Rumour Future of the club (Bevo, board, assistant coaches, football department)

[MrChristo]

Bevo’s an objectively bad coach. Sorry to break this news to you.

I'll bite, simply because this is a human condition that literally makes my head explode (*)

If it's "objective", care to post your unequivocal evidence for us all to see?

(*) I would hope this didn't actually need an asterisk.

 

[ArNcHiSe]

I'll bite, simply because this is a human condition that literally makes my head explode (*)

If it's "objective", care to post your unequivocal evidence for us all to see?

(*) I would hope this didn't actually need an asterisk.

Is the person I replied to gonna post their unequivocal evidence for all to see?

 

[geoffjennings79]

I'm as frustrated by Beveridge as anyone, but if a flag and a second GF defines a bad coach... what does that make Joe Kelly, Norm Ware, Arthur Olliver, Terry Wheeler, Terry Wallace and Rodney Eade?

He's quite possibly over-stayed his tenure, and failed to back up success with subsequent finals, but only 2 other (captain)-coaches got us to grand finals.

 

[4Seasons]

Who is Kane Cornes? Sounds like a condition you'd get working on a Qld sugar plantation

Kane Cornes is a guy who owns people. Lives in their head rent free. Don’t blame the retailer.

 

[_Cerberus_]

I'm as frustrated by Beveridge as anyone, but if a flag and a second GF defines a bad coach... what does that make Joe Kelly, Norm Ware, Arthur Olliver, Terry Wheeler, Terry Wallace and Rodney Eade?

He's quite possibly over-stayed his tenure, and failed to back up success with subsequent finals, but only 2 other (captain)-coaches got us to grand finals.

Two Grand Finals, with one being a win. Most fans would take that any day. I'm frustrated too, but have never recalled seeing a premiership coach get shat on by his own base as hard as Bevo has. Some of it has been over the top.

The Media and our own fans keep over rating the list. If anything, Bevo has been able to get more out of the list. Which is a shame we haven't been able to put a list together yet, that sits in the top four and pushing deep in finals for a few years, like the Hawks, Cats, Swans, Tigers.

Even if we got a new coach. We still have players that mentally check out or don't chase. We still have weaknesses and inconsistencies across some positions, esp wing and the forwards. The bottom end of the best 22 are not consistent enough, etc. If our current players only had the same hardness and mentality as the 2016 team, we'd be a pain to play on.

Regardless of success. I think all coaches do have a max time limit. Eventually the same environment, philosophies, style. It all becomes stale. A few teams have bounced back instantly on the back of a new coach, but many more have ended up in the same boat or worse off. Especially after the honey moon period of season one.

I'd take another Bevo coach any day if I get to see another flag. Something my Dad never saw in his ENTIRE life. Try being a Saints fan born in the 50s.

 

[Anja_Nees]

Two Grand Finals, with one being a win. Most fans would take that any day. I'm frustrated too, but have never recalled seeing a premiership coach get shat on by his own base as hard as Bevo has. Some of it has been over the top.

The Media and our own fans keep over rating the list. If anything, Bevo has been able to get more out of the list. Which is a shame we haven't been able to put a list together yet, that sits in the top four and pushing deep in finals for a few years, like the Hawks, Cats, Swans, Tigers.

Even if we got a new coach. We still have players that mentally check out or don't chase. We still have weaknesses and inconsistencies across some positions, esp wing and the forwards. The bottom end of the best 22 are not consistent enough, etc. If our current players only had the same hardness and mentality as the 2016 team, we'd be a pain to play on.

Regardless of success. I think all coaches do have a max time limit. Eventually the same environment, philosophies, style. It all becomes stale. A few teams have bounced back instantly on the back of a new coach, but many more have ended up in the same boat or worse off. Especially after the honey moon period of season one.

I'd take another Bevo coach any day if I get to see another flag. Something my Dad never saw in his ENTIRE life. Try being a Saints fan born in the 50s.

I think Bevo is a victim of his own early success. It raised the expectations and people get angry that it doesn’t just happen again.

If you go to Melbourne’s board or Geelong’s board after a frustrating loss you see posts nearly identical to the ones on here - ie he plays his favourites, the forward line is a disaster, he’s squandering a great list etc.

Every coach has his time, and if we have a repeat of last year where we get into a good position and blow it losing to poor sides I’d probably think he’s had his time.

