Analysis Grundy, Cox and Cameron Discussion

[Wearmouth]

Not sure how getting personal, progresses, your argument.
But it’s predictable given emotion rather than facts, drive your debating style.

Notice how the facts of todays game didn’t care about your feelings.

Otherwise Gawn and Jackson would have smashed our Rucks. And all the Dufflecoaters would be in a circle singing Kumbaya with Brodie and awaiting his return.

Inconvenient as it is, the two boys are exposing some real truths.


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[Wearmouth]

You’re not trying hard enough - here’s a hint. Use the search button.
Now here’s a radical idea, where is your evidence that Fly can’t make Grundy better as he’s done with so many other players.
The lame explanation in your earlier post is illogical.

He had all summer and preseason and couldn’t fix him. Yet magically Cameron and Cox have been able to listen and understand what Fly wants after Grundy got injured. And now are playing their best football for the club.

There is no way Grundy will walk in to ruck if these boys are still winning.


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[No SPIN]

He had all summer and preseason and couldn’t fix him. Yet magically Cameron and Cox have been able to listen and understand what Fly wants after Grundy got injured. And now are playing their best football for the club.

There is no way Grundy will walk in to ruck if these boys are still winning.


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Just keep the Grundy, duffle-coat badges you offered me, you’re going to need them.

 

[sr36]

No SPIN has no point. Should change in name to No CLUE.

Grundy has to be able to take marks and tap to his mids. Attributes he has refused to do for the past two years. Grundy thinks his possession and dump kick clearance game is the way forward. A stubborn dumb footballer. That the 2019 prelim exposed us to. We just didn’t understand at the time what actually was happening.


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Re-watch that prelim. Watch where the mids position and who is giving the instructions to the stoppage group. The hit zone wasn't Grundy's call and whilst it was dumb it sure as hell wasn't a stubborn dumb footballer making the call.

 

[swoop42]

I wonder whether McRae will at least be pondering whether the days of Grundy spending 80-85% time in the ruck then heading to the bench needs to comes to an end so Grundy and the team can potentially become the best versions of themselves.

In reality it's not about demoting Grundy it's about allowing Cameron (and by extension Cox) more minutes to keep developing as a first ruck option, seeing what they can produce and allow more players the ability to contribute in dual roles.

While Grundy has stagnated as a ruck these past 2 seasons I'm still adamant if we are prepared to intensely focus on improving his forward craft and Grundy is prepared to commit to a change of role he can regain the spark and influence he once had.

So are we a better team without Grundy?

No.

Are we a better team with Grundy?

Probably not at present. Grundy is the better pure ruck option, Cameron/Cox the better ruck/forward hybrids.

Can we be a better team with Grundy?

Yes come 2023 if he can turn himself in to a 15-20 goal a season ruck/forward.

 

[Matrix10]

Despite the fact you cant organise a sentence..

i'm all for the current way we play!
I'm just offering a tactical reason why things have changed. Even Fly hinted in his presser that grundy isn't a certainty.

I was just pointing out the different style we played since Grundy wasn't available...which who is to say wont work when he is back?

Too slow of mind , bereft of football nous ,

 

[Matrix10]

Don't be so pathetic.

I simply stated that with Grundy out, we're playing a different style.
Which is predicated on the strengths/weaknesses of what we have available.
Do you agree?

That's good coaching.

Who knows what would have happened today if Grundy played and smashed Gawn / etc in the ruck.....in which case this conversation would be different.

patience.....lets see where we are the week before Grundy comes back to make any decisions.

Patience ! It’s been how long without precious bubble boy been on the field ? I’ll let you work that out , how many games have we been been effective with our clearances ,connection since ! that’s a $ 50 thousand dollar a week , football calendar question.

 

[chop_me]

Grundy is very much overpaid but he is still a better option than both Cox and Cameron.


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[jmac70]

Patience ! It’s been how long without precious bubble boy been on the field ? I’ll let you work that out , how many games have we been been effective with our clearances ,connection since ! that’s a $ 50 thousand dollar a week , football calendar question.

I don’t think you actually barrack for Collingwood.

 

[JLC]

Yes.

At the very least Cox and Cameron have set a benchmark of what we should expect. That third quarter patch of Mason Cox

46

Mason Cox

Age

33

Ht

211cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.7

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

3.5

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.6

4star

G

1.2

4star

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.3

2star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.0

4star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.8

5star

where he dropped into defence is exactly what I want from my Ruckman.

 

[jmac70]

Yes.

At the very least Cox and Cameron have set a benchmark of what we should expect. That third quarter patch of Mason Cox where he dropped into defence is exactly what I want from my Ruckman.

Any team is only ever as good as the players on field.

Are West Coast better without Nic Nat?

 

[The Phantom]

The Q this thread posed: are we a better team without Grundy?

