Round 1 Vs Sydney GAMEDAY

[Doggiesfan14]

So conservative has our team become.
They are now so boring to watch.
What happened to caution to the wind of 2015.
Are we going to play safe all year and finish
15th.
Personally l would be ruthless and try something new.
Like give English 11 games as first ruck
like you did with Ayce.Back him in .The worst thing that can happen is he'll become a better footballer.
Trengrove is stop gap nothing more IMO.
Play Fergus Greene and Cavarra as soon as they show form.As they give us x factor.
Aka Lynch and hopefully Vandermeer and Khanis come on.
I will be unpopular all year as l keep repeating Suckling ,Crozier , Trengrove and now Durea are only back ups.Or stop gaps.
If they play , we are not progressing.
I would love to be proven wrong.

What is the go with Vandermeer? Haven't heard much about him all pre season and I thought his pace would've been handy to look at

 

[Virgin Dog]

What is the go with Vandermeer? Haven't heard much about him all pre season and I thought his pace would've been handy to look at

I always figured he'd be a while off debut because of being too similar to JJ, so with JJ out injured JLT would surely have been a perfect time to give him a run. Must not have the fitness required?

 

[Mantis Toboggan]

Nope, you don't erase your attributes once drafted. He was rated as an elite shot for goal in TAC and continues to be an excellent exponent. You can react to a miss-kick or a skill error. I'll continue looking at the wider picture and evidence.

Right. So if you’re elite in TAC then you’re elite in the AFL, regardless of how you perform?

Is Tom Boyd still an elite forward?

Players might as well just start retiring after draft night. Job done. Your TAC stats are enough to get you in the hall of fame.

Totally idiotic argument.

 

[Yojimbo]

B- Dale Morris Lewis Young Easton Wood.
HB- Hayden Crozier Zaine Cordy Caleb Daniel.
C- Lachie Hunter Jackson Macrae Bailey Williams.
HF- Sam Lloyd Josh Schache Ed Richards.
F- Billy Gowers Aaron Naughton Mitch Wallis.

Followers- Jackson Trengove, Marcus Bontempelli, Tom Liberatore.

I/C: Toby McLean, Josh Dunkley, Matthew Suckling, Tim English.

Hate Daniel at HB with a passion, but I've been beaten into submission by the
Beveridge mantra.

Sydney: possible line up.
B- Dane Rampe Heath Grundy Nick Smith.
HB- Jake Lloyd Aliir Aliir Jackson Thurlow.
C- Callum Mills Josh Kennedy Ryan Clarke.
HF- Will Hayward Lance Franklin Isaac Heeney.
F- Oliver Florent Sam Reid Ben Ronke.

Followers- Callum Sinclair, Luke Parker, Tom Papley.

I/C: George Hewett, Harry Cunningham, Zac Jones, Nick Blakey.

Tipping a dour slugfest played between the arcs.

 

[gangsta deluxe]

Right. So if you’re elite in TAC then you’re elite in the AFL, regardless of how you perform?

Is Tom Boyd still an elite forward?

Players might as well just start retiring after draft night. Job done. Your TAC stats are enough to get you in the hall of fame.

Totally idiotic argument.

I like how theyre referring to that as somehow more relevant evidence than the three years of AFL football Schache has produced in which he has 40.35...

 

[Mattie2016]

Right. So if you’re elite in TAC then you’re elite in the AFL, regardless of how you perform?

Is Tom Boyd still an elite forward?

Players might as well just start retiring after draft night. Job done. Your TAC stats are enough to get you in the hall of fame.

Totally idiotic argument.

Kicking for goal is a craft. Established this as a junior and that remains his greatest weapon. He is known as the best shot for goal at the club, despite your critique from the stands.

 

[gangsta deluxe]

Kicking for goal is a craft. Established this as a junior and that remains his greatest weapon. He is known as the best shot for goal at the club, despite your critique from the stands.

