Roast Topping up on senior players was the wrong move

[iameviljez]

That is laughable. Kelly won the best first year player awarded by his peers in the AFL by such a massive margin that it was a one-horse race. He will finish in the top 5 in the B&F. If he has room for improvement he will be an A-grade elite player with 200 games in front of him. Nothing short of a Darling, Kennedy or Gaff would be acceptable and those are all much older, I'd take Gaff and a first round draft pick.

What on earth you're smoking, I have no idea but I could do with some

Gaff plus a first-round pick puts you pretty much into Josh Kelly territory. Tim Kelly's a good player - very good, in fact - but he's not yet a superstar.

Also: 200 games in front of him? He's already 24. Even if he goes at 20 games/season, that would mean he'd play until he was 34.

 

[Peter Wallis]

That is laughable. Kelly won the best first year player awarded by his peers in the AFL by such a massive margin that it was a one-horse race. He will finish in the top 5 in the B&F. If he has room for improvement he will be an A-grade elite player with 200 games in front of him. Nothing short of a Darling, Kennedy or Gaff would be acceptable and those are all much older, I'd take Gaff and a first round draft pick.

Your not aka Adrian Dodoro are you?

 

[steady2]

What on earth you're smoking, I have no idea but I could do with some

Gaff plus a first-round pick puts you pretty much into Josh Kelly territory. Tim Kelly's a good player - very good, in fact - but he's not yet a superstar.

Also: 200 games in front of him? He's already 24. Even if he goes at 20 games/season, that would mean he'd play until he was 34.

Look up the words hyperbole and ambit claim. My post was to the Bulldogs guy trying to sell us short.

 

[steady2]

Your not aka Adrian Dodoro are you?

You're not "I stick my nose into other clubs business to stir up a bit, bored easily" are you?

 

[Peter Wallis]

You're not "I stick my nose into other clubs business to stir up a bit, bored easily" are you?

Didn't realise I was stirring anything up, thought what I said was fair.
Not bored, just enjoy AFL & have 2 eyes & not 1 like you clearly have mate.

 

[iameviljez]

Look up the words hyperbole and ambit claim. My post was to the Bulldogs guy trying to sell us short.

I had no idea this was where Geelong's horse-trading was done

 

[Lewy]

It sounds good and it is, but you've gotta factor in the debuts of
2E- 27yo from Carlton
Crameri- Gone
Black - Gone
Kelly- Gone either this year or next.
Parsons - Not looking good
Buzza- Not looking good at all.


But yeah still some awesome ones in Stewart and Henry who almost look certain to be good long servants of the club.
Possibly Savrat and Parfitt too.

Even if we lose Kelly, it is still a good draft outcome. They will have had 1 or 2 years from a very good player and ended up with a much higher draft pick (likely to be a younger player) or a very good established player. Either way the outcome is well beyond what you expect from a pick in the 20’s.

 

[Lewy]

Simpson not AFL standard
Zuthrie not ready
Abbott - mature age ruck not really a kid
JJ not ready, probably not AFL standard

Henry, Stewart, Kelly, Parfitt, Sav, Narkle, Cunico all a tick

Stewart and Kelly are mature agers so a shorter shelf life (if kelly stays)

that leaves Parfitt, and Henry as the kids who have been given games and have shown a bit over the last 2 years (unfortunate injuries to Sav and Narkle)

Fogarty also got games but questionable ability, not really ready for AFL yet
Cunico probably should have got more games

kind of a different story to the 15 debuts over 2 years, half of those are junk picks and most didnt get a great deal of games

Only 31% of players reach 50 games, 17% 100 games & 9% 150 games. So expectations in terms of how many of those 15 make it probably needs to be low. If 3 of them end up playing 150 games (20%), then that will be a great outcome.

 

[thecatattack]

Simpson not AFL standard
Zuthrie not ready
Abbott - mature age ruck not really a kid
JJ not ready, probably not AFL standard

Henry, Stewart, Kelly, Parfitt, Sav, Narkle, Cunico all a tick

Stewart and Kelly are mature agers so a shorter shelf life (if kelly stays)

that leaves Parfitt, and Henry as the kids who have been given games and have shown a bit over the last 2 years (unfortunate injuries to Sav and Narkle)

Fogarty also got games but questionable ability, not really ready for AFL yet
Cunico probably should have got more games

kind of a different story to the 15 debuts over 2 years, half of those are junk picks and most didnt get a great deal of games

Fogarty is AFL ready tbh. 13 touches, 2.5 marks and 3.5 tackles at 19 he should be in our 22 next year.

Out of the 11 names you mentioned, I think Simpson is the only one who probably doesn't have a future here.

 

[juzcat]

I remember draft night 2012 a lot of people were bemused that Geelong took Thurlow over Grundy.

That was tragic, and may well have cost us 2 flags IMO.. biggest over reach


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[Mr Meow]

Fogarty is AFL ready tbh. 13 touches, 2.5 marks and 3.5 tackles at 19 he should be in our 22 next year.

Out of the 11 names you mentioned, I think Simpson is the only one who probably doesn't have a future here.

He's shown some good signs but why did we recruit another player who can't kick? The most elite ball user we've picked up in recent times is a player from the GFL (Stewart). Kelly early on showed class but fell into the spray it on the boot camp as the year progressed.

