List Mgmt. 2022 Draft and Trade Hypotheticals: Kinnear & Dalrymple - we march to no drum but our own!

[Ticky009]

 

[caesar88]

I see no reason Gould can't be a key defender. He's 4cm taller than Rampe who made a career out of playing a key defender role. I think the club would still see Gould as primarily that Hurn type rebounding player, but there's a good chance he may not be fit enough to do just that and will need to add another string to his bow, like being able to take an opponent in a 1v1.

 

[rustycrate]

lots of chatter about needing KPPs.

Over the next two years, we will lose our..
Tall forward - Buddy
2nd tall forward / 2nd ruck - Reid
Ruck - Hickey
back up ruck - Sinkers
All round defender - Rampe

but over the last few years we have drafted / recruited..
Tall forward - Buddy McDonald, with back up from McLean
2nd tall forward / 2nd ruck - Reid Amartey
Ruck - Hickey Ladhams
back up ruck - Sinkers McAndrew
All round defender - Rampe Blakey, Gould, T McCartin, OConnor, and Melican is only 25
plus its likely we will pick P McCartin who can play KP at both ends.

It was interesting hearing Kinnear saying there will be no 'quality' KPPs come our picks in this years draft. That suggested to me that we're not interested in average KPPs, only quality ones. Some might put, McLean, Amartey, Melican, Gould, Oconnor, McAndrew in the 'average' bucket, meaning we have enough cover there. Its quality that I think we are after.
I think Amartey could be a better player than Reid; all of Melican, Gould, OConnor could hold down a b22 spot, McAndrew could become a good ruck... and, McCartin x 2, Blakey, McDonald, Ladhams could all be a-graders.

I dont reckon our tall/KPP stocks are as bad as people think. In saying that, I wouldn't be surprised to draft/recuit 2 more at the next trade/draft period (When melb miss the 8 we'll have a top 10 pick)

I just think like Dalrymple from now on. Just pick the best available.
We will be picking up KP players in this draft because it is slated that way.
BTW Dalrymple is a politician as well. Has to be in his role.
We will draft KPD this draft and that is no lie.
Unless it isn;t.

 

[hairy biker]

I see no reason Gould can't be a key defender. He's 4cm taller than Rampe who made a career out of playing a key defender role.

Rampe is a smart footballer (pole climbing and chain link fences aside), watching Gould in the reserves it's not his athleticism or his size that I see as his main issue, but rather his shocking lack of footy nous.
He constantly got lost in no man's land, slow to react, slow to impact a contest.
I have nothing against the guy but from what I've seen to date he just doesn't look like making it as an AFL player.

 

[caesar88]

Rampe is a smart footballer (pole climbing and chain link fences aside), watching Gould in the reserves it's not his athleticism or his size that I see as his main issue, but rather his shocking lack of footy nous.
He constantly got lost in no man's land, slow to react, slow to impact a contest.
I have nothing against the guy but from what I've seen to date he just doesn't look like making it as an AFL player.

I don't disagree, but it's worth considering what his lack of fitness (if I was more diplomatic, I'd say his "developing fitness") would do for his confidence and composure. Melican is a prime example. I feel like whenever he returns from an injury lay-off, he is shocking. It's like the game is moving at a different speed to him. And then within a few matches, he seems to get into the groove as he gets his match-fitness. Hard to feel strong and confident when your body is holding you back.

Imagine that initial feeling Melican has, and then apply it to every quarter of every game for Gould. He's just not fit enough. Not saying he won't be a bust - the issue of his fitness is a massive one that he has to overcome - but I think it really is at the root of all of his problems.

 

[Troystenvic]

Dusty to be in red and white 2023.

 

[hairy biker]

I don't disagree, but it's worth considering what his lack of fitness (if I was more diplomatic, I'd say his "developing fitness") would do for his confidence and composure. Melican is a prime example. I feel like whenever he returns from an injury lay-off, he is shocking. It's like the game is moving at a different speed to him. And then within a few matches, he seems to get into the groove as he gets his match-fitness. Hard to feel strong and confident when your body is holding you back.

Imagine that initial feeling Melican has, and then apply it to every quarter of every game for Gould. He's just not fit enough. Not saying he won't be a bust - the issue of his fitness is a massive one that he has to overcome - but I think it really is at the root of all of his problems.

I'll give you an example of what I meant when I said I thought he lacked footy nous.

