Traded 2018 Live Trade: Carlton trade #4 (2019) to Adelaide for #19 (2018) and #9 (2019)

[DangerSloane]

What Fisher does with the disposals? Namely winning the ball, providing a link up option - which, yes, results in some shorter disposals - and setting up play.

Metres gained is handy, but another stat that gets bandied around with much thought as to what is being produced with those disposals.

Your implication is that Gallucci is more constructive with his disposal (based on his metres gained), but the reality is 5 of those 12 disposals are ineffective, effectively making that stat redundant.

The point is a stat like either of them is useless on its own.

 

[La Dispute]

Point is Gallucci would be playing midfield for CFC.
He cant get a gig in there for us. In the future he will if he keeps developing at the rate he is.

He’d be behind O’Brien IMO, who is a much better kick and far more versatile.

 

[DangerSloane]

Dow is anything but vanilla. Has great speed and power.

Mackay and Atkins are what I’d describe as vanilla - average players who are slightly soft and largely ineffectual.

Atkins isn't vanilla. His problem is consistency, but that does prove that you have no clue about the players you're talking about.
He can do the absolute amazing, and has great speed and evasiveness and goal kicking ability.

He just has real issues putting together 3 or 4 quality games in a row and not drifting out of games.

Mackay is completely vanilla, agreed. However he has more of the consistency that Atkins lacks.


Remember Atkins was a pick in the 60s or 80s or something. Not top 10.
Outside midfield is an area we needed to improve. If Gallucci had a full preseason I'm sure he would've played lot more up the ground.
You can see from the way we drafted this year that it was a big focus.

 

[Robertio]

The past = last season... well I guess you're right.
Doesnt mean your 2018 draftees wont be gifted games.
Doesnt mean you still wont have rubbish players getting a game.

I know you're getting rid of them bit by bit after having a list full of them, but you're not done yet.

We got rid of the rubbish players and brought in Bugg, Setterfield and McGovern who would get a game in most teams. Except Adelaide of course.

 

[ad victoriam]

The story presented was that Crows posters can sleep easy on their recruiters, while Carlton supporters should have no confidence theirs. If this this story had merit, it’s not a big ask to expect that out of the 3 exposed drafts since SOS took over, the Crows would at least have taken the better performed player more often with their first pick than Carlton did with their next available pick.

Maybe they did take the better performing player for the Crow setup. because look at the Crows side back then, Milera got games in the Crows side because he filled several of the Crows needs, It Curnow would not have played until 2017 and then only a couple of games No way would he have gotten games before Walker (Capt) or Jenkins (Forward/Ruck), and he is not a Tom Lynch our 3rd tall. which is why the Crow did not select Curnow, Hipwood and Himmelberg with that pick.
And before you get on the high horse Walkler = 47 and 54 goals, JJ = 62 and 45 goals, Lynch = 42 and 31 goals.

With Gallucci vs Fisher I would seriously wait on that call.

 

[Monkey King]

Well on its own what does getting 6 more disposals a game playing a different position have to do with overall performance.

Also metres gained is part of Cripps/Mitchell's problem. Their kicking isnt as good as it could be. I'm sure they will both improve and being elite in other facets means they're still high quality players overall.

Metres gained is well renowned as a meaningless stat in measuring performance. Your invented hybrid takes that to the next level. Gallucci has more “metres gained per disposal” than Mitchell, Cripps, Sidebottom, Oliver, Pendlebury, Selwood, Dangerfield, Gaff, Martin. You couldn’t have invented a more useless statistic if you’d tried.

 

[Monkey King]

Maybe they did take the better performing player for the Crow setup ...

With Gallucci vs Fisher I would seriously wait on that call.

There’s two Carlton players clearly better performed than their Crows counterpart who was drafted before them. Resorting to this type of mental gymnastics only goes to show there’s not much worthwhile to say otherwise.

