Caro has got it right - no need for clash jumpers

[Dont be a lemon]

Then Freo need to change their jumper then.

Should never have been allowed into the league with a jumper that could have been mistaken for another teams. Port in this boat as well. Change them both now.

Sheer arrogance.

"Oh we were here first we shouldn't have to change wah wah "

 

[Mero]

Sheer arrogance.

"Oh we were here first we shouldn't have to change wah wah "

Well, actually, that was the VFL/AFL policy from 1897 to 2006.
It only changed with the new Marketing Agreement.


Geelong were the first team to wear a Clash jumper, at Home, in 1914, against Collingwood.
They used to wear thin hoops, and when they first moved to wider hoops they took to wearing all Blue jumpers against Collingwood.
In various games they also wore Red socks, and when numbers came in they wore Red numbers to distinguish them from Collingwood.

 

[lionbear]

I honestly can't believe people are still arguing about this. Manchester United The Red Deveils wear clash jumpers and don't think twice about it. Why is it so hard for teams here to accept it.

What is going to happen in 100 years time.

"We shouldn't have to wear clash jumpers we have had our jumpers for 200 years they have only had there's for 100".

Lets just draw a line in the sand introduce clash jumpers once and for all and move on.

 

[Mero]

I honestly can't believe people are still arguing about this. Manchester United The Red Deveils wear clash jumpers and don't think twice about it. Why is it so hard for teams here to accept it.

What is going to happen in 100 years time.

"We shouldn't have to wear clash jumpers we have had our jumpers for 200 years they have only had there's for 100".

Lets just draw a line in the sand introduce clash jumpers once and for all and move on.

Let's also introduce Offside and reward staging, because everyone knows soccer is better than footy.

Man Utd sell more shirts in Japan than Collingwood sell in Melbourne.

One is a unique game played in one corner of the world with 16 teams, the other a world sport where they can (and do) play against teams with exactly the same shirts in any country in the world.

There is no comparison.

 

[trevnosh]

IMO clash jumpers should be used very sparingly. There was no reason for the Bulldogs to wear their clash strip on Friday night against Richmond (although I'll admit it did look good).

But puh-lease, keep our game unique and don't let it end up like soccer.

I agree- either the clubs need a clash strip for when there is a genuine colour clash, so that players can find teammates, or clubs develop away strips, whether necessary or not, and acknowledge that 'away' strips are for generating merchandising revenue.

The more alternative jumpers there are the more clashes there will be. Just use a clash strip when it's necessary and leave the bloody game alone.

As Dennis Cometti said to Bruce McAveney on Friday night (Bulldogs v Richmond): "I have to say those white strips dominate the landscape". Good enough for me.

 

[lionbear]

Let's also introduce Offside and reward staging, because everyone knows soccer is better than footy.

Man Utd sell more shirts in Japan than Collingwood sell in Melbourne.

One is a unique game played in one corner of the world with 16 teams, the other a world sport where they can (and do) play against teams with exactly the same shirts in any country in the world.

There is no comparison.

I would hate that, infact I have not been a fan of any rule changes in the last 10 years.

I am talking generally about being able to clearly identify the two teams like Basketball for example. Not saying I want the game to be like Basketball. I just think there must be a way to meet in the midle for everyone which has clash strips where required.

 

[Eagle87]

One is a unique game played in one corner of the world with 16 teams, the other a world sport where they can (and do) play against teams with exactly the same shirts in any country in the world.

There is no comparison.

I agree- either the clubs need a clash strip for when there is a genuine colour clash, so that players can find teammates, or clubs develop away strips, whether necessary or not, and acknowledge that 'away' strips are for generating merchandising revenue.

The more alternative jumpers there are the more clashes there will be. Just use a clash strip when it's necessary and leave the bloody game alone.

More dribble and irrationality.

The soccer teams dont have alternative strips because they play against teams with exactly the same strip! They do it to ensure that players and spectators have the best possible viewing experience. Teams alternate strips are chosen based on their opposition to ensure their is contrast between shirts/shorts AND socks.

What possible damage is done to a club and its history by wearing a uniform that makes you clearly distinguishable to viewers on television networks that have stumped up $780million??

"The more alternative jumpers, the more clashes" - wtf??? The more alternative jumpers, the more likely you will have one that doesnt clash with that weeks opponent - surely?

This is all just silly. Freo, the Bulldogs on Friday and others have shown that something predominantly white makes for a much simpler viewing than all the darkish jumpers with the odd splash of colour that we get most weeks.

