Player Watch #34: Jack Graham - Part 2

[captain cotch 9]

whats the bennifit of playing him over Sonsie or Mcaulife?

 

[Wooden Robot]

whats the bennifit of playing him over Sonsie or Mcaulife?

None.

 

[smasha]

AS much as it hurts hard,to progress this club,we have to make some hard decisions to fast track our progress into the future.

Pies lost Treloar and Henry and Grundy.

Let's see if we get a Geelong like return on our players,that's the questionable part.

CFL Boy's club involvement.

 

[Grrr]

"Not the sort of player clubs chase."

In the 2022 off season a player called Ben Long was traded from St Kilda to the Suns for pick 32.

Tom Berry went from Lions to the Suns for roughly similar value.

Tobias Bedford went from Demons where he wasn't getting a game to GWS for pick 44.

2023 Zac Fisher from Carlton to North for probably the value of pick 30 odd.

Lachie Schultz pick 34 and a future first.

Small selection from the last couple of off seasons. If those guys are being traded for those picks then there is definitely a market for Jack Graham, basically a triple flag, automatic selection, model citizen footballer.

I think clubs have seen a lot of him and see that he has stalled as a player. Caddy wasn't picked up for much the same reason. Young players who have not had a lot of exposure, were highish draft pics, suit a need etc, worth a punt, get picked up and are given a go.

Graham I don't feel should be an automatic selection and I don't think he will be by years end. Yes model citizen and on reflection would probably get picked up, but it was more to do with the concept of playing him to raise his trade profile.

 

[tiger_tough]

whats the bennifit of playing him over Sonsie or Mcaulife?

None. Just like there wasn't for playing Kmac ahead of anyone else on a wing for the first 7 rounds.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I think clubs have seen a lot of him and see that he has stalled as a player. Caddy wasn't picked up for much the same reason. Young players who have not had a lot of exposure, were highish draft pics, suit a need etc, worth a punt, get picked up and are given a go.

Graham I don't feel should be an automatic selection and I don't think he will be by years end. Yes model citizen and on reflection would probably get picked up, but it was more to do with the concept of playing him to raise his trade profile.

"Stalled as a player" is a Kane Cornes type statement. It is saying nothing but designed to cast a shadow on the subject of the statement. A player who has been an automatic selection throughout his career including in multiple Premiership teams is not stalled. Clubs will very much trade for players who have found their ceiling, Lachie Schultz proves that. They are only interested in whether the player makes their team better, not so much what his improvement curve is, or how early he hit his ceiling.

 

[Noidnadroj]

Or you could follow the general flow of the last 150 odd pages that have debated whether Graham is worth his place in the side. Generally, when that happens, the player is not long for the side because we don't debate the good to very good players.

Graham is a veteran of his position, he is at his peak age, yet he is still in the bottom 6 players in our side, for either value as a player, or value for the position he plays. He is a high half forward, that is not an essential position generally. I have noted that he was good in that position early in his career, but he has not progressed, even those like yourself who value him would concede that, and that the need to provide Dusty when on ball defensive presence is no longer needed. So he is now being measured on actual form. His 15 possession, 1 tackle game is not really making him safe. He had plenty of similar games last year as well.

I and many other posters don't need the TI seal of approval/disapproval to make an opinion valid. We've have had plenty of disagreements over the years, but I generally value his sometimes harsh assessments, because like all of us, he's sees things his way and has a right to voice that. Take what you want out of it, like all posters. I even liked our rather forthright WA college, sheesh I've forgotten his name(s), but he has disappeared.

Graham and MacIntosh, the two in the gun from posters over the last two years, (beside Ellis who you mention), were always going to stay in the side in the short term. Yze was hardly going to come in and run a line through players that have served us so well, and that's good. Hardwick was loyal to the back teeth, which made him the coach he was, but by the end he was not the same coach. So quoting coaches value things that we don't see does not wash with me. We have all been around long enough to value our own judgement, which in general is the eye test, not stats or opinion of others.

I will be surprised if Graham lasts the season. If he does it will be because he has regained real form, if so well and good. I also do not care about trading him for a higher pick because he has played all year, what message would that send. I would be surprised if Graham went for a draft pic of note, because he is not the sort of players clubs chase. He may have been a few years ago.

With Graham available to clubs for nothing he will definitely be in demand as he improves the depth of any team he goes to.

Even a club like North, where there are seemingly no standards and limited leaders, when he doesn’t cost a draft pick they’d be asking themselves if someone like Graham helps their ‘club’ as a whole, and it’s a definitive yes.

And Graham has shown he can play a really important role as part of a finals / flag team, so why wouldn’t a team who sees themselves a contender secure Graham, who can help them at the pointy end as a complimentary player to more attacking mids or flankers?

Graham isn’t going to cost a club draft collateral, and won’t cost a bomb (3-years on $450k / season probably secures him).

So whilst Graham helps us to an extent, an end of second round pick as compensation helps us more given the stage of our list build.

Time will tell, but I’ll be staggered if Graham doesn’t have multiple suitors given he’s a free agent and comes as a very low risk acquisition.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Grrr]

"Stalled as a player" is a Kane Cornes type statement. It is saying nothing but designed to cast a shadow on the subject of the statement. A player who has been an automatic selection throughout his career including in multiple Premiership teams is not stalled. Clubs will very much trade for players who have found their ceiling, Lachie Schultz proves that. They are only interested in whether the player makes their team better, not so much what his improvement curve is, or how early he hit his ceiling.

