Draft Pass Mark

[Lingsface]

What is a pass mark for the draft?
Constantly there is debate on wether someone lived up to there pick and with the discussion around Horne Francis being traded what are people expecting out of a number 1 pick?

And then what are people expecting out of a top 5 a top 10 a top 20 etc ?
I thought I’d have a go at putting together some names and giving them a tier rating.

Number 1 ( the holy pick that bears more pressure than 2 and 3 by a fair margin it seems.)
I went from 2000 onwards

Pass- Bryce Gibbs Matthew Kreuzer

8

Matthew Kreuzer

Age

34

Ht

200cm

Wt

101kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.4

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

5.6

4star

CL

3.1

5star

HO

21.0

5star

D

1.0

1star

K

0.0

1star

HB

1.0

1star

CL

0.0

1star

HO

7.0

5star

D

11.8

3star

K

6.0

3star

HB

5.8

4star

HO

9.8

5star

Fail- Jack Watts Jonathon Patton

25

Jonathon Patton

Age

30

Ht

198cm

Wt

102kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.1

3star

K

7.7

3star

HB

4.3

3star

M

5.5

5star

T

1.9

4star

G

1.7

5star

D

5.3

1star

K

3.8

1star

HB

1.5

1star

M

2.3

2star

T

0.5

1star

G

0.8

4star

D

9.8

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

2.2

2star

M

5.4

5star

T

2.2

4star

G

2.2

5star

Tom Scully

21

Tom Scully

Age

32

Ht

181cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.7

5star

K

9.9

4star

HB

10.8

5star

M

3.8

4star

T

3.5

5star

CL

2.3

4star

D

12.6

3star

K

7.5

3star

HB

5.1

3star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.1

2star

CL

0.8

3star

D

19.8

5star

K

8.8

4star

HB

11.0

5star

M

3.0

3star

T

4.6

5star

CL

3.8

5star

Tom Boyd
Good- Murphy Cooney Whitfield Weitering
Very Good- Swallow Goddard Walsh Deledio
Amazing- Hodge Reiwoldt

Have left out some names especially recent but can do a atm rating. This is not my rating for them as a player more on what they have showed while considering age opportunities etc.

Ugle Hagan- fail
Matt Rowell

18

Matt Rowell

Age

22

Ht

180cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.4

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

D

17.4

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

D

17.4

5star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

- Good
Mcgrath- Good
Rayner- Fail

 

[Lingsface]

Top 5 is interesting this is a bit more flexible with some players not living up to the hype but still being very serviceable is not seen as a waste. (This is excluding number 1 pick.)