I’m not waiting on anything. This isn’t a prediction of the future. This is about the here and now, given that it’s here and now that Carlton supporters are being told they should have no confidence in their recruiters.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

All the talk I have ever heard was that Adelaide were going to take McKay and weren’t interested in Curnow hence why Carlton went McKay with the earlier pick. I remember being pissed off because I wouldn’t have risked missing Curnow and would’ve preferred Milera over McKay.

If that’s true than you would’ve taken a KPF but maybe it’s just one of those things where people keep repeating a rumour so often it becomes fact.

The Crows were always taking Milera. May have taken McKay over Doedee. Very happy with our picks as imo both will be 200+ game AA players.

Both McKay & Curnow look like good picks too, but jury out on Weitering being #1 worthy.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

The only handicap Gallucci has are his kicking skills.

He's one of our better kicks at spotting up a team mate with either foot. Now you are doing your best at trolling to support your argument.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

From what I heard we were always going Milera. Lacking speed and ball use at the time and thats exactly what he provides.
Also being an SA kid, it was fairly well a no-brainer.

I mean Curnow, Hipwood, Himmelberg were all available when we picked up Milera.

Exactly.

We bid on Himmelberg with our Doedee pick, so we may have preferred McKay then. Happy we got Doedee though as more of a need.

 

[Crow till I die]

SPS is a shitload better than Gallucci, and I’d take Dow over Fogarty.

For 2015 I’d go Curnow>McKay>Weitering>Doedee>Milera

Mate..fogarty will be a super super player for years to come. He will be the steal of the 2017 draft and that is allowing for stephenson who is currently a super player

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Almost half his touches (a paltry 12) are ineffective.

He’s a currently a bit of a scrub.

His kicking later in the season once he found the pace of AFL was good. I'm not concerned about his kicking going forward.... but hey you keep pointing out you know more about my club that I watch every week..

Way too much prejudgment of players going on here. I would not bother until they have played at least 50 games to get a true picture.

 

[La Dispute]

His kicking later in the season once he found the pace of AFL was good. I'm not concerned about his kicking going forward.... but hey you keep pointing out you know more about my club that I watch every week..

Way too much prejudgment of players going on here. I would bother until they have ppl Mayer at least 50 games to get a true picture.

Basically sums up this whole thread. Adelaide supporters are happy to have a go at our recruiting of Stocker, yet when Carlton supporters point out a first-round Adelaide player hasn’t set the world on fire, and actually has form to gauge (especially in comparison to a player recruited after him) they go on the defensive.

This thread was always going to be a shitshow, but the level of w***ery and tit-for-tat retaliation is off the charts.

Mate..fogarty will be a super super player for years to come. He will be the steal of the 2017 draft and that is allowing for stephenson who is currently a super player

Agreed, but I think Dow will be a very good player, and better than Fogarty.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Basically sums up this whole thread. Adelaide supporters are happy to have a go at our recruiting of Stocker, yet when Carlton supporters point out a first-round Adelaide player hasn’t set the world on fire, and actually has form to gauge (especially in comparison to a player recruited after him) they go on the defensive.

This thread was always going to be a shitshow, but the level of w***ery and tit-for-tat retaliation is off the charts.



Agreed, but I think Dow will be a very good player, and better than Fogarty.

I have supported the Stocker trade in numerous posts, so how about you stop treating all supporters the same & stop changing the goal posts replying... as you have habit of dragging everything down to the lowest common denominator then crying foul.

 

[Crow till I die]

Basically sums up this whole thread. Adelaide supporters are happy to have a go at our recruiting of Stocker, yet when Carlton supporters point out a first-round Adelaide player hasn’t set the world on fire, and actually has form to gauge (especially in comparison to a player recruited after him) they go on the defensive.

This thread was always going to be a shitshow, but the level of w***ery and tit-for-tat retaliation is off the charts.



Agreed, but I think Dow will be a very good player, and better than Fogarty.

