Opinion AUSTRALIAN Politics: Adelaide Board Discussion Part 5

[Scorpus]

Follows on from here: Opinion - The Adelaide Board Politics Thread Part 4

This thread is for discussing Australian politics. That's all Australian politics, not US or other international politics

If you wish to discuss INTERNATIONAL politics, please use our other new thread: Opinion - The Adelaide Board INTERNATIONAL Politics Thread Part 5

 

[Cap]

It's raking in billions of dollars in public money. Now whistleblowers are accusing this consulting firm of ripping off the government

Consulting giant KPMG has been accused by whistleblowers of wasting public money, submitting inflated invoices and billing the Department of Defence for hours never worked.

www.abc.net.au

Seems to becoming a bigger and bigger problem.

It does make you wonder why we don't just use the public service more.

 

[Cap]

'Significant lapse of judgement': ACT government slams early release of report into Bruce Lehrmann's prosecution

The head of an inquiry into judicial fairness as part of the prosecution of Bruce Lehrmann is now the one under the spotlight.

www.abc.net.au

Looks like not going after a re trial was one of the mistakes.

I assume they won't have another crack, bit concerning we might have a rapist on the loose, or just as bad,he isn't.

 

[Eagleboy2011]

'Significant lapse of judgement': ACT government slams early release of report into Bruce Lehrmann's prosecution

The head of an inquiry into judicial fairness as part of the prosecution of Bruce Lehrmann is now the one under the spotlight.

www.abc.net.au

Looks like not going after a re trial was one of the mistakes.

I assume they won't have another crack, bit concerning we might have a rapist on the loose, or just as bad,he isn't.

Wow that a high bar. I have no opinion on the case but isn't a presumption of innocence until found guilty part of our laws anymore.

 

[Cap]

Wow that a high bar. I have no opinion on the case but isn't a presumption of innocence until found guilty part of our laws anymore.

As I said,which for whatever reason you chose to ignore.

My concern is both he could be a rapist, or just as bad, people think he is and he isn't.

The retrial would have solved that.

 

[arrowman]

It's raking in billions of dollars in public money. Now whistleblowers are accusing this consulting firm of ripping off the government

Consulting giant KPMG has been accused by whistleblowers of wasting public money, submitting inflated invoices and billing the Department of Defence for hours never worked.

www.abc.net.au

Seems to becoming a bigger and bigger problem.

It does make you wonder why we don't just use the public service more.

I worked for a consultancy firm back in the day, but not at the "big end of town". IMO (and in my colleagues' opinions, too), government departments love / are dependent on consultants for a number of reasons - some legitimate, some more driven by the public service environment / mentality / rules:

1. Skills / experience. Sometimes legitimate, sometimes just marketing by the consultancy firms. Quite often the "special skills" are overstated and overpriced.

2. Resources / arms & legs for a project. Usually legitimate, but sometimes it's a result of staffing constraints. Sometimes a govt dept finds it easier to justify hiring consultants at high $ rates for a fixed timeframe, than to justify increased staffing on an ongoing basis but at a (much) lower $ cost. The saving becomes illusory when you end up retaining the same consultants / contractors for years on end, one project after another.

3. Objectivity / independence. This is possibly the most legitimate reason, especially when it comes to projects that may result in a restructure or major change in process. The client knows what needs to be done, but they need the "external experts" to recommend it if it's going to get up internally. Public service management get a lot less leeway to make individual decisions than private sector management.

I honestly believe we did some good and worthwhile work for our government clients, on smaller / focused projects, reviews and the like. But the hundreds of millions of $ stuff, rolling on year after year, that we're talking about here, good god. I mean, how badly is your department being operated, if you need to be spending that kind of $ on review after project after review after investigation after strategy....

 

[Punchy Bassett]

As I said,which for whatever reason you chose to ignore.

My concern is both he could be a rapist, or just as bad, people think he is and he isn't.

The retrial would have solved that.

I honestly think a retrial wouldn't change people's opinion. If he got off plenty would think he's still guilty and vice versa.

 

[Cap]

I honestly think a retrial wouldn't change people's opinion. If he got off plenty would think he's still guilty and vice versa.

Looking at the comments in social media, in think you may well be right.

 

[Vader]

2. Resources / arms & legs for a project. Usually legitimate, but sometimes it's a result of staffing constraints. Sometimes a govt dept finds it easier to justify hiring consultants at high $ rates for a fixed timeframe, than to justify increased staffing on an ongoing basis but at a (much) lower $ cost. The saving becomes illusory when you end up retaining the same consultants / contractors for years on end, one project after another.

I'd argue that this is the primary reason for the growth in contractor numbers over the last decade. The Abbott Government placed a cap on Public Service staffing numbers for each department, and the only way to increase staffing levels (to cope with ever increasing work loads) was to employ contractors, who didn't count towards the cap.