So you’ve now shifted from “evidence” all of which is irrelevant and TAC based, and that flies in the face of the AFL evidence to date, to conjecture (he is known as better than Dicko?)

Mate, get a grip. This is delusional.

 

[dergert]

What happened to the men of mayhem?

Our players, bont included just dont look like theyre playing to a structured plan.

Did anyone actually go to the vfl?

 

[RUNVS]

Sydney: possible line up.
B- Dane Rampe Heath Grundy Nick Smith.
HB- Jake Lloyd Aliir Aliir Jackson Thurlow.
C- Callum Mills Josh Kennedy Ryan Clarke.
HF- Will Hayward Lance Franklin Isaac Heeney.
F- Oliver Florent Sam Reid Ben Ronke.

Followers- Callum Sinclair, Luke Parker, Tom Papley.

I/C: George Hewett, Harry Cunningham, Zac Jones, Nick Blakey.

Tipping a dour slugfest played between the arcs.

Not too bad, a much better effort than I could do with the Bulldogs round 1 team. Only obvious error is that Nick Smith is injured and won't be available round 1.

 

[ossie_21]

Not too bad, a much better effort than I could do with the Bulldogs round 1 team. Only obvious error is that Nick Smith is injured and won't be available round 1.

Is Buddy likely to play, or not? As an outsider they make it seem he won’t play but I’m guessing that’s just to conserve him for the real deal

 

[Virgin Dog]

Not too bad, a much better effort than I could do with the Bulldogs round 1 team. Only obvious error is that Nick Smith is injured and won't be available round 1.

Who comes in for Smith? Also what are you thinking the chances are of Buddy playing?

I think our chances of winning this comes down to Buddy. If he's missing, we may even go in as favourites despite our JLT form. If he's there, it'll be a serious uphill battle

 

[RUNVS]

Is Buddy likely to play, or not? As an outsider they make it seem he won’t play but I’m guessing that’s just to conserve him for the real deal

The Swans have not been super open about this but from what we do know it seems more likely than not that Buddy is going to play.

As for the team, I am going to chicken out here but it will be something like this, though I have 6 men on the bench so drop 2.

B: Aliir - Melican - Rampe
HB: McVeigh - Grundy - Lloyd
C: Dawson - Kennedy -Cunningham
HF: Papley - Franklin - Heeney
F: Parker - Reid - Hayward
Foll: Sinclair - Mills - Hewett
I/C: Blakey - Clarke - Thurlow - Ronke - Florent - Jones

I honestly don't know what team Longmire will go with, but I think it will be 22 of those 24 players. The two that miss out will be very unlucky.

 

[Mattdougie]

So you’ve now shifted from “evidence” all of which is irrelevant and TAC based, and that flies in the face of the AFL evidence to date, to conjecture (he is known as better than Dicko?)

Mate, get a grip. This is delusional.

Do not do that to him he will immediately block you or go and talk to Chris Grant in their weekly chats and probably have your membership pulled.

 

[Mantis Toboggan]

Kicking for goal is a craft. Established this as a junior and that remains his greatest weapon. He is known as the best shot for goal at the club, despite your critique from the stands.

Well he is categorically not the best set shot at the club, so you’re wrong there.

Kicking may well be a ‘craft’ but the only thing that counts is getting the ball between the big sticks on gameday. It’s all very well doing it in the TAC or in training but Schache’s kicking has been nothing more than decent at AFL level.

Stop talking nonsense.

 

[Tommycash]

Well he is categorically not the best set shot at the club, so you’re wrong there.

Kicking may well be a ‘craft’ but the only thing that counts is getting the ball between the big sticks on gameday. It’s all very well doing it in the TAC or in training but Schache’s kicking has been nothing more than decent at AFL level.

Stop talking nonsense.

Not to engage in a debate late in the piece, but from this article on 16 August last year, Schache was the 11th best player in the league in terms of set shot accuracy, Wallis was our best with 84.6 (second best in the league).

