted more than 3 minutes on your 'professional wrestling' show? ...lol.



leaving out straight up comedy like gillberg, just after a quick thought...harris bros (cant remember what they called themselves at the time), los boricuas, oddities, tiger ali singh, headbangers.

youre looking at a couple of legit worst of all time contenders here.

I've been watching Attitude Era on and off over the last few years - started with 1997 (probably my favourite year due to Hart Foundation) and am currently up to end of 99 (just watched No Mercy the other day). I stopped watching full time really around Rumble 98 (great timing!) but used to catch bits and pieces when my little bro was watching. 1999 WWF has been incredible and I can't wait to get to 2000 with Angle and The Radicalz coming through as well as the epic Dudleys/Hardys/E&C feud and Trish Stratus!

I defy anyone to go back and watch and say that any other era is more entertaining than this era of WWF. Sure the actual "wrestling" may have lacked on occasions but the spontaneity and excitement of the shows was great, the crowds were insane (this makes the show in most cases) and you were actually interested in most wrestlers from top to bottom. It is so far ahead of what we have now it's ridiculous.

The only other era I'm looking forward to watching more to compare is 2002 with Lesnar, Benoit, Angle, Guerrero etc

 

[nobbyiscool]

I agree it's actually over exposed if anything. The problem is a good wrestling show isn't just comprised of good wrestling.

This x100.

I don't think the problem is that we don't get good wrestling matches any more. We do. It's just that they want you to watch 30 hours of wrestling a month now to see those good matches, and those matches will be interspersed with rubbish, with filler, with non-finishes and with never-ending replays.

I agree with the notion that the Attitude Era is the most romanticised thing in the history of wrestling. But all around, the 15 hours a month of wrestling was a better, easier to watch product than what we see now.

 

[TooUglyForFugly]

Here's one thing I don't hear a lot: Two mid-card titles are better than one. Allows for more involved feuds if creative get off their arses. Make them better themed and you've at least got something to initially work with. OVW's TV Title and the way it's used can work.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

This might be a popular opinion, but RAW should to go back to 2 hours.

They should also ditch Smackdown and have NXT as the secondary show.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

I always thought Edge was overrated and never believed him as a top star. I can't really put my finger on it but he always seemed like just a mid card talent to me. He was solid in all aspects but I always thought he was missing something.

Also with the WWE Network and going back watching the WCW PPVs of the late nineties has me feeling less fondly about the NWO. I was just a kid watching it when it happened so it's always had that good nostalgic feelings for me, but watching it now and the whole NWO after it was just the outsiders and Hogans sucked. Should have just stayed those guys and maybe added Bischoff as well. Pretty much all PPVS of 97-99 were terrible because of the continual non-finishes and swerve of the NWO in the Main Event. The original angle helped shoot WCW into huge success but they ultimately took it far and ruined the product. So my unpopular opinion is that NWO was the best and worst thing to happen to WCW.

WCW had way better undercards in 96-97 however the main events sucked the WWF was the reverse, terrible undercards great main events.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

I've been watching old WMs in the lead up to this years event.

WM16 was the first WM I saw. I've obviously watched all of them since then - but the events I've been watching have been from 17 on.

WM17 is an incredibly over rated event. People refer to it not only as the best WM of all time, but the best PPV.

It wasn't even in the best 2 PPVs of that 3 year period. Having watched WM19 today, it is clearly better than 17. I don't usually try and do star ratings, but 19 had 3 matches that were better than 4 stars, and 3 matches better than 3 stars. 17 doesn't stack up to that.

I watched Summerslam 2002 a few months ago - it's probably ahead of both of them in the all-time standings.

Brock v Rock at SS02 was terrible, the crowd were completely anti-Rock at that point and the result was a foregone conclusion because everyone knew the Rock was leaving to go to make movies.

HBK/HHH was great though.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

i've had some rather unpopular opinions about the attitude era for a few years now (coincidentally from around the same time i went back and actually watched all of it) but i'll let mr. dean ambrose sum up my thoughts this time

Cmon that IS wrestling. It's not some high brow social commentary it's lowbrow entertainment with excitement and spontaneity at its best. Pretty sure I see regular Cena promos these days where he makes "peepee" jokes and jokes about men's nipples.

Yeah there was a lot of cringeworthy stuff but when hasn't there been? Additionally though there was also a lot of intense stuff with Austin, Triple H, Rock, Undertaker etc Nothing I've seen since has really compared though I haven't watched much 02-04 era from what I remember. The thing that turned me off wrestling altogether for a number of years were the 2 Triple H/Scott Steiner PPV's to kick off 2003 - I was out for a few years after that came back and watched One Night Stand 06 and then was out again (after the revamped ECW shemozzle turned me off again) and only really came back on/off 2-3 years ago with Punk and Bryan. I still went back and watched old stuff occasionally through this period but was off the current stuff.

 

[NitroFan]

theres a lot of room between 'high brow social commentary' and jerry springer lowest common denominator trash. something doesnt have to be one or the other

Pretty sure I see regular Cena promos these days where he makes "peepee" jokes and jokes about men's nipples.

and he gets widely shat on for it

 

[Wizard]

If they only decided to let Jericho keep the championship that night against HHH.....

I agree, i reckon his character would have gone so far over at that point.

Instead they waited and had him take the belt as a heel. That single moment with HHH when he "won" the strap could have set them on there way with him as THE MAN for a decade.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

and he gets widely shat on for it

Yeah but the difference is now that's been the "main event" level stuff for 10 years at least during the attitude era that stuff was in the mid-lower card for the most part.

 

[MUYB]

The best feud of the 90s wasn't Hogan Sting, or Austin Rock, or Austin McMahon.

It was Jericho Malenko

 

[Cleavy]

maybe best undercard/midcard feud...

 

[Lensen]

The best feud of the 90s wasn't Hogan Sting, or Austin Rock, or Austin McMahon.

It was Jericho Malenko

austin/mcmahon probably shades it, but yes i agree with the sentiment

and it was basically entirely because of jericho, and malenko just basically being an angry brick wall of emotion

 

[Zach Package]

I like Roman Reigns.

He's not my favourite by any means, but as of right now, I'm a fan, and I'm hoping that doesn't change because he's relentlessly rammed down our throats for the next decade/

 

[Chops18]

Charlotte is better than Ric

 

[timtamWB]

Charlotte is better than Ric

Well that's not an unpopular opinion, that's blatantly wrong

Ric Flair is one of the best wrestlers ever. Charlotte was only signed 2 1/2 years ago.

 

[Cleavy]

Charlotte is better than Ric

easier on the eyes