Autopsy Cats lose to Suns by 64 points.

[Finknottle]

Let’s be honest, the cats have the weakest midfield in the league. Having Dangerfield back certainly improves it significantly, but we also need to get Guthrie back to his best. Only then will they be able to compete.

Cam Guthrie is miles off his best and his best football is behind him. He's 31 years old and he has slowed down. He's the midfielder who is rewarded for years of service by being given a roving role in the backline. But we already have Duncan doing that. 9 disposals and 3 tackles in a bit under 3 quarters of football led to him being subbed out of the game. However his replacement Clark didn't do much better. Look to the VFL.

 

[Mr Meow]

Me when Dave the Kitty tells me off in the MVP thread for commentary.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I dunno, he might have just hit the wall

Blitz i get because hes had a limited PS and huge workload all year. But guthrie has low TOG and still cant cover the ground. He used to be a great outlet runner. Hes either injured or cooked.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Cam Guthrie is miles off his best and his best football is behind him. He's 31 years old and he has slowed down. He's the midfielder who is rewarded for years of service by being given a roving role in the backline. But we already have Duncan doing that. 9 disposals and 3 tackles in a bit under 3 quarters of football led to him being subbed out of the game. However his replacement Clark didn't do much better. Look to the VFL.

Clark was one of our shining lights in limited gametime. But mannagh and hardie should be in for cam.

 

[bruce lindner]

Not a pretty last few games but has unpapered some major undeniable cracks to now expedite tough decisions about our list - looking forward to how the MC approach the next few weeks

 

[Mr Meow]

Cam Guthrie is miles off his best and his best football is behind him. He's 31 years old and he has slowed down. He's the midfielder who is rewarded for years of service by being given a roving role in the backline. But we already have Duncan doing that. 9 disposals and 3 tackles in a bit under 3 quarters of football led to him being subbed out of the game. However his replacement Clark didn't do much better. Look to the VFL.

I agree with people that have been alarmed at Duncan over the past couple of weeks at times. But for context, if you call Duncan cooked based on his whole season so far...then Guthrie is charcoal. Inedible.

 

[winty]

Wonder how much of a difference it would've made if O'Sullivan came in for SDK instead of Tuohy.

 

[cats_09]

Me when Dave the Kitty tells me off in the MVP thread for commentary.

It wasn't DTC...

 

[Footy Smarts]

Bowes' lack of defensive work rate in midfield is a huge problem. Just gets torched repeatedly. Also tries to do too much with it too often

 

[Play it Sam]

Surely we all knew he'd be asked

What a cop out. It is about individual decisions when they stack up like tonight.
Should have hacked a recording in the coaches box for honest.opinion.

 

[Mr Meow]

It wasn't DTC...

I didn't say it was...

I've been calling you Dave the Kitten for a while now.

 

[Mr Meow]

I realize there is a theory that Geelong doesn't worry about losing the midfield battle but for it's worth...

Midfield Disposals:

Gold Coast Suns: 177
Anderson 41
Flanders 37
Rowell 35
Miller 32
Sexton 32

Geelong: 115
Holmes 32
Bowes 21
Parfitt 20
Atkins 17
Bruhn 11
Cuthrie 9
Clark 5

If you want to do this properly you compare score involvements from ours vs opposition midfielders to calculate a differential. Or do the same for scores from clearances (us peasants don't get the latter data though...I bet you'll see it On The Couch soon).

Now do this for rounds 1-7 and then run it rounds 8-10. You'll see a big difference.

I'm actually curious enough that I might make a thread running that analysis.

I'd also say the disposal count differences have gotten much bigger. Our 6 players getting 18-22 touches in midfield on average has dialled down to 15-16 touches. And the opposition's main 4 or 5 has exploded from say 27 touches on average to in the 30s.

Is some of this explained by playing against better midfields? Maybe. But losing Dangerfield, Bruhn missing or returning to early 2023 form etc are other factors.

 

[Mr Meow]

Bowes' lack of defensive work rate in midfield is a huge problem. Just gets torched repeatedly. Also tries to do too much with it too often

They've all dropped off in this area the past 3 weeks.

It's not just quantity, but quality of opposition clearances that has improved. No more scrappy dump kicks to defenders. Forward rolling handballs to space and then players in the clear to deliver lace out passes.

 

[Finknottle]

I agree
Out: Tuohy (cooked)
Guthrie (injured)
Parfitt (not good enough)
Henry (doesnt look right)
Neale (not ready)
dempsey (managed)

In:
Hawkins
Cameron
Duncan
SDK
Mannagh
Hardie

Put atkins in the backline and put holmes in the freaking midfield.
Mannagh is needed for class and its a joke if hardie doesnt play over guthrie.
blitz looks tired but we have no structural replacement.

I reckon Atkins days in the midfield are numbered. Our midfielders are smaller and slower than most midfielders. They get pushed aside and can't stick tackles. We need some bigger bodies. Bruhn will be ok. Mitch Hardie is 185cm and solid. Humphries might be a future outside mid with his speed. Just give them a go. With our current midfield we will be in for some more hidings.

 

[Mr Meow]

Neale was a liability ..

He had a bizarre game.

2 nice goals and a goal assist. But completely uncompetitive in the air and dropped about 5 sitters right in front of goal. He could've kicked a bag of 5 on another night. Needs to sort out his around the ground work, clunking marks and contesting the aerial ball to give our crumbers a chance.