Anecdotally I also seem to remember that Schache had a lot from the 50-40m mark. I think it is fair to say from stats and my own recollection his set shot kicking for goals is one of the best at the club, although as you say perhaps not the best at the club, certainly not statistically the best.

https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2018-08-15/mcdonald-not-worried-about-shakiness

Set-shot goal scoring accuracy

*Minimum 10 goals*

1. Charlie Cameron 12.2 (85.7%)
2. Mitch Wallis 11.2 (84.6%)
3. Josh Caddy 21.4 (84%)
4. Will Hoskin-Elliott 23.5 (82.1%)
5. Luke Parker 13.3 (81.3%)
6. Aaron Young 12.3 (80%)
7. Harry McKay 16.4 (80%)
8. Bayley Fritsch 13.4 (76.5%)
9. Josh Thomas 12.4 (75%)
10. Ben Brown 50.17 (74.6%)
11. Josh Schache 14.5 (73.7%)
12. Jamie Cripps 19.7 (73.1%)
13. Mark LeCras 16.6 (72.7%)
14. Patrick Dangerfield 13.5 (72.2%)
15. Oscar McInerney 10.4 (71.4%)
16. Brody Mihocek 12.5 (70.6%)
17. Isaac Heeney 14.6 (70%)
18. TOM McDONALD 28.12 (70%)

 

[Mattdougie]

So we need 100 points each week to win lost games so for us that is probably 12-28-100

Who do we see kicking them if we get to that mark ? And are we even capable week in week out?

I still see Naughton playing back most weeks so I personally wouldn’t rely on him for goals

 

[Mattie2016]

Not to engage in a debate late in the piece, but from this article on 16 August last year, Schache was the 11th best player in the league in terms of set shot accuracy, Wallis was our best with 84.6 (second best in the league).

Anecdotally I also seem to remember that Schache had a lot from the 50-40m mark. I think it is fair to say from stats and my own recollection his set shot kicking for goals is one of the best at the club, although as you say perhaps not the best at the club, certainly not statistically the best.

https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2018-08-15/mcdonald-not-worried-about-shakiness

Set-shot goal scoring accuracy

*Minimum 10 goals*

1. Charlie Cameron 12.2 (85.7%)
2. Mitch Wallis 11.2 (84.6%)
3. Josh Caddy 21.4 (84%)
4. Will Hoskin-Elliott 23.5 (82.1%)
5. Luke Parker 13.3 (81.3%)
6. Aaron Young 12.3 (80%)
7. Harry McKay 16.4 (80%)
8. Bayley Fritsch 13.4 (76.5%)
9. Josh Thomas 12.4 (75%)
10. Ben Brown 50.17 (74.6%)
11. Josh Schache 14.5 (73.7%)
12. Jamie Cripps 19.7 (73.1%)
13. Mark LeCras 16.6 (72.7%)
14. Patrick Dangerfield 13.5 (72.2%)
15. Oscar McInerney 10.4 (71.4%)
16. Brody Mihocek 12.5 (70.6%)
17. Isaac Heeney 14.6 (70%)
18. TOM McDONALD 28.12 (70%)

Some people don't like facts getting in the way of their opinion.

They may do well to type in 'Schache' and 'set shot' into google and eat some humble pie whilst reading the critiques of other people within the industry.

 

[Mattdougie]

Some people don't like facts getting in the way of their opinion.

They may do well to type in 'Schache' and 'set shot' into google and eat some humble pie whilst reading the critiques of other people within the industry.

Shouldn’t you be asking Chris Grant his opinion?

 

[Virgin Dog]

So we need 100 points each week to win lost games so for us that is probably 12-28-100

Who do we see kicking them if we get to that mark ? And are we even capable week in week out?