 

[iameviljez]

Only 31% of players reach 50 games, 17% 100 games & 9% 150 games. So expectations in terms of how many of those 15 make it probably needs to be low. If 3 of them end up playing 150 games (20%), then that will be a great outcome.

That's of all players, though - whereas the list quoted is just those who have debuted in the AFL.

 

[iameviljez]

and may well have cost us 2 flags IMO.. biggest over reach

THAT is a big over-reach, IMO. 2013 was Grundy's debut year and while we needed a ruckman something shocking, he wasn't anywhere near ready. I'm not sure what other year you're referring to, but given we got a firm smacking in both years before we even made the Big Dance, I don't think we were that close.

 

[Strange Cat]

I sill remember my big WTF that we chose Thurlow over Grundy ..imo that was the biggest oversight wells had made in years

It’s still a shocking call no matter what way you look at it

 

[Max Milburn]

Your not aka Adrian Dodoro are you?

Word of advice, Peter: if you are going to come onto another club's board with a passive/aggressive stand-up routine, you should make sure your material is actually funny.

 

[steady2]

Didn't realise I was stirring anything up, thought what I said was fair.
Not bored, just enjoy AFL & have 2 eyes & not 1 like you clearly have mate.

It is one thing to enter another teams forum and tell us to flog off one of our best recruits for a cheap sale, then when challenged, attack one of the fans who disagrees with you. Best of luck with the trolling. Oh, by the way you guys should sell off Bontempelli, sell him now while he's hot, you'd get a first round pick for him. Of course I would not enter the Bulldogs forum and provide that advice it might be seen as inflammatory, and I have no desire to provoke Doggie fans, they're a pretty good mob, most of them.

 

[steady2]

I had no idea this was where Geelong's horse-trading was done

Is it? I thought it was where people expressed their opinion over things. Usually when outsiders enter the forum they are polite and respectful unless they are trolling.

 

[The Casey Cat]

I don't think it was the wrong call to get these players necessarily. It could have worked better than it has. We have been very poorly coached and organised. We have played like the talent we acquired would get us by and not defined worthwhile roles that emphasised playing as a team and working hard for each other week in week out.

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[Hamingja]

Agreed, the list management has been good since 2015, we just haven't taken advantage of it on field.

The window for the top up flag looks like it has closed though so very hesitant with what we appear to be cooking up this off season.

If we can get a top 12 pick for Kelly I would be happy to let him go now. He is going to leave regardless and can't see him being the difference in 2019.

Two picks in the top 12 or so is a good start to regenerate the list with elite talent.

 

[Max Milburn]

Agreed, the list management has been good since 2015, we just haven't taken advantage of it on field.

The window for the top up flag looks like it has closed though so very hesitant with what we appear to be cooking up this off season.

If we can get a top 12 pick for Kelly I would be happy to let him go now. He is going to leave regardless and can't see him being the difference in 2019.

Two picks in the top 12 or so is a good start to regenerate the list with elite talent.

Still slightly ajar?

 

[Moley Russels Wart]

I think the issue is people are nominating us and we are taking them all. Rather than we nominating the players we think we need. Now with Blicavs and Henry we don't need Henderson, S.Selwood is barely AFL standard. So the strategy isn't neccessarily wrong but we need to be more discerning about who we take.

 

[Peter Wallis]

It is one thing to enter another teams forum and tell us to flog off one of our best recruits for a cheap sale, then when challenged, attack one of the fans who disagrees with you. Best of luck with the trolling. Oh, by the way you guys should sell off Bontempelli, sell him now while he's hot, you'd get a first round pick for him. Of course I would not enter the Bulldogs forum and provide that advice it might be seen as inflammatory, and I have no desire to provoke Doggie fans, they're a pretty good mob, most of them.

Sorry if I offended you, but it felt like you were attacking me for having an opinion. But I did say that if Kelly wants to stay beyond 2019 then he shouldn't be traded regardless of what Fremantle were to offer.

I still don't see how pick 5 for him if he is going to leave in 2020 is a poor return. He had a great first year with the club but was drafted as a second round pick so obviously his currency has risen since then but he is still in the infancy of his AFL career and has a lot to prove.

I personally hope he stays with Geelong because they deserve more than 1 or 2 years service from him & I have no doubt he will be a star over the next few years.

Bontempelli is a completely different situation because he has expressed no desire to leave the club, but if he did want to go then an early first round pick & maybe a future second would be about the best we could expect for him. As good as he is, he is no Dustin Martin or Dangerfield at this point in his career.

Again, sorry if my comments were deemed inflammatory, that was not my intention. Cheers.

 

[Peter Wallis]

Word of advice, Peter: if you are going to come onto another club's board with a passive/aggressive stand-up routine, you should make sure your material is actually funny.

Noted.

 

[Tandy]

Na it beats being a Carlton or St kilda. Just means we are a 5-10 side and need to keep topping up. Being in the mix allows us to get players in who want a shot at a flag

 

[Hamingja]

Still slightly ajar?

I don't think so. We would have to improve a hell of a lot. We are behind Melbourne and GWS already and they have more upside for improvement than we do.