What has the past got to do with the future. He is a player that should have taken the bull by the horns with all our senior players injured and he hasn't. He was given a go in the midfield, and now he isn't. Sounds like a stalled player, sound bite or not.

Where in our best 22 does Graham fit. He is fighting with Campbell and Mansell for a spot on the forward flank. Dustry, Bolton, Baker and MRJ have the other small forward positions. Right now I would have Ross over Graham no problem. Has played about 3 games there and was in our best on 2 of them.

Graham would make some sides marginally better perhaps, but we are somewhere near the bottom, so not many sides are going to go for a player who has reached there peak and is hanging on in a side coming 16th.

I do not bag players and I am not bagging Graham, I am just questioning his worth to the side and to another side. If we (and the press) are talking trades, what does that indicate, that he's an automatic selection.

 

[Grrr]

With Graham available to clubs for nothing he will definitely be in demand as he improves the depth of any team he goes to.

Even a club like North, where there are seemingly no standards and limited leaders, when he doesn’t cost a draft pick they’d be asking themselves if someone like Graham helps their ‘club’ as a whole, and it’s a definitive yes.

And Graham has shown he can play a really important role as part of a finals / flag team, so why wouldn’t a team who sees themselves a contender secure Graham, who can help them at the pointy end as a complimentary player to more attacking mids or flankers?

Graham isn’t going to cost a club draft collateral, and won’t cost a bomb (3-years on $450k / season probably secures him).

So whilst Graham helps us to an extent, an end of second round pick as compensation helps us more given the stage of our list build.

Time will tell, but I’ll be staggered if Graham doesn’t have multiple suitors given he’s a free agent and comes as a very low risk acquisition.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

North maybe, depth no problem. Again talking in the past regarding performance, when was the last time he played sustained good football, a while ago. Injuries, plateaued?

My argument is not would he be tradeable, he may be, but we should not be playing him in a team when we and he are underperforming, for want of a better trade deal. If he was in my team this weak, he is just in. Look what Hugo did last week when backed in. Look what Lefau has done, Browne, MRJ. We need to try something new, have a look at some players that deserve a go, and swing a few changes to playing positions before our players start returning, because spots are going to get tighter the longer the season goes..... providing a bit of luck with injuries.

 

[Profop]

I mean we did play Sonsie is his position and Sonsie struggled until he was dropped

 

[Hank Heavenly]

whats the bennifit of playing him over Sonsie or Mcaulife?

NONE

 

[Grrr]

I mean we did play Sonsie is his position and Sonsie struggled until he was dropped

Well Sonsie is a mid, but plenty of others aren't.

 

[tiger_tough]

I mean we did play Sonsie is his position and Sonsie struggled until he was dropped

Sonsie isn't a forward.

 

[Hoos]

whats the bennifit of playing him over Sonsie or Mcaulife?

None that I can see.

 

[Hoos]

I mean we did play Sonsie is his position and Sonsie struggled until he was dropped

Except Sonsie isn't a forward. Play him as a midfielder for a few games and see how he goes.

 

[Grrr]

Except Sonsie isn't a forward. Play him as a midfielder for a few games and see how he goes.

I think we'll find out this week. Not sure MacAuliffe will play, hasn't played much footy of late so would be a tough ask.

 

[tiger_tough]

Well he's done a hammy at training this week so he's out.

 

[Profop]

I’m aware that Sonsie is better placed to play as a mid but it isn’t Graham keeping him out of that spot

 

[Hoos]

I think we'll find out this week. Not sure MacAuliffe will play, hasn't played much footy of late so would be a tough ask.

Yeah, I don't know whether he'll come back yet either. I'll be amazed if Sonsie doesn't come in.

I guess it depends on who else goes out whether McAuliffe comes in. Campbell may need a spell in the twos. Banks on one wing and Ralphsmith on the other. McIntosh may get dropped too, but there's probably more chance of Dusty playing at full back.

 

[Hoos]

Well he's done a hammy at training this week so he's out.

Who has?

 

[tiger_tough]

Who has?

JGTI

 

[Grrr]

JGTI

Spoil sport

 

[TigerImposter]

JGTI is out with a Heart String. Hopper and this bloke are cut from the same cloth and both will spend their time with constant leg injuries as they're two tractors who are not cut out for the game physically.

 

[RJK Tiger]

You joined an argument late, provided a whole heap of off topic dribble relating to form, tried to pass it off as evidence of the topic at hand despite it being kinda weird and now throwing your toys out of the cot?

I and others provided evidence, but TI provided none but I reckon you know that and are just trying to get TI to ask you out for a romantic dinner or something?

You should go back to bagging Dan Rioli as being one of the worst defenders in the game, that was some of your best work

Yeah your right - he is awesome and a gun. I guess thats why after 8 years the mother****er STILL starts most games son the bench.

Even with Prestia, Ross, Taranto out, Cotchin , Edwards, Lambert retiring - dude still starts most games on the bench


2024


Tell me - what is Grahams position? Then make a list imaging our entire side is completely healthy, ranking every player in his position and tell me where he sits, after 8 ****ing years.

Want to know what is evidence? you bringing up Dan Rioli to me in a Jack Graham thread. Thats how flimsy your argument is. I'm in the Jack Graham thread talking about Jack Graham. what are you doing ya filthy animal?

 

[Daka]

This guy is absolutely cooked! quads, hamstrings but it also says a lot about our fitness staff do we put this down to another player that was rushed back??