Very happy to see how we go this year though.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Kane Cornes is a guy who owns people. Lives in their head rent free. Don’t blame the retailer.

Luckily I don’t ever have to hear or read his bile but when my Melbourne-based rellies moan about him, I say, SWITCH OFF!

 

[dogwatch]

Luckily I don’t ever have to hear or read his bile but when my Melbourne-based rellies moan about him, I say, SWITCH OFF!

Cornes is the new Damien Barrett.

Everybody complains about him but they also quote him, talk about him or link him. That’s what his minders want. It’s how he increases his popularity and influence. It’s also what will spawn more media types of that ilk.

Best to ignore him.

 

[CarnTheScray]

Think many of us (myself included) would have been more in support of Bevo if we didn’t have the round one capitulation again. Though we really don’t know how much of an advantage the extra game in the bank was.

But speaking of that game, it’s a joke we have to play them every year in round one. Imagine if Adelaide had to play Richmond at the MCG 3 years in a row to start the season after 2017, or if Sydney had to open the season in Geelong each year after 2022, or Collingwood had to play in Perth round one for three years after 2018. It’s a joke we get put in that scenario by the AFL to never have a chance to GET OVER the grand final.

It’s been half a decade since I’ve been able to walk up to our home ground in Round 1, not worry about having to pre purchase a ticket and not have to get there early to secure a seat. I get WHY the AFL schedules us at the MCG in round one, but it’s gotten ridiculous now.

 

[Anja_Nees]

Think many of us (myself included) would have been more in support of Bevo if we didn’t have the round one capitulation again. Though we really don’t know how much of an advantage the extra game in the bank was.

But speaking of that game, it’s a joke we have to play them every year in round one. Imagine if Adelaide had to play Richmond at the MCG 3 years in a row to start the season after 2017, or if Sydney had to open the season in Geelong each year after 2022, or Collingwood had to play in Perth round one for three years after 2018. It’s a joke we get put in that scenario by the AFL to never have a chance to GET OVER the grand final.

It’s been half a decade since I’ve been able to walk up to our home ground in Round 1, not worry about having to pre purchase a ticket and not have to get there early to secure a seat. I get WHY the AFL schedules us at the MCG in round one, but it’s gotten ridiculous now.

Yeah at least let us have a go at them at Marvel round one. It’s a tedious fixture.

 

[GetDimmaBack]

Some people need to stop listening to Kane Cornes.

"Some"?

 

[threenewpadlocks]

The Media and our own fans keep over rating the list. If anything, Bevo has been able to get more out of the list.

And perceptions of the list are shaped, in part, by the coach. I get it's not wholly by the coach - the recruiting staff still have a job to do - but there are many players we perceive as "talented" just because Beveridge's coaching has made them appear so in a way that other coaches may have not. Even if it is true (that you and I don't necessarily subscribe to) that we have a "good list" that Beveridge is "not getting anything out of", there's every chance that a different coach handed the same players don't criticise a coach as much even with the same or less wins because it "appears" that the list shouldn't be "rated".

My head hurts thinking about it, but it makes sense. I think.

 

[yebach]

And perceptions of the list are shaped, in part, by the coach. I get it's not wholly by the coach - the recruiting staff still have a job to do - but there are many players we perceive as "talented" just because Beveridge's coaching has made them appear so in a way that other coaches may have not. Even if it is true (that you and I don't necessarily subscribe to) that we have a "good list" that Beveridge is "not getting anything out of", there's every chance that a different coach handed the same players don't criticise a coach as much even with the same or less wins because it "appears" that the list shouldn't be "rated".

My head hurts thinking about it, but it makes sense. I think.

I've just read that and now my head hurts too.

 

[Anja_Nees]

And perceptions of the list are shaped, in part, by the coach. I get it's not wholly by the coach - the recruiting staff still have a job to do - but there are many players we perceive as "talented" just because Beveridge's coaching has made them appear so in a way that other coaches may have not. Even if it is true (that you and I don't necessarily subscribe to) that we have a "good list" that Beveridge is "not getting anything out of", there's every chance that a different coach handed the same players don't criticise a coach as much even with the same or less wins because it "appears" that the list shouldn't be "rated".

My head hurts thinking about it, but it makes sense. I think.

I think one possibility people don’t consider enough is that if we removed the Bevoisms that occasionally drive us mad and play with a more conventional setup we might get worse.