We agree to disagree because i see fogarty having the attributes to become one of the best forwards in the AFL when he reaches full fitness. Dow will be a good mid but i don't see a potential cripps or fyfe or dangerfield level in his game

 

[LemmingMaster]

When was the last time that Carlton drafted a player in the 3rd-4th round and then get a solid career or trade out of them?

Please ONCE again read your INITIAL statement!!!!!!!

I know you've changed it to only include trade out of them and removed the solid career part.

 

[ad victoriam]

There’s two Carlton players clearly better performed than their Crows counterpart who was drafted before them. Resorting to this type of mental gymnastics only goes to show there’s not much worthwhile to say otherwise.

I’m not waiting on anything. This isn’t a prediction of the future. This is about the here and now, given that it’s here and now that Carlton supporters are being told they should have no confidence in their recruiters.

Problem is you making judgement calls way too early. and you are using the fact one team plays its kids early while the other is known for letting there kids develop a bit in 2nd's, ie one team needs too the other can afford not to rush development

Gallucci from what I have seen both AFL and SANFL will be a better player than Fisher who I have seen in Both AFL and on replays in the VFL.
But it will take 50 plus game to get a true indication maybe we can talk about in August.
But the talk will most likely centre around Stocker and pick whatever. Or will guys like you be doing a Stocker vs McHenry

As for Curnow vs Milera different players
Lets face on Potential C Curnow may be a good key forward but he has not achieved that yet. need more than a 34 goal year to anything but potential, need some consistency,
Milera is also showing the potential to be an important player, again needs to show that consistently,
Again both different players, but who's more important they guy delivering the pill or the guy on the receiving end kicking goals.
Age old argument.

 

[goBlue]

Well if we are looking at what players have done to date like a number of tge carlton posters here are doing tgen doedee is currently better than weitering. But yes 50 games is a better guide but that particular draft the crows certainly nailed their picks to date

And so did the Blues

 

[goBlue]

Dow over Fogarty.
Ill bookmark that. Dow is a vanilla player. Fogarty has the ability to be an absolute superstar. His ceiling is so much higher.

Look I get you guys dont see much of crows players, especially when they cant crack the side, but you may well be proven wrong.

You're getting down to opinions now. The thing is the CFC players have exposed form whereas the crows ones dont because they have to fight for a position.

You dont think Gallucci if he played for CFC would've had similar if not better stats to SPS?
15 disposals 3 marks a game over first 40 games isnt setting the world alight.

The fact that you have said this shows your clueless. Not even gonna say anymore...

 

[Monkey King]

Problem is you making judgement calls way too early.

If I was making calls about the future you might be correct, but I’m not. I’ve responded to a Crows poster who talked about how we supporters should feel about our respective recruiting teams here and now, and hence, I’m just taking a look at here and now. Imagined futures just aren’t on the agenda here, yours or mine.

 

[DangerSloane]

He's one of our better kicks at spotting up a team mate with either foot. Now you are doing your best at trolling to support your argument.

He's not trolling he just has no idea about our players.
Thinks Dow is a superstar in the making too.

 

[DangerSloane]

And so did the Blues

The guy you picked 1st in the draft has no idea what he's doing currently.
I'd say thats not 'nailed'

 

[DangerSloane]

The fact that you have said this shows your clueless. Not even gonna say anymore...

Nah sorry. Dow is nothing special.
Come back to me in 5 years.
Solid AFL contributor, nothing more.

 

[goBlue]

The guy you picked 1st in the draft has no idea what he's doing currently.
I'd say thats not 'nailed'

Lets wait and see then. By the end of this season he's gonna look great.

 

[goBlue]

Nah sorry. Dow is nothing special.
Come back to me in 5 years.
Solid AFL contributor, nothing more.

Lol. So Dow went pick #3 because recruiters thought he would be a good contributor.
Dow's already shown more than half your draft picks.

Where's Galluci at, havent seen him in a while lol