Preview Changes v Gold Coast

[weekend at bernies]

Would it? It's akin to an adult playing auskick against a bunch of pre-schoolers. Does the adult really get anything out of it?

I don't see any benefit to playing senior players in the SANFL. None. That said, I can understand the frustration of fans who demand retribution for the poor performances they're forced to watch week in week out. What I don't have is a magic bullet that will turn a player's form around overnight.

We will have to agree to disagree..

I think you underestimate the level of football played at SANFL level.

 

[Elder van Berlo]

The problem is that we have so many players who are out of form. In order to drop one player who is performing badly they have little choice but to replace him with another who is in the SANFL having also been recently dropped for poor performance. It smacks of rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Or, we could play a young player who is playing well in the SANFL. Chopping and changing between the like of Jaensch, Wright and Henderson is not the only possibility.

Playing senior players in the SANFL is a joke. They dominate, even when out of form. They're just too good for the state league competitions. Playing them there won't help them get their mojo back.

Which begs the question.. if the SANFL isn't the answer (and for players like Reilly & Porps it clearly isn't), then what is the solution? How do we get them to rediscover their mojo? I have absolutely no idea. I know what doesn't work, but I don't have a solution that does.

How is it so clear for players like Reilly and Porps? They've been out of the AFC team for a collective of 3 weeks this season and haven't played an SANFL game between them. I'll repeat. The only player who is clearly best 22 who has gone back to the SANFL and dominated is Bernie Vince. The only player who has come back into the Crows team after being dropped and significantly improved their performance is Bernie Vince. Petrenko also went back and found some form and played better when he came back into the side.

Compare and contrast with the likes of Porplyzia and Wright (and we will see how Reilly goes) who have gone back, not found any or any significant form, and have come back and stunk it up the same way they did before they got dropped.

Maybe senior players in the SANFL is a joke. Maybe they will dominate regardless. But if it lets them find some touch, come back with more confidence and play better, what's wrong with that? Isn't that what it's all about?

I don't think that's why they're not being selected. It's why the BF collective needs to take SANFL performances with a grain of salt - but not why they're not being selected. Sando has them under his watchful eye for 40+ hrs every week. He has a very good idea of where they're at and what they're capble of - a much better idea than the BF collective in all of it's wisdom.

I think he'd rather select an out of form senior player than a kid who he doesn't think is ready to play. Playing the senior player hurts the team now. Playing the kid when he's not ready could have longer term consequences. Short term pain, long term gain. I just wish the short term pain wasn't so damn painful to watch.

I'm sorry, but I stopped accepting the "trust Sando over the BF collective" line when the club (was it Phil Harper) came out and admitted they should have played Crouch in round 1 and that it was a mistake to play Callinan in round 2 - both decision which were roundly criticised on here and which the usual apologists justified by saying "Sando should know, he's been watching them all summer".

I don't see how anybody could mount a compelling case for Reilly's recall this week, given:
1. His own form
2. The fact that he hasn't played for 3 weeks
3. The exposed results of players who have been dropped and come back without showing any form in the SANFL.

And I also don't see how it could hamper the long term development of Lyons or Grigg to come into the side and play against a bunch of players roughly their own age.

 

[Slippery Pete]

Whatever your opinion on SANFL form is, selection is about sound judgement calls.

Someone said to me earlier that Kerridge couldn't possibly be selected because his last SANFL game was poor. I don't care if he ran out in his last SANFL game wearing a dress with a pot plant on his head and handing out fairy floss, if I think he's about to explode or he can offer us something, I'm going to pick him.

The moral of this story is

-Selection is about judgement calls. That's why people are paid to do it, and we don't use an iPhone app and a stats sheet.

-Selectors don't have to justify their judgement calls. They just have to get them right.

The End.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

-Selection is about judgement calls. That's why people are paid to do it, and we don't use an iPhone app and a stats sheet.

-Selectors don't have to justify their judgement calls. They just have to get them right.

The End.

Like most judgement calls in life there is a balance between using objective evidence, and as you've rightly said, intuitive gut feel.

In the end the proof is in the pudding. Problem is the pudding this year tastes like ****.

 

[Vader]

and,

No SANFL performances with good Training performances will see players elevated into the AFL team.

and that's the problem i'm having with selection at the moment. Plus, I'm not entirely convinced that not putting a formless player into the SANFL is bad, because they'll dominate by virtue of being on an AFL list. For a pick #4 at the AFL draft, Mr Tambling isn't setting the world on fire for example.