Fail- Richard Tambling

Richard Tambling

Age

37

Ht

180cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.9

4star

K

8.4

3star

HB

6.5

4star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.9

4star

No current season stats available

D

8.4

3star

K

5.6

3star

HB

2.8

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.8

4star

Harley Bennell

17

Harley Bennell

Age

31

Ht

185cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.4

5star

K

11.9

4star

HB

9.5

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.7

4star

D

12.7

3star

K

6.0

2star

HB

6.7

4star

M

2.0

2star

T

0.3

1star

CL

1.0

3star

D

17.6

5star

K

8.2

4star

HB

9.4

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.6

4star

CL

1.8

4star

Anthony Morabito

Anthony Morabito

Age

32

Ht

189cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.7

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.1

4star

M

2.6

3star

T

3.0

5star

CL

1.9

4star

No current season stats available

D

14.2

4star

K

8.6

4star

HB

5.6

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

3.6

5star

CL

2.0

4star

Paddy Dow

15

Paddy Dow

Age

24

Ht

184cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

7.0

3star

HB

7.1

4star

M

2.1

2star

T

2.9

4star

CL

2.6

4star

D

7.0

1star

K

4.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.0

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

12.4

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

1.6

2star

T

2.8

5star

CL

2.6

5star

Gumbelton
Pass- Chris Masten

Chris Masten

Age

34

Ht

180cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.8

5star

K

10.9

4star

HB

9.9

5star

M

4.1

4star

T

2.7

4star

CL

1.7

4star

No current season stats available

D

14.8

4star

K

8.8

4star

HB

6.0

4star

M

4.2

4star

T

5.0

5star

Matt Leunberger Lachie Hansen
Good- Stephen Coniglio

3

Stephen Coniglio

Age

30

Ht

182cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

24.5

5star

K

13.0

5star

HB

11.5

5star

M

3.8

4star

T

4.7

5star

CL

4.7

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

8.8

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

3.8

4star

CL

5.4

5star

D

19.2

5star

K

8.2

4star

HB

11.0

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.2

4star

CL

3.0

5star

Michael Hurley

18

Michael Hurley

Age

33

Ht

193cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

12.1

4star

HB

6.2

4star

M

6.4

5star

T

0.9

3star

MG

389.3

5star

D

16.5

4star

K

11.8

5star

HB

4.7

3star

M

6.3

5star

T

0.3

1star

MG

301.2

4star

D

15.0

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.4

5star

M

5.0

5star

T

2.0

4star

Daniel Wells

Daniel Wells

Age

39

Ht

181cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.3

5star

K

11.7

4star

HB

7.5

5star

M

3.9

4star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

10.6

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.6

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

3star

Jordan De Goey

2

Jordan De Goey

Age

28

Ht

188cm

Wt

93kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.7

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

6.7

4star

M

3.9

4star

T

3.1

5star

CL

2.3

4star

D

15.8

4star

K

9.7

4star

HB

6.2

4star

M

2.8

3star

T

1.7

3star

CL

2.3

4star

D

11.6

3star

K

6.2

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

1.4

2star

T

4.8

5star

CL

2.6

5star

Daniel Wells

Daniel Wells

Age

39

Ht

181cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.3

5star

K

11.7

4star

HB

7.5

5star

M

3.9

4star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

10.6

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.6

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

G

0.6

3star

Ryan Griffen
Very Good- Trent Cotchin

9

Trent Cotchin

Age

34

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.4

5star

K

13.8

5star

HB

9.5

5star

M

3.4

3star

T

3.9

5star

CL

5.2

5star

D

19.0

4star

K

9.5

4star

HB

9.5

5star

M

2.7

3star

T

4.3

5star

CL

3.5

4star

D

16.6

4star

K

8.0

3star

HB

8.6

5star

M

4.6

5star

T

1.0

3star

Travis Boak

10

Travis Boak

Age

35

Ht

183cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.7

5star

K

11.6

4star

HB

12.0

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

4.4

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

22.0

5star

K

11.0

4star

HB

11.0

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

4.4

5star

CL

4.9

5star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

9.0

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

2.4

4star

Luke Ball Josh Kennedy
Elite- Chris Judd Lance Franklin Scott Pendelbury Marcus Bontompelli.

 

[Danw0w]

Top 5 is interesting this is a bit more flexible with some players not living up to the hype but still being very serviceable is not seen as a waste. (This is excluding number 1 pick.)

Fail- Richard Tambling Harley Bennell Anthony Morabito Paddy Dow Gumbelton
Pass- Chris Masten Matt Leunberger Lachie Hansen
Good- Stephen Coniglio Michael Hurley Daniel Wells Jordan De Goey Daniel Wells Ryan Griffen
Very Good- Trent Cotchin Travis Boak Luke Ball Josh Kennedy
Elite- Chris Judd Lance Franklin Scott Pendelbury Marcus Bontompelli.

How do you not rate a Brownlow medallist as elite?

 

[Meteoric Rise]

How do you not rate a Brownlow medallist as elite?

Richmond tax.

 

[Jetafl]

Pass- Bryce Gibbs

100% agreed Gibbs was a pass for sure. Not for us especially with what we coughed up 2 1st rounders. But on his career as a whole for sure. I don't feel I'm wearing my Crows had when saying this but what really peeved me off at the time was, we should have got him as a FS but back then they had this unfair system that Vic was 100 games WA was 150 games and SA 200 games for FS Bryce's father Ross missed out as he'd only played 191 games for Glenelg before joining AFC in our inaugural season.

 

[Boppo]

Tom Boyd won a premiership in the half a dozen years he played AFL. That’s not a fail.

 

[Father Jack]

How do you not rate a Brownlow medallist as elite?

By not rating the Brownlow medal I'd imagine. Not hard to do.

 

[SSSSSS]

I'd put Scully in the pass mark IMO. Should have been AA at least once. Was one of the best wingmen in the comp at his peak and the Scully/Kelly/Whitfield trio was just plain fun to watch. Just a shame his body didn't hold up.

 

[Father Jack]

Tom Boyd won a premiership in the half a dozen years he played AFL. That’s not a fail.