It was an obvious false economy, paying contractors several times as much as their APS equivalents, for the same work. The Libs are ideologically driven in their hatred of the APS, so they were more than happy to waste taxpayer money rather than allowing the expansion of the APS.

Note that this is not the only reason for growth of contractor numbers, but I would argue that it's the biggest single factor.

Note also that contractor numbers had been rising for many years before the staff caps were introduced. The caps turbocharged the previously existing trend.

On SM-X205 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Cap]

I worked for a consultancy firm back in the day, but not at the "big end of town". IMO (and in my colleagues' opinions, too), government departments love / are dependent on consultants for a number of reasons - some legitimate, some more driven by the public service environment / mentality / rules:

1. Skills / experience. Sometimes legitimate, sometimes just marketing by the consultancy firms. Quite often the "special skills" are overstated and overpriced.

2. Resources / arms & legs for a project. Usually legitimate, but sometimes it's a result of staffing constraints. Sometimes a govt dept finds it easier to justify hiring consultants at high $ rates for a fixed timeframe, than to justify increased staffing on an ongoing basis but at a (much) lower $ cost. The saving becomes illusory when you end up retaining the same consultants / contractors for years on end, one project after another.

3. Objectivity / independence. This is possibly the most legitimate reason, especially when it comes to projects that may result in a restructure or major change in process. The client knows what needs to be done, but they need the "external experts" to recommend it if it's going to get up internally. Public service management get a lot less leeway to make individual decisions than private sector management.

I honestly believe we did some good and worthwhile work for our government clients, on smaller / focused projects, reviews and the like. But the hundreds of millions of $ stuff, rolling on year after year, that we're talking about here, good god. I mean, how badly is your department being operated, if you need to be spending that kind of $ on review after project after review after investigation after strategy....

I'm not questioning your or others contribution nor it's need.

I also knew a few guys who lost jobs in the PS due to cost cutting, only to be rehired at often over double the rate as a consultant.

I think we could be smarter about it.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

It's raking in billions of dollars in public money. Now whistleblowers are accusing this consulting firm of ripping off the government

Consulting giant KPMG has been accused by whistleblowers of wasting public money, submitting inflated invoices and billing the Department of Defence for hours never worked.

www.abc.net.au

Seems to becoming a bigger and bigger problem.

It does make you wonder why we don't just use the public service more.

Look no further than the $20M pa Korda Mentha contract to improve CALHN, which basically achieved buggar all!

They have had a merry-go-round of consultants meanwhile no one is actually sitting down with clinicians over basic KPI's like length of stay theatre time & adverse incidents.

 

[Cap]

Why high-speed rail goes nowhere fast

Infrastructure Minister is the latest Australian politician to enjoy the beautiful waste of time that is high-speed rail, writes Alan Kohler.

thenewdaily.com.au

Alan not a fan of High Speed rail.

Always seems like a great idea until we start crunching numbers

 

[Vader]

LOL

How surprising a Canberra based leftist public servant would think this...

Perhaps you can explain Diktator Dan's ALP Government's outrageous spending on same.

But no with your leftist logic it's Abbott Abbott Abbott LNP LNP LNP.

Daniel Andrews, Victorian government spends big on KPMG, PwC, Ernst & Young, Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu consultants

amp.theage.com.au

Andrews government spending on consultants soars 200%

Dan Andrews is your White Whale, not mine

On SM-A5360 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[arrowman]

I'd argue that this is the primary reason for the growth in contractor numbers over the last decade. The Abbott Government placed a cap on Public Service staffing numbers for each department, and the only way to increase staffing levels (to cope with ever increasing work loads) was to employ contractors, who didn't count towards the cap.

It was an obvious false economy, paying contractors several times as much as their APS equivalents, for the same work. The Libs are ideologically driven in their hatred of the APS, so they were more than happy to waste taxpayer money rather than allowing the expansion of the APS.

Note that this is not the only reason for growth of contractor numbers, but I would argue that it's the biggest single factor.

Note also that contractor numbers had been rising for many years before the staff caps were introduced. The caps turbocharged the previously existing trend.

On SM-X205 using BigFooty.com mobile app

Maybe, but I don't know about "single biggest factor". The need to use contractors rather than create new full-time positions is inherent in the way the public service operates, regardless of which party is in power.

Also noting that there are two things going on here - contractors and consultants. When it comes to consultants, if I was the Minister for Defence (for example) I'd be wanting to ask the Defence CEO why his/her management of that department is so deficient that they need to be constantly engaging expensive consultants for all sorts of reviews or whatever.