The fact is, we’re just a better team.

And would still be a better team with Grundy in it.
It’s other factors determining that.

 

[Mostfamousclub_Pies]

This thread is called ‘Grundy to CHF’ not ‘Will Grundy force his way back into the side?’.
While Grundy has been injured, it has provided a good opportunity for Cameron & Cox to consolidate their respective spots in the team.
Grundy is not the lumbering oaf that many consider him to be. His inclusion as the third tall (assuming the other two are fit and can maintain form) won’t tip the scales.
Cox is showing a far better understanding of centre bounce ruck work. He demonstrated that against Gawn (Gawn did have a dodgy ankle). I liked what I saw, as I’m sure everyone else did too.
Grundy will need to realise that he needs another string to his bow, and I am sure McCrae will be telling him that.

 

[Scodog10]

Thank Duck ha , there are only a few on here who have a basic comprehension of what a true footballer and his worth are to the outcome of a football match

Definitely no typo. BigFooty can’t make up it’s mind about it’s auto edit of f.ck. It started as duck and is now * it’s a bit weird.

Out of curiosity was the second part of your post directed at me? Because to be clear he’s obviously an automatic inclusion when fit and the Brisbane match was all the evidence we needed to show three rucks won’t work. The beauty of footy is that by the time Grundy is fit one of Cox or Cameron will either be out of form or unavailable so the decision of who to leave out will make itself. It’s obvious though that he’s no CHF.

 

[sideswipe]

You can choose not to comment.

Yet you’re drawn to it like a fly.

It exposes the further Grundy the Inconvenient Truth.


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You seem really happy with that “Inconvenient Truth” tag? I like your certainty. Might not be based on reality but it is your truth Ron. Not sure Al would be on your side.

Grundy will be first ruck at first availability.

Who knows? Maybe all 3 will be selected. It’s happened before. In the meantime you and Kap just keep searching for clouds in silver linings.


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[Anzacday]

Thankfully the good form of Cox and Cameron has provided us with options around selection.
The good thing from a coaching perspective is BG can see what McRae expects of the talks in our game plan.
The onus will now be on BG to adapt or not, if only he wasn’t injured

PS: All three threads have been combined into here.

FYI: Gone Critical jathanas Jen2310 Maggie5

 

[Scodog10]

I don’t get all this Ned Guy bashing…i think it’s more Eddie. He was the one that said we’ll come to an agreement because of his relationship with the bulldogs president. I bet he was also the one who insisted giving Grundy his deal, just like he was for Beams.

I’m not going to buy into speculation when it was literally Ned Guy’s job to re-contract players. If Ed’s coming in over the top anyway Guy deserves flack for not telling him to bugger off out of FD matters. He bottled a lot of list management decisions in his time and we’ve been a much better outfit on that front since his departure!

 

[manicpie]

Easy up, it’s a separate thread about a separate topic. If you want to backslap and unfurl the flag go to the other threads

Question for me is what will Grundy, Dean, Kruger & Johnson do for us when all fit?


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I'm replacing Grundy with Carmicheal in that list

 

[Anzacday]

The amazing revival of Mason Cox: Pies big man again stands tall on the big stage

Whatever can be said of Mason Cox and his strange and unique journey from Texas to the Collingwood Football Club, one fact is clear: That he has reserved his premium form for the occasions that match his size.

www.theage.com.au

 

[sideswipe]

Thankfully the good form of Cox and Cameron has provided us with options around selection.
The good thing from a coaching perspective is BG can see what McRae expects of the talks in our game plan.
The onus will now be on BG to adapt or not, if only he wasn’t injured

PS: All three threads have been combined into here.

FYI: Gone Critical jathanas Jen2310 Maggie5

“Adapt or not”? Pretty sure he will be ok sans adaptation.


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[JLC]

Any team is only ever as good as the players on field.

Are West Coast better without Nic Nat?

They won a flag without Nic Nat.

 

[JLC]

The Q this thread posed: are we a better team without Grundy?

The fact is, we’re just a better team.

And would still be a better team with Grundy in it.
It’s other factors determining that.

So who would you drop for Grundy?

 

[Mostfamousclub_Pies]

They won a flag without Nic Nat.

Touché, but they still aren’t better without him.

 

[JLC]

Touché, but they still aren’t better without him.

Mainly because his tap work is elite.

I have maintained from day one that the McRae game plan only requires ruckman that can provide a contest and clunk marks.

Cox and Cameron on current form are clunking marks and deserve to be playing. If Grundy played yesterday, I don’t see what area we would have been improved.

 

[adammania9]

The question is - when Grundy is fit - can we play all 3?

I think for the most part barring desperate measures to swing a game, you’d have 2 of the 3 on the ground at any one time and one on the interchange. I think it could work