 

[Footy Smarts]

I'd prefer to see Knevitt and Humphries over Hardie and Mannagh. I just don't think Hardie's game will translate well to AFL and Mannagh is not a position of need. Knevitt as a defensive winger and Humphries to release Holmes into midfield seem better long-term moves.

 

[Mr Meow]

I reckon Atkins days in the midfield are numbered. Our midfielders are smaller and slower than most midfielders. They get pushed aside and can't stick tackles. We need some bigger bodies. Bruhn will be ok. Mitch Hardie is 185cm and solid. Humphries might be a future outside mid with his speed. Just give them a go. With our current midfield we will be in for some more hidings.

I'm with you on rolling the dice on Hardie. But not for Clark. For Cam Guthrie.

Bowes and Bruhn had been going okay before tonight. Maybe it wasn't a good game to come back into up there in the humidity.

When Dangerfield is available why not try a midfield mix of Dangerfield, Holmes, Bruhn, Bowes, Clark and Hardie? An eye to the future with Danger as the veteran and Bowes/Hardie the other mature bodies.

The Atkins, Parfitt, Guthrie, Blicavs brigade just don't look like getting near it. Parfitt tonight was at least a bit better.

 

[terry_bright]

What a cop out. It is about individual decisions when they stack up like tonight.
Should have hacked a recording in the coaches box for honest.opinion.

It’s also about individual performances and John Howorth (17) put in arguably the most disgraceful one sided efforts I think I’ve seen. I’d love to get a breakdown of his free kick count.
Yes, you can say it didn’t make a difference, but that’s an excuse in itself to look past the incompetence of some of the umpires.

 

[Kobe Gryant]

I must say, it's refreshing that for the first time in a long time the problem is actually the veteran players, while the under 25s are showing great promise and really controlling this side now.

As a supporter, it sucks for the now, but consoles us for the future I suppose...which is something we haven't had in a looooooong time.

 

[Mr Meow]

I realize there is a theory that Geelong doesn't worry about losing the midfield battle but for it's worth...

Midfield Disposals:

Gold Coast Suns: 177
Anderson 41
Flanders 37
Rowell 35
Miller 32
Sexton 32

Geelong: 115
Holmes 32
Bowes 21
Parfitt 20
Atkins 17
Bruhn 11
Cuthrie 9
Blicavs 9

Going back to this. I've removed Clark who was sub but added Blicavs.

The first 3 you can live with if we have another 3 or 4 going at that level. That is what we saw the first 7 weeks with our heavy midfield rotations. We had a good spread, and it was complimented by strong defensive pressuring (forcing scrappier opposition midfield sequences).

We can't have 4 midfielders combining for 46 disposals like Atkins, Bruhn, Cuthrie and Blicavs did tonight. Not only that, but they were poor for pressure acts etc. Drag those 4 players up to 80 disposals combined and we have something resembling a midfield battle.

Dangerfield in is obvious. Maybe Hardie or Knevitt need a call up. Then we need two more to lift their game. Bruhn before injury was fine. But Atkins/Blicavs/Guthrie? Just not getting it done.

 

[hoopla]

Cam Guthrie is miles off his best and his best football is behind him. He's 31 years old and he has slowed down. He's the midfielder who is rewarded for years of service by being given a roving role in the backline. But we already have Duncan doing that. 9 disposals and 3 tackles in a bit under 3 quarters of football led to him being subbed out of the game. However his replacement Clark didn't do much better. Look to the VFL.

I’m not sure they should write him off yet. You may be right in the end, but they need to give him an opportunity to get back to his best.

 

[Play it Sam]

It’s also about individual performances and John Howorth (17) put in arguably the most disgraceful one sided efforts I think I’ve seen. I’d love to get a breakdown of his free kick count.
Yes, you can say it didn’t make a difference, but that’s an excuse in itself to look past the incompetence of some of the umpires.

Yeah he knows he's skating on thin ice, so has to suck up to the AFL to pacify even mentioning umpires. Would love to tie them to a chair and read every single horrified comment from our game day thread. And those were from intelligent posters who don't ever criticise the umps. Normally we just go, it will even out in the wash and move on....but enough is enough.

The cop out oh, we just want to clarify how the rules apply to our players is BS. So they can understand umpiring mistakes against what they know of the rules., is more like it.

Dire and influential non decisions/decisions that remarkably influenced the game and gave discriminatory impetus.
How's the almighty AFL feel about it behind closed doors?

 

[terry_bright]

I’m not sure they should write him off yet. You may be right in the end, but they need to give him an opportunity to get back to his best.

Can we afford him the luxury of doing that in the seniors at the moment?

 

[Mr Meow]

The only good news about this recent slump is that our dear friend Partridge will be back soon.

 

[terry_bright]

Going back to this. I've removed Clark who was sub but added Blicavs.

The first 3 you can live with if we have another 3 or 4 going at that level. That is what we saw the first 7 weeks with our heavy midfield rotations. We had a good spread, and it was complimented by strong defensive pressuring (forcing scrappier opposition midfield sequences).

We can't have 4 midfielders combining for 46 disposals like Atkins, Bruhn, Cuthrie and Blicavs did tonight. Not only that, but they were poor for pressure acts etc. Drag those 4 players up to 80 disposals combined and we have something resembling a midfield battle.

Dangerfield in is obvious. Maybe Hardie or Knevitt need a call up. Then we need two more to lift their game. Bruhn before injury was fine. But Atkins/Blicavs/Guthrie? Just not getting it done.

With no Danger, we lack a midfield general. Someone who can put their stamp on a game. And he’s a 33yr old, injury prone player who clearly showing signs of slowing down.
The better teams have 2, even 3.