Why this becomes an argument about history and tradition is baffling and just supports a view (not mine) that we are somewhat of a mickey mouse league with small minded clowns in charge when compared with truly international codes.

 

[Mero]

I would hate that, infact I have not been a fan of any rule changes in the last 10 years.

I am talking generally about being able to clearly identify the two teams like Basketball for example. Not saying I want the game to be like Basketball. I just think there must be a way to meet in the midle for everyone which has clash strips where required.

I don't doubt that some people had problems with Melbourne v Freo and Melbourne v Essendon.

But then, the AFL had a good rule that every club understood, and it worked for Geelong in 1914, and it worked for West Coast and Brisbane in 1987.

You are free to brand yourself (from a marketing perspective, not cattle) with whatever guernsey design you choose.
However, if your choice is too close to that of an existing design, you must also provide a Clash jumper for games between the two.
It was a simple rule, and for some reason people get stuck in the traditional argument that Home ground advantage means something.
There is only a Home ground advantage interstate.
The game wasn't played at Junction Oval or Moorabbin, yet it was StKilda's home game. Against Essendon, who are also tenants of Telstra Dome.
Who decided Home team gets to decide anything?
Why is this any 'fairer' than the previous system?

 

[D Mitchell]

There was no reason for the Bulldogs to wear their clash strip on Friday night against Richmond ....

Exposure on the biggest stage, Friday night football. Otherwise it would probably have debuted on Saturday afternoon at Subiaco on 5 May, unlikely to be on national TV.

 

[Souup]

You need them for some matches.. Essendon Vs Richmond, North Melbourne Vs Collingwood and Fremantle Vs Melbourne are just a few examples

There are only a few exceptions but i would prefer the 1 strip for each team aswell

 

[Dagless]

I agree, not necessarily with all white, but the clash strip must be completely different to the home strip. For example, Essendon's "clash" strip was useless, if anything, the only clash avoidance was done by wearing red shorts, which would have achieved the same thing with our normal jumper I reckon.

The AFL needs to force us to wear a jumper predominately not red or black. Our "clash" games are against teams like St. Kilda, who are predomiantely red and black, so I fail to see how an alternative strip with different amounts of each of those two colours does anything, but anyway.

Personally, I wouldnt mind Essendon trialing a style close to that of River Plate in Argentina - all white with a normal (thin) red sash, white shorts etc. Would work a treat as a clash, and IMO River Plate has a good strip, not ugly at all.

Also, the AFL needs to incorporate shorts into this. A couple of games this season, such as Collingwood v North, it was a joke. North wore their "clash" strip, which is predominately blue and gets rid of most of the white from their traditional, against collingwoods black and white stripes, so what do they do? As the HOME team, North wear WHITE shorts? WTF!!!!

Sometimes the mind boggles...

what about having one like the bendigo bombers away??? You know the one which is all white but has the bombers logo in the middle

 

[lionbear]

I don't doubt that some people had problems with Melbourne v Freo and Melbourne v Essendon.

But then, the AFL had a good rule that every club understood, and it worked for Geelong in 1914, and it worked for West Coast and Brisbane in 1987.

You are free to brand yourself (from a marketing perspective, not cattle) with whatever guernsey design you choose.
However, if your choice is too close to that of an existing design, you must also provide a Clash jumper for games between the two.
It was a simple rule, and for some reason people get stuck in the traditional argument that Home ground advantage means something.
There is only a Home ground advantage interstate.
The game wasn't played at Junction Oval or Moorabbin, yet it was StKilda's home game. Against Essendon, who are also tenants of Telstra Dome.
Who decided Home team gets to decide anything?
Why is this any 'fairer' than the previous system?

I can see your argument, Essendon are the only team I believe who have actually a right to it. I did like there jumpers last Saturday I thought it cleared up the clash well with the red shorts worked alot better then what I was expecting.

Collingwood have changed there jumper numerous times in the last 10 years it is easy for them to fix the Clash jumper issue...
one white jumper with 3 1mm black strips.
one black jumper with 3 1mm white strips.

I do think though this is one thing that no one will ever 100% agree on.

 

[Flukey!]

Bombers clash strip is ridiculous.

Red shorts lmao - its not 1985

 

[Eagle87]

You need them for some matches.. Essendon Vs Richmond, North Melbourne Vs Collingwood and Fremantle Vs Melbourne are just a few examples

There are only a few exceptions but i would prefer the 1 strip for each team aswell

I understand this is your opinion and thats fine but can I ask why??

What possible difference does it make if a team has more than 1 jumper??

