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Discussion 2021 Help / General Discussion
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Milkshaker
Cancelled
- Nov 6, 2014
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So, the AFL Tinkering department has added "Medical Substitute" to the teams.
So as i see it, coaches will try to exploit this, and we will find that players will be "Injured" and can't see out the rest of the game. A fresh player will come in for the last quarter to replace the tired, or player having a stinker.
So, what does it do for Supercoach?
A player named as a substitute will come on in the last quarter, get 3 kicks, and get a supercoach score of 20 points. Down goes his value, down goes his average, and down goes his break-even.
Is the answer for Supercoach to ignore scores for players named as Medical Substitutes?
So as i see it, coaches will try to exploit this, and we will find that players will be "Injured" and can't see out the rest of the game. A fresh player will come in for the last quarter to replace the tired, or player having a stinker.
So, what does it do for Supercoach?
A player named as a substitute will come on in the last quarter, get 3 kicks, and get a supercoach score of 20 points. Down goes his value, down goes his average, and down goes his break-even.
Is the answer for Supercoach to ignore scores for players named as Medical Substitutes?
- Sep 5, 2011
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Teams have to categorically rule out the subbed out player for 12 days, so it is less likely to be used flippantly for game strategy only.
Just when you pick rookies, try to have them all be best 22 so theyre scoring each week rather than holding onto donuts and hoping they dont go down.
The player can make a quick recovery, though, and be able to play. Only time a player can't play is if he is concussed.
The doctor can make a ruling that in his opinion, the player would have been injured for 12 days, but that is not definitive.
- Mar 20, 2009
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The thing that is going ot frustrate me and I'm sure others, is that we wont know the sub until the game starts. So all our rookies will be named but we still wont know if they're going to play until the game. Also *s some loopholes.
- Sep 5, 2011
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Pretty risky to do it IMO. I know its a possibility (and a dumb loophole for them to leave open), but no club could do it each week as a ploy without coming under fire.
- Mar 20, 2009
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I am not sure its a simple exploitation. The doctor has to sign off on it, he/she has to sign a medical certificate stating that the play is/was in fact injured. Now I assume doctors to be of the utmost integrity and wouldn't sign off on something unless it is an actual fact. Signing off on something and then it not being accurate and true would put their license at risk. In saying that I also understand that some doctors like to bend the rules. But I firmly belive doctors in footy are of the highest integrity and honesty.
But what do I know?
- Jul 13, 2015
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Surely teams select older players as the emergency sub rather than kids? Depending on the timing of fixtures, it's likely that the emergency won't be able to play VFL/reserves whatever it is that weekend so would do nothing but stunt that players growth.
The fact that its conditional on medical reporting makes me inclined to believe it won't be exploited, no doctor is going to risk their license by providing false information.
The fact that its conditional on medical reporting makes me inclined to believe it won't be exploited, no doctor is going to risk their license by providing false information.
timtimtim
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- Feb 27, 2021
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Nothing in life is black and white. There will be exploitation of this rule especially if the injured player is fringe best 22 - Ie: there’s strategy in who you pick for MS based on the team your playing anyway
Also non 12 days play less impact in do-or-die matches & finals - did someone say “GF Impact player”
For SC the biggest impact is checking to see your captain’s loophole is not named the MS
Even then the risk is low given low % of not being used, and if so, the guy was your loophole so hardly destroying amazing cash gen potential
From a SC point of view it’s a storm in a teacup
Also non 12 days play less impact in do-or-die matches & finals - did someone say “GF Impact player”
For SC the biggest impact is checking to see your captain’s loophole is not named the MS
Even then the risk is low given low % of not being used, and if so, the guy was your loophole so hardly destroying amazing cash gen potential
From a SC point of view it’s a storm in a teacup
- Aug 22, 2009
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Doctors don’t have to provide false information, they just have to assess the player as likely to miss 12 days. So if they only miss 7-8 days it’s not that surprising. All it takes is a player to tell them something that the doc needs to hear.
But I think for SC it just makes the risk of rookies a bit higher. But it’s not a huge deal compared to the impact on loopholes.
But I think for SC it just makes the risk of rookies a bit higher. But it’s not a huge deal compared to the impact on loopholes.
timtimtim
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the injured player can’t play for 12 days regardless of how they pull up. Same as concussion
storm in a teacup
- Aug 22, 2009
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I'm just disgusted the AFL hierarchy has fallen for this obvious game playing by the coaches who pushed the idea. The original reason the number of bench players was increased from 2 to 3 and then to 4 players was to ensure a team didn't run out of players when multiple injuries hit, but over time the coaches made it more about increasing rotations and keeping players fresh. God forbid a player be tired at the end of a game.