For example, throwing midfielders like Dunkley into the ruck was maddening when the opposition got a clean hitout to advantage, yet we very often won the clearances while doing it. The downside was just very obvious and the benefit wasn’t.

Throwing an immobile ruckman into the mix would have won us some hitouts but robbed us elsewhere. The trick was to recruit a ruckman who wasn’t a liability (Martin was good but short lived, but Darcy is obviously looking great).

If we threw Naughton back he would no doubt take a raft of intercept marks and look a million bucks but the ball would likely exit the forward line easier and leave JUH more exposed. We could pick a more skilled forward than VDM who would kick a goal or two, but again the ball would exit more easily.

Doesn’t mean that he gets everything right at all, but there is usually a lot of thought behind what we do.

And every time posters say “at last, a balanced team” when the side is announced, we lose.

 

[maddog37]

Think many of us (myself included) would have been more in support of Bevo if we didn’t have the round one capitulation again. Though we really don’t know how much of an advantage the extra game in the bank was.

But speaking of that game, it’s a joke we have to play them every year in round one. Imagine if Adelaide had to play Richmond at the MCG 3 years in a row to start the season after 2017, or if Sydney had to open the season in Geelong each year after 2022, or Collingwood had to play in Perth round one for three years after 2018. It’s a joke we get put in that scenario by the AFL to never have a chance to GET OVER the grand final.

It’s been half a decade since I’ve been able to walk up to our home ground in Round 1, not worry about having to pre purchase a ticket and not have to get there early to secure a seat. I get WHY the AFL schedules us at the MCG in round one, but it’s gotten ridiculous now.

Or you could say we get the opportunity every year to bite back but keep shitting the bed.

 

[BIG_BONTS]

I think one possibility people don’t consider enough is that if we removed the Bevoisms that occasionally drive us mad and play with a more conventional setup we might get worse.

For example, throwing midfielders like Dunkley into the ruck was maddening when the opposition got a clean hitout to advantage, yet we very often won the clearances while doing it. The downside was just very obvious and the benefit wasn’t.

Throwing an immobile ruckman into the mix would have won us some hitouts but robbed us elsewhere. The trick was to recruit a ruckman who wasn’t a liability (Martin was good but short lived, but Darcy is obviously looking great).

If we threw Naughton back he would no doubt take a raft of intercept marks and look a million bucks but the ball would likely exit the forward line easier and leave JUH more exposed. We could pick a more skilled forward than VDM who would kick a goal or two, but again the ball would exit more easily.

Doesn’t mean that he gets everything right at all, but there is usually a lot of thought behind what we do.

And every time posters say “at last, a balanced team” when the side is announced, we lose.

Yeah completely agree with this. I still think Naughton should go back but let's not pretend it's a free lunch. None of our other forwards are anywhere near dominant enough for this to be a slam dunk. Marra, Flea and Lobb are reliably inconsistent C grade players — aka will kick 1-2 goals in 2-3 games per moth. Darcy I'd consider D grade right now — aka will bob up for 2 goals once a month. Hopefully they all click and step up but it's far from a sure thing

 

[blurst]

I think one possibility people don’t consider enough is that if we removed the Bevoisms that occasionally drive us mad and play with a more conventional setup we might get worse.

For example, throwing midfielders like Dunkley into the ruck was maddening when the opposition got a clean hitout to advantage, yet we very often won the clearances while doing it. The downside was just very obvious and the benefit wasn’t.

Throwing an immobile ruckman into the mix would have won us some hitouts but robbed us elsewhere. The trick was to recruit a ruckman who wasn’t a liability (Martin was good but short lived, but Darcy is obviously looking great).

If we threw Naughton back he would no doubt take a raft of intercept marks and look a million bucks but the ball would likely exit the forward line easier and leave JUH more exposed. We could pick a more skilled forward than VDM who would kick a goal or two, but again the ball would exit more easily.

Doesn’t mean that he gets everything right at all, but there is usually a lot of thought behind what we do.

And every time posters say “at last, a balanced team” when the side is announced, we lose.

Great post. I have found it hilarious how many people were rejoicing at the balanced team selection prior to Round 1, only for the blame for that loss to end up placed on “poor team selection”

 

[maddog37]

Bevo moonlighting in Ridley Scott’s latest film.