I still see Naughton playing back most weeks so I personally wouldn’t rely on him for goals

In terms of where players should be aiming for:
2 goals/game
Wallis
Schache
Gowers
Lloyd
Dickson

I'd expect at least 4 of the 5 above to consistently be putting up 2 goals per game, if not more. This puts them on par with guys like Josh Thomas from Collingwood, which is not exactly too high of a standard.

Then we should see Bontempelli, McLean, Hunter plus a few others averaging roughly 1 goal/game (probably closer to 0.8). These aren't exactly huge targets to be setting, but it's up to the players to not flip flop in form so much, and the coaches to not * around with structures so much

 

[House_of_Dahl]

Well my 2 cents. Regardless of any stats I genuinely think Schache is one of our best set shots.

I also have a lot of confidence in Bont's set shots still too regardless of a bad run.

 

[Mattdougie]

In terms of where players should be aiming for:
2 goals/game
Wallis
Schache
Gowers
Lloyd
Dickson

I'd expect at least 4 of the 5 above to consistently be putting up 2 goals per game, if not more. This puts them on par with guys like Josh Thomas from Collingwood, which is not exactly too high of a standard.

Then we should see Bontempelli, McLean, Hunter plus a few others averaging roughly 1 goal/game (probably closer to 0.8). These aren't exactly huge targets to be setting, but it's up to the players to not flip flop in form so much, and the coaches to not **** around with structures so much

Kick 17 goals a week you will win more than you lose.

Don’t think we have the firepower but when you break it down 2 each isn’t unattainable so who knows

 

[Virgin Dog]

Kick 17 goals a week you will win more than you lose.

Don’t think we have the firepower but when you break it down 2 each isn’t unattainable so who knows

I set that as my expectation, but I doubt it's achieved. Dickson will maybe play 10 games (so producing an average of about 1 goal per week) and Gowers goes hot and cold. The weeks one of that group is firing, another might go missing, but between them I'd hope they can put up 8-10 goals per week.

My concern is we still lack the proper marking target. Putting Naughton up forward gives us another decent target, but it's robbing Peter to pay Paul, so we are still left with a gap

 

[Mattdougie]

I set that as my expectation, but I doubt it's achieved. Dickson will maybe play 10 games (so producing an average of about 1 goal per week) and Gowers goes hot and cold. The weeks one of that group is firing, another might go missing, but between them I'd hope they can put up 8-10 goals per week.

My concern is we still lack the proper marking target. Putting Naughton up forward gives us another decent target, but it's robbing Peter to pay Paul, so we are still left with a gap

We didn’t have a marking target in 16 so don’t play a style that relies on one.

We didn’t to win a flag what’s the obsession tying to do it now? Schache is not and never will be a key target. His could be a very good number 3,3?3 Maybe 2 in a mobile forward line

We seem to have a puzzle of squares pieces that we are squashing round pieces into

 

[Virgin Dog]

We didn’t have a marking target in 16 so don’t play a style that relies on one.

We didn’t to win a flag what’s the obsession tying to do it now? Schache is not and never will be a key target. His could be a very good number 3,3?3 Maybe 2 in a mobile forward line

We seem to have a puzzle of squares pieces that we are squashing round pieces into

My concern is it seems we have two conflicting game plans and the mids and forwards just have no cohesion. We play as if we rely on a marking target based on the inside 50 entries almost always being "bomb it long and hope for the best" instead of smart, fluid movement thats required for a smaller forward line like ours. Also why wouldn't we be playing Greene if we're relying on smaller/medium targets? There just seems to be conflict between what the mids are doing and what the forwards are doing. It's either we find ourselves a big target, or we change how we're aiming to enter the forward 50

 

[Mantis Toboggan]

Some people don't like facts getting in the way of their opinion.

They may do well to type in 'Schache' and 'set shot' into google and eat some humble pie whilst reading the critiques of other people within the industry.

Are you for real?

The stats clearly state he is not the best at the club.