Los of players do that, and if that's your only accomplishment as a number one draft pick, well it's hardly a pass mark.

 

[Lingsface]

How do you not rate a Brownlow medallist as elite?

Some would rate him in the elite category and fair enough, I didn’t take the ratings too serious just looking to get the general feeling of what the expectations for the first pick top 5 picks are from others.

 

[Dangerousfield]

Shows how over rated draft picks are. Every one of those Fail/Pass/ok players had a pre draft write ups like they were guns. Posters on here talk about tiop five picks like they are certainties. On my board posters are wringing their hands over giving up pick 5 for Rankine, because pick 5 will get us an elite mid but we know from history that's far from fact. Only have to look on our list to see 'elite' pick 6 McAsey who can't get a kick at SANFL level!

That so many top five picks can end up so ordinary shows how smart it is to trade those picks for proven mature players. The AFL edict that you must use two first rounders in a rolling four year period is nanny stuff. Clubs should be able to decide for themselves if they want to opt out of the draft lottery for the security of known players.

 

[Wojcinski]

Los of players do that, and if that's your only accomplishment as a number one draft pick, well it's hardly a pass mark.

especially when you didn't win it with the club that took you #1. Decent trade for the Doggies though

 

[citizen-erased]

pick 1 is an interesting one. With said pick, you're generally bottom of the ladder (JUH & likely Ashcroft aside)
So what's better - you get a gun player or you get 200+ decent games from someone

Could argue the latter is better at that stage, and the gun players can come on the way up.

Hodge is the classic example. Nothing overly out of the ordinary skill wise, but durable and led them through 3 flags.

 

[The 747]

What is a pass mark for the draft?
Constantly there is debate on wether someone lived up to there pick and with the discussion around Horne Francis being traded what are people expecting out of a number 1 pick?

And then what are people expecting out of a top 5 a top 10 a top 20 etc ?
I thought I’d have a go at putting together some names and giving them a tier rating.

Number 1 ( the holy pick that bears more pressure than 2 and 3 by a fair margin it seems.)
I went from 2000 onwards

Pass- Bryce Gibbs Matthew Kreuzer
Fail- Jack Watts Jonathon Patton Tom Scully Tom Boyd
Good- Murphy Cooney Whitfield Weitering
Very Good- Swallow Goddard Walsh Deledio
Amazing- Hodge Reiwoldt

Have left out some names especially recent but can do a atm rating. This is not my rating for them as a player more on what they have showed while considering age opportunities etc.

Ugle Hagan- fail
Matt Rowell- Good
Mcgrath- Good
Rayner- Fail

Right.

 

[The 747]

Top 5 tough as there are a few who don't make it.

You would expect 200 games from a number 1 pick IMO.

 

[Lingsface]

Top 5 tough as there are a few who don't make it.

You would expect 200 games from a number 1 pick IMO.

I agree that’s why the pass mark is a little lower for that category but your still expecting close on an all australian representative.

 

[btdg]

I'm still trying to work out how a 300 gamer who won the coaches association MVP and who captained his club for 6 years is rated 'Good', as is a 250 gamer who won a Brownlow medal.

Meanwhile, a player who has played 197 games without playing in a final or making an All-Australian team (let alone winning a league award) is rated 'Very Good'.

 

[Lingsface]

I'm still trying to work out how a 300 gamer who won the coaches association MVP and who captained his club for 6 years is rated 'Good', as is a 250 gamer who won a Brownlow medal.

Meanwhile, a player who has played 197 games without playing in a final or making an All-Australian team (let alone winning a league award) is rated 'Very Good'.

I’m not sure my ratings were spot on, who are you talking about?

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

It depends on the strengthnof the draft.
Some years there's few good players in the top 20 and other years nearly every club nails a great player in the top 20.
This years draft is weak , next year is very strong.

 

[btdg]

I’m not sure my ratings were spot on, who are you talking about?

Murphy and Cooney (good) vs Swallow (very good).

 

[Lingsface]

Murphy and Cooney (good) vs Swallow (very good).

Ok yes Murphy could be very good definitely one of the better players for Carlton in the last 20 years.

I think Swallow has been an outstanding leader as well and one of Gold Coast best and most consistent players. Games record holder for the club best and fairest runner up twice and captain for last 4 years.

But you have a valid point and I do have a bit of a soft spot for him because of his loyalty to the club.