 

[TiAn_]

Great post. I have found it hilarious how many people were rejoicing at the balanced team selection prior to Round 1, only for the blame for that loss to end up placed on “poor team selection”

I really don’t get why people are up in arms about Daniel and Macrae not being best 18 to start the season. Or calling for players that don’t play the same positions as those two to be dropped for them. They were two players that were constantly complained about last year as being too slow and not having defined roles. Wedging our best players all into the one team didn’t work particularly well for us last year, I’m glad we’ve tried to move away from it and hope it sticks.

We didn’t lose round 1 because of selection, it was because the team as a whole weren’t adequately prepared.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

I think one possibility people don’t consider enough is that if we removed the Bevoisms that occasionally drive us mad and play with a more conventional setup we might get worse.

For example, throwing midfielders like Dunkley into the ruck was maddening when the opposition got a clean hitout to advantage, yet we very often won the clearances while doing it. The downside was just very obvious and the benefit wasn’t.

Throwing an immobile ruckman into the mix would have won us some hitouts but robbed us elsewhere. The trick was to recruit a ruckman who wasn’t a liability (Martin was good but short lived, but Darcy is obviously looking great).

If we threw Naughton back he would no doubt take a raft of intercept marks and look a million bucks but the ball would likely exit the forward line easier and leave JUH more exposed. We could pick a more skilled forward than VDM who would kick a goal or two, but again the ball would exit more easily.

Doesn’t mean that he gets everything right at all, but there is usually a lot of thought behind what we do.

And every time posters say “at last, a balanced team” when the side is announced, we lose.

I remember when we played that excellent game against Richmond late last year among some bad games and a lot of the post-game posts were like this. "See Bevo you did what we said, and not what we didn't say, so therefore we won". I remember being absolutely slammed for sarcastically saying "yeah the difference with this game was that in previous games, Bevo was not trying to win, and in this game, he was trying to win, so we won". Kind of ridiculous. Bevo does things for a reason. I'm not sure how much insight any of us have into the decision-making process for what he does. We can analyse the results, and we can infer from the results, but to doubt Bevo's sincerity in trying his best is just bizarre.

 

[lachy]

I remember when we played that excellent game against Richmond late last year among some bad games and a lot of the post-game posts were like this. "See Bevo you did what we said, and not what we didn't say, so therefore we won". I remember being absolutely slammed for sarcastically saying "yeah the difference with this game was that in previous games, Bevo was not trying to win, and in this game, he was trying to win, so we won". Kind of ridiculous. Bevo does things for a reason. I'm not sure how much insight any of us have into the decision-making process for what he does. We can analyse the results, and we can infer from the results, but to doubt Bevo's sincerity in trying his best is just bizarre.

To be fair, from memory that was more related to not playing 3 KPD's with poor disposal and only one who could intercept mark to have 'Height' in the backline, yet try to attack out of the back line

 

[TiAn_]

I remember when we played that excellent game against Richmond late last year among some bad games and a lot of the post-game posts were like this. "See Bevo you did what we said, and not what we didn't say, so therefore we won". I remember being absolutely slammed for sarcastically saying "yeah the difference with this game was that in previous games, Bevo was not trying to win, and in this game, he was trying to win, so we won". Kind of ridiculous. Bevo does things for a reason. I'm not sure how much insight any of us have into the decision-making process for what he does. We can analyse the results, and we can infer from the results, but to doubt Bevo's sincerity in trying his best is just bizarre.

We had 1 great quarter in that game. We won the first quarter by 44 points and then only won the other 3 quarters by a combined 11 points. We just clicked to start the game while our opponents absolutely stunk. We were otherwise the same as we were all season. Capable of good football, but only for stretches, and utterly inconsistent.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

We had 1 great quarter in that game. We won the first quarter by 44 points and then only won the other 3 quarters by a combined 11 points. We just clicked to start the game while our opponents absolutely stunk. We were otherwise the same as we were all season. Capable of good football, but only for stretches, and utterly inconsistent.

That's an interesting way to spin a 55 point win though. It's a 55 point win? Wins aren't distributed by scoring goals evenly over the course of a game.

 

[ScragCity]

BevoBall to the moon

 

[TiAn_]

That's an interesting way to spin a 55 point win though. It's a 55 point win? Wins aren't distributed by scoring goals evenly over the course of a game.

Easy tiger, I was agreeing with you.