Porps & Reilly are more akin to Vince, who seems to run rampant, collecting 30+ every time he gets sent back to the SANFL.

 

[Vader]

We will have to agree to disagree..

I think you underestimate the level of football played at SANFL level.

OK.. references to Auskick are a bit over the top. It's more like an Adult playing against the U12s.

 

[Slippery Pete]

Like most judgement calls in life there is a balance between using objective evidence, and as you've rightly said, intuitive gut feel.

In the end the proof is in the pudding. Problem is the pudding this year tastes like ****.

It's almost as if there's a rotation policy with the youth - Kerridge you've had your go at it, it's time for Riley to have a crack....

Sanderson thinks he is still at Geelong.

 

[Mattrox]

Sanderson thinks he is still at Geelong.

If we end up with Geelong like success in '14 and beyond Sando can do what he likes ....

 

[Stripple]

The problem is that we have so many players who are out of form. In order to drop one player who is performing badly they have little choice but to replace him with another who is in the SANFL having also been recently dropped for poor performance. It smacks of rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Playing senior players in the SANFL is a joke. They dominate, even when out of form. They're just too good for the state league competitions. Playing them there won't help them get their mojo back.

Which begs the question.. if the SANFL isn't the answer (and for players like Reilly & Porps it clearly isn't), then what is the solution? How do we get them to rediscover their mojo? I have absolutely no idea. I know what doesn't work, but I don't have a solution that does.

I don't think that's why they're not being selected. It's why the BF collective needs to take SANFL performances with a grain of salt - but not why they're not being selected. Sando has them under his watchful eye for 40+ hrs every week. He has a very good idea of where they're at and what they're capble of - a much better idea than the BF collective in all of it's wisdom.

I think he'd rather select an out of form senior player than a kid who he doesn't think is ready to play. Playing the senior player hurts the team now. Playing the kid when he's not ready could have longer term consequences. Short term pain, long term gain. I just wish the short term pain wasn't so damn painful to watch.

You say if a player plays badly at SANFL there name is wiped from the selection board. You also say senior players dominate the SANFL. The thing is we can then determine how out of form some one is by sending them to the SAnFL what if Reilly didn't dominate then we would know he is really out of form. 1 more week (and with us against GC) wouldn't have killed the team.

 

[RichardMarx]

Porps & Reilly are more akin to Vince, who seems to run rampant, collecting 30+ every time he gets sent back to the SANFL.

And after his successful stint in the SANFL, Vince has returned to decent form in the AFL. Maybe Porps & Reilly need a run in the magoos for the same reason?

 

[Vader]

And after his successful stint in the SANFL, Vince has returned to decent form in the AFL. Maybe Porps & Reilly need a run in the magoos for the same reason?

How much of that was actually due to playing in the reserves though.. and how much was the kick up the backside from being dropped in the first place? I'd go so far as to suggest that actually playing in the SANFL had 0% impact on his subsequent revival. He just needed a kick up the backside, reminding him to get out of cruise control.

I don't see Porps & Reilly needing the same treatment. Their problems aren't attitudinal. The coaches seem to think that Reilly needed to work on his endurance - so they worked him hard and dropped a couple of kg. We'll see how much of a difference that makes. It's plausible.

I have no idea how to fix Porps' problems. I suspect they may be career terminal, related to his shoulder problems of the past.

 

[mattymac]

Would it? It's akin to an adult playing auskick against a bunch of pre-schoolers. Does the adult really get anything out of it?

I don't see any benefit to playing senior players in the SANFL. None.

This is an idiotic statement.

Mainly because its just patently idiotic.

 

[Archie87]

If training form meant more than SANFL form Sellar would still be on our list. The bloke was renowned for "training the house down".

A few weeks back Callinan/Henderson/Petrenko were only playing "ok" footy at SANFL level... one of them was playing average footy again and got injured/one has finally been dropped after further average performances/the other is hanging on by a thread too.

How wouldn't playing in the SANFL be a positive thing, as opposed going by training form? AFL players should dominate, get plenty of it and get back their touch again.

 

[Elite Crow]

I don't see Porps & Reilly needing the same treatment. Their problems aren't attitudinal. The coaches seem to think that Reilly needed to work on his endurance - so they worked him hard and dropped a couple of kg. We'll see how much of a difference that makes. It's plausible.

