Preview R2: Changes v Port

[Rory Walkerfield]

In fact here's the graph with even more midfield players: Smith, Sloane, Lynch, Laird, Henderson, Thompson, M. Crouch, Douglas and of course VB and Mackay

Nice work. Can you make all the lines bold. Too hard to see who's with dotted lines.

 

[1970crow]

You mean how i was harping on about him being best 22 because he was selected best 22 again by a 6th consecutive coach.

He wasn't named on the bench to start. I thought that bench players were an indicator of last players selected (like they were under previous regimes). I was wrong about that as Mackay obviously started on the Bench.

The funny thing though, is that even him starting on the bench - still means he is BEST 22.



And still performed better than 1/3 of our team despite less game time.



Because its impossible to try and discuss things with you. You have an agenda and are more caught up with point scoring than actually discussing things.

I like Mackay as a player. I think he is still best 22 at Adelaide because we have an average list. This is something I have said for years. I don't think he is a great player (I do ham it up for a bit of fun), but he deserves to be in our middle of the road AFL lineup.

I believe that the club has identified him as a player who leveled out with regards to his performance and potential. They have recruited players that can hopefully take the next step and push him out of the side (Seed, Rat, Knight etc).

IF these players step up - then he will rightfully be out of the side and I will not shed a single tear, because it means we are a better side.

It only means best 22 if we have an uninjured list and every player has the conditioning required to be considered for AFL selection. We know that both CC and Knight were best 22 and played SANFL to gain match fitness after missing the entire NAB. We know Menzel is a high end talent, but is lacking conditioning.

if he's best 22, which isn't a set rating anyway, he's only just in there at this point. Won't stay there if his output doesn't improve.

 

[Scorpus]

Nice work. Can you make all the lines bold. Too hard to see who's with dotted lines.

Nah, that actually makes it harder to see the difference. The point is to highlight VB and Mackay against everyone else.

 

[GreyCrow]

VB- I'm one of his few fans but enough is enough. Yeah he puts his head over it but thats all. Next years SANFL captain.

.

If I had joined earlier this was the comment I would have made. I thought he should have been made THIS years Captain.

For those who want Lever on Westhoff. Really? Westhoff will smile and run him all over the ground not just the forward line. I would contemplate Henderson for fitness. His stats in the SANFL suggest he is near enough ready.

 

[Bicks]

My answer still stands. You figure out the numbers, based on that information. I can't be bothered.

That would be the GRAND total of 2 AFL games and 1 NAB game this year against Freo since his corrective surgery..

http://www.afc.com.au/news/2015-04-27/slowly-but-shawly-sams-long-road

http://www.aflplayerratings.com.au/Ratings/Player/115846/Sam-SHAW

2015 Season
1 Hamstring.
2 Hamstring.
3 Hamstring.
4 Hamstring.
5 Hamstring.
6 Hamstring.
7 Hamstring.
8 Hamstring.
9 SANFL Looked good in defence. 23 touches, nine marks in first game back. -
10 SANFL Benched after half-time after suffering heavy knock. Luckless. -
11 SANFL Bye. -
12 SANFL Steady, versatile performance with 18 possessions. -
13 SANFL An important defensive cog with his marking and desperation. -
14 SANFL Match postponed. -
15 SANFL Enjoyed one of his better matches for 2015. Particularly good early. -
16 SANFL Marshalled the backline expertly. -
17 GCS Came in for his first game of the year, grew in confidence as the game wore on.
18 SANFL Senior emergency. -
19 SANFL Run and rebound out of defence was impressive. -
20 SANFL Fairly quiet afternoon. -
21 Bris Didn’t find a lot of footy but in his defence it wasn’t at his end often.
22 SANFL Benched after copping a knock to his knee in the third quarter. -
23 Thigh.

 

[GreyCrow]

Thommo won't get dropped at any point this year.

He might be managed

 

[1970crow]

Given the likes of knight, CC, Menzel and Hampton were not available for senior selection, I couldn't care which two of VB, Mackay, CEY and Lyons play. Once those first 4 guys are ready to roll, none of the last 4 should be playing.

The point I was trying to make was that with Danger gone and Brouch playing his first game for over 12 months that perhaps we should have beefed up our inside resources until we get a handle on where our midfield is at without Moggsy and with interchange reduced. Just an opinion.

 

[mistylake]

I don't think we can play and carry two young players at once during our incredibly tough start to the season. Bring back McGovern a bit later, but right now we need in workhorses like Knight

Ouch bring in the experienced veteran Knight. What is he 10 games?
But anyway bring him in I think he's real good. I want Mclovin to stay though.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Cheney might be a fringe workhorse, he's still 5x the player that Shaw is and ever will be.

Neither is great on a tall kpp forward, so they have that in common.-

 

[BRL121]

Is there any news on this?