I just dont understand why this is an issue at all.

 

[Chewy]

Let's also introduce Offside and reward staging, because everyone knows soccer is better than footy.

Man Utd sell more shirts in Japan than Collingwood sell in Melbourne.

One is a unique game played in one corner of the world with 16 teams, the other a world sport where they can (and do) play against teams with exactly the same shirts in any country in the world.

There is no comparison.

Mero,

During these debates, when people bring up the Manchester United example, you always act as though they are victims of "cultural cringe", that we think the big football clubs from overseas are better and we should copy them. You are missing the point. People mention them (and other famous clubs) to illustrate that they are no worse off for wearing a different shirt now and then.

I understand you are a traditionalist and love your traditional Essendon jumper, but you act as though somehow your club is all the poorer for wearing a clash jumper. Collingwood fans are the same. In my opinion, both of your clubs are bigger than that. You aren't the biggest clubs in Melbourne because you kept the same jumper all these years.

Did Wimbledon cease to be the greatest tennis tournament in the world when they switched from white balls to yellow balls? No, tradition was lost, but it made it far better for the paying spectators and TV viewers.

 

[Mero]

I can see your argument, Essendon are the only team I believe who have actually a right to it. I did like there jumpers last Saturday I thought it cleared up the clash well with the red shorts worked alot better then what I was expecting.

Collingwood have changed there jumper numerous times in the last 10 years it is easy for them to fix the Clash jumper issue...
one white jumper with 3 1mm black strips.
one black jumper with 3 1mm white strips.

I do think though this is one thing that no one will ever 100% agree on.

Well, they're listed as clashing with Geelong, StKilda and North.
They pay North to keep quiet.
Geelong have wanted to wear Clash jumpers because they want to sell them, and StKilda changed after Collingwood adopted the mostly Black jumpers.
In fact, Collingwood's White jumpers don't clash with StKilda anyway, however when Collingwood went to the mostly Black jumpers, StKilda were wearing mostly Red.

Then there's the charity idea Essendon were supposed to be exploring, yet nobody did anything about.
This was for Melbourne to wear their Clash jumper against Essendon with a Troy Broadbridge Foundation logo on both, and then sell them on AFLAuctions to the highest bidder.
Effectively, Essendon supporters (who buy the jumpers) end up paying for Melbourne to wear their Clash jumper.
Doesn't everyone win in this scenario?
No-one did a thing to make it happen when it was suggested for the Trevor Barker foundation for the StKilda game.

 

[Bretski]

Because stripes suck

 

[lionbear]

Well, they're listed as clashing with Geelong, StKilda and North.
They pay North to keep quiet.
Geelong have wanted to wear Clash jumpers because they want to sell them, and StKilda changed after Collingwood adopted the mostly Black jumpers.
In fact, Collingwood's White jumpers don't clash with StKilda anyway, however when Collingwood went to the mostly Black jumpers, StKilda were wearing mostly Red.

Then there's the charity idea Essendon were supposed to be exploring, yet nobody did anything about.
This was for Melbourne to wear their Clash jumper against Essendon with a Troy Broadbridge Foundation logo on both, and then sell them on AFLAuctions to the highest bidder.
Effectively, Essendon supporters (who buy the jumpers) end up paying for Melbourne to wear their Clash jumper.
Doesn't everyone win in this scenario?
No-one did a thing to make it happen when it was suggested for the Trevor Barker foundation for the StKilda game.

Intresting Collingwoods current home jumper has a shorter history then the Kangaroos, St.Kilda and Geelong, yet they argue till there blue in the face about tradition.

I think the above idea made by Essendon is a great way of helping the above mentioned charitys and yes everyone does win. Perhaps the clubs need to go on the front foot here and work out together how to handle the clash jumper issue when they play each other. That way they can hopefully compromise and both be happy.

 

[Smokin]

what about having one like the bendigo bombers away??? You know the one which is all white but has the bombers logo in the middle
[/IMG]

Yea, it's not bad at all, however I personally dont like footy jumpers with pictures on them. Looks like a T-shirt a fan would wear or something.

I prefer the more traditional types, white with a red sash would be a great compromise for us, it solves the problem, yet we keep the traditional aspect of the sash.

 

[Mero]

Mero,

During these debates, when people bring up the Manchester United example, you always act as though they are victims of "cultural cringe", that we think the big football clubs from overseas are better and we should copy them. You are missing the point. People mention them (and other famous clubs) to illustrate that they are no worse off for wearing a different shirt now and then.