Are you freaking for real? A senior player is dropped because he's carrying weight and that has nothing do with attitude?

 

[King Elvis]

Mind blowing that Radar was dropped for being a chubbster - even more so that he's rushed straight back in.

Radar and Porps, I'm not convinced both would go back and dominate SANFL - but they should be made to, that's the point.

Guys like Lyons do dominate it, but when they do, it doesn't matter.

The concept that good training form is a pathway back into the AFL is a little curious.

Sando has contantly lamented that "in the modern era" weekly training is almost exclusively focussed on recovery. "We'd be lucky to gey 45 minutes of actual training each week once the season is up and running". Given the bye we may have fitted in a few more minutes this week but I doubt it given the fatigued of our players.

Radar must have put together an electrifying 45 minutes

How many premiership points does good training form get you?

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Is tricky Ricky Henderson playing?

 

[hey shorty]

I want to see both Lyons and Grigg in but playing Devils advocate who do they replace. Lyons in particular given that hes almost soley a midfielder. Thompson- no Vince- no, Douglas, Danger and Sloane- no. Grigg could play off half back but our defence is slow enough and inexperienced. Yes Reillys inclusion is puzzling but also somewhat understandable

 

[WAG]

Would it? It's akin to an adult playing auskick against a bunch of pre-schoolers. Does the adult really get anything out of it?

I don't see any benefit to playing senior players in the SANFL. None. That said, I can understand the frustration of fans who demand retribution for the poor performances they're forced to watch week in week out. What I don't have is a magic bullet that will turn a player's form around overnight.

Of all the bullshit that comes from your keyboard, this has to take the cake. It's comments like this that derail threads and add nothing to a decent discussion.

How did you ever become an Adelaide mod? Is it just a reward for time spent on the interwebs?

 

[Glenno23]

I didn't say that his training performances were shit. I said that SANFL performances are not the be all and end all that many people here would like it to be. I don't know why Lyons isn't being selected. It may be that he's fatigued. It may be that they just don't think his strengths (and weaknesses) are suited to the AFL, whereas they are obviously well suited to the SANFL.

You said that they reward training 90% weighting versus 10% of SANFL form, which is complete hyperbole

Something you are guilty of all the time. It needs to stop, its getting tiresome

 

[Crow-eater]

Is tricky Ricky Henderson playing?

Yep named at FF. It's his 50th game this week too

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Yep named at FF. It's his 50th game this week too

Awesommmmmmme.

This will end in tears.

 

[hey shorty]

Awesommmmmmme.

This will end in tears.

He might kick 6 again......

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

He might kick 6 again......

So might Scott Stevens in a final.

 

[BigLefty]

How much of that was actually due to playing in the reserves though.. and how much was the kick up the backside from being dropped in the first place? I'd go so far as to suggest that actually playing in the SANFL had 0% impact on his subsequent revival. He just needed a kick up the backside, reminding him to get out of cruise control.

I don't see Porps & Reilly needing the same treatment. Their problems aren't attitudinal. The coaches seem to think that Reilly needed to work on his endurance - so they worked him hard and dropped a couple of kg. We'll see how much of a difference that makes. It's plausible.

I have no idea how to fix Porps' problems. I suspect they may be career terminal, related to his shoulder problems of the past.

I'll argue though that not actually being forced to play decent footy in the 2's says "we all know you're best 22, we were just trying to shock you into trying again".

the problem is, unless you go and actually earn it back, being dropped is nothing more than a holiday. it's a token demotion.

I actually think Reilly's back injury was code for "he's fat and needs to do extra training to get in shape". Which is ok, if that's how it's presented internally to the team. there's no need to publicly shame a guy on his first lack of discipline.

but he should have been dropped for form anyway.

 

[BigLefty]

I want to see both Lyons and Grigg in but playing Devils advocate who do they replace. Lyons in particular given that hes almost soley a midfielder. Thompson- no Vince- no, Douglas, Danger and Sloane- no. Grigg could play off half back but our defence is slow enough and inexperienced. Yes Reillys inclusion is puzzling but also somewhat understandable

This I agree with 100%.

I desperately want Lyons to get a game, but the only player in our side right now that is a realistic chance of making way for him is Riley. And it seems as though he's in there now to play the Petrenko role. Which admittedly he will do better than Lyons would.

unless of course he came in instead of Radar and we shuffled the team around a bit.