Game v GWS, ball in dispute in our back pocket, 2x2 GWS/Sydney, Gould stands 10 metres off the contest.
GWS win the ball, centre it and there is Jake Riccardi (Gould's opponent) standing all alone straight in front of goal, 25 metres out.
Essentially Gould had just wandered off, left his man all alone in front of goal and stood off a contest, obviously making no impact.

I agree that fitness may affect his overall performance and he is certainly a guy who gets down on himself, slapping his thigh or the ground when his opponent gets the ball.

But I'm far from convinced that even if he gets his fitness and composure/confidence up, he will be able to overcome what I see as his main issue of lack of footy nous.

 

[SGBeach]

I'll give you an example of what I meant when I said I thought he lacked footy nous.

Game v GWS, ball in dispute in our back pocket, 2x2 GWS/Sydney, Gould stands 10 metres off the contest.
GWS win the ball, centre it and there is Jake Riccardi (Gould's opponent) standing all alone straight in front of goal, 25 metres out.
Essentially Gould had just wandered off, left his man all alone in front of goal and stood off a contest, obviously making no impact.

I agree that fitness may affect his overall performance and he is certainly a guy who gets down on himself, slapping his thigh or the ground when his opponent gets the ball.

But I'm far from convinced that even if he gets his fitness and composure/confidence up, he will be able to overcome what I see as his main issue of lack of footy nous.

havnt seen enough of him play to comment on his footy nous. but, his 2nd pre-season he was a truckload fitter than his first, and I wouldn't be surprised if he has stepped it up again for this pre season. I dont think its a fitness issue any more than other big young players.
Swans gave him an extra year, so they havnt given up. They trained him in a KPD position last year, and KPPs generally take longer to develop.
Big year for Gould... and a hard team for a young player to crack into.
Will watch with interest (and hope - would love to be watching him smashing oppo forwards for years to come)

 

[Kiama Chris]

I'll give you an example of what I meant when I said I thought he lacked footy nous.

Game v GWS, ball in dispute in our back pocket, 2x2 GWS/Sydney, Gould stands 10 metres off the contest.
GWS win the ball, centre it and there is Jake Riccardi (Gould's opponent) standing all alone straight in front of goal, 25 metres out.
Essentially Gould had just wandered off, left his man all alone in front of goal and stood off a contest, obviously making no impact.

I agree that fitness may affect his overall performance and he is certainly a guy who gets down on himself, slapping his thigh or the ground when his opponent gets the ball.

But I'm far from convinced that even if he gets his fitness and composure/confidence up, he will be able to overcome what I see as his main issue of lack of footy nous.

TBH I was surprised he was offered a new contract. I really hate getting down on our players and I wish every one of them nothing but success but I can't honestly see how Gould gets a game as a medium defender with Fox, COR, probably O'Connor and now Blakey in front of him.
Don't see him as an interceptor and he doesn't play tight enough to lockdown.

 

[momentbymoment]

Yeah I'm not convinced by Amartey or McLean yet. For sure they had a few games each where they showed they were at the level, but others they weren't. Even Jesse White had good games. Still, they've got more time. All for drafting 3 talls next year, 1 KPD, 1 Ruck (King), 1 tall-ish forward (don't think they need to be a monster) in that order.

I'm also not convinced we won't play Paddy up front. I'm probably more confident he'd make it as a KPF. In which case we might need 2 KPDs.

But …
Jesse White was daft.
I spent 2 minutes in a lift with him.
Nothing going on behind those eyes.

Amartey and McLean may or may not make it, but please don’t compare them to the great white disappointment that was a Jesse White.

 

[rustycrate]

But …
Jesse White was daft.
I spent 2 minutes in a lift with him.
Nothing going on behind those eyes.

Amartey and McLean may or may not make it, but please don’t compare them to the great white disappointment that was a Jesse White.

I said hello to the great White's dad today. Lives next door. Even he thinks his son was very lucky. Says Swans coach is an a-hole. But he also reckons he has to be.

 

[RUNVS]

Dusty to be in red and white 2023.

He's going to Ferrari?

 

[hairy biker]

I said hello to the great White's dad today. Lives next door. Even he thinks his son was very lucky. Says Swans coach is an a-hole. But he also reckons he has to be.

We are talking Longmire?

I remember in possibly White's last season with us, game at the SCG v Hawthorn, and White was given the task of tagging Luke Hodge off their backline.
I can only presume the thought was that White's height/athleticism would present a problem for Hodge when we had the ball.

It didn't.

One of the more bizarre coaching moves of Longmire's tenure.