I understand you are a traditionalist and love your traditional Essendon jumper, but you act as though somehow your club is all the poorer for wearing a clash jumper. Collingwood fans are the same. In my opinion, both of your clubs are bigger than that. You aren't the biggest clubs in Melbourne because you kept the same jumper all these years.

Did Wimbledon cease to be the greatest tennis tournament in the world when they switched from white balls to yellow balls? No, tradition was lost, but it made it far better for the paying spectators and TV viewers.

Yeah. I do.
However, my point is the lack of fairness in the decision, not neccessarily the change in of itself.
Essendon and Collingwood are dead set against these things.
Both to the point of the ridiculous jumpers they've put forward as options.

I don't mind Clash jumpers per se (except the Brisbane Clash jumper, which is 2nd or 3rd ugliest ever, and a bugger to draw).
I say more power to those who want them, and want as many as 4 per season, like North had a year or two ago.
I just don't see how right minded people can see it being fair when some clubs have embraced them, others object to them, and yet based on the outdated concept of Home ground advantage all clubs are forced to.

It doesn't even have anything to do with size of the club or arrogance.
More, what was wrong with the existing method of deciding who was to wear a clash jumper, which was nothing.

Neither do I see what it has to do with sports that bear no resemblance to our game.
We don't play the same game, we're unique. And part of that uniqueness is the unchanging aspect of the jumper.
Players used to want to play for the jumper & speak of earning their first jumper. No other sport has that. So I don't see how the comparisons bear any weight.

 

[A Living God]

Yea, it's not bad at all, however I personally dont like footy jumpers with pictures on them. Looks like a T-shirt a fan would wear or something.

I quiet like the Eagles Eagle and the Bulldogs Bulldog but their (main) jumpers arn't plain white so they could be consider to be different.

 

[Mero]

Intresting Collingwoods current home jumper has a shorter history then the Kangaroos, St.Kilda and Geelong, yet they argue till there blue in the face about tradition.

I think the above idea made by Essendon is a great way of helping the above mentioned charitys and yes everyone does win. Perhaps the clubs need to go on the front foot here and work out together how to handle the clash jumper issue when they play each other. That way they can hopefully compromise and both be happy.

Well, certain Collingwood people said things that got the backs up of presidents from other clubs, who in turn made commitments to their members to make Essendon and Collingwood adopt them.


Imagine how much the Trevor Barker Foundation would have made from 22 Essendon jumpers from Saturday's game. $11,000. They'd find something to spend it on.
I reckon an average of $500 each. Ryder for over $1000, same with Davey, same with Lloyd. Maybe only $200-$300 for blokes who didn't do much.
Same sort of dough for the Broadbridge Foundation. Imagine what that sort of money could do in Thailand for kids.

 

[lionbear]

Well, certain Collingwood people said things that got the backs up of presidents from other clubs, who in turn made commitments to their members to make Essendon and Collingwood adopt them.


Imagine how much the Trevor Barker Foundation would have made from 22 Essendon jumpers from Saturday's game. $11,000. They'd find something to spend it on.
I reckon an average of $500 each. Ryder for over $1000, same with Davey, same with Lloyd. Maybe only $200-$300 for blokes who didn't do much.
Same sort of dough for the Broadbridge Foundation. Imagine what that sort of money could do in Thailand for kids.

Well if these 3 clubs could come to some sought of agreement on this I think it would be a step forward. Perhaps the drawing of the line in the sand in regard to this issue is doing things like helping charity's by selling the jumpers after the game, don't make them available to the public so then it is purley a fundraising not marketing issue and perhaps that would make our game more unique than ever.

I guess the question is Melbourne V Essendon at the MCG and Melbourne refuse to budge on there jumper for whatever reason and the above scenario breaks down, where do Melbourne and Essendon go in this situation? Melbourne would argue they are a older club and playing at there home ground, how does this situation get resolved?

 

[Smokin]

I quiet like the Eagles Eagle and the Bulldogs Bulldog but their (main) jumpers arn't plain white so they could be consider to be different.

I dont like your eagle jumper at all - I think your original jumper is absolutely fantastic, and Im at a loss as to why you dont have it as your home strip?

Footscray's I dont mind, the picture kind of blends in with the old traditional stripes.

The Bendigo one looks fine, but too much like somebody needed a jumper on an hours notice, and just chucked a logo on a white jumper etc.

 

[sheller891]

ijust dont understand how players played like this for so many years if its so hard to distinguish between certain jumpers

btw, first time i watched footy classified

how caan she be so ugly? wtf?