Logically it makes no difference whether a player can't continue in a game because of concussion or because of any other injury, so why do the clubs need a special replacement for a concussed player? Clearly they don't, but the AFL are so concussion-conscious these days that the wily coaches have used concussion as a front to get another bench player added. Why? Well, certainly not because of concerns about concussion. The concussion protocols protect the player perfectly well. No, the coaches have come up with this scheme for one reason alone ... to gain an extra bench player to offset the effects of the reduced number of interchanges being introduced this season. Amazed the AFL can't see that.
Logically it makes no difference whether a player can't continue in a game because of concussion or because of any other injury, so why do the clubs need a special replacement for a concussed player? Clearly they don't, but the AFL are so concussion-conscious these days that the wily coaches have used concussion as a front to get another bench player added. Why? Well, certainly not because of concerns about concussion. The concussion protocols protect the player perfectly well. No, the coaches have come up with this scheme for one reason alone ... to gain an extra bench player to offset the effects of the reduced number of interchanges being introduced this season. Amazed the AFL can't see that.
- Aug 22, 2009
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Another interesting thing from that article is that all teams are lodged at 5:45pm the before a game. I’m not sure if that’s when they will be named though. It’s earlier than Thursday teams time but later than the normal 5pm fri/sat time.
stevebbb
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- May 21, 2013
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What am I missing here, why is this such a big deal?
In thrashings teams just rest their stars for the last part of the match anyway. Thankfully with SC, scaling is given based on impact when the game is actually close (eg. goal to take the lead is scored more than a goal to put them 60 points up). If your player cops a niggle and they exploit this rule to rest him, sure it'll be upsetting, but you'd hope he would have hit 100+ already.
In terms of the sub itself, it'll be one of the named emergencies. If your player is named as an emergency, just count him as not playing.
The teams being released the night before each match is 10000000x worse for SC than this sub rule.
In thrashings teams just rest their stars for the last part of the match anyway. Thankfully with SC, scaling is given based on impact when the game is actually close (eg. goal to take the lead is scored more than a goal to put them 60 points up). If your player cops a niggle and they exploit this rule to rest him, sure it'll be upsetting, but you'd hope he would have hit 100+ already.
In terms of the sub itself, it'll be one of the named emergencies. If your player is named as an emergency, just count him as not playing.
The teams being released the night before each match is 10000000x worse for SC than this sub rule.
Treating the sub as not playing and putting him on the bench saves you from having to include his reduced score, but it doesn't stop his average score and value being adversely affected. That's the main thing people are concerned about ... the damage to rookie cash generation.
- Aug 7, 2013
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Clubs know in advance when they’re going to rest a player the following week. Therefore the enforced 12 day won’t hurt then. Expect a lot of hamstring tightness at 3/4 time.
Edit: I just read that other injuries (not concussion) won’t even incur that mandatory 12 day break....
Edit: I just read that other injuries (not concussion) won’t even incur that mandatory 12 day break....
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stevebbb
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Team will be named the night before, then 1 of the 4 named emergencies will the sub, which will be named an hour before the game? Right? So yeah if you're player goes from the 22 to the emergency list, trade him out lol, he's still "dropped", even if he ends up being the sub.
In terms of rookies, yeah I can see it, this might hurt fringe rookies who have already played games, been dropped, then coming back into the team, being the sub, maybe playing a quarter. But again, if they're not in the starting 22, bench them or trade them out.
With debutants, no way teams will put a kid who has played no games as the sub, because they would want to allow the family to be there for his debut. They can't provide tickets for the players family if he's the sub, because there's a chance he's not going to play.
Ehh I'm not too worried. It's better for Footy, nothing worse than watching a team running out of legs and losing a game because their rotations got screwed by early injuries/concussions.
- Aug 7, 2013
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Makes your 200-275k ‘seasoned players‘ more appealing for mine.
timtimtim
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What % of matches do you think will have to use the Sub?
Maybe 5% which = approx 1 game every 2 rounds?
Then you need to have a player from the unlucky team (1 in 18 or about 5%)
Then you need to have the unlucky emergency that’s named (1 in 4)
Sure it’ll affect cash gen, captains loophole etc. but % are so low the reality is that most of us will be unaffected
Maybe 5% which = approx 1 game every 2 rounds?
Then you need to have a player from the unlucky team (1 in 18 or about 5%)
Then you need to have the unlucky emergency that’s named (1 in 4)
Sure it’ll affect cash gen, captains loophole etc. but % are so low the reality is that most of us will be unaffected
- Dec 3, 2017
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There are roughly 75 concussions per season from a total player pool of 750 or so which = 10% just from concussions alone.
ImissFrosty
Murphy's Law
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Not too worried, just means that when I trade in floating donuts, I might carve out 15-20k more to get a bloke who is recovering from an LTI. Can't risk them being an emergency.
You're being a little naive if you think the coaches won't find an exploit to allow them to use the sub every match.
blackshadow
Hall of Famer
Exactly.
Doc on game day. "Looks bad looks like a couple of weeks".
Doc on Monday "it looked like it could have been a couple of weeks but thankfully scans show he's ok this week"
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