 

[arrowman]

Why high-speed rail goes nowhere fast

Infrastructure Minister is the latest Australian politician to enjoy the beautiful waste of time that is high-speed rail, writes Alan Kohler.

thenewdaily.com.au

Alan not a fan of High Speed rail.

Always seems like a great idea until we start crunching numbers

It beggars belief that any politician / government is still contemplating the idea.

Maybe they could engage KPMG to do a $50 million feasibility study.

 

[arrowman]

China, climate and gender equality: Australia's new foreign aid policy aimed at building influence in Pacific

Australia will require both climate and gender objectives in much of its foreign aid spending, under a new framework aimed at strengthening Australia's influence in the Indo-Pacific.

www.abc.net.au

Under the new rules, all new international development projects worth more than $3 million will have to include a gender equality objective.

"Hello, good people of Western Samoa. You know that clean drinking water project you've asked for help with? Happy to help, but we're going to need to know about the project's gender equality objectives first."

 

[Slippery Pete]

So, I’ll post this here, since it’s been classified as Australian politics.

This is the vote in the Senate yesterday on a Covid Royal Commission.

Does anybody here think there shouldn’t be a Royal Commission?

 

[Cap]

China, climate and gender equality: Australia's new foreign aid policy aimed at building influence in Pacific

Australia will require both climate and gender objectives in much of its foreign aid spending, under a new framework aimed at strengthening Australia's influence in the Indo-Pacific.

www.abc.net.au

"Hello, good people of Western Samoa. You know that clan drinking water project you've asked for help with? Happy to help, but we're going to need to know about the project's gender equality objectives first."

Can't see a real problem trying to enhance women's rights in countries like Western Somoa. Could come across at lecturing, but even they are publicly trying to improve it.

New targets will also be set around engaging local contractors in construction work, in an effort to drive more investment into developing regions.

There is also a hope that providing more work for local contractors might be seen as contrasting with Chinese projects, often dominated by imported workforces.

I took.more out of this one. Seems interesting point of difference, although assumes the required trades or services exist.

 

[arrowman]

Can't see a real problem trying to enhance women's rights in countries like Western Somoa. Could come across at lecturing, but even they are publicly trying to improve it.

You enhance women's rights in other countries via diplomacy, cultural exchange etc, not by requiring those countries to gild their application for aid with a statement about how the project includes a "gender equality objective". That doesn't "come across as lecturing", it IS lecturing.

- And while we're on the subject of consultancies - I can see a potential market for ex-public service people to consult to Asia-Pacific nations on how to word "gender equality statements".

I took.more out of this one. Seems interesting point of difference, although assumes the required trades or services exist.

Absolutely. There's a tension in the Asia-Pacific between China and Australia / our allies, and some of it is coming down to which country is the "friendlier" / a "better ally/support" to the nations in question. This sort of "point of difference" is important.

 

[Cap]

You enhance women's rights in other countries via diplomacy, cultural exchange etc, not by requiring those countries to gild their application for aid with a statement about how the project includes a "gender equality objective".

I'm not sure you or I are the right person to explicitly state what is or what is not enhancing rights

However I would suggest the provision of aid falls under diplomacy , so we seem in agreement here that it's fine.

That doesn't "come across as lecturing", it IS lecturing.

Could be argued either way. I would be a definite as you as it really is in the eye of the person responding.

- And while we're on the subject of consultancies - I can see a potential market for ex-public service people to consult to Asia-Pacific nations on how to word "gender equality statements".

I guess mocking things you ideologically oppose is easier than addressing the issue.

Absolutely. There's a tension in the Asia-Pacific between China and Australia / our allies, and some of it is coming down to which country is the "friendlier" / a "better ally/support" to the nations in question. This sort of "point of difference" is important.

Yes, let's hope the current Govt has a better eye on the Asia pacific than our last one.

I'd like to see closer ties with Indonesia to be honest, seems like a useful ally to have

 

[Slippery Pete]

Hahaha

 

[Cap]

Just to a follow up about our 'real' politican

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Just to a follow up about our 'real' politican

This is like when engineers scuff up their steel toe boots before going to a work site.

I'm relieved though, for a second I thought he was doing black face.

 

[Vader]

Maybe, but I don't know about "single biggest factor". The need to use contractors rather than create new full-time positions is inherent in the way the public service operates, regardless of which party is in power.

Also noting that there are two things going on here - contractors and consultants. When it comes to consultants, if I was the Minister for Defence (for example) I'd be wanting to ask the Defence CEO why his/her management of that department is so deficient that they need to be constantly engaging expensive consultants for all sorts of reviews or whatever.

Fair comment on the difference between contractors and consultants.

On SM-A5360 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Cap]

This is like when engineers scuff up their steel toe boots before going to a work site.

I'm relieved though, for a second I thought he was doing black face.

We didn't see the after party