Someone mentioned it was an injury sustained after the game?

Did he kick the dressing-room door?

 

[1970crow]

I disagree, it was one of his better games!

Vader has conditioned himself based on our history of selection. It's not hard to predict, we can all do it. But what's funny is that he looks at that game and because he sees it as the norm and selection follows, he endorses it as AFL quality. It's not, Mackay is not, it's a poor game and wouldn't cut it at a club desperate to improve or that understands average plodders don't get you anywhere just because they bring game day experience.

Although, to be fair, some of them have finally woken up to VB, although he's no worse than he's been the last 3 uninjured seasons and they celebrated that rubbish.

 

[GreyCrow]

He was last night too for one of his kicks

Would that be the one along the ground 3rd quarter?

 

[Elite Crow]

You mean how i was harping on about him being best 22 because he was selected best 22 again by a 6th consecutive coach.

He wasn't named on the bench to start. I thought that bench players were an indicator of last players selected (like they were under previous regimes). I was wrong about that as Mackay obviously started on the Bench.

The funny thing though, is that even him starting on the bench - still means he is BEST 22.

And still performed better than 1/3 of our team despite less game time.

Because its impossible to try and discuss things with you. You have an agenda and are more caught up with point scoring than actually discussing things.

I like Mackay as a player. I think he is still best 22 at Adelaide because we have an average list. This is something I have said for years. I don't think he is a great player (I do ham it up for a bit of fun), but he deserves to be in our middle of the road AFL lineup.

I believe that the club has identified him as a player who leveled out with regards to his performance and potential. They have recruited players that can hopefully take the next step and push him out of the side (Seed, Rat, Knight etc).

IF these players step up - then he will rightfully be out of the side and I will not shed a single tear, because it means we are a better side.

You know you make me laugh, you accuse me of point scoring and yet before the game you were the one point scoring "look he's still best 22, you guys are idiots, 6 coaches know best" and then expect not to cop some back. That's hypocritical and precious.

You like him but think he's in our side because we have an average list and he's not a great player. And yet when he's criticised for being an average player you ark up. Your are an odd individual. Why didn't you just agree with us that he's and average player and we could have stopped all this much earlier.

 

[ThreeLeggedCrow]

Yes, Henderson maybe in the next couple of rounds ... needs match fitness and have some luck this year.
2013 - knee surgery
2014 - broken fibula
2015 - bulging disc

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

Kicked a couple on Talia .....are you suggesting Hartigan would do a better job than Talia ?

Suggest the better strategy is to cut the supply ......but North were able to deliver non-pressured kicks to their forwards

When was Talia playing on Waite? that very rarely happened if at all, he was petrie for most of the game and couple of times on goldsein, it was almost always Lever or Cheney on Waite.

I'm warming to the idea of Talia, Lever and Shaw (+ Cheney as a medium defender). Shaw's form in the SANFL has been good the past two weeks, if he continues to play well he deserves a spot.

I still don't think Shaw is great one on one, but if his form in the twos is good, he's worth a shot at AFL level again

Meanwhile Hartigan wasn't exactly awesome yesterday in the twos.

Think Shaw would be a good match up for Whesthoff.

I think there were 2 errors at selection. One was going a KPD short and the other was going one short in clearance mids. Either McGovern or Mackay should have made way for Lyons or CEY. Was a bad debut as the big banana at the selection table for Pyke. Outsmarted ourselves.

I'm not against another clearance type, but winning them wasn't the problem, it was how easily they got theirs. It will take a little while for a Crouch to get back to his best but he'll be better for the run. I expect a big step up from Sloane though, needs to respond from an average performance. If Jacobs can get on top of Lobbe we'll go alright.

 

[Doctor B]

Schulz 193cm 95Kg
Westhoff 199cm 93Kg
Dixon 202cm 105Kg

As suggested by others, drop VB for Hartigan, get in some more KPD height otherwise Talia wont sleep this week. Surely we don't go in 1 short again.

We need to shut Gray and Wingard down as much as possible 26 disposals & 4 goals / 21 & 3 respectively today.

Today Lobbe with 9 disposals 42 H/O smashed by Hickey 20 disposals 56 H/O. Sauce should be able to give us a good first look this week after getting belted by the best ruckman going around last night.

 

[1970crow]

Cheney might be a fringe workhorse, he's still 5x the player that Shaw is and ever will be.

Next year will be the last of his contract extension and you can refer to him as a dead man walking. Shaw is a talented footballer with excellent attributes. He has shown this at the highest level before being cruelled by persistent injury. No doubt that there was concern over his kicking, but every poster who's watched him play since the op has commented on how much better his kicking is. Sometimes you should just admit that you aren't qualified to offer biased opinions as matters of fact.