 

[rustycrate]

We are talking Longmire?

I remember in possibly White's last season with us, game at the SCG v Hawthorn, and White was given the task of tagging Luke Hodge off their backline.
I can only presume the thought was that White's height/athleticism would present a problem for Hodge when we had the ball.

It didn't.

One of the more bizarre coaching moves of Longmire's tenure.

His dad is very pragmatic. Calls a spade shovel. Says a lot of things half I reckon is true. But he also says that the Swans were the most professional club.
He like our club but hates that his son was cut. Blames Longmire. But has no regrets.

 

[BloodySwan]

His dad is very pragmatic. Calls a spade shovel. Says a lot of things half I reckon is true. But he also says that the Swans were the most professional club.
He like our club but hates that his son was cut. Blames Longmire. But has no regrets.

White had put himself into our best 22 when he left. Not sure what he has to blame Longmire for.

 

[rustycrate]

White had put himself into our best 22 when he left. Not sure what he has to blame Longmire for.

What can I say. His old man loves the Swans but hates Longmire.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

He's going to Ferrari?

Nup. St George.

 

[brad cooper]

His dad is very pragmatic. Calls a spade shovel. Says a lot of things half I reckon is true. But he also says that the Swans were the most professional club.
He like our club but hates that his son was cut. Blames Longmire. But has no regrets.

could you please tell his dad that his hatred is misplaced given his son requested a trade at the end of 2013 and wasn't cut

 

[caesar88]

TBH I was surprised he was offered a new contract. I really hate getting down on our players and I wish every one of them nothing but success but I can't honestly see how Gould gets a game as a medium defender with Fox, COR, probably O'Connor and now Blakey in front of him.
Don't see him as an interceptor and he doesn't play tight enough to lockdown.

I think he got a contract because he was a second-round draft pick. Though I'm sure Horse tries to abide by the, "Where you were drafted is irrelevant" ethos, the truth is that a pick inside the top 30 is a massive investment to make in a prospect, one that we'd want to give ourselves every chance possible at getting a reward from.

I would say there would be very few examples in history of a second-round pick being delisted at the end of his initial two-year contract, so it was unlikely that a developing key position player who'd had two interrupted years of reserves development would be the anomaly.

 

[BloodySwan]

What can I say. His old man loves the Swans but hates Longmire.

I also think Horse got the most out of White.....

 

[PMBangers]

Dubai Quacker 28 Nov 2021
I’m going to declare my (stupidly early) WA draft crush for 2022.

Jackson Broadbent, a 202cm ruckman who debuted in the WAFL SENIORS (!) this year at age 16.

Mind-boggling that a 16 year old ruckman can play WAFL seniors.

See you in 2022 draft thread!

Not to put any more excitement towards Broadbent, but his last measurements were 205 cm and 92 kg

 

[Bloods86]

But …
Jesse White was daft.
I spent 2 minutes in a lift with him.
Nothing going on behind those eyes.

Amartey and McLean may or may not make it, but please don’t compare them to the great white disappointment that was a Jesse White.

All I'm saying is that I recall moments and games where Jesse showed as much promise as Amartey and McLean have so far. I'm not predicting outcomes, but I'm too cautious to lock them in as long term players just yet.

 

[dosser]

All I'm saying is that I recall moments and games where Jesse showed as much promise as Amartey and McLean have so far. I'm not predicting outcomes, but I'm too cautious to lock them in as long term players just yet.

Usually it was when he was negotiating his contract.

 

[anotherletdown]

Not to put any more excitement towards Broadbent, but his last measurements were 205 cm and 92 kg

Excellent news, at that size he should be able to carry the added weight of my wagon being hitched to the fan club

Seriously though, how good is he? All the reports seem to say he's Luke Jackson level.. and therefore no chance at our likely picks

 

[PMBangers]

Excellent news, at that size he should be able to carry the added weight of my wagon being hitched to the fan club

Seriously though, how good is he? All the reports seem to say he's Luke Jackson level.. and therefore no chance at our likely picks

Jackson was much more athletic, Broadbent reminds me a bit of Jarrod Witts but a bit cleaner with disposal and around the ground impact, so while I think he's 'safe' early on to turn into a number 1 ruck

 

[caesar88]

All I'm saying is that I recall moments and games where Jesse showed as much promise as Amartey and McLean have so far. I'm not predicting outcomes, but I'm too cautious to lock them in as long term players just yet.

Might as well throw Logan in as well then.