 

[Tex200]

I was happy with our defensive structure last night and don't feel this cost us the game.

Knight must return as well as Cameron. Shooter and Milera must stay.

The 2 outs are glaring but I feel defeated and that its a waste of time suggesting it

 

[mattymac]

Knight must come in for Mackay as he is clearly the better, faster, stronger option. Charlie should come in as well. We saw how easy it is to get out and score over the back against port. Eddie looked lost without his partner in crime. Might fall to the gov to make way now that he's had a taste.

VB needs to make way for Hartigan

 

[Coopers]

Well, Hartigan needs to come in. Lever and Cheney were both pretty good. Lever is a very smart footballer (ignoring Thomas taking a dive).
I'd keep them and play both in defence, switching them out as required.

I'd drop Mackay and I'd move VB into the midfield full time (stick with me here) as I think he sucks arse at half back but is not so bad if he's already at the contest.

That said, if Knight and Cameron are good to go I'd drop VB, and McGovern (sorry mate, think you have a future, but last man in is first man out). too.

 

[Elite Crow]

Well, Hartigan needs to come in. Lever and Cheney were both pretty good. Lever is a very smart footballer (ignoring Thomas taking a dive).
I'd keep them and play both in defence, switching them out as required.

I'd drop Mackay and I'd move VB into the midfield full time (stick with me here) as I think he sucks arse at half back but is not so bad if he's already at the contest.

That said, if Knight and Cameron are good to go I'd drop VB, and McGovern (sorry mate, think you have a future, but last man in is first man out). too.

You want to entertain VB in the midfield? There is no sticking with you on that one.

 

[Vader]

So in 2015 he played 4 good games, 8 poor games and 8 average games? 80% of his games are poor or average. How can we keep justifying his selection?

That's why he was dropped last year. Too many poor games.

 

[1970crow]

Schulz 193cm 95Kg
Westhoff 199cm 93Kg
Dixon 202cm 105Kg

As suggested by others, drop VB for Hartigan, get in some more KPD height otherwise Talia wont sleep this week. Surely we don't go in 1 short again.

We need to shut Gray and Wingard down as much as possible 26 disposals & 4 goals / 21 & 3 respectively today.

Today Lobbe with 9 disposals 42 H/O smashed by Hickey 20 disposals 56 H/O. Sauce should be able to give us a good first look this week after getting belted by the best ruckman going around last night.

Is that forward line all that different to North's? If we didn't think we needed Hartigan for structure against them, why would that change for Port. Surely they're not going to shelve the system after a close loss away against the Roos. If VB gets replaced, which is unlikely, you don't drop 200 game club stalwarts after one (ha, ha) poor performance, I would expect the structure to remain.

 

[Vader]

Not talking Shaw. I agree he is not the answer, would much prefer Hartigan.
More talking vB and mackay. Accepting a not too bad game is not going to get us anywhere.

I'm all for dropping VB this week. His performance last night was very poor. No argument there. Dmack, not so much - he was OK last night.

As a general philosophy, I don't see the point in dropping a player who is performing reasonably well unless the player replacing him is an upgrade. In 2015 the players waiting on the sidelines were CEY, Grigg and Lyons - none of whom represent an upgrade. This year we have more options, many of whom could be considered to be an upgrade. Missing from this week were Knight, Cameron and Menzel, all of whom I would consider to be upgrades (though Menzel is not currently fit enough).

Replace Mackay with CEY or Lyons, and I will be disappointed. Replace him with Knight or Cameron, and you won't hear a peep from me.

If we assume that Knight and Cameron are ready for AFL selection this week, then 2 players have to drop out. One of them should be VB. The other, I believe, will come down to a choice between Milera and Mackay...

Milera has the potential to be much better than Mackay, but he's currently struggling at AFL level - he oozes class when he gets the ball, but he doesn't get enough of it. That's not a criticism of him, it's just an observation of where he is at with his development. Is he better off developing in the SANFL, or the AFL? I think he would be better off playing in the SANFL, learning how to accumulate more possessions. Milera has the potential to be a very good player, so we need to work out a development plan that is best for him. It's not a case of hating on the shiny young toy, it's wanting to see the shiny toy achieve its full potential.

Thus, I think the changes for this week should be Knight & Cameron in, VB and Milera out. I want to see more of Milera at AFL level this year, but I think he is best off in the SANFL for now.

 

[1970crow]

You want to entertain VB in the midfield? There is no sticking with you on that one.

Let's just keep moving him around until he's competent somewhere. Then when he's not we can roll out the 'had a tough year due to being our Mr Fixit' excuse. If that doesn't fly, Vader can roll out his patented, "got his preseason wrong" excuse.

But it's not an AFC team without VB (or Mackay) in it, so we must persist and hold our nerve, their form will turn, just believe.